Celebrity at it again, I guess the new CEO can’t seem to tell the truth!

[pzsdd6]

31 minutes ago, PTC DAWG said:

If I don’t like the price of something,  I don’t buy it, works for me every time. 
 

 

Simple answer for a simple example, but not apples to apples.

lets say you walked into a store to buy a widget. The sales person says “ are you married or single?” Most people, before answering the question, would ask why does it matter? “Because Sir, if you are married, we charge $50 each, $100 total, for you and your significant other, if you are single, we charge you $150 for one”

Is there anyone that would not be bothered by that? If that doesn’t bother you……

Edited June 13 by pzsdd6

[TGfromTX]

1 hour ago, pcur said:

However, on RCCL I do benefit from the C&A promo code that allows me to pay a 50% supplement instead of 100%.

 

 

What is C&A?  Where do you get this code?

[markeb]

7 minutes ago, pzsdd6 said:

Simple answer for a simple example, but not apples to apples.

lets say you walked into a store to buy a widget. The sales person says “ are you married or single?” Most people, before answering the question, would ask why does it matter? “Because Sir, if you are married, we charge $50 each, $100 total, for you and your significant other, if you are single, we charge you $150 for one”

Is there anyone that would not be bothered by that? If that doesn’t bother you……

But that’s not what they’re doing. They’ve set a market value where the cabin generates the same revenue regardless of occupancy. And apparently people are paying it or they’d price it differently. It would be nice and better optics if they’d find that revenue elsewhere, but if people (not you, clearly) pay, why would they?

[rmalbers]

Going back to the OP, I don't think the new (not new anymore) president of X has any control or probably any real influence,  over cabin pricing on X.

[NutsAboutGolf]

2 minutes ago, pzsdd6 said:

Simple answer for a simple example, but not apples to apples.

lets say you walked into a store to buy a widget. The sales person says “ are you married or single?” Most people, before answering the question, would ask why does it matter? “Because Sir, if you are married, we charge $50 each, $100 total, for you and your significant other, if you are single, we charge you $150 for one”

Is there anyone that would not be bothered by that? If that doesn’t bother you……

Im not saying it’s right but X sounds like they are charging solos more to make up for the second person’s anticipated on board spend

[pzsdd6]

11 minutes ago, markeb said:

But that’s not what they’re doing. They’ve set a market value where the cabin generates the same revenue regardless of occupancy. And apparently people are paying it or they’d price it differently. It would be nice and better optics if they’d find that revenue elsewhere, but if people (not you, clearly) pay, why would they?

Yes, that’s exactly what they are doing. I’m just calling them out for trying to meet their market value at the sole expense of solo travelers! It’s wrong! And to make matters worse, when they do get called out and admit that it wrong, they then lie to us that they will stop the practice. It’s discrimination…….and it’s wrong. And it’s still going on, and Laura Hodges Bethge is condoning it.

Edited June 13 by pzsdd6

[Liao]

7 minutes ago, rmalbers said:

Going back to the OP, I don't think the new (not new anymore) president of X has any control or probably any real influence,  over cabin pricing on X.

Algorithm is the deciding factor.

[NutsAboutGolf]

11 minutes ago, TGfromTX said:

What is C&A?  Where do you get this code?

Royals loyalty program, Crown & Anchor.  I interpreted that the code is for Royal sailings and wouldn’t apply to X’s sailing

[Liao]

4 minutes ago, pzsdd6 said:

Yes, that’s exactly what they are doing. I’m just calling them out for trying to meet their market value at the sole expense of solo travelers! It’s wrong! And to make matters worse, when they do get called out and admit that it wrong, they then lie to us that they will stop the practice. It’s discrimination…….and it’s wrong.

While I may not like the policy, it certainly is not discrimination.  As far as I know, solo cruisers are not a protected class.

[fnar]

On 6/8/2024 at 12:34 PM, ngrund said:

Oh, ok, Just wanted to make sure that wasn't the issue. I can't stand the deposit BS, but we have to deal with it.

"BS" is correct--Celebrity charges $1500 to make $900 deposit refundable ($900 for $500 on short cruises)! How is that legal? And it just makes deposit refundable, not whole cruise. Trying to figure out who to ask about this, Biden has talked a lot about "excessive fees" last few months, this sure is one.

[CruisingAlong4Now]

On 6/10/2024 at 9:53 PM, Ommadawn said:

 

Thanks so much for the information. I didn't think that it could be as high as 75% (simply a hyperbole by the poster), but it is interesting to know that North America makes up nearly half of the world-wide the cruising dollars.

