Equal benefits for non-americans!!!!

[Sunny Sailing]

I guess that Oceania figures that it can fill it's ships with those from North America, so don't really care all that much whether the rest of the world sails with them or not.

 

It then becomes our choice to accept (or not) that we will always have to pay a lot more to cruise with them, or to continue to battle for a fairer deal.

 

Who ever said that life (or cruising with an American Cruiseline) was fair!!!

[owl61]

Here is my email to the US Dept of Justice. I won't be surprised if they refer me to the Federal Trade Commission.

 

Many cruise lines appear to charge their world wide distributors and wholesalers different prices for the identical cruise products/services. For example, cruise wholesalers and distributors in Australia pay more for the identical RCL,Ltd or Carnival Corp cruise product than their American counterparts. These Australian distributors and wholesalers, in turn, must charge their consumers higher prices for the identical cruise. The cruise lines then prohibit cross border sales, that is, RCL, Ltd and Carnival Corp expressly prohibit travel agents in one country from selling a cruise product to a resident outside that country. Australian consumers cannot buy the cruise from an American wholesaler/travel agency even if the price is cheaper. Do the antitrust unfair competition laws allow this conduct?

Thank you for your consideration.

[lahore]

Sunny: that's the only conclusion I can draw too, unfortunately.

 

Owl: Great, thanks. I will be so interested to see what response you receive. I have neither the funds nor the legal knowledge to follow this through in any way other than trying to rattle the cage of the cruiselines.

[meow!]

However, if my booking address doesn't match the address in my passport, I wonder what COULD happen?

There is no address on your passport other than your place of birth and where the passport was issued. Who is to tell where is your residency from those data? You could be an immigrant carrying the passport of your birth country, and renewed your passport in that country, just for arguments sake.

 

Only congress/parliament can make laws. The cruise line's private contract between them and whole salers are only binding on them. While the cruise line by contract does not want to sell you the cruise, you are not forbidden to buy it from someone else! You can claim to be from country X while carrying a passport of country Y. In this day and age, even some married couples carry different passports, so what?! In New York's photo-video mail order stores, often, for the same product, there is a grey market version (not sold through the national distributer) cheaper and without local warrenty, and the distributor sanctioned version, more expensive and with local warrenty. They exist side by side in the same store. What I mean is that you cannot buy smuggled goods, but you can buy grey market goods!

[LHT28]

LHT28: with respect, this time it was your comment that made me cross (e.g.,):

 

"Not too much more in price difference it could be in the Australian taxes or other surcharges they apply.... $650-750 difference

 

You cannot just look at he prices you have to check what is included in the pricing"

 

Please - I (and I know that Aussie Gal is too) am a well travelled person with a PhD and excellent web-based research skills. I found your response patronising. .

 

Sorry did not mean to be patronizing

It is unfortunate that the cruise lines do business this way.

[lahore]

Meow, I guess you are right. I just find it difficult to believe that the cruise lines would establish such an ostensibly binding rule, and then allow it to be flouted so easily. I would like to think it’s possible, but I don’t know if I would want to be the test case. Especially with past passenger numbers – it’s going to be pretty easy to prove that I don’t actually live in the USA if they wanted to go to that length.

I know addresses aren’t in Passports, but they are in immigration documentation… although I agree that probably wouldn’t be seen by the cruiselines until it was too late (for a first cruise anyway).

LHT28: Apology accepted with thanks – for me it’s a case of careful budgeting allows luxury travel. I know many on this board can splash hundreds of USD about like it means nothing, but unfortunately I am not one of them. :(

[Aussie Gal]

I too feel that we are being discriminated against because we don't live in the U.S. Why should citizens of one country pay nearly double of what the citizens of another pay for the same product. Surely that is against the Trade Practices Act and in this era of Global economy we should all be equal.

 

If shove came to push, I would try to use a false address in the U.S. but I wouldn't be happy going down that path. Like Lahore, I would be afraid of being turned away at the gangplank and it would be very hard to claim insurance for something like that.

 

I feel that the cruiselines should not be coercing with their wholesalers both in the U.S. and down here.

 

Jennie

[dharmapath]

I believe this thread is a lesson in a free market economy. Producers of products will price the goods at what the market will bear. The price fluctuations in different world markets vary with many services and products due to all sorts of reasons. In America I would like to think we vote with our dollars. If you think a product is not a value, choose an alternative and do not give money to Oceania.

[lahore]

In America I would like to think we vote with our dollars. If you think a product is not a value, choose an alternative and do not give money to Oceania.

 

I presume that you mean the USA when you say "America" Dharmapath, because I think Owl61 is from South America and I doubt that he would empathise with your line of thinking. I do tire of 'oh well, it's all right for us so stuff you'. How would you feel if the prices of all the cruises coming up in your lengthy signature line suddenly doubled? Or is that just our dharma down here for some reason?

