Surprised there's no story up yet regarding couple stuck in Cozumel

[sanger727]

On 9/20/2023 at 9:19 AM, Eli_6 said:

And fwiw, I dealt with insurance companies for over a decade (often times resorting to suing them) and I also think insurance is primarily a scam.  They write the policies in such a way that it is a flip of a coin whether they will pay. They have a team of attorneys figuring out ways to NOT pay you. (I also used to work with a fellow attorney who had been an insurance attorney and his stories were bad.)

 

When our house flooded with 7+ feet of Water in Harvey, I had to fight them for 9 months to get paid. Home insurance wouldn't pay (as they shouldn't) because it was flood damage. And flood insurance said my damage (from 7 feet of water mind you!!!) was undamaged.  They even sent out an unlicensed "expert" structural engineer and took pics of the undamaged portions of my house and claimed that there was no damage.  If I had not been a lawyer who literally practiced in this arena, I would have been screwed.

 

Similarly, my husband recently was owed over 50k by Aetna due to their screw up.  He didn't get paid for a 5 months period for over a year because they lost a contract.  It took me blasting out a demand letter to every board member and the CEO for him to finally get paid a year later. Probably 200+ hours were spend by him and his staff trying to collect this money.

 

And I have seen it worse in a business situation where companies owed millions in liability and had to be sued to be paid.  Took it all the way up to the 5th circuit and won. So, 7 years after the claim, my client was finally paid.  SEVEN years and 100k in attorney fees.  But the company wins at this game because most people won't fight it for seven years and don't have 100k to spend in lawyer fees.

 

I have hundreds of other stories like this. Every insurance company out there makes money by NOT paying you. Some are worse than others. Yes, I still have home owners insurance, professional liability insurance, car insurance, and health insurance.  But for anything that won't be "catastrophic" to my financial situation, I don't buy insurance for.  And a lot of credit cards provide travel insurance if you pay with them anyway...including even car insurance. 

 

We had a major claim at our house a few years ago. The house was built in the 70s and had sunroom on the back. There was a windstorm which severely damaged the sunroom. So, we went to get quotes for a new one. Here's the rub. That room was up to code in the 70s when the house was built. It wasn't up today's code. To replace the sunroom today we had to dig large footers and a new foundation which tripled the price. Our insurance company would pay the cost to replace "the sunroom" but no the cost of the footers and foundation to bring it up to code. 

 

On 9/20/2023 at 9:05 AM, Eli_6 said:

This actually is a legitimate Amazon scam.  They send packages you didn't order to your address, and charge your card.  Oh, and they send you some item of little value and overcharge you for it.  When you try to dispute it with the cc company, the seller shows them a pic of what was delivered to you by amazon so you look like the liar and they get to keep the money.  And the seller is someone who doesn't take returns or you can't find a return address or they claim you are not sending back the item they sent you.  My Mom had a friend who had this happen to her. 

 

So this scam is from illegitimate sellers on Amazon. I would expect Amazon to make this right. They have the records of what you ordered and when. I don't see how a seller could fake an order and make it look like it went through Amazon's website. 

[balcony bound]

6 minutes ago, sanger727 said:

 

So the scammers are illegitimate sellers on Amazon? I would expect Amazon to handle this. They have records of what you purchased and when. 

Well, since you didn't actually purchase it, that doesn't help.  

When I reported the packages to Amazon they didn't give me much information at all, got more info from the driver they sent to pick them up.

Probably too hard for folks to figure out unless you are a scammer.

[sanger727]

1 minute ago, balcony bound said:

Well, since you didn't actually purchase it, that doesn't help.  

When I reported the packages to Amazon they didn't give me much information at all, got more info from the driver they sent to pick them up.

Probably too hard for folks to figure out unless you are a scammer.

 

But the only way they would get your information is by you making a sale through Amazon to them. And if they are currently selling on Amazon then they should immediately be removed. I guess I don't see how this wouldn't be eligible for a credit card dispute and/or pursuing Amazon for a refund. If they don't have any receipts or proof that you purchased the item, then the credit card should take it. If they show a receipt showing you purchased the item through Amazon, then Amazon can verify that it's not true. Just showing the credit card company a picture of a package on a porch is meaningless. That package could be anything left at anytime  by anyone. 

[balcony bound]

12 minutes ago, sanger727 said:

 

But the only way they would get your information is by you making a sale through Amazon to them. And if they are currently selling on Amazon then they should immediately be removed. I guess I don't see how this wouldn't be eligible for a credit card dispute and/or pursuing Amazon for a refund. If they don't have any receipts or proof that you purchased the item, then the credit card should take it. If they show a receipt showing you purchased the item through Amazon, then Amazon can verify that it's not true. Just showing the credit card company a picture of a package on a porch is meaningless. That package could be anything left at anytime  by anyone. 

