Carnival Horizon vs. Celebrity Reflection??

[norwane]

Hello!

I am considering booking a cruise to the ABC islands next year.  Right now, it looks like my options are Celebrity or Carnival.  I've been on Carnival several times and do enjoy the laid back vibe (I also really, really appreciate the fact that Carnival now has Pepsi products, so I have Diet Dew available 24/7!!)  However, the last Carnival cruise we took, everything felt a bit cheaper?  I did feel like I was in a Walmart much of the time (that is not a slam, as I shop there myself!)  If we did do the Horizon, I want to get the Havana aft cabana's.  How are those?

My friend wasn't wild about all the kids running around.   Would there be more or fewer kids in the Havana area?

So, is Celebrity better than Carnival?   I wouldn't mind a bit more upscale, but I don't want to be around people who are hoity-toity, if that makes sense?

 

Thank you for your wisdom and advice!  🙂 

[x lindsay x]

Havana is exclusively for guests 13 years or older so kids running around shouldn't be an issue as long as you stay in the Havana area. There are generally more kids onboard during the summer months and school break times. If you avoid those times you will have fewer kids to contend with overall. 

 

I've had great experiences on Celebrity and great experiences on Carnival. They are certainly different but I think if you like peaceful pool lounging the Havana area will be ideal for your needs. 

[Illbcruzn4life]

9 minutes ago, norwane said:

Hello!

I am considering booking a cruise to the ABC islands next year.  Right now, it looks like my options are Celebrity or Carnival.  I've been on Carnival several times and do enjoy the laid back vibe (I also really, really appreciate the fact that Carnival now has Pepsi products, so I have Diet Dew available 24/7!!)  However, the last Carnival cruise we took, everything felt a bit cheaper?  I did feel like I was in a Walmart much of the time (that is not a slam, as I shop there myself!)  If we did do the Horizon, I want to get the Havana aft cabana's.  How are those?

My friend wasn't wild about all the kids running around.   Would there be more or fewer kids in the Havana area?

So, is Celebrity better than Carnival?   I wouldn't mind a bit more upscale, but I don't want to be around people who are hoity-toity, if that makes sense?

 

Thank you for your wisdom and advice!  🙂 

kids 11 and younger are not allowed in the Havana area. When we went didn't see more than 2 kids. It's more laid back in the Havana area so kids would probably be bored back there. We loved the Havana area on the Horizon.

[mz-s]

There will probably be fewer kids on an ABC cruise in the first place.

 

As far as which is better it depends on what you value the most in your vacation.

 

I would choose Celebrity for one reason - the casinos and all interiors are non-smoking. The rest of my feelings on the current state of Carnival's product are well-documented here, and there are many reasons why I'd prefer Celebrity over Carnival - but that one reason alone would push it over the mark for me personally.

 

Everything seems cheaper on Carnival because it is. There's no such thing as a free lunch.

Edited December 15, 2023 by mz-s

[kwokpot]

EVERYTHING on the Reflection will be far superior to the Horizon. I've been on both ships. The rooms are no comparison. Despite the Reflection not having a recent update the rooms will be far more luxurious than the Horizon, especially the bathroom. The buffet is no comparison either with vastly more choices and superior quantity. Carnival doesn't have lox at their buffet in the mornings but Celebrity does. That's just one small example. The shows are better and the ship is modern and upscale with real artwork throughout the ship. There's a real lawn with grass on the top decks. A great indoor pool that's adults only which the Horizon lacks. I could go on and on. The only major differences where Carnival is better is the waterparks, slides, and other doodads for kids and the young at heart. Additionally Carnival has separate venues for Comedy shows, piano bar, and main theater whereas Celebrity will utilize the main theater for all shows and alternate the types of nightly entertainment. So if you're a fan of nightly comedy shows which I know many Carnival cruisers are, you'll be a bit disappointed that there won't be nightly comedy shows.