[LHT28]

LHT28: Apology accepted with thanks – for me it’s a case of careful budgeting allows luxury travel. I know many on this board can splash hundreds of USD about like it means nothing, but unfortunately I am not one of them. :(

 

Neither are we. :(

[Wendy The Wanderer]

Ok I got it now...

 

This happened to us when we booked a cruise here in Canada in 2004. Our dollar has been strengthening gradually for the last 4 years, and between booking and final payment, it went up substantially. But the cruise line (not O), apparently buys its foreign currency in bulk for future foreign bookings, so they expect payment in CDN.

 

We lost at a bit on that one. It's why we book in the US now, and has worked well with our dollar now around par. Of course, we might speculate in the other direction some day in future. Luckily we have that option here, as should everybody.

[LHT28]

This happened to us when we booked a cruise here in Canada in 2004. Our dollar has been strengthening gradually for the last 4 years, and between booking and final payment, it went up substantially. But the cruise line (not O), apparently buys its foreign currency in bulk for future foreign bookings, so they expect payment in CDN.

 

We lost at a bit on that one. It's why we book in the US now, and has worked well with our dollar now around par. Of course, we might speculate in the other direction some day in future. Luckily we have that option here, as should everybody.

 

Yes Wendy ..we were getting the shaft for many years with our $$.

In 2003 we paid .65 on the dollar...that was one expensive cruise for us.

 

Some cruise lines will not let Canadians book direct you have to go through the wholesaler in Canada at their higher exchange rate.

Now with being able to book with U.S. agents increasing it works better except if something goes wrong we do not get protection from TICO!!

There are advantages & disadvantages;)

[pondnana]

Why can't you lovely people downunder (or aliens as you were called on our last Oceania cruise) pay in US dollars and have the conversion done by your credit card co. That is what we do here in Canada.

[dharmapath]

I presume that you mean the USA when you say "America" Dharmapath, because I think Owl61 is from South America and I doubt that he would empathise with your line of thinking. I do tire of 'oh well, it's all right for us so stuff you'. How would you feel if the prices of all the cruises coming up in your lengthy signature line suddenly doubled? Or is that just our dharma down here for some reason?

 

Sorry I should have qualified America as USA. But you should correct the original poster as they use that term in the title and body of their post.

 

"Or is that just our dharma down here for some reason?"

 

Yep. I was just trying to put a very simple point to the board. There are things that are not fair in the world. But I look at what I am willing to accept as a fair price. I know even here when I book a cruise, someone will most likely get a lower price than me. Is it fair? I don't know but it is what it is and like I said before, If I don't like the price, then I will go somewhere else with my money.

 

I do understand why everyone is upset with this situation, and I am not trying to add fuel to the fire. Just wanted to post my opinion.

[dharmapath]

I presume that you mean the USA when you say "America" Dharmapath, because I think Owl61 is from South America and I doubt that he would empathise with your line of thinking. I do tire of 'oh well, it's all right for us so stuff you'. How would you feel if the prices of all the cruises coming up in your lengthy signature line suddenly doubled? Or is that just our dharma down here for some reason?

 

For what it's worth, I normally cruise solo which means I pay up to double already. I don't like it but if that's what it takes for me to cruise then I have to accept it.

[Aussie Gal]

. But I look at what I am willing to accept as a fair price. I know even here when I book a cruise, someone will most likely get a lower price than me. Is it fair? I don't know but it is what it is and like I said before, If I don't like the price, then I will go somewhere else with my money.

 

I realize that one can go from agent to agent to get different prices for cruises but that only happens in the U.S. and then the discount is only in the hundreds.

 

Down here we are stuck with a more or less standard price which is as I pointed out above in one of my posts is actually thousands more than what the citizens of both the U.S. and Canada pay (nearly double) and that is what we are so upset about.

 

We are being discriminated because we are now not allowed to book through an U.S. agent for an Oceania cruise unless we use a false address in the U.S. which is really against one's principles.

 

In other words, if one wants to cruise on Oceania, and they live in either Australia or New Zealand, then they either have to pay nearly double for the privilege by using an Australian T.A., or use a false address and use a T.A. in the States.

 

Some I know, will not be cruising with Oceania but will go with a cruiseline that doesn't have such unfair rules.

 

Jennie

[lahore]

For what it's worth, I normally cruise solo which means I pay up to double already. I don't like it but if that's what it takes for me to cruise then I have to accept it.

 

Yep, OK, so double that again and know that the person in the cabin next to you is also single but paying 60% of what you paid. Feeling cheated yet?

[lahore]

Why can't you lovely people downunder (or aliens as you were called on our last Oceania cruise) pay in US dollars and have the conversion done by your credit card co. That is what we do here in Canada.

