Dog at Dining Table & Skunk Pot on Balcony common issues?

[RobInMN]

13 minutes ago, foxgoodrich said:

My friend, age 64, due to her lifelong struggle with juvenile onset diabetes, has never had the experience of a "normal" life as you put it.  Her small professional service dog is a poodle,  trained for 12 months at a formal and specialized medical alert training facility, then trained with her for an additional month.  You most likely would never recognize him as a poodle since he has an allover buzz cut, not a poodle cut.

 

He is worn in a special medical alert service harness on her chest most of the time - similar to a "snuggly carrier" that people carry newborns in.  At times when she is sitting, he is in her lap when the harness doesn't work for the situation or a shoulder seat belt must be worn.  He is trained to ignore food on a plate or a table, he will only accept being fed a dog bone or treat from her hand when he is on the floor at home, and eats and drinks from dog bowl on the floor.

 

Clearly you don't know what the term "brittle" means as it applies to diabetics, nor do you understand professional service dogs.  Most people with profound medical disability issues cannot take a week off for a cruise and change their treatment protocols, as you so glibly suggest.  You could at least listen to or read the disclaimers that follow those glossy TV commercials that you are watching.

 

I can see from your post that you are no stranger to contempt and gain a lot of info from TV.

Let's take a step back.

For the sake of this discussion, let's assume that your friend has a legitimate need and a properly trained Service Dog (doesn't matter what for). You should be incensed at the proliferation of pets and untrained emotional support animals being played off as "Service Dogs" as it reflects negatively not only on your friend's situation, but every other person with legitimate service dog needs.

The phase "a rotten apple spoils the bunch/barrel", but in this case, there now there are probably more rotten apples than good ones. Ten years ago, I don't think we'd be debating this, but now, every dog and dog owner is looked at with suspicion. The more pet-like it's being treated, the worse they are going to be judged. Owners and friends of legitimate service dogs should be absolutely irate at the ESA abuse.

 

Back to your friend's case, if it wasn't for all the fakers out there, I don't think anyone would be questioning the legitimacy of a diabetic sniffing dog, but now, this seems like a very grey area, and it's all due the abuse of ESA.

 

This article contains a story of a legitimate service dog being attacked in an elevator by a completely BS ESA.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2017/10/29/several-states-crack-down-fake-service-animals/807676001/

 

[cured]

38 minutes ago, cruisingguy007 said:

 

They have foldable grabbing tools. Next!

Unbelievable.  

 

Thank goodness there are laws like the ADA to protect those that need service dogs from people like you.  Your opinion doesn't matter as long as the dog is within the defines of the

ADA.

 

Edited March 15, 2022 by cured

[Lane Hog]

6 minutes ago, cruisingguy007 said:

 

The whole system has been abused to the umpteenth degree and needs to be regulated. Those who rely on service animals to function (ie seeing eye dogs and such) are being disserviced by all this fraud and stretching of "need". I feel bad for those people that really need them to function and have nothing but contempt for those who have been allowed to abuse the system (the vast majority). 

Please explain how the people who really do rely on a service animal are being inconvenienced by someone else "abusing the system" as you've put it?

Are they being denied the ability to have their animal accompany them?  Doesn't appear that way.

How do the borderline "abusers" impact the legitimate users, other than in the eyes of random observers like you?

From my experienced, people who need assistance don't worry too much about what uninvolved spectators think about it.  They're going to go about their lives regardless if they think you're offended or doubting their need.  As they should.

Edited March 15, 2022 by Lane Hog

[cured]

12 minutes ago, cruisingguy007 said:

 

While I can appreciate those specifics, many of these things can be accomplished without dragging a dog around everywhere, specifically on a cruise or a restaurant, store, etc. The simple fact is that many so called "service dogs" are simply pets that people want to tote around with them as accessories. Then make excuses as to why they are necessary when people with similar conditions/limitations make it everyday without them or use non animal tools/products to facilitate the same objectives. The whole system has been abused to the umpteenth degree and needs to be regulated. Those who rely on service animals to function (ie seeing eye dogs and such) are being disserviced by all this fraud and stretching of "need". I feel bad for those people that really need them to function and have nothing but contempt for those who have been allowed to abuse the system (the vast majority). It's nonsense and needs to stop and regulations tightened. Feining victimhood, lobbing sob stories, insulting me and pretending that there are simply no alternatives isn't going to sway my opinion. A blind person with a seeing eye dog isn't in the same ball park as many of these fraudsters with excuses. Sorry, not sorry.         

