Veendam failed latest cdc inspection

[cruz chic]

Douglas Hernandez does not need me or anyone else to come to his defense and I have no intention of doing so.

 

I do wish to mention we have sailed with him, most happily, on Maasdam a number of times and think very highly of him. We have always found him to be a great Hotel Manager, run a fine hotel department and scored very well on USPH Inspections. He's a man of wonderful humor, very friendly, and someone we are always delighted to find aboard. We'd switch ships for the opportunity to sail with him again.

 

(In general and not directed at you, KK) ...... Don't judge him so harshly when there well might be lots of information to which we do not have access. Please don't fling so many stones at someone many of you have never met and do not know 'the story.'

 

 

We've sailed with A LOT of Hotel Managers and feel we have some small means of comparison and Mr. Hernandez always rates very high with us.

 

JMO.......

 

I have also sailed with that hotel manager. I was invited to one of those small meet and greets with senior staff. There was only 3 of us there. I had brought up and issue and the CD agreed with me and admitted it was true. Douglas was late getting to the meeting. He didn't realize what had been said before he got there. When he got there he completely denied the issue existed. Duh! Then the couple there brought up smoking on the ships. Keep in mind that this was a couple of years ago. He said there would be no changes in the smoking policy because "laws" would have to be changed. Is that right? I guess he thought all three of us fell off the turnip truck. We all talked about what we had heard after so it wasn't misunderstood. Please understand that your opinion may be different than others.

[Althearose]

I just spoke to my mother who is waiting in line to embark on the Veendam today. The embarkation is delayed because they are sanitizing the ship. My mother's dear friend is also waiting to board and has a compromised immune system, so she is talking to the nurse. (I wouldn't trust anything a HAL employee said) I wish I had done some research before they left, but this was their vacation and not mine.

 

Does anyone have any info about the last sailing and possible norovirus outbreak?

 

And yes, the CDC website does that the last inspection score at 77. Apparently HAL didn't take notice.

[sail7seas]

I have also sailed with that hotel manager. I was invited to one of those small meet and greets with senior staff. There was only 3 of us there. I had brought up and issue and the CD agreed with me and admitted it was true. Douglas was late getting to the meeting. He didn't realize what had been said before he got there. When he got there he completely denied the issue existed. Duh! Then the couple there brought up smoking on the ships. Keep in mind that this was a couple of years ago. He said there would be no changes in the smoking policy because "laws" would have to be changed. Is that right? I guess he thought all three of us fell off the turnip truck. We all talked about what we had heard after so it wasn't misunderstood. Please understand that your opinion may be different than others.

 

Sorry for your negative experience.

 

I understand that we all report our opinions based on our personal experiences and they are not always the same.

 

No problem. :)

 

[mamaofami]

I just spoke to my mother who is waiting in line to embark on the Veendam today. The embarkation is delayed because they are sanitizing the ship. My mother's dear friend is also waiting to board and has a compromised immune system, so she is talking to the nurse. (I wouldn't trust anything a HAL employee said) I wish I had done some research before they left, but this was their vacation and not mine.

 

Does anyone have any info about the last sailing and possible norovirus outbreak?

 

And yes, the CDC website does that the last inspection score at 77. Apparently HAL didn't take notice.

 

The delayed sailing is because the ship was sanitized because of the noro virus on the last sailing. Most times, but not always, that's enough to curtail the spread of the virus. Sometimes, a few cases linger on for the next cruise. Everything is done on board to protect the spread of the virus.

 

No one can really advise someone with a compromised immune system whether they should sail or not. Noro can break out on any ship at any time, or on a plane or in a hotel or hospital. Tell your mother's friend to wash her hands constantly. That helps.

[sail7seas]

One of our best friends is a MD. We once asked if we should be worried about Noro given what he knows of our medical histories.....

 

His answer was to worry far more about catching the flu than Noro like viruses. People die from flu but not many die from Noro.

 

Of course, it is miserable and no one wants it but most of us will recover fine. We are exposed to it all over the place in our everyday lives.... at school, in dorms, nursing homes, hospitals, restaurants, any place where people gather in numbers.

 

[innlady1]

For two or three cruises before ours on the Maasdam last winter, the ship had a Noro outbreak. I believe they scrubbed her down the cruise before ours. And, as far as I know, that nipped it in the bud.

