Cruising: Big Money On the High Seans

[aliaschief]

Woops, I stand corrected. Still came away with the impression that NCL is probably not our cup of tea.

[kryos]

There wasn't really anything new that I saw on this program. They still have Park West selling art, though - I'm glad HAL decided to discontinue the practice. I wonder what will take Park West's place to replace the lost revenue.

 

Smooth Sailing! :):):)

LOL ... my guess is that it wasn't HAL that discontinued the practice, but rather probably Park West. Maybe they weren't making enough money on HAL ships to justify it any longer. Let's face it, according to that special, the cruise line gets a 20% cut on Park West's onboard sales. I don't for one minute think HAL kicked Park West off. That's a lot of change!

 

I also found interesting the fact that cabin stewards make $2,500 per month. I always knew they were well-paid ... after all, what idiot would leave his family for months at a time to work on a ship if he wasn't well-paid? And, please don't misunderstand me ... I'm not saying they don't deserve that money, but just remember what they are getting every month the the next time you feel sorry for them and think they are so overworked. $2,500 a month is not a bad piece of change for someone who, I would assume, has a relatively low level of job skills, and has all of their living expenses covered. Don't forget, they don't pay taxes on that $2,500 either. Take a look now at someone who lives in your neighborhood ... maybe a kid who is trying to earn some money over the summer months for college or starting his first job after high school. I doubt very, very strongly he is making anywhere near that, especially after taxes and living expenses.

 

Finally, I wasn't at all surprised to see that the one area on the ship that did not make their sales goal for the week was shore excursions. I figured that area wouldn't be profitable, especially on a Caribbean cruise. They tried to blame it on the weather, but I doubt the weather was entirely responsible. That particular sailing looked to me to be a "family-type" cruise and I honestly don't think too many families are willing to dump $300 or more for a shore excursion in each port. Where shore excursions could be profitable, and probably are, would be on more exotic itineraries such as Europe. There it is often easier just to do the cruise line's excursion rather than have to do all the work to set up your own.

 

Overall, though, I found it to be a great show and I enjoyed it. I honestly didn't learn anything from it that I didn't know, however. Of course, the cruise lines are in business to make money. Did anyone doubt that? I don't think Andy Steward was telling us anything we didn't already know. And of course onboard spending can make or break them each cruise.

 

I've said it before and I'll say it again ... I think these cruise lines made a big mistake years ago ... and it really hasn't very much to do with our current economy. They simply are building too many ships, without retiring too many of them. This is leaving the cruise lines with tons of capacity which I think they are going to have a real problem filling in the coming years. Yes, I heard that figure bandied about ... something about only 17% of the population has cruised. Well, did the executives in the corner office ever consider that maybe that 17% figure is all they are going to get? Maybe the other 83% are not interested in cruising ... or at least 60% of them? As shocking as it may seem to us, there are lots of people who have no desire whatsoever to get on a boat, and there's nothing you could say or do to lure them onboard.

 

So yes, I found the show interesting, but think it could have gone much more in-depth. One hour is not enough, in my opinion, to present the whole picture. Perhaps this should have been a series running for a few weeks?

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[esther e]

There originally was to be a second hour following, but since the president decided he needed to talk, it got cut to just the one hour. And, please, no flames on my comment -- I just hate to miss a show I'm looking forward to.

[Texas Tillie]

There originally was to be a second hour following, but since the president decided he needed to talk, it got cut to just the one hour. And, please, no flames on my comment -- I just hate to miss a show I'm looking forward to.

 

Don't think there is a second hour - they showed the same one hour show twice in a row. (Probably done to catch people in all time zones.)

[jtl513]

I also found interesting the fact that cabin stewards make $2,500 per month.

I think that must include the auto Hotel Service Charge, and not just a base salary.

 

There originally was to be a second hour following, but since the president decided he needed to talk, it got cut to just the one hour. And, please, no flames on my comment -- I just hate to miss a show I'm looking forward to.

No, it's just a one-hour show. The same show aired at 9:00p, 10:00p, and 1:00a (ET), and will be on again Sun night at 10:00p (ET).

[Mary Ellen]

Don't think there is a second hour - they showed the same one hour show twice in a row. (Probably done to catch people in all time zones.)

I agree. When I checked my TiVo this is being shown many, many times - all 1-hr.

[Boytjie]

There originally was to be a second hour following, but since the president decided he needed to talk, it got cut to just the one hour. And, please, no flames on my comment -- I just hate to miss a show I'm looking forward to.