Again, your opinion of whether a service dog is truly needed or not is completely irrelevant . As long as the dog meets the legal definition of a service dog, the handler and the dog is protected under the ADA.

 

Is there abuse? Absolutely. Fluffy in a stroller is not protected under the ADA, so go ahead and complain about them. But you dismissing all service dogs beyond seeing eye dogs is irrelevant.

 

May I ask what your profession is that makes you the ultimate expert on whether a dog is needed or not?

Edited March 15, 2022 by cured

[RobInMN]

1 minute ago, Lane Hog said:

Please explain how the people who really do rely on a service animal are being inconvenienced by someone else "abusing the system" as you've put it?

Are they being denied the ability to have their animal accompany them?  Doesn't appear that way.

How do the borderline "abusers" impact the legitimate users, other than in the eyes of spectators like you?

Public perception. Like I said in my previous post, 10 years ago, we probably wouldn't even be having this argument. True service dogs are well trained and nearly invisible. I can only imagine that owners of legitimate service dogs have seen changes in public reception and acceptance in recent years. Pets and ESAs are not well trained, are not nearly invisible, and in many cases, are treated in a way to draw attention. They can bark, growl, piss, poop, attack, and be a general nuisance, all of which a legitimate service dog will not do.

Not to mention the story I linked to above where a legitimate service dog was attacked in an elevator by some lady's pet that she initially tried to claim was a Service Dog, then an ESA, then finally admitted, it was just a pet. The article doesn't say, but how long was that service dog out of commission? It's possible that such an attack could render it unable to perform, so where does that leave the owner that needs the service dog?

 

 

[flamingos]

17 minutes ago, Lane Hog said:

Please explain how the people who really do rely on a service animal are being inconvenienced by someone else "abusing the system" as you've put it?

Here's one perspective:

 

The loophole, which was put in place to respect the privacy of disabled individuals, also presents several problems, including:

Fake service animals in public places can be disruptive, as they are typically not trained as real service animals.

Fake service animals can pose a risk of distraction or injury to real service animals.

A distracted service animal can inadvertently cause harm to their handler by not being able to perform their trained functions properly.

The damage and disruption caused by fake service animals has led businesses to put pressure on legislators to change ADA rules, which could have negative impacts on disabled individuals.

The rise in fake service animals in recent years has caused individuals with real service animals to fall under suspicion.

 

https://www.westparkanimalhospital.com/blog/fake-service-animals/

[Lane Hog]

Y'all are grasping at straws with some of these hypothetical hyperbolics...

Believe me, if guests with legitimate service animals were experiencing issues on cruises due to "fake" service animals, they'd be dealt with.

 

Edited March 15, 2022 by Lane Hog

[cruisingguy007]

42 minutes ago, cured said:

Again, your opinion of whether a service dog is truly needed or not is completely irrelevant . As long as the dog meets the legal definition of a service dog, the handler and the dog is protected under the ADA.

 

Is there abuse? Absolutely. Fluffy in a stroller is not protected under the ADA, so go ahead and complain about them. But you dismissing all service dogs beyond seeing eye dogs is irrelevant.

 

May I ask what your profession is that makes you the ultimate expert on whether a dog is needed or not?

 

Hopefully, this gets changed. All the fraudsters are only making the case for tightening the rules. Hope it happens sooner than later. It's gotten beyond ridiculous at this point. That is all, have a great day!  

[flamingos]

3 minutes ago, cured said:

I absolutely agree something needs to be done about the stroller and pocketbook pets.

 

On that, I think everyone can agree.

[Mikew0805]

On 3/13/2022 at 11:42 PM, topnole said:

Your comparing a discussion board to minding one’s own business on a

cruise.  The entire point of this part of the website is to discuss cruise related topics.  That is not the same issue as how one behaves when encountering a given issue on a cruise.  
 

