Military and shareholders OBC no longer combinable soon.

[Guest ldtr]

1 hour ago, Ken the cruiser said:

Not too much. We’re still quite happy getting up to $500 free OBC on our future cruises with Princess. On the bright side we won’t have to worry any more about submitting the SHB form anymore, especially after we refare a cruise once or twice. 😁

Now we just need to find about the grandfathering status of all of the existing bookings where we have both SOBC and MOBC (for both of us).

duplicate

Edited June 23, 2023 by ldtr

[Guest ldtr]

1 hour ago, Ken the cruiser said:

Not too much. We’re still quite happy getting up to $500 free OBC on our future cruises with Princess. On the bright side we won’t have to worry any more about submitting the SHB form anymore, especially after we refare a cruise once or twice. 😁

Now we just need to find about the grandfathering status of all of the existing bookings where we have both SOBC and MOBC (for both of us).

Will the SOBC is still good if you ever sail any of the other CCL lines such as HAL or P&O.

[ChutChut]

I agree both OBCs should be non-refundable and should be used onboard (or you lose it).

[nasa1974]

2 hours ago, ldtr said:

If this holds up this is very good news.  This eliminates the impact for most of us, but still does impact those were both passengers are veterans.

Doesn't do much good for those of us that travel solo.

[damiross]

I am eligible for the military OBC and the shareholder OBC.  I sold all but 100 shares of CCL today.  I would have sold all of my shares, but I am optimistic that CCL will see the errors of their way and allow a person to have both types of OBC at the same time.

 

It doesn't bother me if both are non-refundable. 

Edited June 23, 2023 by damiross

[Steelers36]

3 hours ago, ldtr said:

If this holds up this is very good news.  This eliminates the impact for most of us, but still does impact those were both passengers are veterans.

Not so much in my mind as they still get two OBC's.  Someone made a post the other day and were claiming/thinking PCL was not valuing Military and Veterans as much as Shareholders.  Well the clarification on previous page disputes that one.  (And yes, I realize they would have had 3 before this change).

 

Two people is the typical cabin booking:

• Both have Military - they both get OBC.
• One Military and one Shareholder - they both get OBC.
• Two Shareholders - only one gets OBC.

 

[Astro Flyer]

On 6/21/2023 at 8:05 PM, Ken the cruiser said:

This is just a suggestion. If you get the SOBC posted under your name on the booking, even though your DW’s name is the only name listed on the submitted Princess SB form, why not ask your PVP/TA to put your DW’s name as Guest #1 on the booking? We make my DW Guest #1 all the time. But we have to ask for that to happen; otherwise for some reason my name winds up being Guest #1.

My TA made my wife the first name & it was issued to her within a couple of hours. Hopefully our other 2 bookings made months ago with SOBC issued in my name won’t be affected. 🤞 If so, will have our TA make my wife the first name & to reapply for SOBC.

 

[cr8tiv1]

1 hour ago, Steelers36 said:

Not so much in my mind as they still get two OBC's.  Someone made a post the other day and were claiming/thinking PCL was not valuing Military and Veterans as much as Shareholders.  Well the clarification on previous page disputes that one.  (And yes, I realize they would have had 3 before this change).

 

Two people is the typical cabin booking:

• Both have Military - they both get OBC.
• One Military and one Shareholder - they both get OBC.
• Two Shareholders - only one gets OBC.

 

And again, singles get the worse end of the deal.  I have had unrelated travel mates who “suggested” that we should go halve-zzz on the OBC, IF they also owned stocks.  
 

My arguments:

I bought my stocks first.  I get the full benefit.  I booked the cruise…blah, blah, blah.

[Tigrou]

Firstly I will say I appreciate that Princess includes UK military for the military OBC.  Unlike HAL who only value the contribution made by US and Canadian forces (which I've often thought must be particularly irritating for the Dutch military given the name of the company).