Lastly Celebrity doesn't consider themselves the 'Fun ships'. In other words on Celebrity there isn't a constant push from employees and passengers to always have FUN. So the general energy is different on a Celebrity cruise. It's more laid back both in the ways the employees interact with the guests and the guests themselves. Some people think a Celebrity cruise is boring. You'll never see the same participation on a Celebrity ship for their deck parties as on a Carnival cruise. As long as you go into it knowing the cruise style is different on Celebrity you'll have an amazing time! 

Edited December 15, 2023 by kwokpot

[TeresaJ]

When are you sailing?  We sailed the Horizon 8 night last January and there were hardly any kids on board because it was after holiday break.  We rebooked for January 2025 and will be in a Havana cabin this time because we have heard it's pretty nice.  It is nice that no little kids will be in the Havana area. 

 

With that being said, Carnival is a family-oriented cruise line so if you are not sailing with kids and are looking for more of an adult-oriented cruise, then perhaps you should go with Celebrity. We have not tried Celebrity yet but have been checking into them more recently because our kids are in college now and don't cruise with us like they used to.

 

Regarding the Walmart crowd, I am curious what ship you were on? Also, we just sailed on Royal a few weeks ago and I felt the clientele was pretty similar to Carnival! Haha. I think (at least in my mind) that Celebrity might be more upscale because it's catered to adults.

[kwokpot]

2 hours ago, norwane said:

So, is Celebrity better than Carnival?   I wouldn't mind a bit more upscale, but I don't want to be around people who are hoity-toity, if that makes sense?

This is an interesting question and I'll answer it as honestly as I can. Celebrity has always had an excellent suites level cabins and when it was rebranded as Retreat Class they added some more amenities for those sailing in a suite cabin ( As with every cruiseline there have been some changes and cutbacks to the suites amenities which have loyal Celebrity clients up in arms, but that's another thread of discussion!). Because of this there are many, many more people that sail in a suite cabin than the rest of the mainstream cruiselines. If you peruse the Celebrity forum here on CC you'd think every single Celebrity customer sails in a suite. The majority of the questions and discussions revolve around sailing in a suite. Because of this and the older average age of a Celebrity cruiser you will notice a lot more people complaining about how much better it used to be and how things have gotten so bad (it hasn't). As I previously stated people who cruise Carnival are there to have fun, and the general attitude (I'm generalizing here) of a Carnival cruiser is to have a fun cruise and a fun time. So yes you may find more fuddy duddy passengers complaining about everything under the sun and having a sour demeanor. What I say to that is you do you own thing and don't like those negative Nancy's affect your enjoyment of your cruise. 

Edited December 15, 2023 by kwokpot

[Illbcruzn4life]

9 hours ago, kwokpot said:

EVERYTHING on the Reflection will be far superior to the Horizon. I've been on both ships. The rooms are no comparison. Despite the Reflection not having a recent update the rooms will be far more luxurious than the Horizon, especially the bathroom. The buffet is no comparison either with vastly more choices and superior quantity. Carnival doesn't have lox at their buffet in the mornings but Celebrity does. That's just one small example. The shows are better and the ship is modern and upscale with real artwork throughout the ship. There's a real lawn with grass on the top decks. A great indoor pool that's adults only which the Horizon lacks. I could go on and on. The only major differences where Carnival is better is the waterparks, slides, and other doodads for kids and the young at heart. Additionally Carnival has separate venues for Comedy shows, piano bar, and main theater whereas Celebrity will utilize the main theater for all shows and alternate the types of nightly entertainment. So if you're a fan of nightly comedy shows which I know many Carnival cruisers are, you'll be a bit disappointed that there won't be nightly comedy shows.

Lastly Celebrity doesn't consider themselves the 'Fun ships'. In other words on Celebrity there isn't a constant push from employees and passengers to always have FUN. So the general energy is different on a Celebrity cruise. It's more laid back both in the ways the employees interact with the guests and the guests themselves. Some people think a Celebrity cruise is boring. You'll never see the same participation on a Celebrity ship for their deck parties as on a Carnival cruise. As long as you go into it knowing the cruise style is different on Celebrity you'll have an amazing time! 