Is it wrong for someone to stand up mid show blocking your view to dance.  Happens all the time at shows and concerts.  What about the a fan at a game standing up constantly blocking the view of others.  Assume both are allowed behavior as is the case in many places.  Do folks just mind their own business and move elsewhere?  I bet few do?  Do they talk about it later with others?  I’ll bet almost everyone does.  Does that make them childish for not minding their own business and controlling what they can control.  I think not. 
 

Half the stuff on here would be childish by your logic.  
 

But yet it isn’t childish to discuss issues.  It is adult behavior.  There is zero wrong with a healthy discussion (or even passionate discuss) on anything.  Period.  It is never childish to discuss any issue.  In fact we need more open discussion in this world on every topic.  The thing that is ruining society is the fear of talking about issues.  Every one gets offended to easily or results to name calling as in your case calling others a child for talking about an issue.  I personally wouldn’t do anything other than roll my eyes if I see a dog violating Royal policy.  Isn’t going to change my mood one bit.  But I certainly don’t blame someone if that gets their goat and they want to discuss their frustrations with others.  
 

And for the record many companies have changed policy on such matter due to public push back (see the airlines much tighter restrictions now).  So people talking does make a difference sometimes.  

Wow.. do you even see the hypocrisy in your post? I am posting my opinion, and I just checked.. I never called anyone any name. I said I prefer to be an adult, and referred to behavior as less than adult like. If that is name calling, well you are the one with issues of offense. 

 

I stand by my opinion, adults should act like an adults. You can create any random scenario you like, but unlike the ones you mentioned, a dog in ones view, (as mentioned by the OP) does not affect the person who simply sees the dog. So yes, they should mind their own business. Another example in the dining room that is related, unlike your examples, if you see someone that is not dressing the way you think they should... stop looking at them, problem solved by being an adult. 

 

My original response post #104 simply said "wow"  It did not admonish anyone, and it did offer an opinion on the subject. Post #134.. again stated my opinion and did not call anyone a name. Now this post... Continued with the opinion, and never called anyone a name.

 

Am I missing your point... should only your opinion matter? If that is the case, just come out and say it. At least I can respect that. To be clear... you keep saying childish, when all I said was what I would do and think others should do in that situation. I never said anything about the discussion being childish, but that seems to be how you took it... and I cannot help how you took it. That is a you problem, not a me problem.

 

 

 

[Chad2022]

12 hours ago, ryano said:

 

Ummm, thank you Captain Obvious but I was clearly talking about the people at the Hilton. Pot is legal medicinally in FL now.   The cops arent gonna do much if anything at all.    We all know that smoking anything on a cruise ship balcony is against the rules.  

I agree. “There is some lady on the phone complaining about someone smoking weed. Lets skip going out for these shootings and robberies in Miami tonight. Gotta get to the hilton to meetup with karen and write a ticket for weed smoking.” SMH.
 

Honestly, I would much rather smell weed in the distance than tons of badly behaved kids. ….or people dressed like they work at walmart, looking all sloppy. Thats why I started going on Celebrity. Much better clientele. Last time i was on RCCL, it clearly was going head on, competing with carnival. 

[LGW59]

9 hours ago, foxgoodrich said:

I will always oblige when a person requests to be educated.  Here are a few summaries you might like to think about...

 

Mobility assistance dogs can open doors for those in wheelchairs, manipulate light switches and pick up objects off the ground or retrieve them from other spots. Individuals with limited mobility may need the dog to help switch from their wheelchair to another position, like their bed or a toilet. Dogs can also unload laundry from the dryer. Some other capabilities of service dogs are paying cashiers, pressing handicapped accessible buttons and pressing elevator buttons.

 

People with epilepsy have service dogs who are trained to alert their human partner before a seizure occurs which helps prevent injury during a seizure. Seizure alert dogs have an innate ability to detect the onset of a seizure. When they sense an imminent seizure, the dogs give their owners a signal like pawing, pacing, intense staring or placing their head or nose on their owner. During a seizure, service dogs will lie down close to the person having the seizure. If the alert is seen in time, individuals with epilepsy can prepare themselves and get to somewhere safe, such as on a soft surface or on the floor, before the seizure happens. After the seizure is over, the dog may go and seek additional help if it’s needed.