 

No, is just one hour. I saw the last 10 minutes of it on CNBC last night and then they replayed it again and I watched the whole thing.

[swedish weave]

I think that must include the auto Hotel Service Charge, and not just a base salary.

 

I think you will find that $2500 is a bit low. Ask the stewards how many rooms they have to take care of, and multiply that by their share of the daily "service charge" of $12.00 per person. ( Example 25 rooms at $8.00 per day per room is $200.00 per day in tips alone for the two stewards. If they split evenly, $100.00 per day each times 30 days in the month is $3000.00 each per month. ( This is assuming that there are two people in each room and the stewards share of tips is $4.00 per person.

Not bad for people who make $10 to $12 per day doing the same work in their home countries. Maybe we know why they stay on the ships !!

[Koshlong]

I'm sorry but I don't agree that the cabin steward are well-paid at that amount. For how many hours a week? Fluent in a foreign language? Expected to be polite and smile at utter twits? Are they worth LESS than you are because don't happen to come from NA?

 

Yes, in their countries, the money is very good. But, they are NOT working in their countries...........

[kryos]

We both hours the same - the 2nd hour just a rebroadcast of the 1st hour?

 

Have them 'both' recorded so we can watch & zip through the commercials. :D

Wasn't that stupid? I was amazed by that too. When I saw the show was on for two separate hours, I stupidly assumed that one hour was the actual cruise, and the second would be about the 21-day drydock they did. Wasn't I shocked when I saw both hours were the exact same thing!

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[SDHALFAN]

 

I also found interesting the fact that cabin stewards make $2,500 per month. I always knew they were well-paid ... after all, what idiot would leave his family for months at a time to work on a ship if he wasn't well-paid?

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

 

What idiot would leave his family for months at a time to work on a ship if he wasn't well paid? Okay - well, a member of the U.S. Navy or Marine Corps comes to mind immediately.

 

I am not saying that they are idiots - far from it: they have my utmost admiration, and heartfelt thanks for a job well done - but I wonder how many people who feel sorry for the low-paid stewards aboard a cruise ship realise how very little money the enlisted members of our armed forces bring home? It is a crying shame, in fact a total embarassment, that our enlisted men and women in all of our armed services, who serve our country admirably and with a great deal of pride on their part, qualify for Food Stamps and indeed need to use them at times in order to feed their families.

 

The "Officer Class" does okay (daughter of an Air Force Officer and widow of a Naval Officer), although we would never be thought of as wealthy, and I am not whining. As long as we recognise our financial limitations and make our spending choices accordingly then we can get by very well but you need to understand that the enlisted personnel don't have that luxury. Unlike the stewards from Indonesia or the Phillipines the average "G.I. Joe's" U.S. Dollar is worth only one U.S. Dollar at home and they have to stretch that dollar until it is screaming for mercy.

 

So the next time you feel sorry for your steward because he is away from his family for months and months on end and is working almost 24 hours a day then please just take a moment to think about all the wonderful young American women and men who are also away from their families for months and months on end, working almost 24 hours a day, and who are also making it so much easier for you to sleep comfortably in your beds at night.

 

I love all the Indonesian and Filipino stewards it has been my pleasure to meet aboard my many HAL cruises but I have to admit that those I feel the sorriest for are the hard-working women and men in our Armed Forces and their families who have to make so many sacrifices also.

 

Valerie:)

 

p.s. The United States Armed Forces do not institute an "Autotip";):D

[kryos]

I'm sorry but I don't agree that the cabin steward are well-paid at that amount. For how many hours a week? Fluent in a foreign language? Expected to be polite and smile at utter twits? Are they worth LESS than you are because don't happen to come from NA?

 

Yes, in their countries, the money is very good. But, they are NOT working in their countries...........

What do you think the average waiter in a restaurant has to do? Basically the same thing. Put up with a lot of crap ... sometimes unreasonable demands ... making relatively low wages, and being totally dependent on tips ... and not tips from vacationers who may be in a good, or even charitable mood since they are on vacation. We're talking people who just got off from work and maybe had a lousy day, and who aren't feeling too generous when the time comes to leave the tip.

 

Yes, the cabin stewards work longer hours. I don't doubt that. It's part of the package they sign on for. But I still think $2,500 a month is "dammed" good for a wage, especially when you consider that $2,500 is not subject to U.S. taxes and doesn't get eroded by day-to-day living expenses. Most of that money gets sent right home to their families. I think the only things they need to pay for onboard the ship is perhaps a drink or two in the crew bar (where trust me, they pay a lot less than we do for a bottle of beer), and maybe items of a personal nature, such as soaps, toothpaste, etc. That's why they generally make their WalMart runs when in a port that has one.

