Seabourn's "house wines"

[Nicho99]

laryrob,

 

My first cruise is coming up in December on the Sojourn. You mentioned good bourbon, my beverage of choice. Any high end bourbons on board or is Maker's their best?

[Emperor Norton]

laryrob,

 

My first cruise is coming up in December on the Sojourn. You mentioned good bourbon, my beverage of choice. Any high end bourbons on board or is Maker's their best?

 

Negative Ghostrider , pattern is full. Bourbon selection is a joke. Order ahead or bring your own

[laryrob]

Negative Ghostrider , pattern is full. Bourbon selection is a joke. Order ahead or bring your own

 

Last yr on sojourn had nice selection- some at up charge but had bookers,Blanton,knob creek,basil Hayden ...no Hirsch or wild Turkey Reserve though

[smilin jack]

drink some of their good bourbon with your steak!

 

Now your talking.........:D

[mick70]

Was Knob Creek an upgrade?

[vistaman]

OMG! Chenet Rose! The name jumped off the page at me!

 

2 euros 39 cents a bottle in my local supermarket, which is not the cheapest supermarket in town either.

 

The big selling point for the Chenet blended wines is the kink in the neck of the bottle.

 

They are the cheap of the cheap end of blended nondescript wines from the European Wine Lake, much of which is distilled into industrial alcohol these days.

 

I am so pleased to have read everything about this cruise line on CC, I always aspired to try it after Cunard, believing it to be a truly wonderful experience.

 

Now I have been made aware of the reality.

 

and ik you buy 5 bottles the 6th is for free...in belgium

[lincslady]

To be fair to Seabourn, this rose is by far the worst wine they offer, and surprisingly quite a few people actually ask for it!

[Chairsin]

Three Seabourn cruises in the last 18 months and I have never had to drink JP Chenet. We love rose with lunch and have always found other rose options on board( ad no, I don't mean white zinfandel!!!)

[philipb]

We are just back from a 33-day voyage from Fort Lauderdale to Buenos Aires aboard Seabourn Sojourn. I am posting a full ship review on the CC website which should be available to view in the next few days.

 

In the meantime, here is an update on wines. There is no list of freely available wines, but within 24 hours of getting on board I had worked it out. Others were still confused by the end of the voyage!

 

There are 6 white wines and 6 red (and a rose, I think).

 

The white wines comprise an Italian Pinot Grigio (ok for a glass at lunchtime but very ordinary), a NZ Sauvignon Blanc (drinkable, but no finesse - it must have been a cheap variety. I didn't recognise the label, despite being a regular drinker of NZ wines), a (screw-top) Petit Chablis (again ok, but very ordinary - one glass was usually enough), a Californian Chardonnay (which I always steer well clear of), a Chilean Sauvignon Blanc (which came on mid-cruise, was obviously locally sourced and was surprisingly nice) and ANother (details not remembered - French, I think).

 

The red wines comprise a Californian Syrah ('Brassfield') which was drinkable but undistinguished, a Cabernet Sauvignon from Washington State ('Two Vines') (ditto), an unpleasant Italian Sangiovese, a Chilean Merlot (ditto), a poor Cotes du Rhone (a Chateauneuf du Pape would have been a nicer choice) and a very hard-edged and unlikeable Pinot Noir from Villa Maria in NZ.

 

In my discussions with the F&B Manager, Marco de Oliviera, I established the following facts:

 

The price range for these wines is $6-10 per bottle. The average per diem consumption was running at three quarters of a bottle per passenger. Over a 14-day cruise this amounts to about 10 bottles per passenger. So, if Seabourn were to charge passengers an extra $50 per person for a 14-day cruise, they could spend an extra $5 per bottle on the wines and make a real step-change in terms of quality offered.

 

Marco made notes feverishly! Let's hope some of this gets sent back to Head Office and is acted upon, because at the moment the quality of the wines (indifferent to poor) is bothering too many passengers.