I don't think you understand the facts.  They get your address from the credit card you used.  They purchase amazon prime with it, then they send you packages.  It's not from your account.

[1kaper]

On 9/20/2023 at 11:02 AM, Babr said:

 

Credit card travel benefits cover cancellation, interruption, and delay - not medical. Wouldn’t help these girls or anyone else in a similar situation. 

 

I am in Canada so that may be the difference but my credit card travel insurance does cover medical.  I just looked it up to check to see if alcohol related medical was excluded.  It is.  

[BobbiSox]

Having been cruising for decades, I have leaned many things, the most important being FOLLOW THE RULES, regarding everything. Period. Doing so will lower your odds of getting into some kind of trouble. If it's recommended  that you buy insurance, buy it. If you can't afford it, stay home until you can. 

[Eli_6]

I also was the victim of a scam where I actually ordered a high end dishwasher and they charged my credit card for it and then showed it ostensibly delivered.  Only it was delivered to some other address and not my own. (In reality, I suspect just a small cheap package was delivered.) My CC gave me back the money, but I am sure they never saw it from the scammers.  I wasn't alerted to the fact that it was a scam until literally the day of delivery when fedex said it arrived and it didn't and I noticed that the address of where they were shipping the item to had suddenly changed from my address to some other address.  These scammers go to great lengths to look legitimate  Even the website where I ordered the dishwasher from looked completely legitimate and had a business address you could look up in NY, etc. It had multiple reviews on the website and had reviews on google.  They even answered emails I sent in asking about the dishwasher. I had even tried (before the scam) to contact the manufacturer to make sure their claim that they were a licensed dealer was correct, but the manufacturer never got back with me.  

Edited September 21, 2023 by Eli_6

[Eli_6]

38 minutes ago, 1kaper said:

 

I am in Canada so that may be the difference but my credit card travel insurance does cover medical.  I just looked it up to check to see if alcohol related medical was excluded.  It is.  

Yeah, pp is wrong. There are absolutely some credit cards that cover emergency medical when traveling. There are also some that cover car insurance so you don't have to buy it from the rental place simply if you use your card. There are others that cover plane cancellation and delay, trip interruption, lost luggage, hotel stays, etc., etc.  My guess is the PP simply doesn't have those particular cards. 

[sparks1093]

19 minutes ago, BobbiSox said:

Having been cruising for decades, I have leaned many things, the most important being FOLLOW THE RULES, regarding everything. Period. Doing so will lower your odds of getting into some kind of trouble. If it's recommended  that you buy insurance, buy it. If you can't afford it, stay home until you can. 

A recommendation is only that. People still need to decide if the recommendation is right for them and their circumstances. I doubt affordability comes in to play that often for insurance.

[sanger727]

1 hour ago, balcony bound said:

I don't think you understand the facts.  They get your address from the credit card you used.  They purchase amazon prime with it, then they send you packages.  It's not from your account.

 

you're right. I am definitely not following how this scam works. But that's ok. If it ever happens to me I am sure I will figure it out.

[Elaine5715]

1 minute ago, sanger727 said:

 

you're right. I am definitely not following how this scam works. But that's ok. If it ever happens to me I am sure I will figure it out.

There is another scam called "Brushing".  

What happens in a brushing scam?

 

 

Brushing is a scheme to create fake sales and reviews for a product. It is generally carried out by sellers who want to increase sales using positive online reviews. Sellers will mail unordered items to individuals and use the recipients' names to post positive online reviews for the product

[Babr]

Just now, Eli_6 said:

Yeah, pp is wrong. There are absolutely some credit cards that cover emergency medical when traveling. There are also some that cover car insurance so you don't have to buy it from the rental place simply if you use your card. There are others that cover plane cancellation and delay, trip interruption, lost luggage, hotel stays, etc., etc.  My guess is the PP simply doesn't have those particular cards. 

PP is aware of those cards but does not consider the $2,500 emergency care as adequate for foreign travel. 
 

A premium card with a nearly $600 annual fee is more appropriate for someone who travels often, not a couple of young people on a lark to Mexico.

[Eli_6]

26 minutes ago, Babr said:

PP is aware of those cards but does not consider the $2,500 emergency care as adequate for foreign travel. 
 

