Cancelled Ports

[jonthomas]

39 minutes ago, ak1004 said:

 

Celebrity has larger ships compared to lines like O, V, SS or SB, maybe this is the reason? Larger ships might be less sensitive to bad weather and waves? I'm just guessing here, really have no insights.

 

I don't believe the "environmental, climate change etc" BS for a second. The shortened ports are definitely beneficial to O financially - but not cancelled ports. This is different.

Yes I agree.

[Jockocruiser]

In the BIG picture, don't these issues simply exemplify a problem of poor management - and even worse corporate communication?
    As companies grow and founders retire, larger companies acquire smaller brands, diverse groups consolidate, the ability to manage becomes increasingly difficult.  
    Synergy is often stated as reasons for corporate acquisitions.  In fact, the result frequently is a loss of key personnel, tighter budgets, different cultures, nonsensical meetings, and poor outcomes.  While you’re at it, throw in some rhetoric about ESG, CRT, BLM and climate change to really lose focus of the primary business goals.

    Only very well managed companies with superior leadership rise to the top.  Others strive to become better competitors. While some are content to earn big pay for mediocre results.

[shepherd really]

1 hour ago, Jockocruiser said:

In the BIG picture, don't these issues simply exemplify a problem of poor management - and even worse corporate communication?
  

No, because there is no concrete proof that these claims represent actual problems and are not simply anecdotal and unrelated events.

[jonthomas]

Very hard to prove that shortened port times are a cost cutting measure, but I can't see it as anything else.

[Acrusa]

Do we think if a cruise line docks there ship in a port from 8 am to 5 pm,and then decided to leave at 2 pm they get a refund for leaving early? I doubt it. 

Plus the extra expense of fuel.

[jonthomas]

They can go much slower to the next port, thus saving  fuel.

And if staying in port less hours costs the cruise line less, BINGO !

[clojacks]

13 minutes ago, jonthomas said:

They can go much slower to the next port, thus saving  fuel.

And if staying in port less hours costs the cruise line less, BINGO !

Think of what they could save if they never left their home port and just docked as a floating AI for a week…

[basor]

12 minutes ago, jonthomas said:

They can go much slower to the next port, thus saving  fuel.

And if staying in port less hours costs the cruise line less, BINGO !

In fact they have a whole department dedicated to looking at each cruise and each port to figure out how to maximize cost savings by cutting time in port and/or canceling the port all together.  It is a full time job but cutting cost is the most important aspect for the cruise lines and having happy clients do not matter - at least that is what I have learned from all of the conspiracy theories for this topic.

[Acrusa]

The longer the passenger's are on board the more they spend and gamble ,makes more sense then saving fuel.But the fuel may figure into it.as a savings 

Edited October 15, 2023 by Acrusa

[LHT28]

4 minutes ago, Acrusa said:

The longer the passenger's are on board the more they spend and gamble ,makes more sense then saving fuel.But the fuel may figure into it.as a savings 

Really??

I spent  $20  in the casino  over  a 15 day  cruise

 

[Acrusa]

2 minutes ago, LHT28 said:

Really??

I spent  $20  in the casino  over  a 15 day  cruise

 

LOL I never go into the casino. Spend it on bottles of wine😀

[LHT28]

1 minute ago, Acrusa said:

LOL I never go into the casino. Spend it on bottles of wine😀

That is  what OBC is for 😉

 

[Acrusa]

4 minutes ago, LHT28 said:

That is  what OBC is for 😉

 

You are absalluty correct. Except for SM we don't do drink packages so OBC might be a little less.

 

[basor]

38 minutes ago, LHT28 said:

Really??

I spent  $20  in the casino  over  a 15 day  cruise

 

You re the big time spender !!!  I spent $2.00 and have a voucher for $.20......going to turn it in and put another $1.80 with it during our next cruise 😜

 

[ak1004]

54 minutes ago, Acrusa said:

The longer the passenger's are on board the more they spend and gamble ,makes more sense then saving fuel.But the fuel may figure into it.as a savings 

 

Just one small issue with this argument: casinos are operated by a thirds party, not the cruise line, so cruise lines have zero benefit from passengers being longer on board.

 

It's time to debunk those ridiculous conspiracy theories once and for all.

[SophieM]

1 hour ago, Acrusa said:

The longer the passenger's are on board the more they spend and gamble ,makes more sense then saving fuel.But the fuel may figure into it.as a 

Edited October 15, 2023 by SophieM
MIsread his post

[ORV]

4 hours ago, ak1004 said:

 

Just one small issue with this argument: casinos are operated by a thirds party, not the cruise line, so cruise lines have zero benefit from passengers being longer on board.

 

It's time to debunk those ridiculous conspiracy theories once and for all.

I can't locate it at the moment, but I think I read somewhere here once upon a time that NCL operates their own casinos. But I could have dreamed it. 