When did Celebrity restore the buffet to the point that they all these choices now. About 6 months or so the Celebrity board were going nuts with everybody complaining about X closing all but about 2 stations in the buffet

[kwokpot]

7 minutes ago, Illbcruzn4life said:

When did Celebrity restore the buffet to the point that they all these choices now. About 6 months or so the Celebrity board were going nuts with everybody complaining about X closing all but about 2 stations in the buffet

It was shortly after all the brewhaha that  Celebrity brought back all the choices for the dinner buffet. I was on the Apex in July and had dinner one night and all but two areas had food. Really couldn't have been any better. 

[jimbo5544]

19 hours ago, Illbcruzn4life said:

kids 11 and younger are not allowed in the Havana area. When we went didn't see more than 2 kids. It's more laid back in the Havana area so kids would probably be bored back there. We loved the Havana area on the Horizon.

I have stayed in Havana area 8 times, and other than when first announced (and kids other guests were allowed in the area in the evening) I have never seen kids in this area.  

 

 

[jimbo5544]

18 hours ago, kwokpot said:

This is an interesting question and I'll answer it as honestly as I can. Celebrity has always had an excellent suites level cabins and when it was rebranded as Retreat Class they added some more amenities for those sailing in a suite cabin ( As with every cruiseline there have been some changes and cutbacks to the suites amenities which have loyal Celebrity clients up in arms, but that's another thread of discussion!). Because of this there are many, many more people that sail in a suite cabin than the rest of the mainstream cruiselines. If you peruse the Celebrity forum here on CC you'd think every single Celebrity customer sails in a suite. The majority of the questions and discussions revolve around sailing in a suite. Because of this and the older average age of a Celebrity cruiser you will notice a lot more people complaining about how much better it used to be and how things have gotten so bad (it hasn't). 

Just trying to understand your comments about suites on Celebrity.  You are saying of posters here at CC, the majority are suite guests?

[kwokpot]

36 minutes ago, jimbo5544 said:

Just trying to understand your comments about suites on Celebrity.  You are saying of posters here at CC, the majority are suite guests?

What I'm trying to say is the majority of comments, questions, and complaints on the Celebrity CC forum are regarding Retreat Class. Is that a statistical analysis, no but it's a generalization. Peruse the Celebrity forum and you'll see all sorts of questions and comments about Luminae, the Retreat Lounge, and even questions and comments about the highest level multi room suites, the ones costs tens of thousands of dollars. These discussions are almost unheard of on Carnival solely because Carnival's suite class has very, very few amenities as compared to Celebrity. On Carnival there's no special dining room or lounge and only on the Excel Class is there an exclusive sundeck. Many of the most well known CC Celebrity forum posters sail exclusively in Retreat Class, and post extensively and has a loyal reader following. 

Even Celebrity's Spa Class, Aquaclass, has more amenities than Carnival's Spa cabins. 

[thundercrack]

What is the suggested dress attire for Dinner on Celebrity?  Definitely interested in Celebrity, but I am more a Polo Shirt/Dress Shorts most nights and Button Down Shirt/Dockers for "Elegant" Night.  Definitely do not like to "Dress up" for dinner, and definitely do not want to wear a tie!!

[kwokpot]

23 minutes ago, thundercrack said:

What is the suggested dress attire for Dinner on Celebrity?  Definitely interested in Celebrity, but I am more a Polo Shirt/Dress Shorts most nights and Button Down Shirt/Dockers for "Elegant" Night.  Definitely do not like to "Dress up" for dinner, and definitely do not want to wear a tie!!

Polo shirt or button shirt with dockers/chinos are fine for all nights at dinner on Celebrity including Chic Nights when jackets aren't required for men. By the book shorts are never allowed in any restaurant during dinner time. I phrase it that way since there will always be times when you see someone allowed in wearing shorts at dinner even though it's against the rules. 