 

As to the military OBC becoming non-refundable, until reading this discussion I'd never considered it would be otherwise and was surprised to learn it is currently refundable. 

 

I can understand the desire to cut costs.  What I don't understand is why Princess don't appear to realise, or possibly care, that this move could be construed as insulting to their military shareholders.

 

"Thank you for your service", here's $xxx OBC to show our appreciation.

 

Thank you for buying Carnival shares, here's $xxx OBC to show our appreciation.

 

Except if you are a military shareholder then either:

(1) your military service isn't appreciated as much as those who haven't bought shares, or

(2) your having bought shares isn't appreciated as much as non-military shareholders.

 

Whichever way you look at it, it's a kick in the teeth to those people who are both military and shareholders but not to those who are only one or the other.

 

 

 

 

 

[Tigrou]

4 hours ago, Steelers36 said:

Not so much in my mind as they still get two OBC's.  Someone made a post the other day and were claiming/thinking PCL was not valuing Military and Veterans as much as Shareholders.  Well the clarification on previous page disputes that one.  (And yes, I realize they would have had 3 before this change).

 

Two people is the typical cabin booking:

• Both have Military - they both get OBC.
• One Military and one Shareholder - they both get OBC.
• Two Shareholders - only one gets OBC.

 

 

In recent years I have unfortunately got used to cruise lines not valuing me as much as the 'typical cabin booking' of 2 people - even though I'm generally still paying for 2 people, it's just that my DH is now an 'invisible' passenger on account of his being dead.

 

But this move by Princess simply adds insult to injury.  I am military.  I am a shareholder.  But because I now travel solo one of those, whether it be military or shareholder, no longer holds any value.

 

 

 

[Tigrou]

7 hours ago, Ken the cruiser said:

My DW just made a very good point. What’s the purpose of the June 29 date if PCL is not going to allow previously authorized MOBC and SOBC postings to remain on existing bookings? Our guess from over here in the peanut gallery is PCL will allow them to be grandfathered.

 

Any 'grandfathering' for Princess UK bookings will presumably be somewhat limited as they won't award shareholder benefits until within 90 days of sail date.  

 

At least that was my experience recently, before this particular situation arose.  When I emailed my request 6 months ahead I was told they are not allowed to apply the benefit until it's within 90 days, and that I must re-apply - with updated proof of shares - when it's less than 90 days out.  

 

That will be just before 29 June 2023 so it will be interesting to see what happens, whether I get refused or 'grandfathered'.

 

 

[MissP22]

5 hours ago, Steelers36 said:

Two people is the typical cabin booking:

• Both have Military - they both get OBC.
• One Military and one Shareholder - they both get OBC.
• Two Shareholders - only one gets OBC.

 

This is our situation and hopefully what you posted is correct. 😉  

 

[whitecap]

7 hours ago, Ken the cruiser said:

My DW just made a very good point. What’s the purpose of the June 29 date if PCL is not going to allow previously authorized MOBC and SOBC postings to remain on existing bookings? Our guess from over here in the peanut gallery is PCL will allow them to be grandfathered.

Ken, I agree with your DW.  Because the "new policy" doesn't take affect until June 29th and there is no mention of it being retroactive, I believe that Princess will begin the new policy on June 29th and bookings made on and after that date (that depart beginning Sept 12th) will fall under the new policy, all prior bookings, regardless of departure date, will fall under the current policy.  Fingers crossed!

[palolake]

If you're going to have your choice of using Military or Shareholder benefit, I wonder if you'll have to start applying for military.  Instead of it automatically showing up like it does now.

[HaveDogWillTravel]

12 hours ago, Happiest when cruising said:

A post from a Princess Cruise Vacation Planner from another very popular social media site.
Her name is Jeanine Light. You can even join her page. 
 

Attention: CCL Shareholders and Military Benefit OBC!

