Remember the Spanish Protocols on Sailing? It's been updated apparently

[Megabear2]

Wasn't sure where to put this, so apologies for yet another thread!

 

Those who followed the insurance issues will recall a document on Spanish protocols which we used in discussions on insurance and offloading -  apologies I can't recall who found it - well over on the Celebrity board someone has found a new updated version from March 2022. I can't find a link on the internet, hopefully one of those who are more internet savvy than myself can, but this is what's appeared over yonder:

 

https://docreader.readspeaker.com/docreader/?jsmode=1&cid=cesks&lang=es_es&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.sanidad.gob.es%2Fen%2Fprofesionales%2FsaludPublica%2FsanidadExterior%2Fdocs%2FHealth_Measures_for_the_restoration_of_Cruise_Ship_Activities_in_Spain.pdf&referer=https%3A%2F%2Fboards.cruisecritic.com%2F

 

[Harry Peterson]

11 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

Wasn't sure where to put this, so apologies for yet another thread!

 

Those who followed the insurance issues will recall a document on Spanish protocols which we used in discussions on insurance and offloading -  apologies I can't recall who found it - well over on the Celebrity board someone has found a new updated version from March 2022. I can't find a link on the internet, hopefully one of those who are more internet savvy than myself can, but this is what's appeared over yonder:

 

https://docreader.readspeaker.com/docreader/?jsmode=1&cid=cesks&lang=es_es&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.sanidad.gob.es%2Fen%2Fprofesionales%2FsaludPublica%2FsanidadExterior%2Fdocs%2FHealth_Measures_for_the_restoration_of_Cruise_Ship_Activities_in_Spain.pdf&referer=https%3A%2F%2Fboards.cruisecritic.com%2F

 

Thanks - that looks very interesting and very useful, Megabear.

 

This appears to be the link to the PDF document:

 

https://www.sanidad.gob.es/en/profesionales/saludPublica/sanidadExterior/docs/Health_Measures_for_the_restoration_of_Cruise_Ship_Activities_in_Spain.pdf

[Cathygh]

Thank you Megabear. I haven't come across the 3.5% figure and 5% figure  below before :

QUOTE:

"If, upon arrival at a Spanish port, 3.5% or more of those on board (crew and passengers) are reported as Covid-19 cases, only those cases and passengers who end the cruise at that port will be allowed to disembark; under no circumstances shall passengers be allowed to disembark for tourism or other reasons. Crew members may only disembark for essential reasons. Authority may be given for patients' close family members to be allowed off the boat. Passengers joining a cruise may also be given authority to board." and...

"Allocated areas to isolate cases that do not require medical attention. As part of this, at least 5% of the maximum capacity must be reserved for possible isolation."

 

 

[howmuch!]

and this - 

 

The shipping company's procedure should cover all possible scenarios - including the potential full evacuation of the ship, and should include all aspects related to transportation, medical treatment and supervision, accommodation, maintenance and eventual repatriation of any passenger or crew taken off for Covid-19-related reasons. Costs arising from these actions shall be covered by the shipping company, either directly or through an insurance company.

 

Passengers insurance or Cruise Line???

 

[Megabear2]

Cruise line if the passengers' insurance doesn't cover it. It was in the old one  as well (worded slightly differently) and was the basis of my argument with them/Holiday Extras. It's what led to the wording in the frequently asked questions.

Edited April 2, 2022 by Megabear2

[my marina bay]

22 hours ago, Cathygh said:

Thank you Megabear. I haven't come across the 3.5% figure and 5% figure  below before :

QUOTE:

"If, upon arrival at a Spanish port, 3.5% or more of those on board (crew and passengers) are reported as Covid-19 cases, only those cases and passengers who end the cruise at that port will be allowed to disembark; under no circumstances shall passengers be allowed to disembark for tourism or other reasons. Crew members may only disembark for essential reasons. Authority may be given for patients' close family members to be allowed off the boat. Passengers joining a cruise may also be given authority to board." and...

"Allocated areas to isolate cases that do not require medical attention. As part of this, at least 5% of the maximum capacity must be reserved for possible isolation."

 

 

If this is correct the chances of disembarking in Spain are low. We were thinking of sailing on Iona in September. If there are circa 4000 on board including crew it only needs 140 to test positive before arrival in any Spanish port and no one can get off (exceptions apply to crew changeover or illness). If they enforce the rule over summer its unlikely we will cruise.

