Veendam failed latest cdc inspection

[sail7seas]

These inspectors may be working from the same rule book, but certainly individuals could interpret the rules somewhat differently. so things that got passed on the last inspection might fail this time. Since the rules are so stringent, a small variation could make a big difference. One would think that all of the inspectors examine a ship on a very standard basis, but in reality one inspector having a bad day could probably spell disaster for a ship. I would be more concerned if the review, or next inspection also produced a similar low score.

 

 

Maybe... ?

You might be making good points. :)

I hope so.

 

[iancal]

Oh, I am sure that the dismal failing grade from the CDC was just because of a few technicalities. Nothing to be alarmed at, and certainly not a reflection of conditions on the ship or staff morale..... Not! After all, some people do not have a problem with brown water dripping on plates that are subsequently used for/by cruisers.

 

Just as much as cruisers leaving verandah doors open is the reason for all the HVAC challenges on Veendam.

 

Let's NOT make excuses for HAL. The Veendam is one ship that has been going downhill from an engineering perspective for quite some time with no remediation by HAL.

[goodearth]

AND the lack of follow up from HAL is inexcusable. Everyone can hope things will get better.........but Denial (De Nile) is not just a river in Egypt!! :D:)

[Cruzin Terri]

These inspectors may be working from the same rule book, but certainly individuals could interpret the rules somewhat differently. so things that got passed on the last inspection might fail this time. Since the rules are so stringent, a small variation could make a big difference. One would think that all of the inspectors examine a ship on a very standard basis, but in reality one inspector having a bad day could probably spell disaster for a ship. I would be more concerned if the review, or next inspection also produced a similar low score.

I would tend to agree with you except the two inspections are so dissimilar.

The one in April really did not show any of the problems that the one in August showed. You really have to read both of them to see the difference. I would hate to think that the inspection in April was less than thorough or the one in August was just a bunch of nit picking because someone was having a bad day.

Terri

[blueboro]

I tend to agree with you about the Veendam as of late. The last cruise I took on HAL was the Veendam in April of 2012. It was fine. The way some people talk on this board it makes it sound like HAL has totally changed. I've been cruising with HAL for a very long time and I think they still have a decent product. Makes me wonder if some are more high maintainance then others. Don't get me wrong, the issues happening on the Veendam now are gross. I cruised on Celebrity at the end of May and the experience was nowhere near as nice as HAL.

 

 

Not sure what X ship you were on but the Solstice class ships are spectacular. I also loved the Nieuw Amsterdam but IMO the Solstice design is superior.

[cruz chic]

Not sure what X ship you were on but the Solstice class ships are spectacular. I also loved the Nieuw Amsterdam but IMO the Solstice design is superior.

I was on the Millennium. It wasn't that I didn't like the ship it was the service and some of the food.

[eroller]

Holland America - "The Spotless Fleet". Well not exactly. 77 is one of the lowest scores in recent memory for any major ship. Some might recall QM2 failed at one point last year I think. With modern galley's and proper maintenance it's hard to imagine any modern ship failing. In addition the cruise lines know pretty much exactly what the inspectors are looking for.

 

Not good for Holland America.

[Gail & Marty sailing away]

I hope they do a spot check soon again on her ..

[BruceMuzz]

Holland America - "The Spotless Fleet". Well not exactly. 77 is one of the lowest scores in recent memory for any major ship. Some might recall QM2 failed at one point last year I think. With modern galley's and proper maintenance it's hard to imagine any modern ship failing. In addition the cruise lines know pretty much exactly what the inspectors are looking for.

 

Not good for Holland America.

 

I won't make any excuses for Veendam. It was a terrible score with no good reason.

 

It may help to understand the politics of a USPH Inspection.

When I am not managing cruise ships, I work with 3 retired Directors of the CDC Vessel Sanitation Program.

They have admitted to me on several occasions that they already know the inspection score before they arrive at the ship - unless they have some very positive or very negative surprises once onboard.

If they see some really spectacular performances and situations, the pre-determined score can go up.

If they see some really stupid behaviour or precedures taking place, they start digging deeper and the score goes down.

 

And they have reminded me on many occasions that they can fail the cleanest ship in the world if they want to dig deep enough.

 

Several years ago my ship had 5 consecutive 100 scores. Then on the sixth inspection, we received a barely passing score. I was devastated and anticipated losing my job. The lead inspector apologized to me and explained that CDC had an issue with my employer following up on his suggestions. This low score was a wake-up call to the cruise line. Luckily he explained this to my boss, so I did not lose my job. Our next score was 100.

