Carnival Cruise Line’s Fleet Expanding More Than Rivals in 2023

[Saint Greg]

2 minutes ago, CarnivalShips480 said:

The ships mentioned like Toscana are going to be the last to go

 

All of the ships mentioned? Or two of them? Would you have guessed the two Vista class ships would be among the first to go? The Dream class ship hasn't even been sailing. Carnival owns all of them and can do what they want with them.

 

Edited March 16, 2023 by Saint Greg

[staceyglow]

5 hours ago, Joebucks said:

 

Limiting exec pay is a cool thing to say on the internet to show how much you hate the man. CEOs and other executives don't deserve millions. However, we never mention musicians, athletes, and other celebrities doing the same.

 

The truth is, limiting executive pay could be the most financially disastrous move to the company. Imagine trying to retract and retain the best talent by telling them they aren't going to be paid. They go elsewhere. No large company is having financial problems because executives are "paid too much" regardless of hip, woke, opinions. However, many companies are in poor financial situations because of poor leadership.

People like to pop off about excutive pay and claim a  company would be in much better financial shape if they didn't pay them so much, but I am an accountant by trade, and I do the math.  The top execs at Carnival Corp. could work for free and it would only save a few pennies per passenger day.  And it would be a rounding error compared to their billions of dollars in debt.  People make those kinds of salaries because the shareholders believe the receive more than that in return.  One wrong decision by an executive can cost a company hundreds of millions of dollars.  Is it fair to give a tiny portion of that to the people who make better decisions?  Absolutely

.

 

[BlerkOne]

3 minutes ago, staceyglow said:

People like to pop off about excutive pay and claim a  company would be in much better financial shape if they didn't pay them so much, but I am an accountant by trade, and I do the math.  The top execs at Carnival Corp. could work for free and it would only save a few pennies per passenger day.  And it would be a rounding error compared to their billions of dollars in debt.  People make those kinds of salaries because the shareholders believe the receive more than that in return.  One wrong decision by an executive can cost a company hundreds of millions of dollars.  Is it fair to give a tiny portion of that to the people who make better decisions?  Absolutely

.

 

The shareholders don't determine salaries. Isn't a lot of the compensation in stock options that have yet to be exercised?

 

The execs are often who the institutions (who often hold much of the debt) choose.

[dallasdan]

1 hour ago, mz-s said:

 

By and large those few places are the only places they want. Exotic ports of call for a Carnival ship like the Windwards, a thing of the past. The biggest problem (not necessarily for Carnival because they can't afford any more big ships) is the new megaships can't tender, so that really limits the future for places like HMC and Grand Cayman (and of course many other places as well).

Why can't the mega ships tender?  Are you including Celebration as a mega ship?

[mz-s]

3 minutes ago, dallasdan said:

Why can't the mega ships tender?  Are you including Celebration as a mega ship?

 

Too many guests to do it effectively, it would take 4 hours to get everyone off, and then it's time to make them line up to get back on before we are late for the next stop.

[CarnivalShips480]

2 minutes ago, Saint Greg said:

 

All of the ships mentioned? Or two of them? Would you have guessed the two Vista class ships would be among the first to go? The Dream class ship hasn't even been sailing. Carnival owns all of them and can do what they want with them.

 

All of them. They said There's another Spirit Class ship, a Dream class ship, and two Excellence class ships all built within the last 10 years they can transfer over. 

 

They aren't going to get rid of their best and newest ships. Need those to operate, get people to try Costa out. And Deliziosa is needed for the world cruise.

 

Yes, Carnival Corp does own all of them. They have said that they are trying to right size Costa's fleet, not deprive it. So they are doing what they want with it. Carnival Corp isn't just one cruise line.

[CarnivalShips480]

1 hour ago, mz-s said:

 

By and large those few places are the only places they want. Exotic ports of call for a Carnival ship like the Windwards, a thing of the past. The biggest problem (not necessarily for Carnival because they can't afford any more big ships) is the new megaships can't tender, so that really limits the future for places like HMC and Grand Cayman (and of course many other places as well).

Half Moon Cay is supposed to have a dock coming, haven't heard anything about it for awhile

[dallasdan]

Didn't think about the logistics of the tendering that many people.  

[Saint Greg]

6 minutes ago, CarnivalShips480 said:

All of them. They said There's another Spirit Class ship, a Dream class ship, and two Excellence class ships all built within the last 10 years they can transfer over. 

 

They aren't going to get rid of their best and newest ships. Need those to operate, get people to try Costa out. And Deliziosa is needed for the world cruise.

 

Yes, Carnival Corp does own all of them. They have said that they are trying to right size Costa's fleet, not deprive it. So they are doing what they want with it. Carnival Corp isn't just one cruise line.

 

Well they just got rid of two ships that were newer than half of those. I would not be surprised of Costa doesn't exist at some point.