 

For individuals with disabilities that cause fatigue, pain, trouble walking, or limited mobility, service dogs can help! Like the mobility tasks for wheelchair users, service dogs can also help people regain balance and prevent falling. The dog can carry items if the individual is too weak to move or hold them. Because service dogs are allowed by law in public places for the benefit of their owners, this means they can perform these assistive tasks in the grocery store, on the sidewalk and other public areas. Using a service dog for balance can help when unstable walking and stumbling occur. Service dogs are trained for various bracing maneuvers to prevent falls, provide secure footing after making a difficult move and recover control.

 

Medical Alert Service Dogs also are trained to alert their human partners that a diabetic incident is coming, that a TIA is coming, and can help their partners prevent injuries by anticipating an oncoming medical event through their sense of smell.  Hearing Service Dogs are trained to alert their Deaf partners to sounds such as doorbells, door knocks, smoke alarms, glass breaking, babies crying, people yelling, horns honking, thunder, tornado and other weather warning sirens, and many other environmental and home sounds too numerous to mention.

 

These summaries are not exhaustive.  You can further your own education using any search tool online.  Thank you for asking to be educated!

My neighbor fairly young guy, is in a wheelchair, no use of his legs, very limited mobility of his hands.  Some days he is able to use to maneuver his wheelchair, some days he cannot.  On days he cannot, his service dog is trained to do that for him.   His dog can use the building auto door opener, knows what elevator button to push as well.  When he leaves his apartment he leaves the door unlocked, service dog can open the door.  Can also open the refrigerator door, flush the toilet if needed, pretty amazing stuff for a companion not only assisting a non blind person, or the 99.9% of phonies who “don’t” need a service dog.  Can’t fix stupid…

Edited March 16, 2022 by LGW59

[topnole]

24 minutes ago, Mikew0805 said:

Wow.. do you even see the hypocrisy in your post? I am posting my opinion, and I just checked.. I never called anyone any name. I said I prefer to be an adult, and referred to behavior as less than adult like. If that is name calling, well you are the one with issues of offense. 

 

I stand by my opinion, adults should act like an adults. You can create any random scenario you like, but unlike the ones you mentioned, a dog in ones view, (as mentioned by the OP) does not affect the person who simply sees the dog. So yes, they should mind their own business. Another example in the dining room that is related, unlike your examples, if you see someone that is not dressing the way you think they should... stop looking at them, problem solved by being an adult. 

 

My original response post #104 simply said "wow"  It did not admonish anyone, and it did offer an opinion on the subject. Post #134.. again stated my opinion and did not call anyone a name. Now this post... Continued with the opinion, and never called anyone a name.

 

Am I missing your point... should only your opinion matter? If that is the case, just come out and say it. At least I can respect that. To be clear... you keep saying childish, when all I said was what I would do and think others should do in that situation. I never said anything about the discussion being childish, but that seems to be how you took it... and I cannot help how you took it. That is a you problem, not a me problem.

 

 

 

I think you are missing my point.  Discussion on this thread is mutually exclusive from minding your own business in person.  One can eat dinner, never say a word to the dog owner, and still express their opinion about it to others later.  That is fully in the range of adult behavior. 
 

What exactly do you mean by not acting like an adult or behavior less than adult?  

[topnole]

41 minutes ago, Chad2022 said:

I agree. “There is some lady on the phone complaining about someone smoking weed. Lets skip going out for these shootings and robberies in Miami tonight. Gotta get to the hilton to meetup with karen and write a ticket for weed smoking.” SMH.
 

Honestly, I would much rather smell weed in the distance than tons of badly behaved kids. ….or people dressed like they work at walmart, looking all sloppy. Thats why I started going on Celebrity. Much better clientele. Last time i was on RCCL, it clearly was going head on, competing with carnival. 

Let me get this straight.  You don’t like Royal because people dress like they work at Walmart?  

 

And, you now like Celebrity because weed smells better than bad kids?  