Edited December 16, 2023 by kwokpot

[thundercrack]

8 minutes ago, kwokpot said:

Polo shirt or button shirt with dockers/chinos are fine for all nights at dinner on Celebrity including Chic Nights when jackets aren't required for men. By the book shorts are never allowed in any restaurant during dinner time. I phrase it that way since there will always be times when you see someone allowed in wearing shorts at dinner even though it's against the rules. 

Thanks kwokpot.  How about Polo Shirt and jeans?

[kwokpot]

2 minutes ago, thundercrack said:

Thanks kwokpot.  How about Polo Shirt and jeans?

That's not an issue. 

[thundercrack]

9 minutes ago, kwokpot said:

That's not an issue. 

Thank you

[jimbo5544]

1 hour ago, kwokpot said:

What I'm trying to say is the majority of comments, questions, and complaints on the Celebrity CC forum are regarding Retreat Class. Is that a statistical analysis, no but it's a generalization. Peruse the Celebrity forum and you'll see all sorts of questions and comments about Luminae, the Retreat Lounge, and even questions and comments about the highest level multi room suites, the ones costs tens of thousands of dollars. These discussions are almost unheard of on Carnival solely because Carnival's suite class has very, very few amenities as compared to Celebrity. On Carnival there's no special dining room or lounge and only on the Excel Class is there an exclusive sundeck. Many of the most well known CC Celebrity forum posters sail exclusively in Retreat Class, and post extensively and has a loyal reader following. 

Even Celebrity's Spa Class, Aquaclass, has more amenities than Carnival's Spa cabins. 

Got it, thanks

[Illbcruzn4life]

21 hours ago, kwokpot said:

It was shortly after all the brewhaha that  Celebrity brought back all the choices for the dinner buffet. I was on the Apex in July and had dinner one night and all but two areas had food. Really couldn't have been any better. 

Thanks. I haven't stayed up with the buffet saga. I was contemplating booking a cruise on X but after I read that I went a different direction.

 

Maybe I'll take another look at X.

[AstoriaPreppy]

On 12/15/2023 at 11:58 PM, Illbcruzn4life said:

When did Celebrity restore the buffet to the point that they all these choices now. About 6 months or so the Celebrity board were going nuts with everybody complaining about X closing all but about 2 stations in the buffet

 

The buffet cutbacks reported on CC were… somewhat overblown in our experience? It seemed to be linked closely to how full the ships were sailing: with high passenger load, more of the buffet was open, and when the ship was deserted they scaled back. One of the biggest issues was the removal of the station where they will grill a steak for you, but I believe that’s back? 

 

On 12/16/2023 at 8:28 AM, jimbo5544 said:

Just trying to understand your comments about suites on Celebrity.  You are saying of posters here at CC, the majority are suite guests?

 

On 12/16/2023 at 9:13 AM, kwokpot said:

What I'm trying to say is the majority of comments, questions, and complaints on the Celebrity CC forum are regarding Retreat Class. Is that a statistical analysis, no but it's a generalization. Peruse the Celebrity forum and you'll see all sorts of questions and comments about Luminae, the Retreat Lounge, and even questions and comments about the highest level multi room suites, the ones costs tens of thousands of dollars. These discussions are almost unheard of on Carnival solely because Carnival's suite class has very, very few amenities as compared to Celebrity. On Carnival there's no special dining room or lounge and only on the Excel Class is there an exclusive sundeck. Many of the most well known CC Celebrity forum posters sail exclusively in Retreat Class, and post extensively and has a loyal reader following. 

Even Celebrity's Spa Class, Aquaclass, has more amenities than Carnival's Spa cabins. 

 

We’re elite on Celebrity, and gold on Carnival, and we’ve got both Celebrity and Carnival trips booked next year. I would absolutely agree with the above comments. Especially, compared to other boards on Cruise Critic, the Celebrity boards tend to be a very specific type of Celebrity passenger… not representative of the line in general, or people we encounter on the line.