 

Edited March 16, 2023 by Saint Greg

[CarnivalShips480]

2 minutes ago, Saint Greg said:

 

Well they just got rid of two ships that were newer than half of those. I would not be surprised of Costa doesn't exist at some point.

 

Because China was shut down. But I agree with you, Costa probably won't exist one day.

Edited March 16, 2023 by CarnivalShips480

[Saint Greg]

Just now, CarnivalShips480 said:

Because China was shut down. But I agree with you, it won't exist one day.

 

And where do you think their newer ships are going to go.

[CarnivalShips480]

2 minutes ago, Saint Greg said:

 

And where do you think their newer ships are going to go.

To Carnival. Have you been talking about the ships new homes after the end of Costa this whole time??!?

[Saint Greg]

2 minutes ago, CarnivalShips480 said:

To Carnival. Have you been talking about the ships new homes after the end of Costa this whole time??!?

 

I'm certainly not talking about this year. They haven't even gotten Venezia and Firenze yet. The conversation was about them not having newer ships coming on after Jubilee. I'm talking mostly 2025 and beyond.

[BlerkOne]

45 minutes ago, dallasdan said:

Why can't the mega ships tender?  Are you including Celebration as a mega ship?

and Royal megamalls. Existing ports need to be modified for them, too, or new ports built - like Falmouth.

[CarnivalShips480]

4 minutes ago, Saint Greg said:

 

I'm certainly not talking about this year. They haven't even gotten Venezia and Firenze yet. The conversation was about them not having newer ships coming on after Jubilee. I'm talking mostly 2025 and beyond.

I think that Costa might not be able to survive without Toscana and Smeralda.

 

I would like if Carnival gets all the Costa ships to become a mega fleet. I guess the ships could still cruise where they go now.

[BlerkOne]

The three majors have 74 billion in debt +/-. None of them should be building many new ships.

 

Seabourn is shedding a ship.

[CarnivalShips480]

Just now, BlerkOne said:

Seabourn is shedding a ship.

I saw that too. 2009 Odyssey. Its interesting, outside of the 3 they said before.

[staceyglow]

57 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

The shareholders don't determine salaries. Isn't a lot of the compensation in stock options that have yet to be exercised?

 

The execs are often who the institutions (who often hold much of the debt) choose.

The shareholders elect the board, which determines the salaries of the highest execs, who in turn, determine everyone else's salaries

 

[Eli_6]

I clicked into this thread hoping to hear about Firenze.  So looks like there is still no news???

[Tom-n-Cheryl]

54 minutes ago, CarnivalShips480 said:

Half Moon Cay is supposed to have a dock coming, haven't heard anything about it for awhile

 

And it's been over a decade since they were floating ideas for a pier in Belize.

 

If it's a tender port, it's most likely a sea day for me 🙂

 

Tom

[BlerkOne]

8 minutes ago, staceyglow said:

The shareholders elect the board, which determines the salaries of the highest execs, who in turn, determine everyone else's salaries

 

It is rare for the entire board to be replaced en masse and executive compensation is more than salary.

 

Everybody else's compensation is determined by a compensation committee.

https://www.carnivalcorporation.com/committee-details/compensation-committee

[BlerkOne]

5 minutes ago, Tom-n-Cheryl said:

 

And it's been over a decade since they were floating ideas for a pier in Belize.

 

If it's a tender port, it's most likely a sea day for me 🙂

 

Tom

There is a port under construction is Belize

[Tom-n-Cheryl]

3 minutes ago, BlerkOne said:

There is a port under construction is Belize

 

Why didn't they contact me about that !!!  lol

 

Time to search for info (the last time I did that was probably 3-5 years ago).

 

Tom

[Joebucks]

1 hour ago, Tom-n-Cheryl said:

 

Economically speaking - with current considerations - it's the best (only) path.

 

It will put them at a disadvantage over the next few years, lacking that next flagship or new class of ship excitement/anticipation.

 

It is what it is.

 

Tom

 

I don't disagree with these points. However, there's economics to everything. Building new mega ships during high costs of everything is a tough sell when there is already ton of debt. While I prefer mega ships, not everyone does, and it isn't perfect for every financial goal.

 

I think the Venezia is an interesting strategy. It certainly has caught my attention. I wonder how different themes and venues might stir up interest.

[BlerkOne]

13 minutes ago, Tom-n-Cheryl said:

 

And it's been over a decade since they were floating ideas for a pier in Belize.

 

If it's a tender port, it's most likely a sea day for me 🙂

 

Tom

Actually at least two ports?

 

https://www.portcoral.com/

is well underway, and Royal has signed with Port of Magical.

https://amandala.com.bz/news/royal-caribbean-makes-deal-with-port-of-magical-belize/

 

Tendering to end (allegedly) by 2025.