A premium card with a nearly $600 annual fee is more appropriate for someone who travels often, not a couple of young people on a lark to Mexico.

I am not sure which card you are talking about with a 600 fee (amex platinum  has 799 fee or venture x is 395???) or only 2500 medical, but the one I am talking about isn't capped at $2500. The card I have has 200k in coverage. That will go pretty far in Mexico.

 

You can add AUs on cards for children, household members, and employees so they get their own card and are covered under the same benefits...so it is possible that 20-somethings could have one of those cards.  

 

Long story short: If you feel more comfortable with travel insurance, go ahead. You do you. I feel okay given the health of myself and family in just using our card insurance.  I have traveled around the world and only one time had a health incident (noro)...and it wasn't enough to even make a claim on the insurance we did have.  Admittedly, being married to a physician, I probably feel more comfortable than most because we can generally treat anything minor without going to the onboard doctor or getting treatment on land.  If we had major health issues, I might feel differently.   

Edited September 21, 2023 by Eli_6

[1kaper]

21 minutes ago, Babr said:

PP is aware of those cards but does not consider the $2,500 emergency care as adequate for foreign travel. 
 

A premium card with a nearly $600 annual fee is more appropriate for someone who travels often, not a couple of young people on a lark to Mexico.

 

Mine is not a $600 a year annual fee.  $120. 

 

From my policy - "unless otherwise noted in this Certificate of Insurance, the maximum benefit of this medical insurance is unlimited". 
Hospital and medical treatment does not have a maximum benefit otherwise noted.  Dental is max of $2000.  

 

Another one (basic Amex) has up to 5,000,000.

[2wheelin]

22 hours ago, MadManOfBethesda said:

Fine, neck purse. You still have to take the money out of it to use it. And if you use cash in ports, it is subject to being taken from you. Even you have to admit that if you use cash there is a greater-than-zero chance of having it stolen and then you and you alone are out that money. But if you use a credit card that is hacked or stolen, it is the credit card company that is out the money. You have lost zero, nada, nothing.

 

So once again, explain how using cash is safer than using credit cards?

This only works until it doesn’t. I would rather lose $50 in cash than hassle with the cc company over a $1000 fraudulent charge. Sometimes it goes well and other times not so much. We just had a fraudulent $150 charge posted to a card which had been canceled the day before because of fraudulent activity. This new charge will take up to 90 days for them to “investigate” and meanwhile it is on our billing statement. Many phone calls to the cc company which will only transfer to frauds dept AFTER canceling your current card (which in our case was the new one issued two days prior).

This is Master Card which I think you will agree is one of the major companies and not one we need to discount.

[2wheelin]

21 minutes ago, Eli_6 said:

I am not sure which card you are talking about with a 600 fee (amex platinum  has 799 fee or venture x is 395???) or only 2500 medical, but the one I am talking about isn't capped at $2500. The card I have has 200k in coverage. That will go pretty far in Mexico.

 

You can add AUs on cards for children, household members, and employees so they get their own card and are covered under the same benefits...so it is possible that 20-somethings could have one of those cards.  

 

Long story short: If you feel more comfortable with travel insurance, go ahead. You do you. I feel okay given the health of myself and family in just using our card insurance.  I have traveled around the world and only one time had a health incident (noro)...and it wasn't enough to even make a claim on the insurance we did have.  Admittedly, being married to a physician, I probably feel more comfortable than most because we can generally treat anything minor without going to the onboard doctor or getting treatment on land.  If we had major health issues, I might feel differently.   

Is. It allowed to name cc names on this forum? I would be interested in learning more about associated travel insurance. I have never paid more than $100 for a credit card and most are free but now that I am retired, hope to do more traveling and insurance rates keep going up.

[Eli_6]

2 minutes ago, 2wheelin said:

Is. It allowed to name cc names on this forum? I would be interested in learning more about associated travel insurance. I have never paid more than $100 for a credit card and most are free but now that I am retired, hope to do more traveling and insurance rates keep going up.

 You should join some of the travel or points forums on the book (also not allowed to say the name). That is where I have primarily learned about the best travel CCs.  There are literally so many travel cards out there that have different benefits.  Some of them are definitely better than others.  I know for example on plat biz amex emergency medical transportation is provided at no cost if approved by them through their global assistance hotline at up to 100k. It also provides trip interruption, baggage loss, and cell phone insurance. Medical is now up to 250k per trip. (I looked it up in response to this thread. I thought it was 200k, but they upped it to 250k since I last looked it up.)  I am sure amex black offers even better but I think you have to have 500k a year in spend to qualify.  There is no min spend on amex plat but the fee is $799 after 09/26.  Gold has benefits, too, and the fee is more reasonable. I think the plum and green cards are either free or have a lower fee...not sure as I don't have one.