Effective on 8 a.m. PDT on June 29, 2023 for all voyages departing after September 12, 2023, Shareholder and Military Onboard Credits have the following policy changes.

• The Shareholder and Military OBC will no longer be combinable with each other.

• The Military OBC will be non-refundable.

• The Shareholder OBC is currently and will remain non-refundable.

Non-Compatibility is at the guest level and not at the booking level.

Example Scenarios:

1.    Guest 1 has Military, Guest 2 has Shareholders - this is allowed.

2.    Guest 1 and Guest 2 both have Military, so neither can have Shareholders. If Guest 3 has Shareholders, this is allowed since they don't have Military.

I really hope this is true!  But I do empathize with veterans who feel their service us being equated to shareholders.  Yes there are younger veterans. My son is only 42 he served 8 years.  He spent one year getting shot at daily in Afghanistan. 

[cruiserdf]

10 hours ago, damiross said:

I am eligible for the military OBC and the shareholder OBC.  I sold all but 100 shares of CCL today.  I would have sold all of my shares, but I am optimistic that CCL will see the errors of their way and allow a person to have both types of OBC at the same time.

 

It doesn't bother me if both are non-refundable. 

My travel agent confirmed yesterday 6/22 that "Princess will only allow one benefit (MOBC or SOBC per booking, not per passenger."  So, unless you can figure out a way to have two separate bookings for the same cabin, I think it will be either military OBC or shareholder OBC.  I had previously sold to 100 shares, but now no need to hold those 100 shares either.  For me, it is not really about the dollars, but about the message sent to the veterans.  How large a dollar impact is that really for Princess compared to being able to advertise that as a differentiator for your cruise line?  I believe it was the CEO prior to Jan Swartz that was very pro-veteran.  New execs new rules.  John  Padgett not so much ...... Hoping for better leadership in the future.

[Guest ldtr]

4 hours ago, Tigrou said:

Firstly I will say I appreciate that Princess includes UK military for the military OBC.  Unlike HAL who only value the contribution made by US and Canadian forces (which I've often thought must be particularly irritating for the Dutch military given the name of the company).

 

As to the military OBC becoming non-refundable, until reading this discussion I'd never considered it would be otherwise and was surprised to learn it is currently refundable. 

 

I can understand the desire to cut costs.  What I don't understand is why Princess don't appear to realise, or possibly care, that this move could be construed as insulting to their military shareholders.

 

"Thank you for your service", here's $xxx OBC to show our appreciation.

 

Thank you for buying Carnival shares, here's $xxx OBC to show our appreciation.

 

Except if you are a military shareholder then either:

(1) your military service isn't appreciated as much as those who haven't bought shares, or

(2) your having bought shares isn't appreciated as much as non-military shareholders.

 

Whichever way you look at it, it's a kick in the teeth to those people who are both military and shareholders but not to those who are only one or the other.

 

 

 

 

 

Keep in mind the P&O does not give US veterans their benefit, only UK and I believe Australia and NZ.

[whitecap]

5 minutes ago, cruiserdf said:

My travel agent confirmed yesterday 6/22 that "Princess will only allow one benefit (MOBC or SOBC per booking, not per passenger."  So, unless you can figure out a way to have two separate bookings for the same cabin, I think it will be either military OBC or shareholder OBC.  I had previously sold to 100 shares, but now no need to hold those 100 shares either.  For me, it is not really about the dollars, but about the message sent to the veterans.  How large a dollar impact is that really for Princess compared to being able to advertise that as a differentiator for your cruise line?  I believe it was the CEO prior to Jan Swartz that was very pro-veteran.  New execs new rules.  John  Padgett not so much ...... Hoping for better leadership in the future.

Maybe send your TA a copy of the memo shown in post #271.   

[cruiserdf]

21 minutes ago, whitecap said:

Maybe send your TA a copy of the memo shown in post #271.   