 

That's exacctly what I did last time Podnana - but that was because I purchased online through USA. In Australia you can't pay for anything in USD and they would look at you like you had two heads (and were indeed an alien) if you suggested it.

[Aussie Gal]

I actually did it once when I booked and paid for a HAL cruise but I had to pay for the privilege. I had to pay an extra 3%-4% to the wholesaler here in Australia just to have the payment in U.S. dollars, then the exchange rate wasn't the interbank rate but a rate far lower than we would get if we went to our Commonwealth Bank and bought cash. We saved a little on the fare mainly because the conversion rate is set 12-16 months beforehand for the cruises, though certainly not the amount that we can save if we pay directly to Oceania or a U.S. agent with our credit cards.

 

Jennie

[Sunny Sailing]

Why can't you lovely people downunder (or aliens as you were called on our last Oceania cruise) pay in US dollars and have the conversion done by your credit card co. That is what we do here in Canada.

 

 

Because wholesalers send the account in $NZ/$AUS at whatever conversion rate they have decided on = which is not necessary the current rate. (More money in their pocket!) This is one of the major gripes (see earlier postings by others).We are thinking about laying a complaint with the Fair trading Commission about it all :(

 

If we could pay in $US at the current conversion rate at the time of payment we would save ourselves a lot of money - I do not understand why we can't. Basically when someone has the monopoly on something (ie: Oceania Cruises) you have to like it or lump it. What we need "down under" is some competition!!! If anyone from Oceania reads this maybe they could consider that.

 

I LOVE cruising with Oceania, but eventually I guess we, sadly, like others will have to look elsewhere for better deals- at the moment we are still booking with them. We feel a bit guilty as we have recommended Oceania to many of our friends, and those who have sailed with them are now as frustrated as we are over the problems we have been discussing.

[Sunny Sailing]

This ended up being a repeat of an earlier message so has been deleted

[lahore]

I would happily be involved in a case to Fair Trading, my partner used to work there so I have a bit of inside knowledge. I doubt that they can help us with the cartel situation because it seems to be an offshore thing, but you never know. The other stuff could be a point of interest though (e.g. the exchange rate gouging). I wish there was someone in our slowly growing group of aggreived Aussies and Kiwis who had some legal knowledge.

[LHT28]

A I posted above in canada we have to use a wholesaler for some cruise lines at a higher exchange rate than the daily posted bank rate.

It is posted on many forums that the cruiseline set a rate of conversion many months in advance ..and are not quick to adjust it when the rates get better

Recently the CAD went above the USD and still the cruiselines were still charging Canadians up to 14 cents on the $$.

it is not unique to AZ/NZ

 

JMHO

If you can pay in USD to the cruise line of choice it is better for all but it appears in AUD as already pointed out to me that it is converted to local currency by the wholesaler.

It appears that the only way around the situation is to write letters to the cruise line of choice and keep doing so until they see the light.

Other countries want to be able to pay in the currency of our choice

The price for the cruise should be the same for all & if you have to pay currency exchange rates let you deal with you credit card company or bank not some 3rd party (wholesaler)

 

Off my soapbox

[meow!]

I LOVE cruising with Oceania, but eventually I guess we, sadly, like others will have to look elsewhere for better deals- at the moment we are still booking with them. We feel a bit guilty as we have recommended Oceania to many of our friends, and those who have sailed with them are now as frustrated as we are over the problems we have been discussing.

If as some of you claim on this thread, you folks Downunder are paying twice the U.S. rate, then why not consider cruising with Silversea instead? Silversea now actually has its own office in Australia particularly to develop the Australasian market, and likely (you can check it out) will not have these price doubling red tape. Silversea is a luxury line versus Oceania's upper premium (as the respective cruise lines themselves claim to be), and if their prices are roughly the same for you folks, why not try it?

 

http://www.silversea.com/form.aspx?ekfrm=33 (this is not an agency link, but a cruise line link showing their own Sydney office address)

 

In the long run, market forces will take care of themselves. IF Oceania has enough customers as is and therefore does not appear to value the Australasian market, that is their choice. Once Oceania has their new large ships in service, they will be hunting for new passengers and will perhaps dump the wholesaler and put in their own office in Sydney or Melbourne and bend over backwards to say how they value your business!

[Jancruz]

Can you use a relative or friend's U.S. address? The fact that you hold an Australian passport does not exclude you from buying things in the U.S. (lots of people with U.S. residency "green card" still use their original passports from foreign countries). You cannot break laws, but you can go around individual cruise lines' internal "rules" (their preferences for you to pay more)! Am I right? Perhaps Jancruz can comment on that!

 

There is only one way people from NZ, AU or UK can book with a US agent that is to have a US address

Jan

*****