I do not mean to suggest that this was the case on Veendam, but only to explain the wide range of scores a ship can receive based on the situation.

 

And a reminder: If the Vessel Sanitation Program Inspectors were to make a surprise visit to your favorite restaurant, the score would not be nearly as good as the one Veendam received.

If that happened, would you still eat at that restaurant?

[Salacia]

I won't make any excuses for Veendam. It was a terrible score with no good reason.

 

It may help to understand the politics of a USPH Inspection.

When I am not managing cruise ships, I work with 3 retired Directors of the CDC Vessel Sanitation Program.

They have admitted to me on several occasions that they already know the inspection score before they arrive at the ship - unless they have some very positive or very negative surprises once onboard.

If they see some really spectacular performances and situations, the pre-determined score can go up.

If they see some really stupid behaviour or precedures taking place, they start digging deeper and the score goes down.

 

And they have reminded me on many occasions that they can fail the cleanest ship in the world if they want to dig deep enough.

 

Several years ago my ship had 5 consecutive 100 scores. Then on the sixth inspection, we received a barely passing score. I was devastated and anticipated losing my job. The lead inspector apologized to me and explained that CDC had an issue with my employer following up on his suggestions. This low score was a wake-up call to the cruise line. Luckily he explained this to my boss, so I did not lose my job. Our next score was 100.

I do not mean to suggest that this was the case on Veendam, but only to explain the wide range of scores a ship can receive based on the situation.

 

And a reminder: If the Vessel Sanitation Program Inspectors were to make a surprise visit to your favorite restaurant, the score would not be nearly as good as the one Veendam received.

If that happened, would you still eat at that restaurant?

 

You stated that you manage cruise ships, and you tell me that my favourite restaurant health inspection "would not be nearly as good as the one Veendam received"...and yet, you have not idea what my favourite restaurant is...and I have no idea what cruise ships you manage...

 

ms Veendam did not fail inspection for "no good reason". Veendam failed for several good reasons found by VSP inspectors. -S.

 

 

[goodearth]

I won't make any excuses for Veendam. It was a terrible score with no good reason.

 

It may help to understand the politics of a USPH Inspection.

When I am not managing cruise ships, I work with 3 retired Directors of the CDC Vessel Sanitation Program.

They have admitted to me on several occasions that they already know the inspection score before they arrive at the ship - unless they have some very positive or very negative surprises once onboard.

If they see some really spectacular performances and situations, the pre-determined score can go up.

If they see some really stupid behaviour or precedures taking place, they start digging deeper and the score goes down.

 

And they have reminded me on many occasions that they can fail the cleanest ship in the world if they want to dig deep enough.

 

Several years ago my ship had 5 consecutive 100 scores. Then on the sixth inspection, we received a barely passing score. I was devastated and anticipated losing my job. The lead inspector apologized to me and explained that CDC had an issue with my employer following up on his suggestions. This low score was a wake-up call to the cruise line. Luckily he explained this to my boss, so I did not lose my job. Our next score was 100.

I do not mean to suggest that this was the case on Veendam, but only to explain the wide range of scores a ship can receive based on the situation.

 

And a reminder: If the Vessel Sanitation Program Inspectors were to make a surprise visit to your favorite restaurant, the score would not be nearly as good as the one Veendam received.

If that happened, would you still eat at that restaurant?

 

 

Your comments are all over the place. The system is rigged, no it's political, no it's a warning shot across the bow for the corporation, no wait-they are really good at inspecting because they would fail my favorite restaurant..............I don't buy whatever it is you are selling. Everyone agree's that the Veendam has been the victim of neglect for way too long.........and it shows in the CDC report as well as in various situations that passengers have faced and reported. No need to blame the CDC...............or try to disparage that agency which does work for the benefit of the public. Oh, wait, we could get rid of them and then no one would know anything. That would be so much better................NOT!!

[Host Walt]

Originally Posted by LauraS

Check out the latest Holland America news from Cruise Critic:

 

Holland America Cruise Ship Fails CDC Inspection

[Gerd]

.

 

Hello all,

 

this would be indeed a good question one could address to him.