More "independent" statistics:  2024-state-of-the-cruise-industry-report-final_seatrade-live-web-revised.ashx (cruising.org)

 

 

 

Number Single Travelers.pdf Passengers by Country.pdf Passengers by Region.pdf

Edited June 13 by CruisingAlong4Now
Corrected Attachments

[pzsdd6]

2 minutes ago, Liao said:

While I may not like the policy, it certainly is not discrimination.  As far as I know, solo cruisers are not a protected class.

“Protected class” is nothing but a legal definition intended for the courts and lawyers to use in legal proceedings in order hide other discriminations that are not rampant enough to get attention. This discussion is not nor was it started to see if their actions are legal or illegal, rather to just point out common sense when things are wrong.

[pzsdd6]

4 minutes ago, fnar said:

"BS" is correct--Celebrity charges $1500 to make $900 deposit refundable ($900 for $500 on short cruises)! How is that legal? And it just makes deposit refundable, not whole cruise. Trying to figure out who to ask about this, Biden has talked a lot about "excessive fees" last few months, this sure is one.

Valid point, perhaps you should start a separate thread, not relevant here.

[pzsdd6]

6 minutes ago, CruisingAlong4Now said:

More "independent" statistics:  2024-state-of-the-cruise-industry-report-final_seatrade-live-web-revised.ashx (cruising.org)

 

 

Passengers by Country.pdf 206.2 kB · 2 downloads Number Single Travelers.pdf 171.83 kB · 2 downloads

Thank you for those data points, once again validating my original point.

[At Sea At Peace]

11 minutes ago, pzsdd6 said:

“Protected class” is nothing but a legal definition intended for the courts and lawyers to use in legal proceedings in order hide other discriminations that are not rampant enough to get attention. This discussion is not nor was it started to see if their actions are legal or illegal, rather to just point out common sense when things are wrong.

 

Good points.  Considering the data just posted re: % of solo passengers, it would appear that the cruise lines (not just Celebrity, so many issues with Celebrity are issues with many sea ship cruise lines) should make more ship accommodations for solo travelers on new builds (more smaller solo-purposed cabins) and on refurbishments (eliminating existing cabin areas and replacing with smaller solo-purposed cabins).

[TGfromTX]

24 minutes ago, markeb said:

But that’s not what they’re doing. They’ve set a market value where the cabin generates the same revenue regardless of occupancy. And apparently people are paying it or they’d price it differently. It would be nice and better optics if they’d find that revenue elsewhere, but if people (not you, clearly) pay, why would they?

I feel like Celebrity, & RC as a whole, looked at the types of people that are pushing the cruising market and they started building infrastructure (ships, programs, etc) that would appeal to them.  Their intention is likely just to pull those travelers and the rest is just automated supply and demand pricing.  It feels much like an airline purchasing experience.  They are going to sell at whatever rate they can get - it's up to the customer base to control the rate.  I'm traveling solo, but there is no way I would have chosen this ship or RC as a solo traveler.  I was a double booking initially so the price I'm paying is at a very good value for any ship.  But their practice as discrimination.  I'm not paying $15 at a drive thru for a fast food joint burger when I can go sit in a restaurant and have one freshly made for $10.  I don't like it, so I spend my money elsewhere. But plenty of people are keeping the drive thru open so they see some value in it.  Each ship that is built seems to have more and more solo cabins - if they continue doing this, the number of cabins should meet demand and push the prices down.  

One item to note is that these solo cabins aren't the same size of doubles.  They are smaller & I believe every one of the verandas have blocked views.  The verandas are right next to the elevator banks also.  If you buy a solo room at double+ rate, please don't let them take advantage of you by booking you in one of those.  At least get equal space and view.  

[jelayne]

36 minutes ago, NutsAboutGolf said:

Im not saying it’s right but X sounds like they are charging solos more to make up for the second person’s anticipated on board spend

Yes, much of the profit is in the on board spending and making a profit is the name of the game with for profit businesses.

[Liao]

10 minutes ago, TGfromTX said:

I feel like Celebrity, & RC as a whole, looked at the types of people that are pushing the cruising market and they started building infrastructure (ships, programs, etc) that would appeal to them.  Their intention is likely just to pull those travelers and the rest is just automated supply and demand pricing.  It feels much like an airline purchasing experience.  They are going to sell at whatever rate they can get - it's up to the customer base to control the rate.  I'm traveling solo, but there is no way I would have chosen this ship or RC as a solo traveler.  I was a double booking initially so the price I'm paying is at a very good value for any ship.  But their practice as discrimination.  I'm not paying $15 at a drive thru for a fast food joint burger when I can go sit in a restaurant and have one freshly made for $10.  I don't like it, so I spend my money elsewhere. But plenty of people are keeping the drive thru open so they see some value in it.  Each ship that is built seems to have more and more solo cabins - if they continue doing this, the number of cabins should meet demand and push the prices down.  