 

There is also a capital one card that you get by invitation (not the Venture X but even a different card) if you have a banking relationship with capital one that I was told has medical up to like a million. However, that is not who I bank with and it is too much trouble to change my bank considering I have been with my bank for 20+ years.

 

As an aside, I am talking about the plat biz because I can look at my own account. The personal platinum may have different or even better benefits...not sure.  There is also an amex black card, but the fee is the thousands and I think you have to have a spend of like 500k a year.  

 

There are many more that I don't know anything about and poster above apparently has unlimited medical on one so clearly there are even better ones out there.  I know a lot of people like the Chase Ink cars (business cards) and the Chase Sapphire, Chase Sapphire Preferred, Capital One Venture X, Citi Premier, etc.  There are co-branded cards with airlines, too, like am Amex Platinum Delta, a SW card, an American Airlines card, an Aer Lingus, Iberia, BA, etc.

 

My favorite is actually a British Air card offered by Chase and it only has a $95 annual fee. However, the reason I like it is not because of the insurance, but because once I spend 30k on it in a year, I get a companion pass so that means when I fly to Europe (even if it is in first class or business), I can fly with a friend for free. (I can actually fly anywhere that British Airways flies, but the most bang for my buck is usually Europe.)  Since those flights run 5k-10k in biz or first, that's a huge savings.  Southwest has a similar deal with a credit card where you can get a companion pass and your companion can fly free all year long with you on domestic flights. However, I don't know the ins and outs of that card as I don't have that card. 

 

 

 

[2wheelin]

50 minutes ago, Eli_6 said:

 You should join some of the travel or points forums on the book (also not allowed to say the name). That is where I have primarily learned about the best travel CCs.  There are literally so many travel cards out there that have different benefits.  Some of them are definitely better than others.  I know for example on plat biz amex emergency medical transportation is provided at no cost if approved by them through their global assistance hotline at up to 100k. It also provides trip interruption, baggage loss, and cell phone insurance. Medical is now up to 250k per trip. (I looked it up in response to this thread. I thought it was 200k, but they upped it to 250k since I last looked it up.)  I am sure amex black offers even better but I think you have to have 500k a year in spend to qualify.  There is no min spend on amex plat but the fee is $799 after 09/26.  Gold has benefits, too, and the fee is more reasonable. I think the plum and green cards are either free or have a lower fee...not sure as I don't have one.

 

There is also a capital one card that you get by invitation (not the Venture X but even a different card) if you have a banking relationship with capital one that I was told has medical up to like a million. However, that is not who I bank with and it is too much trouble to change my bank considering I have been with my bank for 20+ years.

 

As an aside, I am talking about the plat biz because I can look at my own account. The personal platinum may have different or even better benefits...not sure.  There is also an amex black card, but the fee is the thousands and I think you have to have a spend of like 500k a year.  

 

There are many more that I don't know anything about and poster above apparently has unlimited medical on one so clearly there are even better ones out there.  I know a lot of people like the Chase Ink cars (business cards) and the Chase Sapphire, Chase Sapphire Preferred, Capital One Venture X, Citi Premier, etc.  There are co-branded cards with airlines, too, like am Amex Platinum Delta, a SW card, an American Airlines card, an Aer Lingus, Iberia, BA, etc.

 

My favorite is actually a British Air card offered by Chase and it only has a $95 annual fee. However, the reason I like it is not because of the insurance, but because once I spend 30k on it in a year, I get a companion pass so that means when I fly to Europe (even if it is in first class or business), I can fly with a friend for free. (I can actually fly anywhere that British Airways flies, but the most bang for my buck is usually Europe.)  Since those flights run 5k-10k in biz or first, that's a huge savings.  Southwest has a similar deal with a credit card where you can get a companion pass and your companion can fly free all year long with you on domestic flights. However, I don't know the ins and outs of that card as I don't have that card. 

 

Thank you for taking the time to respond. Very good information for me to start with.

 

 

[Etta1213]

17 minutes ago, balcony bound said:

That was a nice compliment.  I wear that badge proudly.  We left school proficient in reading mathematics, history, civics, and science.  Fought in wars, raised families, bought houses, saved for our retirements.