[Britboys]

Appreciate that this is not P&O but a passenger aboard a Saga ship posted yesterday that 7 Covid-positive pax plus partners/travelling companions were disembarked from the ship in Cadiz yesterday.

The other Saga ship was due to make it's call into Lisbon (the first port on this cruise) but has been refused permission to do so.

[molecrochip]

On 4/2/2022 at 10:41 AM, howmuch! said:

and this - 

 

The shipping company's procedure should cover all possible scenarios - including the potential full evacuation of the ship, and should include all aspects related to transportation, medical treatment and supervision, accommodation, maintenance and eventual repatriation of any passenger or crew taken off for Covid-19-related reasons. Costs arising from these actions shall be covered by the shipping company, either directly or through an insurance company.

 

Passengers insurance or Cruise Line???

 

Covered by the cruise line - but cruise line can choose to pay cash or insure against the occurance.

 

36 minutes ago, Britboys said:

Appreciate that this is not P&O but a passenger aboard a Saga ship posted yesterday that 7 Covid-positive pax plus partners/travelling companions were disembarked from the ship in Cadiz yesterday.

The other Saga ship was due to make it's call into Lisbon (the first port on this cruise) but has been refused permission to do so.

Being refused permission to call into Lisbon for 7 positive passengers doesn't seem to add up. Likewise we don't know who made the offloading choice in Cadiz - it may be they were offloaded for their own health as they weren't coping with Covid well.

[tring]

3 minutes ago, molecrochip said:

 

Being refused permission to call into Lisbon for 7 positive passengers doesn't seem to add up.

 

Andrew reported that the Cadiz and Lisbon incidents were for two different Saga ships.

 

Thanks for your input though on an important issue.

 

[nosapphire]

31 minutes ago, molecrochip said:

Covered by the cruise line - but cruise line can choose to pay cash or insure against the occurance.

 

Being refused permission to call into Lisbon for 7 positive passengers doesn't seem to add up. Likewise we don't know who made the offloading choice in Cadiz - it may be they were offloaded for their own health as they weren't coping with Covid well.

Not sure if Lisbon refused or whether ship decided too many infected, but either way there are enough infected (passengers and crew) to have an effect to on board facilities. See the "no independent exploring" thread.

Both ships seem to be having problems.

[Angel57]

24 minutes ago, nosapphire said:

Not sure if Lisbon refused or whether ship decided too many infected, but either way there are enough infected (passengers and crew) to have an effect to on board facilities. See the "no independent exploring" thread.

Both ships seem to be having problems.

Thanks for posting name of thread - not good reading. Feel so sorry for passengers and crew. 

[Dermotsgirl]

4 hours ago, my marina bay said:

If this is correct the chances of disembarking in Spain are low. We were thinking of sailing on Iona in September. If there are circa 4000 on board including crew it only needs 140 to test positive before arrival in any Spanish port and no one can get off (exceptions apply to crew changeover or illness). If they enforce the rule over summer its unlikely we will cruise.

Perhaps they need a ‘support ship’ like they had in the Caribbean, so the positive testing passengers can be offloaded before arrival in port, meaning that the itinerary can proceed in a relatively uninterrupted way.

 

[Megabear2]

Surely all the ships will be sailing to make money. Reading the 5% quarantine requirement I'm guessing we are going to see far more onboard as passengers with all the incumbent difficulties.

 

Mind you with all the comments on poor old Arcadia she might be better off doing that for now followed by a massive overhaul inside.  Joking apart I don't think it would be feasible although I'm not sure how they're all going to cope with this current number of infections.  I assume you stay in your own cabin to quarantine although how that would affect one negative, one positive I'm not sure. Certainly don't think inside cabins are going to be on my agenda for a while just in case!

[tring]

3 hours ago, nosapphire said:

Not sure if Lisbon refused or whether ship decided too many infected, but either way there are enough infected (passengers and crew) to have an effect to on board facilities. See the "no independent exploring" thread.

Both ships seem to be having problems.

 

Just been over to the Saga Boards to read that thread - certainly worth reading and making me wonder if similar may happen on other lines with current infection rates. 

 

Not stopping at a port seems to be the least of the problems for people on board.  Saga now saying excursions only, with no independent exploration of ports (and someone on a 13th April cruise had a notification about that, so does not sound short term measure), lockdowns for about a couple of hours at a time whilst they move infected crew and passengers to quarantine zone.  Also breakfast and lunch in the MDR, now a go to the servery to get your food as well as a speciality steak restaurant closed in the evening.  Sounds like there are loads of crew affected.