 

 

Edited March 16, 2022 by topnole

[Mikew0805]

7 minutes ago, topnole said:

I think you are missing my point.  Discussion on this thread is mutually exclusive from minding your own business in person.  One can eat dinner, never say a word to the dog owner, and still express their opinion about it to others later.  That is fully in the range of adult behavior. 
 

What exactly do you mean by not acting like an adult or behavior less than adult?  

I am not missing your point. Again, I did not admonish anyone for this discussion, your perception is that I did, instead of what actually happened, which was me participating in the discussion with my opinion... which has not changed. I do think one should mind their own business, and use their adult skills. That is MY opinion, which was relevant to the discussion whether you agreed with the opinion or not. Also note.. in my original response, which you responded to... I referred to myself. No one else.

 

Not acting like an adult does mean acting like a child. However, I did not say anyone was acting like a child, I said my opinion was that myself and others should pretend to adult, act like an adult, etc. You can twist it anyway you want, but I didn't call anyone a name. If you still think I did, why do you not just report my post. I am sure that the mods will look at it and see I didn't violate any guidelines. I participated in a discussion, and did not call anyone a name. 

 

[topnole]

2 minutes ago, Mikew0805 said:

I am not missing your point. Again, I did not admonish anyone for this discussion, your perception is that I did, instead of what actually happened, which was me participating in the discussion with my opinion... which has not changed. I do think one should mind their own business, and use their adult skills. That is MY opinion, which was relevant to the discussion whether you agreed with the opinion or not. Also note.. in my original response, which you responded to... I referred to myself. No one else.

 

Not acting like an adult does mean acting like a child. However, I did not say anyone was acting like a child, I said my opinion was that myself and others should pretend to adult, act like an adult, etc. You can twist it anyway you want, but I didn't call anyone a name. If you still think I did, why do you not just report my post. I am sure that the mods will look at it and see I didn't violate any guidelines. I participated in a discussion, and did not call anyone a name. 

 

I don’t care whether you call me or anyone else a child.  Opinions are opinions.   I’m not offended by anything anyone on here could possibly say.  
 

Adults generally have principles and opinions.  Nothing wrong with that.  That is normal behavior.   
 

Expressing opinions on a CC discussion board is adult behavior.  Confronting a dog owner at their table or getting bent out of shape all trip about it isn’t.   These are two very different things.  The former doesn’t imply the latter.   

[brillohead]

Another valid, non-blind reason for a service animal is allergen detection.  There are countless videos out there of allergen detection dogs catching allergens in their person's food.  I just saw one on Tiktok yesterday, where a family had ordered take-out, and the dog alerted on the sweet potato fries containing gluten.  (And yes, while most people are gluten-free because they think it's trendy, there are true celiac patients who CANNOT tolerate it at all.)

Again, a true service dog will be well-behaved in public, only relieve itself in the designated potty areas, and not be eating from the table.  The closest you would see to that behavior is the dog sitting or standing next to the owner's chair in the restaurant, and sniffing each plate/bowl that is lowered to it for examination.  

[Mikew0805]

22 minutes ago, topnole said:

I don’t care whether you call me or anyone else a child.  Opinions are opinions.   I’m not offended by anything anyone on here could possibly say.  

Great - Since I didn't, even though you accused me of calling names.
 

Adults generally have principles and opinions.  Nothing wrong with that.  That is normal behavior.  

Great - Which is what I did. 
 

Expressing opinions on a CC discussion board is adult behavior.  Confronting a dog owner at their table or getting bent out of shape all trip about it isn’t.   These are two very different things.  The former doesn’t imply the latter.

Great - looks like we have come full circle as this is what I said in my original response. Thanks for realizing I never made mention of the discussion itself not being adult behavior.

I'm glad this is over with. Now I am off to bed.

[Chad2022]

1 hour ago, topnole said:

Let me get this straight.  You don’t like Royal because people dress like they work at Walmart?  

 

And, you now like Celebrity because weed smells better than bad kids?  