 

There is, of course, one flaw in my argument. If the ship offers better wines which the passengers actually like, then of course they might want to have an extra glass (or two!). This throws out my calculations!

 

I don't drink spirits, and have never drunk as little wine on this cruise as on any other cruise in the past 35 years. So, I guess Seabourn made a decent profit out of me. As we know, that's all the beancounters at Carnival really bother about these days.

 

Oh, BTW, the House Champagne (Nicholas Feuillatte) is drinkable, but better if made into a classic champagne cocktail (with sugar lump soaked in angostura bitters and a twist of lemon (peel only)). No sugar lumps on board, of course, so they used those little packets:).

[sananda]

Philipb - I had a similar experience with our cruise. The house wines were at best indifferent, but most were only worthy of being poured down the drain. Worst of all, they paired so poorly with the fantastic food.

 

Is there anybody from the Chicago area that knows about the liquor Jeppson's Malort? This is a spirit distilled from wormwood. I'll let Jeppson's own marketing describe it for the uninitiated.

 

"Most first-time drinkers of Jeppson Malort reject our liquor. Its strong, sharp taste is not for everyone. Our liquor is rugged and unrelenting (even brutal) to the palate. During almost 60 years of American distribution, we found only 1 out of 49 men will drink Jeppson Malort. During the lifetime of our founder, Carl Jeppson was apt to say, 'My Malort is produced for that unique group of drinkers who disdain light flavor or neutral spirits.' It is not possible to forget our two-fisted liquor. The taste just lingers and lasts - seemingly forever. The first shot is hard to swallow! PERSERVERE [sic]. Make it past two 'shock-glasses' and with the third you could be ours...forever"

 

The first time I had Jeppson's Malort, I literally thought I had been poisoned. Around here, people give shots as a gag, as some bizare rite of passage, or just to be mean.

 

I must really thank Seabourn for introducing me to the wine Egri Bikaver "Bull's blood". It is to wine what Jeppson's Malort is to liquor. This wine has a wonderful, tremendously colorful history, but is overpowering and tastes shockingly bad. I have been able to get my hands on a case and have taken great pleasure relating this backstory to close friends and serving them a glass with a straight face. The reactions some people have had have been priceless. Don't worry, the practical jokes go both ways and I make it up to them with the real wine I intend to serve. For the life of me, I can't comprehend how Seabourn served this wine in the main dining room.

[JaneBP]

Wine, one of the noblest cordials in nature. - John Wesley

[Silver Sweethearts]

philipb -

 

We disembarked the Sojourn in Fort Lauderdale the day you boarded, and wonder if you had a chance to try La Scolca Gavi - one of the house white wines served during our cruise and, if so, what you thought of that Italian offering?

[nowornever]

About the Columbia "Two Vines" you noted as offered on the wine list...if you hurry over before Sunday, you can pick it up at a local drugstore for $3.79 a bottle! I can almost picture the folks from the home office loading up the truck!

 

Thank you for your review of the Sojourn. You put so much time & thought in it and it is appreciated. I'm hopeful that your next cruise will prove better and you will let us know your thoughts. We will give the Spirit another try in May and hope that your well thought out & reasonable comments to the management are heard.

 

Happy Holidays & cheers (with a better wine).

[philipb]

Hello Silver Sweethearts, no I didn't come across La Scolca Gavi. Maybe you had drunk it all! ;)

 

Nowornever, thank you for the interesting pricing news about the 'Two Vines'. It convinces me that if ever I do go back on Seabourn then I should 'bite the bullet' and pay for the premium wine (unless of course they follow my advice and upgrade the offerings). I keep thinking of that well-worn (but true) saying "Life is too short to drink bad wine".

