Skagway - No Train, Only Bus - Chilkoot White Pass & Yukon

[nicoleinwi]

NCL is still also insisting the train will go to Canada.  I have spoken to 2 different agents who said they've heard from passengers what we are reading online but "you can't believe everything  you read online" and they have no word of cancellation. 

 

We originally booked the train just to the Summit with some other activities so doesn't effect us.  But our inlaws are also going and on the train into Canada.  They want to take the gamble and wait and see what happens.  Oh well, their choice.  

[Coral]

OK - this is weird. 

 

It just dawned on me that Holland America Princess Alaska Tours owns the White Pass Rail. They bought it a few years ago.

[JustAllie]

Thanks to all those who brought this to everyone's attention. 

 

NCL today still claimed to have no information, but the shore excursion rep on the phone sounded like she had discussed this with others before.  

 

I had her switch my friend and me to a train-only excursion.  I'm sorry we won't be able to do the train up, sightseeing, and bus back option that we had originally booked for our mid-May cruise.  But I really prefer round-trip train to round-trip bus, so it seemed wise to rebook.  

 

If something better opens up, we can try to rebook again later. 

[Northern Aurora]

5 hours ago, Coral said:

OK - this is weird. 

 

It just dawned on me that Holland America Princess Alaska Tours owns the White Pass Rail. They bought it a few years ago.

 

 

While it is a somewhat complicated story in 2018 Carrix Rail Management group joined with the Holland American Princess Alaska Tours to purchase the WP&YRR from a Canadian company which owned/managed golf courses.  In 2021 Blackstone Infrastructure Partners purchased Carrix.

[Gramma of Boys]

Still trying to figure this out... I commented earlier that maybe the bus/train combo could still go. My thought process was that if you ride the bus up into Canada, and catch the train back, that you could cross the border on the bus and catch the train back down on the US side.  Or is that not possible?

 

[SightCRR]

It won't work. AK and Yukon don't have a lot of roads. At the AK /Yukon border there is no road for the buses to make the connection. In the past years when the combo was possible the train went into CA to make the connection. sightcrr

Skagway - Google Maps

 

Edited April 19, 2022 by SightCRR

[JT1962]

32 minutes ago, Gramma of Boys said:

Still trying to figure this out... I commented earlier that maybe the bus/train combo could still go. My thought process was that if you ride the bus up into Canada, and catch the train back, that you could cross the border on the bus and catch the train back down on the US side.  Or is that not possible?

 

There is no way to board the train at the border. The closest location is at Fraser, about 7 miles North of the border. Unless something changes, which is always possible in the Covid era, there will be no bus / train combo options in 2022.

Edited April 19, 2022 by JT1962

[70momma]

On 4/7/2022 at 10:42 AM, PJB3 said:

I emailed Chilkoot to change my trip in Sept and they quickly reimbursed me the difference and scheduled me for the bus only trip.  Great service!!

Same here, Stacy was very accomodating for our group of 4

[jhskick]

From White Pass Railroad site. Would think this is correct.

 

Cross Border Tours – Service Suspended for 2022 Operating Season

After months of working towards restoring the Carcross and Fraser Train Service Combination, we unfortunately must announce that we are unable to provide these offerings for the 2022 Season.  We have delayed this difficult decision for several months in the hopes that we could find a workable solution for all involved and provide passenger service on these international routes.  The challenges of logistics, restrictions, and uncertainty around wait times would have made it impossible for us to provide a consistent high quality service without delays and would create significant disruption to the passenger experience.

We respect and appreciate the time and efforts of our communities, staff, partners, customers, and governmental agencies at all levels in both Canada and the United States over the last year to try to bring this to fruition.  Though we could not complete the task in time for this season, we will continue to work together towards restoring this service for 2023.

For those booked on Fraser and Carcross train service this summer, our reservation staff will be reaching out to discuss your travel options and provide an alternative service on our White Pass Summit Excursion offering.

Our staff is dedicated to providing a safe and memorable trip for all that step aboard our trains each summer. We look forward to seeing you aboard the Scenic Railway of the World.

[don't-use-real-name]

3 hours ago, SightCRR said:

It won't work. AK and Yukon don't have a lot of roads. At the AK /Yukon border there is no road for the buses to make the connection. In the past years when the combo was possible the train went into CA to make the connection. sightcrr

Skagway - Google Maps

 

The Bus-Train connection point is 7 miles after crossing the border.

The train and bus connection is at Fraser.

Take the provided Skagway - Google Maps and zoom OUT to see the relationship.

 

Note the train goes up one side of the valley to the Summit while the bus (roadway) is

on the opposite side - the two merge at Fraser.

 

Also note the Summit train trips do actually cross in to Canada - a remote location 7 miles

from Fraser. The trains used to park on a siding at the facade Canadian border check point station

and the locomotives moved from one end of the train to the other.

Now with the recent loop added to the track the locomotive movement is not necessary.

Note which side to sit on - left side ascending to the Summit and right side returning 

to Skagway - feel free to move about the empty seats in each car but do not plan on moving

between cars while the train is in motion unless directed by a WPYRR crew person.

[Gramma of Boys]

What are the cruise lines waiting for?  Everyone seems to be saying that the bus/train trips cannot happen except for them.

[JT1962]

20 minutes ago, Gramma of Boys said:

What are the cruise lines waiting for?  Everyone seems to be saying that the bus/train trips cannot happen except for them.