 

I’ve found a LOT of what I’d describe as “pearl-clutching” on the Celebrity boards here. A dry piece of chicken or an issue with a room steward turns into a sky-is-falling situation where the entire line is imploding, which turns into reminiscing about the good old days of cheese trolleys and MDR servers doing flambé tableside. There’s also a belief by a lot of Celebrity board posters that the line actively reads and responds to what is posted on CC (they do not), so people make these impassioned cases that are only partly based in reality. There’s some valid points, but they turn into a weird vortex of hyperbole and hysteria that doesn’t really represent what’s going on.

 

I think Celebrity and Carnival are both good products. For social people and families, Carnival offers a great experience, and a good value… it’s a lot of fun, and the line focuses on making sure you’re having fun. We also love the fast casual dining options that Carnival has! Celebrity is going to be more chill and absolutely more upscale… but it’s not remotely the sort of elitist, exclusive rich person trip that the boards here would have you think. We still meet fun, social people every time we sail on Celebrity, it’s just not the main focus of the line. 

[kwokpot]

1 minute ago, AstoriaPreppy said:

 

The buffet cutbacks reported on CC were… somewhat overblown in our experience? It seemed to be linked closely to how full the ships were sailing: with high passenger load, more of the buffet was open, and when the ship was deserted they scaled back. One of the biggest issues was the removal of the station where they will grill a steak for you, but I believe that’s back? 

 

 

 

We’re elite on Celebrity, and gold on Carnival, and we’ve got both Celebrity and Carnival trips booked next year. I would absolutely agree with the above comments. Especially, compared to other boards on Cruise Critic, the Celebrity boards tend to be a very specific type of Celebrity passenger… not representative of the line in general, or people we encounter on the line.

 

I’ve found a LOT of what I’d describe as “pearl-clutching” on the Celebrity boards here. A dry piece of chicken or an issue with a room steward turns into a sky-is-falling situation where the entire line is imploding, which turns into reminiscing about the good old days of cheese trolleys and MDR servers doing flambé tableside. There’s also a belief by a lot of Celebrity board posters that the line actively reads and responds to what is posted on CC (they do not), so people make these impassioned cases that are only partly based in reality. There’s some valid points, but they turn into a weird vortex of hyperbole and hysteria that doesn’t really represent what’s going on.

 

I think Celebrity and Carnival are both good products. For social people and families, Carnival offers a great experience, and a good value… it’s a lot of fun, and the line focuses on making sure you’re having fun. We also love the fast casual dining options that Carnival has! Celebrity is going to be more chill and absolutely more upscale… but it’s not remotely the sort of elitist, exclusive rich person trip that the boards here would have you think. We still meet fun, social people every time we sail on Celebrity, it’s just not the main focus of the line. 

I concur with all the points you have made. Within the span of a few months we will have or will be sailing on four different cruises lines; Just completed a cruise on the new NCL Viva (after a hiatus of 6 years); A Christmas cruise on Royal's Anthem of the Seas; A B2B on Celebrity's Ascent in January; And Carnival's Celebration in February. It will be a great way to compare and contrast the current state of the mainstream cruiselines. I still suspect Celebrity will remain our favorite cruiseline despite some drawbacks that are important to me (namely a more robust Spa thermal suite that includes a water feature and more non-heated lounging space).

[Itchy&Scratchy]

we are trying both next year. 🙂

Yes, Celebrity will be a bit more upscale, but also more laid back and "older".

 

P.S. We'll be in an inside cabin on Reflection and I'll write a review after the cruise. We are not upscale and we do not dress up for MDR (but no shorts either).

Edited December 17, 2023 by Itchy&Scratchy

[Itchy&Scratchy]

On 12/15/2023 at 1:44 PM, mz-s said:

There will probably be fewer kids on an ABC cruise in the first place.

I disagree. Both of our ABC cruises next year are during school breaks - Spring break and Thanksgiving break. There will be lots of kids on both.

[mz-s]

16 minutes ago, Itchy&Scratchy said:

I disagree. Both of our ABC cruises next year are during school breaks - Spring break and Thanksgiving break. There will be lots of kids on both.

 

Congratulations?

[Itchy&Scratchy]

42 minutes ago, mz-s said:

 

Congratulations?

we don't care either way. We travel with a child who doesn't care for kid's club.