 

 

But unfortunately "Dutch By Association" last response on this board is from May 6. 2012

 

And on his own web-page, with a great pity I could find-out, that Brad mentioned today to stop also to post there….:mad:

 

 

Happy cruising

 

G E R D

 

 

 

Our marvelous cruises : :)

 

MS Ryndam – Wayfarer – March 1997

MS Noordam - Transatlantic Island Hook - April 2001

MS Volendam - Southern Caribbean - April 2002

MS Volendam - Westfarer Caribbean - April 2004

MS Prinsendam - Windmills & Waterford – September 2004

MS Westerdam - Western Caribbean - April 2005

MS Statendam - Hawaii Circle - September 2005

MS Rotterdam - Vikings and Czars – July 2006

MS Veendam - Southern Caribbean – March 2007

MS Volendam – Panama Canal – April 2008

MS Noordam – Mediterranean Enchantment – September 2009

MS Nieuw Amsterdam - Mediterranean Inaugural Cruise - July 2010

MS Nieuw Amsterdam - Mediterranean Empires - July 2010

MS Ryndam – North Cape Splendors - June 2011

MS Volendam – Glacier Bay – Inside Passage - July 2002

MS Amsterdam – Alaskan Adventure - July 2012

 

227 days - 48'299 Nm :

 

 

 

Future Cruises : :p

 

MS Rotterdam – 17-Night Canary Islands Holiday

 

 

.

[Randyk47]

For whatever reason or reasons DBA has basically stopped posting here or on his own blog. Freedom of speech issues notwithstanding sometimes it's not a good idea to talk too much about your employer even if you're generally positive. Not saying that's what happened but obviously something did or something changed.

 

HAL's response is pretty much what you'd expect and I can't say I find fault with it or expected anything different. Not much more they can say other than "we messed up and we've addressed the problems". I imagine some of the internal conversations were not so pleasant. ;)

[searanch queen]

No hiding now. The story is front and center in USA Today.

[Cruzin Terri]

I won't make any excuses for Veendam. It was a terrible score with no good reason.

 

It may help to understand the politics of a USPH Inspection.

When I am not managing cruise ships, I work with 3 retired Directors of the CDC Vessel Sanitation Program.

They have admitted to me on several occasions that they already know the inspection score before they arrive at the ship - unless they have some very positive or very negative surprises once onboard.

If they see some really spectacular performances and situations, the pre-determined score can go up.

If they see some really stupid behaviour or precedures taking place, they start digging deeper and the score goes down.

 

And they have reminded me on many occasions that they can fail the cleanest ship in the world if they want to dig deep enough.

 

Several years ago my ship had 5 consecutive 100 scores. Then on the sixth inspection, we received a barely passing score. I was devastated and anticipated losing my job. The lead inspector apologized to me and explained that CDC had an issue with my employer following up on his suggestions. This low score was a wake-up call to the cruise line. Luckily he explained this to my boss, so I did not lose my job. Our next score was 100.

I do not mean to suggest that this was the case on Veendam, but only to explain the wide range of scores a ship can receive based on the situation.

 

And a reminder: If the Vessel Sanitation Program Inspectors were to make a surprise visit to your favorite restaurant, the score would not be nearly as good as the one Veendam received.

If that happened, would you still eat at that restaurant?

 

In prior posts you were adamant that there was a set standard for the inspections and that inspectors followed a certain protocol. Now you are saying something different. What is it?

Terri

[NHCruisr]

So sad to read of the Veendam's CDC scores and the ongoing problems. We were booked on the October 6 back to back and just cancelled. I have medical issues which result in a lowered immune system. I can't be on an unsanitary and sick ship, so we won't be going for medical reasons. Fortunately, we have insurance and we live in NE so there are no flights involved.

 

We are three star mariners and have had many wonderful days at sea with HAL, including an amazing 14 day trip to Alaska in June. We are looking closely at our future with HAL and are deeply concerned about these events.

[HAL_PR]

In a recent inspection as part of the Vessel Sanitation Program (VSP), administered by the U.S. Public Health Service Centers for Disease Control, ms Veendam received a less-than-satisfactory review. Ships must score at least 86 to pass the inspection. The score resulted largely from one area of the ship's overall operation. All the issues raised in the report were immediately addressed and have now been corrected. We have also ensured that our management and training practices in this area have been refocused to ensure continued success. The required Corrective Action report has been filed with the USPHS and we are expecting and desirous of a re-inspection in the near future.

 

While unacceptable for Holland America Line, the unsatisfactory score is highly unusual and an aberration. Since 1996, Veendam has received passing scores on 32 inspections. We are confident that this will not occur again, and that Veendam’s VSP scores in future will return to their consistently high levels. Holland America Line is committed to a comprehensive program to provide a clean and sanitary shipboard environment to ensure the health and safety of its guests and crew.