One item to note is that these solo cabins aren't the same size of doubles.  They are smaller & I believe every one of the verandas have blocked views.  The verandas are right next to the elevator banks also.  If you buy a solo room at double+ rate, please don't let them take advantage of you by booking you in one of those.  At least get equal space and view.  

I don’t understand as I believe the elevator banks are in the center of the ship, not on the exterior.  You are also not understanding of the definition of discrimination.

[At Sea At Peace]

34 minutes ago, CruisingAlong4Now said:

More "independent" statistics:  2024-state-of-the-cruise-industry-report-final_seatrade-live-web-revised.ashx (cruising.org)

 

 

 

Number Single Travelers.pdf 204.76 kB · 5 downloads Passengers by Country.pdf 206.2 kB · 2 downloads Passengers by Region.pdf 171.83 kB · 2 downloads

 

Forgot to thank you for the information as it adds to the discussion re: solo cruisers.  We did not know that the % was that high and the believe the industry should adjust to increase solo-purposed cabins on new builds and refurbishments.

[pcur]

1 hour ago, iandjm said:

You make some very good points however what celebrity’s expecting some single traveler's to do is the equivalent of going out for dinner on your own and being asked to pay 3 times for the one meal.
We all reluctantly accept paying for an imaginary person is part of having a solo cabin to ourself, of course with that we are also paying for the imaginary persons food and all other items we get included as part of the price. But to be asked to pay above the 100% cabin price is just wrong. It’s as unacceptable as an airline charging a solo traveler for 2 seats not just the one. 
we all have a choice of which cruise line we go with and as you say we do not have to pay the silly prices, but that does not excuse this immorally wrong practice. 

My main point is not the morally right or wrong of it all, but that I think of it as purchased goods, and I have the power of not giving my business to that merchant. 

 

In this case, my price comparison to a hotel room (with all the additional benefits of included food and entertainment, loyalty perks, etc.) keeps the "purchase agreement" in my favor. I always get my money's worth, or I don't buy it.

[TGfromTX]

4 minutes ago, Liao said:

I don’t understand as I believe the elevator banks are in the center of the ship, not on the exterior.  You are also not understanding of the definition of discrimination.

All the solo cabins with verandas (Edge class ships) are being built flanking the elevators.  If you open your door from a solo cabin, you'll be looking right at the people standing & waiting on the elevator to appear.  That is why the rooms are smaller - the extra space is being used for people to have a place to stand while waiting on the elevators.  You may have to look at the 5th floor layout to understand. & I have no doubt we will disagree on the definition of discrimination.  I don't think we'll agree on the definition of victim either.

[pcur]

53 minutes ago, NutsAboutGolf said:

Royals loyalty program, Crown & Anchor.  I interpreted that the code is for Royal sailings and wouldn’t apply to X’s sailing

Correct. 340 points with RCCL and a solo gets "the value of" a 50% solo supplement.  If the current promo offer is the same or more, then the solo cruiser gets that. There are blackout periods, too.

[TGfromTX]

Just now, pcur said:

Correct. 340 points with RCCL and a solo gets "the value of" a 50% solo supplement.  If the current promo offer is the same or more, then the solo cruiser gets that. There are blackout periods, too.

Does that translate to 340 days at sea?  I don't think I can afford double rates for a years worth of sailings...   😄  But I appreciate the info.

[PTC DAWG]

1 hour ago, pzsdd6 said:

Simple answer for a simple example, but not apples to apples.

lets say you walked into a store to buy a widget. The sales person says “ are you married or single?” Most people, before answering the question, would ask why does it matter? “Because Sir, if you are married, we charge $50 each, $100 total, for you and your significant other, if you are single, we charge you $150 for one”

Is there anyone that would not be bothered by that? If that doesn’t bother you……

I would head back out the same door I came in.

Edited June 13 by PTC DAWG

[pcur]

1 minute ago, TGfromTX said:

Does that translate to 340 days at sea?  I don't think I can afford double rates for a years worth of sailings...   😄  But I appreciate the info.

Solo cruisers get double points per day, plus extra points for sailing in higher categories of cabins.