[pinotlover]

ORV;

 

Unless there has been a recent change, Oceania’s casinos are 3rd party operators. I would be extremely surprised if some type of POP arrangement isn’t in effect therefore giving Oceania motivation to be at Sea.

 

Captain Max gave a lengthy detailed summary of vessel operating costs on one of our Nautica sea days a few years back. Hourly port fees, along with port navigation people, is indeed a huge cost. Ships are charged by tonnage, not by passengers aboard. This is a disadvantage for Oceania ships. Some of the port fees quoted by the good Captain seemed outrageous. Oceania could never sell enough tours to come close to paying the port fees. However, some of those more expensive ports are where the ships have to bring on additional supplies because of logistical infrastructure. They can’t do it at anchor or remote ports. There desire to stay in those ports longer than necessary is nil.

 

While the many cruisers don’t care, others of us sign up for cruises strictly for the stated itinerary. Period. It is the marketing departments job to put together interesting itineraries to draw us in two plus years before sailing. Operations then determines how to maximize profits by eliminating controllable costs . Extended port times are controllable costs. Shave an hour here, and two hours there; and the savings can be significant. 
 

Don’t forget the store and casino POPs, the alcohol sales, etc, once at sea and/or all aboard.

[LHT28]

14 hours ago, ORV said:

I can't locate it at the moment, but I think I read somewhere here once upon a time that NCL operates their own casinos. But I could have dreamed it. 

No  not dreaming

I think it was about  2017 or there abouts it changed

" Casinos at sea"  is the program

[jonthomas]

Yup cruiselines probably do have a whole dept to figure out how to save and where to cut  to improve revenue.

[1985rz1]

23 minutes ago, jonthomas said:

Yup cruiselines probably do have a whole dept to figure out how to save and where to cut  to improve revenue.

I think it's called running a business so it earns a profit for it shareholders/owners and doesn't go bankrupt.

[pinotlover]

26 minutes ago, 1985rz1 said:

I think it's called running a business so it earns a profit for it shareholders/owners and doesn't go bankrupt.

With the dire financial straits that NCLH is in, it should be expected that Oceania would be grasping at cost reductions. Shaving port time is a cost reduction. Corporate and Communications can’t be used in the same sentence with Oceania. Not one of the things they do well. On our Vista cruise in June, we don’t believe the Captain decided on Embarkment Day to shave port time on three upcoming ports. There was zero reason why the passengers couldn’t have been informed of those changes well in advance so we could make alternate arrangements with our private tours prior to boarding. We’re disappointed in the cuts, we’re angered by the unprofessional way they chose to notify their customers.

 

Case in fact, they didn’t actually notify us of the cuts. One had to take the schedule given upon boarding and compare it with the previous itinerary to identify the cuts. Ship staff never brought the changes to any ones attention.

Edited October 16, 2023 by pinotlover

[all2me]

Trying to sort this all out. As always isn’t it likely that this port issue boils down to what’s most cost effective…as complicated everyone’s opinions makes this all sound for me. I do figure it’s rather play by play…day by day….
First time O cruise for us booked for almost a year now for Aug-Sept 2024. We have no extra perks at all….Not the previous Olife or now SimplyMore. Most Basic cruise fare for us. A La carte. We do often book a ship’s offered shore excursions….even if more costly…out of concern if it gets changed or cancelled…it “falls on” the cruise ship. We still have not booked any excursions. Sure hope we get this right. Feel more confused than other cruise lines we’ve used. We cruise for the itinerary, dates and costs. 

[rbtan]

We had this happen in Jan. They used the "Save the Seas hogwash as an excuse or windy weather(another excuse) Basically it was to save on fuel. We hightailed it to the Caribbean then putzed around. We got into a number of ports at 11:00 to 1PM. Short stays I'll admit. The missed ports we were refunded the port charge(which they HAD to do) If it is the same this Jan. on the Vista we may choose another line. We'll not grip. We'll just vote with our feet.

[rbtan]

On 10/16/2023 at 6:45 PM, all2me said:

Trying to sort this all out. As always isn’t it likely that this port issue boils down to what’s most cost effective…as complicated everyone’s opinions makes this all sound for me. I do figure it’s rather play by play…day by day….
First time O cruise for us booked for almost a year now for Aug-Sept 2024. We have no extra perks at all….Not the previous Olife or now SimplyMore. Most Basic cruise fare for us. A La carte. We do often book a ship’s offered shore excursions….even if more costly…out of concern if it gets changed or cancelled…it “falls on” the cruise ship. We still have not booked any excursions. Sure hope we get this right. Feel more confused than other cruise lines we’ve used. We cruise for the itinerary, dates and costs. 

We do basically the same. If we do know the island well, we may do our own excursion or do as you do as well.