Whitecap, I have done that.  Generally these restrictions are controlled at the cabin level.  I will wait to sell my last 100 shares until after full implementation of the change to see what actually happens.  The $250 is not going to make or break most cruisers.  The "value" message around the change is the hard part for me.

[whitecap]

Just now, cruiserdf said:

Whitecap, I have done that.  Generally these restrictions are controlled at the cabin level.  I will wait to sell my last 100 shares until after full implementation of the change to see what actually happens.  The $250 is not going to make or break most cruisers.  The "value" message around the change is the hard part for me.

I sincerely understand and we are in the same boat as far as our shares.  My point was to show how a TA can call and get information from a Princess employee that is completely opposite of what has been written and provided to Princess employees.  I have run into this so many times that I have made a contact with someone within Princess who has the authority to assist me when other Princess representative tell me or my TA that something can't be done.  The old saying applies here, "the right hand doesn't know what the left hand is doing".  I hope this all works out for everyone including the solo cruisers who are both shareholders and military.  All of the question being asked on this thread should have been answered before any information was put out to anyone, employee or customer.  

[damiross]

2 hours ago, palolake said:

If you're going to have your choice of using Military or Shareholder benefit, I wonder if you'll have to start applying for military.  Instead of it automatically showing up like it does now.

I'll take military over shareholder.  I don't have to do anything for it now that it is in my account.  I've already sold most of my shares of CCL.  I kept 100 shares just in case CCL sees the errors of their way and allow the military and shareholder OBC to be combined.

[cr8tiv1]

I’m not a stock watcher, but am guessing that a “huge” sell off can’t be good for CCL.  
 

I have 100 shares that is making money.  I have another 100 shares that still hasn’t reached original buy price.  It may never reach the high of yester-year.  Thank you Princess for the years of OBC even though you didn’t pay dividends.  
 

Does anyone have a guesstimate on what percentage of the company are passenger stock holders?

[Astro Flyer]

2 hours ago, cruiserdf said:

I believe it was the CEO prior to Jan Swartz that was very pro-veteran.  New execs new rules.  John  Padgett not so much

On Veterans Day 2010 the military benefit began when Vietnam Army combat veteran Alan Buckelew was the Princess president.

 

A Soldier Returns on a Cruise to Vietnam, as a Tourist

 

https://www.princess.com/cruise-tips-vacation-ideas/cruise-blog/50-essential-experiences/a-soldier-returns-on-a-cruise-to-vietnam-as-a-tourist.html

 

Edited June 23, 2023 by Astro Flyer

[vjmatty]

2 hours ago, whitecap said:

The old saying applies here, "the right hand doesn't know what the left hand is doing".  I hope this all works out for everyone including the solo cruisers who are both shareholders and military.  All of the question being asked on this thread should have been answered before any information was put out to anyone, employee or customer.  

 

With Princess it always feels more like the right hand doesn't know what its own fingers are doing....

[Honolulu Blue]

1 hour ago, cr8tiv1 said:

Does anyone have a guesstimate on what percentage of the company are passenger stock holders?

What I think you're trying to ask is how much of Carnival Corp. is held by ordinary people with, say, fewer than 1000 shares, as opposed to institutions.  That's actually answerable by digging deep into their financial filings.  My best guess is that the institutions and other big shareholders like the Arisons hold the vast majority of shares in CCL.

 

A related but far more interesting question (to me anyway) is what percentage of people on each Carnival Corp. sailing uses the shareholder credit.  This would be easy to track, and it probably is in Miami and possibly Santa Clarita.  But it involves sensitive and proprietary information, so I'm sure it will never be seen by us in the cheap seats.  My back-of-the envelope guess is less than 1% for the Carnival sailings, and maybe up to 10% for the longest Seabourn cruises (might be higher, but I figure most Seabourn passengers and their travel agents don't worry about piddling sums like the SOBC).  On Princess?  My best guess is 2-3% overall.  But it seems that a far higher percentage use the military credit on Princess.