 

So, I'm sorry ... but I disagree with you. The cabin stewards and waiters on the cruise ships do very well ... and that's exactly why there is such a long list of people that the cruise lines have to choose from when filling those positions. This long list, despite the fact that the job involves ten hours of work a day, and months away from one's family. It's still a great deal.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[Two@Sea]

I'm sorry but I don't agree that the cabin steward are well-paid at that amount. For how many hours a week? Fluent in a foreign language? Expected to be polite and smile at utter twits? Are they worth LESS than you are because don't happen to come from NA?

 

Yes, in their countries, the money is very good. But, they are NOT working in their countries...........

 

Uh, excuse me... but I think $1200 per week (salary plus tips) would be considered a very "well paid" position!

 

And, double excuse me... but what on earth does nationality have to do with their wages and tips, or anything else?

[kryos]

but I wonder how many people who feel sorry for the low-paid stewards aboard a cruise ship realise how very little money the enlisted members of our armed forces bring home? It is a crying shame, in fact a total embarassment, that our enlisted men and women in all of our armed services, who serve our country admirably and with a great deal of pride on their part, qualify for Food Stamps and indeed need to use them at times in order to feed their families.

Thank you for reminding us of this fact. Something we all should think about, huh? How about paying our armed servicemen and women who are off fighting overseas, whether it be on an aircraft carrier or land, $2,500 per month. Betcha they'd be thrilled with that kind of money, and gladly work 16 hours a day to get it.

 

We should all maybe remember that when we start feeling sorry for our cabin steward and all the work he has to do. Remember that he's getting compensated quite nicely for it. Shame the same can't be said for our hard working servicemen and women ... who not only work their tails off, but often don't even make it home at the end of their "contract." :(

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[kryos]

I think that must include the auto Hotel Service Charge, and not just a base salary.

I tend to think that was their average total compensation in a month ... salary, share of auto-tips, plus extra cash tips they receive at the end of a cruise.

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

[hammybee]

 

Didn't they say on the show that the ship got just 20% of PW's income? Maybe HAL wanted more of it?

 

That's what I heard and applied to the purchase being filmed, that was $4K. We'll never know the details....for example is 20% in exchange for the space, promotion, accounting and collections?

[Two@Sea]

SDHALFAN ~ I don't want to quote your entire post, but DO want to thank you for the reminder about our military. I wish my appreciation for each and every service person could be translated into dollars, rather than simple good wishes and heartfelt prayers for their well-being.

[hammybee]

 

I really wish that NCL would have shared the actual numbers with us as far as what each area breaks down to, but I did find them to be very accommodating in what they did divulge.

 

 

I am sure that the accountants at Carnival and RCL would love to know the actual numbers, too. :eek:

[iflyrc5]

On our last cruise we were able to have a good discussion one evening with our cabin steward - we did not discuss pay but he did say that he had been working on ships for 6 years and at the end of his current contract (late 2009) he would be going back home to Indonesia (don't remember the town) and with what he has saved would not have to return to the cruise ships and would never have work again. I don't know his age but he had a 5 year old son at home.

 

Also wondering about he statement on the show - does the $2500 include their tips or is that there salary? On HAL the room stewards (together) are getting $3.85 per day per person per cabin (The CD said that 70% of the $11 per person hotel charge went to the dining stewards and room stewards so assume team gets 35%). Assume 2 people per cabin that is $7.70 per day and our steward had 31 cabins so that is $238.70 per day in tips for the 2 stewards. Assume they divide it equally that is $120 per day per steward in round figures - average month has 30 days = $3600 per month in tips per person - did I figure this wrong???? $3600 in tips plus $2500 in salary for a 10 month contract is $61,000. That is sure more than our military folks make and some of them are gone from home for 18 months at a time.

[SDHALFAN]

I'm sorry but I don't agree that the cabin steward are well-paid at that amount. For how many hours a week? Fluent in a foreign language? Expected to be polite and smile at utter twits? Are they worth LESS than you are because don't happen to come from NA?

 

Yes, in their countries, the money is very good. But, they are NOT working in their countries...........

 

Oh, I have to say that I think that the cabin stewards are doing quite well, otherwise why would they even think about being away from their families for so long? Both the Indonesians and Filipinos are very family oriented societies, much more than we of the explorer minded societies are so they must think it is worth the time and the effort in order to make a better living for their families.