[lincslady]

PhilipB - I can believe all that you say, though I think you were particularly unlucky with the service and lack of hot food at dinner. I agree that the menus are unexciting, and the Chefs on board have little personal input, which must be frustrating for them. There is no doubt some of them produce better food than others, and that some galley staff and wait staff are more efficient. We have been generally lucky; never had cold food, but we tend to dine at a table for two, early in the evening, and usually succeed in finding really good wait station staff. Seabourn management should certainly take the final blame for what is probably the use of too many new staff in the galley and dining room at one time.

 

Regarding wine, although we normally find two or three whites and reds which are drinkable, I really wish Seabourn would stop describing them as 'fine wines', which they are certainly not, and call them, maybe, 'house wines' as some of the other lines now do. It is foolish to boast too much in brochures about what you provide unless you can fulfil the promise.

[philipb]

A good post, lincslady. It made me reach for the brochure again. P17 reads "enjoy complimentary fine wines offered throughout lunch and dinner". Yet again Seabourn are fooling us, by using the word "fine". A pity they don't fall under the UK Trades Description Acts!!!

Perhaps they would like to give me the job of editing the brochure!

[Godot]

Philip

 

Thanks for the review of the wines, we were on the Sojourn with you and generally agree with your assessments of the wines.

 

I was particularly disappointed in the reds that were available. The Two Vines Cab was disgusting. The Cote du Rhone was the best of the bunch, but that's hardly high praise considering what it was up against.

 

I would also agree with Silver Sweetherts that the Gavi was the best of the whites (by a wide margin in my opinion). It was available on the Valparaiso to BA leg, as we were able to restock our fridge with a couple of bottles of it.

 

Cheers, hope the wine situation improved when you got home.

 

 

philipb -

 

We disembarked the Sojourn in Fort Lauderdale the day you boarded, and wonder if you had a chance to try La Scolca Gavi - one of the house white wines served during our cruise and, if so, what you thought of that Italian offering?

[philipb]

Philip

 

Thanks for the review of the wines, we were on the Sojourn with you and generally agree with your assessments of the wines.

 

I was particularly disappointed in the reds that were available. The Two Vines Cab was disgusting. The Cote du Rhone was the best of the bunch, but that's hardly high praise considering what it was up against.

 

I would also agree with Silver Sweetherts that the Gavi was the best of the whites (by a wide margin in my opinion). It was available on the Valparaiso to BA leg, as we were able to restock our fridge with a couple of bottles of it.

 

Cheers, hope the wine situation improved when you got home.

 

Kevin - I've just finished dinner, accompanied by a lovely (Australian) Penfolds Grenache/Shiraz/Mourvedre 2007. So life is OK :)!!!

 

I can't think how that Gavi slipped under my radar (and straight into the 'fridge in your cabin!!!).

 

Merry Christmas!

 

Philip

[Chairsin]

On our recent cruise there was a lovely Penfolds St Henri shiraz on the wine list priced only 10% above retail. By and large many of the wines on the list are well priced. And with a 20% SB Club discount there is really no reason not to buy a few bottles during each cruise. I most certainly agree that they should stop calling the wines they pour gratis "fine" wines in their advertising but I will also reiterate that prices for SB cruises are lower than a few years ago so we should factor that into this discussion.

[sananda]

I think philipb and lincslady have hit upon the source of my frustration with Seabourn, their brochures and website are very deceptive. I was also fooled by the glowing comments on this website. Maybe things were different in the past, but in comparison to the true luxury lines and land based 5-star hotels, the Sojourn of 2012 was a farce.

[philipb]

I think philipb and lincslady have hit upon the source of my frustration with Seabourn, their brochures and website are very deceptive. I was also fooled by the glowing comments on this website. Maybe things were different in the past, but in comparison to the true luxury lines and land based 5-star hotels, the Sojourn of 2012 was a farce.

You couldn't sum it up better, sananda. As I said to Marco de Oliviera (the F&B Manager on the Sojourn) "Your worst enemies are your own marketing people. They set you up to fail every time."

[freddie]

"...in comparison to the true luxury lines and land based 5-star hotels, the Sojourn of 2012 was a farce."