[hypercafe]

People who like the brand what to stick up for it and will find any reason to justify the failing score the same as a sport team that just lost a important game. I have seen. More posts on the HAL board in the last couple of months about broken ane run down ships and failed health inspections than I have in years on other brands. Speaking only for myself I can't justify investing my money on a vacation in the hopes the ship will work, the cabin will be livable and I will not get sick from the environment on the ship. There are lots of ships going to a lot of great places, HAL does not have a monopoly.

[tcook052]

The score resulted largely from one area of the ship's overall operation.

 

All it takes is just one, though I'm glad to hear corrective actions have been taken as this is quite the PR disaster for my favorite cruise line.

[Zyzygy]

This thread has caused me to swear off chocolate volcano cake...but not HAL. If failing scores were a recurring problem, I would swear off the line, too.

[Salacia]

In a recent inspection as part of the Vessel Sanitation Program (VSP), administered by the U.S. Public Health Service Centers for Disease Control, ms Veendam received a less-than-satisfactory review. Ships must score at least 86 to pass the inspection. The score resulted largely from one area of the ship's overall operation. All the issues raised in the report were immediately addressed and have now been corrected. We have also ensured that our management and training practices in this area have been refocused to ensure continued success. The required Corrective Action report has been filed with the USPHS and we are expecting and desirous of a re-inspection in the near future.

 

While unacceptable for Holland America Line, the unsatisfactory score is highly unusual and an aberration. Since 1996, Veendam has received passing scores on 32 inspections. We are confident that this will not occur again, and that Veendam’s VSP scores in future will return to their consistently high levels. Holland America Line is committed to a comprehensive program to provide a clean and sanitary shipboard environment to ensure the health and safety of its guests and crew.

 

Holland America Public Relations: thanks for your response, but is to too little too late. Holland America knew that ms Veendam failed inspection on August 19, and yet Holland America did not convey this information to passengers waiting for hours in the cruise terminal. I was one of those passengers, standing and waiting, and I would have appreciated hearing the real reason why I was standing and waiting for hours to board, but that information was not forthcoming. I would not knowing sail on a ship that failed CDC inspection, and I seriously object that that information was withheld from me prior to boarding the Veendam on Aug 19. (And yes, I did ask several times why boarding was delayed. Each time, from various HAL personal, the answer was "technical issues".)

 

As far as your press release is concerned, it appears to be pro-forma. The press release when Queen Mary 2 failed inspection was copied almost verbatim which makes me wonder if there isn't a form at the ready at CCL PR HQ for ships that fail inspection. Perhaps just as the ships staff has been reduced or cut to those with limited experience (hence low pay grade), the same practice applies to shore-side and Corporate HQ.

 

Salacia

[Salacia]

Originally Posted by LauraS

Check out the latest Holland America news from Cruise Critic:

 

Holland America Cruise Ship Fails CDC Inspection

 

Thank you, but we have been discussing ms Veendam's failed inspection score since 20Sept, so it wasn't really news to many of us. -S.

[travelinjones]

Wow, just spent 2 hours reading all of this thread and the CDC reports. We sailed to Bermuda on the Veendam 8/5/12 to 8/12/12.

 

While shocked at some of the "headlines" from the CDC report, when read line-by-line, it seems like the same issues were re-hashed over and over via different violations.

 

On our Veendam experience, we noted two significant issues:

-our room was too warm and couldn't be adequately cooled for August in Bermuda.

-the ship was overcrowded with passengers and understaffed to deal with the crowd -- in the Main Dining Room, in Room Service and in the timely cleaning of cabins -- compared to the Holland America experience that we know and love.

 

However, we didn't experience issues with cleanliness. The food and service in the Pinnacle was top-notch, as was the MIX bar. The front desk staff was the most proactive and problem-solving that we have ever experienced.

 

Our bottom line: this CDC report wouldn't scare us away from HAL or the Veendam, but we hope it is a wake-up to HAL management (whether on ships or in Seattle) that "good enough" is "not enough".

[whogo]

No hiding now. The story is front and center in USA Today.

http://travel.usatoday.com/cruises/post/2012/09/holland-america-cruise-ship-health-inspection/70001081/1

 

Also on CNN:

http://www.cnn.com/2012/09/25/travel/cdc-cruise-ship/index.html