 

Now, as to having "to be polite and smile at utter twits" - please see my last post. The members of our Armed Forces (and no doubt yours also) not only have to be polite and smile at those utter twits but they have to salute them also if said "twit" is of a higher rank - how degrading must that feel if one thinks said "superior" is honestly a twit?

 

Valerie:D

[rochelle_s]

 

I also found interesting the fact that cabin stewards make $2,500 per month. I always knew they were well-paid ... after all, what idiot would leave his family for months at a time to work on a ship if he wasn't well-paid? And, please don't misunderstand me ... I'm not saying they don't deserve that money, but just remember what they are getting every month the the next time you feel sorry for them and think they are so overworked. $2,500 a month is not a bad piece of change for someone who, I would assume, has a relatively low level of job skills, and has all of their living expenses covered. Don't forget, they don't pay taxes on that $2,500 either. Take a look now at someone who lives in your neighborhood ... maybe a kid who is trying to earn some money over the summer months for college or starting his first job after high school. I doubt very, very strongly he is making anywhere near that, especially after taxes and living expenses.

 

 

Blue skies ...

 

--rita

 

 

rita,

 

I think you would be very surprised to learn that the crew onboard a HAL ship are in fact highly educated. A great many hold university degrees in various fields. The opportunity for a well paid job in their field in their home country though is slim. So they do what needs to be done to support their families and better their lives. I admire them all, especially the women. The women I have spoken to and gotten to know a little were all mothers. As a mother myself I can only imagine how difficult it must be to leave small children for so long and so far away. Women in the Phillipines and Indonesia do not have the same opportunities that we in North America do, nor do they have the necessary support systems that we can sometimes take for granted.

 

On your next cruise strike up a conversation with your dining or cabin steward about their education. I think you will find it very intersting.

 

Rochelle

[mek]

I was surprise whey they said 1/3 of their profits come from on board spending. Did I understand that correctly? I would have thought that number would be much higher. :confused:

[rochelle_s]

 

Also wondering about he statement on the show - does the $2500 include their tips or is that there salary? On HAL the room stewards (together) are getting $3.85 per day per person per cabin (The CD said that 70% of the $11 per person hotel charge went to the dining stewards and room stewards so assume team gets 35%). Assume 2 people per cabin that is $7.70 per day and our steward had 31 cabins so that is $238.70 per day in tips for the 2 stewards. Assume they divide it equally that is $120 per day per steward in round figures - average month has 30 days = $3600 per month in tips per person - did I figure this wrong???? $3600 in tips plus $2500 in salary for a 10 month contract is $61,000. That is sure more than our military folks make and some of them are gone from home for 18 months at a time.

 

 

The $2500 amount is inclusiive of the hotel service charge.....not in addition to.

 

Rochelle

[Koshlong]

Uh, excuse me... but I think $1200 per week (salary plus tips) would be considered a very "well paid" position!

 

And, double excuse me... but what on earth does nationality have to do with their wages and tips, or anything else?

$1200 a week would be a nice salary for one working a 40 hour week; but how on earth does $2500 a month become $1200 a week?

 

Most north Americans have the option of going to school to enhance earning; I don't have a whole lot of sympathy for those who don't take advantage............

 

Don't the staff pay income taxes in their home countries? And probably at a high rate, if they're considered "high end earners"?

If you think US taxes are high, just come north or go to Europe.

[Petronillus]

Have we gotten a bit far off topic? or at least off on a tangent?

The program was IMHO a good piece of journalism. It was neither a puff piece nor a "gotcha" piece of muckraking. I doff my hat to NCL for giving Peter Greenberg such free rein and access. And I for one am pleased that the on-camera NCL executives and representatives were so unashamedly forthright about the fact that they are in business to make money. The central point, though, in this regard was that they make money by helping the pax have a great vacation.

I had to rely on this thread, though, to learn of the overall impression while on an NCL cruise of getting nickeled and dimed at every turn.

On the other hand, there was no evidence, so far as I saw, of cutting corners or wringing the extra dollar out unfairly through manipulation.

Two ominous notes:

* The ubiquitous, all-seeing eye was reminiscent of Big Brother. Am I the only one bothered by this? Does HAL practice the same type and level of security?

* What passes for a good time on NCL is not my cup of tea. DW and I are better suited to the more sedate (dare I say, serene?) style of HAL. The shots of pax dazedly wandering on the pier or gyrating in the disco made me shudder! Is there no place on NCL for a graceful waltz or foxtrot?