 

Sananda - As we have become less satisfied with Regent and Silversea, we have been looking for a good alternative and have considered Seabourn to be that best option. However, you suggest that SB is not amongst "the true luxury lines". What lines do you consider would merit that distinction?

 

We are not so unrealistic as to buy the nonsense in the cruise line brochures and think that any cruise ship will be able to match the quality of food at a 5-star land-based hotel or restaurant. Therefore, we prefer to compare our options amongst cruise lines and cruise ships, without regard to land-based alternatives.

 

Thanks in advance for your kind response.

 

Cheers, Fred

[sananda]

Sananda - As we have become less satisfied with Regent and Silversea, we have been looking for a good alternative and have considered Seabourn to be that best option. However, you suggest that SB is not amongst "the true luxury lines". What lines do you consider would merit that distinction?

 

We are not so unrealistic as to buy the nonsense in the cruise line brochures and think that any cruise ship will be able to match the quality of food at a 5-star land-based hotel or restaurant. Therefore, we prefer to compare our options amongst cruise lines and cruise ships, without regard to land-based alternatives.

 

Thanks in advance for your kind response.

 

Cheers, Fred

 

I wish I had some good advice for you because I strongly feel that in an absolute sense, the best cruise lines do not compare favorably to the world's best hotels, even when you only compare equally priced vacations. That said, we continue to cruise because of the simplicity. There is never a discussion of where should we go / what should we do today. No extended discussion of where should we eat. We often vacation with the extended family and the ease of "no brain" cruising can be a godsend for us.

 

I too turned to Seabourn because I felt that Regent and Silversea have cheapened their product in recent years. I think with the difficult world economy, most, if not all, cruise lines have been cutting costs. Although Regent and Silversea aren't what they used to be, I still felt they delivered what they promised and, overall, was satisfied with recent cruises on these lines.

 

The problem with Seabourn was that I did not get what I paid for. I did not get what was promised in the various brochures and the website. Maybe the problems are specific to the Sojourn, maybe they are fleet wide. I really don't know. I do know that I am not alone. There have been a number of recent critical reviews of the Sojourn on this site and others by both professional reviewers and regular cruisers. If you have an AMEX Platinum card and are registered with them online, check out their August 2012 review of the Sojourn. They did a really nice job comparing the major luxury lines and found Seabourn to significantly trail the others.

 

I have always had a great experience with Crystal. That said, I have not cruised with them recently and don't know how they have cut costs. I also wonder what things are like now that they are all-inclusive.

 

Hope this helps.

[philipb]

"...in comparison to the true luxury lines and land based 5-star hotels, the Sojourn of 2012 was a farce."

 

Sananda - As we have become less satisfied with Regent and Silversea, we have been looking for a good alternative and have considered Seabourn to be that best option. However, you suggest that SB is not amongst "the true luxury lines". What lines do you consider would merit that distinction?

 

We are not so unrealistic as to buy the nonsense in the cruise line brochures and think that any cruise ship will be able to match the quality of food at a 5-star land-based hotel or restaurant. Therefore, we prefer to compare our options amongst cruise lines and cruise ships, without regard to land-based alternatives.

 

Thanks in advance for your kind response.

 

Cheers, Fred

 

I think the problem, in a nutshell, is that all the so called 'luxury lines' have been cheapening their product over the last decade by engaging in a covert pricing war. Cruises are cheaper now than ten years ago and the only people who suffer are the passengers. I would gladly pay 25% more to get better quality food and wine served by experienced crew members. When Cunard was Cunard (before it became 'Disneyfied' by Carnival) there were crew members on board QE2 with as much as 40 years service with the Line. You don't find that anywhere these days!

 

So, in answer to your question I don't think there are any true 'luxury lines' remaining. Perhaps some of the very small boutique lines qualify, but I'm not sure.

[dalliowner]

The problem is I doubt there are another 1800 people willing to pay an extra 25 pc every week.:D