👍👍

[Babr]

2 hours ago, Eli_6 said:

 You should join some of the travel or points forums on the book (also not allowed to say the name). That is where I have primarily learned about the best travel CCs.  There are literally so many travel cards out there that have different benefits.  Some of them are definitely better than others.  I know for example on plat biz amex emergency medical transportation is provided at no cost if approved by them through their global assistance hotline at up to 100k. It also provides trip interruption, baggage loss, and cell phone insurance. Medical is now up to 250k per trip. (I looked it up in response to this thread. I thought it was 200k, but they upped it to 250k since I last looked it up.)  I am sure amex black offers even better but I think you have to have 500k a year in spend to qualify.  There is no min spend on amex plat but the fee is $799 after 09/26.  Gold has benefits, too, and the fee is more reasonable. I think the plum and green cards are either free or have a lower fee...not sure as I don't have one.

 

There is also a capital one card that you get by invitation (not the Venture X but even a different card) if you have a banking relationship with capital one that I was told has medical up to like a million. However, that is not who I bank with and it is too much trouble to change my bank considering I have been with my bank for 20+ years.

 

As an aside, I am talking about the plat biz because I can look at my own account. The personal platinum may have different or even better benefits...not sure.  There is also an amex black card, but the fee is the thousands and I think you have to have a spend of like 500k a year.  

 

There are many more that I don't know anything about and poster above apparently has unlimited medical on one so clearly there are even better ones out there.  I know a lot of people like the Chase Ink cars (business cards) and the Chase Sapphire, Chase Sapphire Preferred, Capital One Venture X, Citi Premier, etc.  There are co-branded cards with airlines, too, like am Amex Platinum Delta, a SW card, an American Airlines card, an Aer Lingus, Iberia, BA, etc.

 

My favorite is actually a British Air card offered by Chase and it only has a $95 annual fee. However, the reason I like it is not because of the insurance, but because once I spend 30k on it in a year, I get a companion pass so that means when I fly to Europe (even if it is in first class or business), I can fly with a friend for free. (I can actually fly anywhere that British Airways flies, but the most bang for my buck is usually Europe.)  Since those flights run 5k-10k in biz or first, that's a huge savings.  Southwest has a similar deal with a credit card where you can get a companion pass and your companion can fly free all year long with you on domestic flights. However, I don't know the ins and outs of that card as I don't have that card. 

 

 

 

 

Are you talking about Emergency Medical or Travel Accident? Not the same thing.

 

FYI: The PP with unlimited coverage is from Canada. That is not the same thing, either.

[Elaine5715]

4 hours ago, 2wheelin said:

This only works until it doesn’t. I would rather lose $50 in cash than hassle with the cc company over a $1000 fraudulent charge. Sometimes it goes well and other times not so much. We just had a fraudulent $150 charge posted to a card which had been canceled the day before because of fraudulent activity. This new charge will take up to 90 days for them to “investigate” and meanwhile it is on our billing statement. Many phone calls to the cc company which will only transfer to frauds dept AFTER canceling your current card (which in our case was the new one issued two days prior).

This is Master Card which I think you will agree is one of the major companies and not one we need to discount.

Not to mention that hassle if that compromised credit card was the one attached to your cruise account.  

[john91498]

lol, you folks will argue about anything...even insurance...lol...

[canes20]

12 hours ago, john91498 said:

lol, you folks will argue about anything...even insurance...lol...

[sparks1093]

12 hours ago, john91498 said:

lol, you folks will argue about anything...even insurance...lol...

I've learned a lot from all of these "arguments" over the years. 

[Joebucks]

Travel insurance is one of the biggest wastes in most cases (and insurance in general). Now, if you are a 75 year old, with health issues, going from continent to continent for a month, I could see it. Know what you have, know what you need, compare the best options. The fear instilled into young, healthy, people to buy "any" policy for a short Caribbean cruise is unreal. If I bought insurance on every trip I took, I'd be so far behind. Insurance is also full of exclusions. No two policies are the same. Even that company you went with 3 years ago, may have changed their terms. They are not plans that throw money at you at your slightest inconvenience. They generally cover, statistically unlikely events, with plenty of protections for the organization.

 

Now, I will say that I use my Chase Sapphire Reserve for travel for "travel insurance," and well the total bundle of that product just makes complete sense for me, for travel. My health insurance also covers me internationally. Doubling, or even tripling up on coverage would be absolutely pointless, and that's not up for debate.

 

Now what is non-negotiable to me for out-of-country travel is

- A passport

- Small amount of cash

- A credit card with a decent limit

 

The fear some of you have with credit cards overseas is also pretty wild. I've had cards hacked here in the states too. The CC company always takes care of it. Much better than losing cash or being limited in cash overseas.