 

[Red Ray]

Arrived home last week from the Azura transatlantic Barbados to Malta cruise. There were only 500 pax on board which suited us fine, but we were not allowed off at either of the only 2 scheduled stops before Valletta - Gran Canaria & Cadiz. Azura was allowed to dock in GC for refuelling and to allow crew, guest speakers & entertainers off and on, but pax had to make do with a view of the port. Cadiz was bypassed completely though I understand weather conditions would have prevented docking in any case. At least we arrived in Malta a day early and could have an evening in Valletta, and though I enjoy sea days I must admit 12 on the trot started to pall near the end. Not sure how many Covid cases were on board but evidently more than 17 if the 3.5% figure was being used.

[jeanlyon]

Oh dear, I am very glad my cruises have been moved to 2023, but even then I am not sure I want to be bothered.  It's really off-putting.

[Harry Peterson]

2 hours ago, jeanlyon said:

Oh dear, I am very glad my cruises have been moved to 2023, but even then I am not sure I want to be bothered.  It's really off-putting.

Exactly my thoughts, Jean.  There are plenty of other holiday options, most of them much less open to unexpected change.

[Dermotsgirl]

I’m now wondering  what other countries protocols are like.

 

I’ve seen a message on a social media site saying that Azura is not calling at Livorno tomorrow for ‘safety reasons’.  This seems to involve Italian authorities wanting to see ‘health  details’.

It’s not entirely clear what is going on, but communication to passengers about Covid seems to be awful. 
 

They are now going to try for Ajaccio, which was previously missed due to bad weather. 

 

[jeanlyon]

Also just saw this on the Beeb  https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-60976958

 

We have just had a 9 day driving holiday.  Visited Rutland, never been there, saw some friends, then went to Bletchley Park, marvellous, then finally 2 more friends in West Sussex.

[jeanlyon]

26 minutes ago, Dermotsgirl said:

I’m now wondering  what other countries protocols are like.

 

I’ve seen a message on a social media site saying that Azura is not calling at Livorno tomorrow for ‘safety reasons’.  This seems to involve Italian authorities wanting to see ‘health  details’.

It’s not entirely clear what is going on, but communication to passengers about Covid seems to be awful. 
 

They are now going to try for Ajaccio, which was previously missed due to bad weather. 

 

It;s just ruination of any cruise.  I'm just not prepared to chance it.

[Britboys]

39 minutes ago, jeanlyon said:

Also just saw this on the Beeb  https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-60976958

 

We have just had a 9 day driving holiday.  Visited Rutland, never been there, saw some friends, then went to Bletchley Park, marvellous, then finally 2 more friends in West Sussex.

Yes, Rutland is lovely. I have friends who live in Leicestershire, not far away.

Interesting that only 62%of the cancelled flights are in the UK - that indicates cases must be rising in other countries too. 

[ferretktf]

6 hours ago, Red Ray said:

Arrived home last week from the Azura transatlantic Barbados to Malta cruise. There were only 500 pax on board which suited us fine, but we were not allowed off at either of the only 2 scheduled stops before Valletta - Gran Canaria & Cadiz. Azura was allowed to dock in GC for refuelling and to allow crew, guest speakers & entertainers off and on, but pax had to make do with a view of the port. Cadiz was bypassed completely though I understand weather conditions would have prevented docking in any case. At least we arrived in Malta a day early and could have an evening in Valletta, and though I enjoy sea days I must admit 12 on the trot started to pall near the end. Not sure how many Covid cases were on board but evidently more than 17 if the 3.5% figure was being used.

Somewhere between 120 and 200 cases on board 

 

most caught by the day 2 LFT test of all passengers 

 

another 20 or so caught when they tested those staying on for the next cruise, 2 days before Malta

 

 

[Red Ray]

Duplicate post

Edited April 4, 2022 by Red Ray
Duplicate post

[Red Ray]

Are you sure about those numbers ferret? I was told by 1 of the testing guys that there were about 30 pax and 20 crew in isolation. If your figures are correct - and I'm not doubting you, just surprised, I feel DW and myself were somewhat lucky.

[OregonGal56]

Set to be in an Azamara Spain Intensive cruise starting May 8th, reading this is getting me depressed!

Azamara's policies (as I understand them) are if you test positive before the initial embarkation, they will pay for lodging, return fares, etc, if you can proof you tested negative 2 days prior. Needless to say, we will be getting testing 1 and 2 days prior to embarkation! Just need to research what type of testing they will accept as we are bring our own kits.