 

 

Yes. RCCL used to be awesome but it has lost its lux factor and caters to families of karens with tons of kids, a karen that goes out of her way to sniff around the ship looking for weed to be appalled by while her kids overtake the pools and run around screaming. When I am on a cruise, I dont want to feel like im at chuck e cheeses, but I say nothing and dont complain. Last time I was on RCCL, were people in MDR dressed like hell, letting kids beat on tables with forks and spoons.  I would deal with catching a whiff of someone puffing away on weed outside better than dealing with kids running all over. Not sure why so many acting like someone was smoking crack. Lets be honest, we have all smoked it. Not really a big deal.

 

On celebrity, far less kids, far less trash, far fewer karens looking for someone having fun that they must report. We all have things we see that we dont like but most of us dont obsess over it or report it unless it is an actual problem for us. I dont go on vacation to sniff out “rule breakers” that arent harming me. I have never taken weed on a cruise because I’m a rule follower and scared of getting in trouble, but one time I did partake late on a neighbors balcony with 2 pilots I met and their wives. Was some awesome stuff from Falmouth, Jamaica one of them picked up. If anyone was awake at 4am, I hope they smelled it and I hope they were appalled at us enjoying our final night on vacation. 

Edited March 16, 2022 by Chad2022

[easyqueasy]

1 hour ago, Chad2022 said:

Lets be honest, we have all smoked it. 

Honestly, never have and never will. Just wanted to participate on this thread. Thanks!

[brillohead]

 

32 minutes ago, easyqueasy said:

1 hour ago, Chad2022 said:

Lets be honest, we have all smoked it.

 

Honestly, never have and never will. 

I'm with @easyqueasy.  Never felt the need.  Also never smoked tobacco.  Rarely drink booze.  

 

@John&LaLa can confirm that I'm pretty inappropriate when I'm stone cold sober, so lowering my inhibitions through substance use would not be advisable.  

[A&L_Ont]

5 hours ago, topnole said:

Let me get this straight.  
 

You don’t like Royal because people dress like they work at Walmart?  

 

And, you now like Celebrity because weed smells better than bad kids?  

 

I can see the new marketing campaign now…

[SRF]

15 hours ago, RobInMN said:

Let's take a step back.

For the sake of this discussion, let's assume that your friend has a legitimate need and a properly trained Service Dog (doesn't matter what for). You should be incensed at the proliferation of pets and untrained emotional support animals being played off as "Service Dogs" as it reflects negatively not only on your friend's situation, but every other person with legitimate service dog needs.

The phase "a rotten apple spoils the bunch/barrel", but in this case, there now there are probably more rotten apples than good ones. Ten years ago, I don't think we'd be debating this, but now, every dog and dog owner is looked at with suspicion. The more pet-like it's being treated, the worse they are going to be judged. Owners and friends of legitimate service dogs should be absolutely irate at the ESA abuse.

 

Back to your friend's case, if it wasn't for all the fakers out there, I don't think anyone would be questioning the legitimacy of a diabetic sniffing dog, but now, this seems like a very grey area, and it's all due the abuse of ESA.

 

This article contains a story of a legitimate service dog being attacked in an elevator by a completely BS ESA.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2017/10/29/several-states-crack-down-fake-service-animals/807676001/

 

 

I totally agree.

[SRF]

5 hours ago, brillohead said:

@John&LaLa can confirm that I'm pretty inappropriate when I'm stone cold sober, so lowering my inhibitions through substance use would not be advisable.  

 

I really hope we sail together sometime.  I am looking forward to meeting you.  You sound like a my type of fun person. 😄

 

[SRF]

7 hours ago, Chad2022 said:

Yes. RCCL used to be awesome but it has lost its lux factor and caters to families of karens with tons of kids, a karen that goes out of her way to sniff around the ship looking for weed to be appalled by while her kids overtake the pools and run around screaming.

 

Hmm, sitting on your balcony and smelling any type of smoke is not running around sniffing it out.

 

And ANY smoking on the balconies is not allowed due to fire risk.  Unless you want to be part of something like this.

 

 

And weed is not allowed on board by RCI rules.  While it may be legal in your state, or even the state where the ship sails from, it is not legal under Federal law and not legal in many ports where the ship docks.