I can only guess that they either are hoping Canada will change their current policy (and the train operator will resume the trips into Canada) or they are short staffed on programmers to update the websites. 

[cawhite]

Hi all,

Given the current situation of no trains going into Canada for 2022, which Chilkoot Charters tour would you recommend for first-time Alaska visitors:

(1) the 6.5 hr. Yukon Klondike Bus Adventure

(2) the 3.75 hr. White Pass Summit Train & (Skagway) City Tour

My husband and I would love taking the train, but we don't want to miss out going into Canada, either.  So we booked option (1) above.

That seemed to be what Stacy from Chilkoot Charters recommended during our phone conversation but I would love to hear feedback from people here who have experienced both train and bus.  We always prefer smaller tour groups / buses so we  traditionally have always booked through local, independent tour operators rather than through the cruise line.

Thanks, in advance, for your help.

Edited April 19, 2022 by cawhite

[JT1962]

2 hours ago, cawhite said:

Hi all,

Given the current situation of no trains going into Canada for 2022, which Chilkoot Charters tour would you recommend for first-time Alaska visitors:

(1) the 6.5 hr. Yukon Klondike Bus Adventure

(2) the 3.75 hr. White Pass Summit Train & (Skagway) City Tour

My husband and I would love taking the train, but we don't want to miss out going into Canada, either.  So we booked option (1) above.

That seemed to be what Stacy from Chilkoot Charters recommended during our phone conversation but I would love to hear feedback from people here who have experienced both train and bus.  We always prefer smaller tour groups / buses so we  traditionally have always booked through local, independent tour operators rather than through the cruise line.

Thanks, in advance, for your help.

I think you made the right choice. I have taken the summit only on the train, the bus / train combo with Chilkoot and moved to the 6.5 Hour Yukon Klondike Bus Tour with Chilkoot when the bus / train combo was canceled for my cruise in 2 weeks. You will see amazing scenery, have several stops for photos and hopefully see wildlife as well.

 

If you have a long day in Skagway, it is possible to take the 6.5 hour tour in the morning and still have time for the summit roundtrip train in the late afternoon. It would make for a long day, but is possible with the right times in port.

[brisalta]

On 4/18/2022 at 5:49 PM, Coral said:

OK - this is weird. 

 

It just dawned on me that Holland America Princess Alaska Tours owns the White Pass Rail. They bought it a few years ago.

 

It was then sold to Klondike Holdings in 2018 with a minority ownership still held by Carnival PLC but who really owns Klondike Holdings?

[don't-use-real-name]

17 minutes ago, brisalta said:

 

It was then sold to Klondike Holdings in 2018 with a minority ownership still held by Carnival PLC but who really owns Klondike Holdings?

Carnival is the main player here although under cruise lines names - Princess - Holland-America

and its own brand Carnival.

Carnival owns a host of other cruise lines some of which:

Carnival

AIDA

COSTA

Cunard

Holland-America

P & O

P & O Cruises Australia

Princess

 

Princess and HAL are more well known in Alaska than others 

 

 

[xlxo]

I wonder if excursion operators are doing the Yukon segment all by bus on the West side of the Valley.  Once back to Skagway, put the passengers on the White Pass Railway to go up the East side Valley for a round trip summit ride.

[don't-use-real-name]

4 hours ago, xlxo said:

I wonder if excursion operators are doing the Yukon segment all by bus on the West side of the Valley.  Once back to Skagway, put the passengers on the White Pass Railway to go up the East side Valley for a round trip summit ride.

That is exactly what they are doing - separating the two excursions - all bus -OR- all train

These can be done with the bus and then the train -OR- train and then the bus ---

Caution if doing both to factor the Port time available

 BUT the two are not connected at any point i.e. a combo tour of one of each round trip.

 

At least that is the present game plan for the season 2022 - - - - -

 

Weather wise lots of variables - but the bus tour in the morning and train afternoon is

the best way to view these excursions. Weather in the am is likely foggy misty low

overcast clouds and clearing later in the day - later in the day the clouds pushed off

by prevailing winds the train views will be remarkable (nothing guaranteed here)

[mpdog42]

2 hours ago, don't-use-real-name said:

That is exactly what they are doing - separating the two excursions - all bus -OR- all train

These can be done with the bus and then the train -OR- train and then the bus ---

Caution if doing both to factor the Port time available

 BUT the two are not connected at any point i.e. a combo tour of one of each round trip.

 

At least that is the present game plan for the season 2022 - - - - -

 

Weather wise lots of variables - but the bus tour in the morning and train afternoon is

the best way to view these excursions. Weather in the am is likely foggy misty low

overcast clouds and clearing later in the day - later in the day the clouds pushed off

by prevailing winds the train views will be remarkable (nothing guaranteed here)

I just canceled mine, It just seemed two risky...Plus for such a popular Excursion..how come Princess and i suspect HA have so many seats available at this late date....

[xlxo]

1 minute ago, mpdog42 said:

I just canceled mine, It just seemed two risky...

Not a risk if this is a cruise line organized tour.  The ship will wait.

 

I believe the next port after Skagway cruise ship itineraries is a short distance away.  So the ship has contingency time to wait a few hours.

[mpdog42]

3 minutes ago, xlxo said:

Not a risk if this is a cruise line organized tour.  The ship will wait.

 

I believe the next port after Skagway cruise ship itineraries is a short distance away.  So the ship has contingency time to wait a few hours.

Hi, that's not what i meant by risky...Cruise line cancels at the last minute...then your left to pick thru the scraps of what is left of the tours...