[kazu]

I just spoke to my mother who is waiting in line to embark on the Veendam today. The embarkation is delayed because they are sanitizing the ship. My mother's dear friend is also waiting to board and has a compromised immune system, so she is talking to the nurse. (I wouldn't trust anything a HAL employee said) I wish I had done some research before they left, but this was their vacation and not mine.

 

Does anyone have any info about the last sailing and possible norovirus outbreak?

 

And yes, the CDC website does that the last inspection score at 77. Apparently HAL didn't take notice.

 

At any NORO sailing we have had, there is an offer to cancel your cruise without penalty - I know, not a pleasant thought - but at least it should be offered. Noro doesn't concern me (except for the inconvenience on the ship) It's something that passes quite quickly.

 

don't worry about researching it - no one can predict when this will happen - it happens in the best hotels and the best ships and in hospitals, nursing homes - wherever.

 

I wish them a smooth sailing - although I am really upset by the score with CDC I would think that by now - the corrective measures should have been put in place.

 

JMVHO though

[sansterre]

While I agree we'd all like to hear official comments, it is highly unlikely HAL will explain themselves on a public message board IMO

 

This is not an issue I would think they'll discuss with us in public. :)

JMO but I'm quite sure they know all that is substandard on Veendam and they don't need us to tell them.

 

But I sure would like to read they plan to fix some of what needs fixing and we can happily look forward to a great time on Veendam.

 

For the third time: From hearing from someone on board the Veendam, things are "fixed". I am sure that their next CDC score will be excellent. In fact, we are looking forward to boarding the Vendam in 3 months. It is time to end this thread.

[sppunk]

For the third time: From hearing from someone on board the Veendam, things are "fixed". I am sure that their next CDC score will be excellent. In fact, we are looking forward to boarding the Vendam in 3 months. It is time to end this thread.

I was in board less than a month ago. Veendam can't be fixed in three weeks, since it's been at least two years since she's been broken.

 

CDC's score just points out even more problems that guests will never, ever see. The ones you can see and experience are enough to know there is no fixing this shop without an extended comprehensive drydock.

 

The failing grade is icing on the cake of complete failure by HAL in this instance. It is sad, but true.

[serendipity1499]

I was in board less than a month ago. Veendam can't be fixed in three weeks, since it's been at least two years since she's been broken.

 

Really, please pin point the thread from two years ago which indicates that the "Veendam" was in total disrepair...

 

CDC's score just points out even more problems that guests will never, ever see. The ones you can see and experience are enough to know there is no fixing this shop without an extended comprehensive drydock.

 

The failing grade is icing on the cake of complete failure by HAL in this instance. It is sad, but true.

 

And you know it will take more than 3 weeks to repair the problems, because you are a licensed mechanical seaman? :confused:

We were on the ship in Aug of 2010 (two years ago) & we did not have or see any of the problems which you state will take longer than three weeks to fix..Since you know so much, please tell us how a ship could receive a 93 in April & a 77 in Aug (four months later) if it would take more than three weeks to repair..

Betty

[sammiedawg]

The CDC report disgusts me. I also noted HAL has not submitted their corrective action report which shocks me even more. In my city a restaurant that fails an inspection may be shut down for 3 days, corrective action must be proven on reinspection. If the restaurant fails repeatedly it can be closed down. I would not knowingly patronize any restaurant that failed an inspection, sorry but I'll take my business elsewhere. WIthin the last year a much beloved historical restaurant closed its doors, service, physical appearance and food had been declining but what sealed the deal was a failed health department inspection. People voted with their feet and business died.

 

I would not book a ship with any recent inspection issues. I would want to see several subsequent inspections documenting imrpovement.

 

I have been on Veendam twice, Europe in 2007 and March 2012 in South America. In march, we did not have any AC or plumbing problems but we talked to people who did.

We were anytime diners and noted every night how short staffed the dining room was, resulting in very very very slow service, long wait times. The food was pretty good, the waiters worked their butts off but they had way too many tables. I sensed something had changed but I couldn't put my finger on what it was. Now I can speculate if the front of the house was understaffed the back of the house was in even worse shape.

I complained on my comment card about the slow dining room service, I complained about the ship being excessively smokey, another issue I never encountered before. The explorations cafe reeked of smoke most of the time as did some hallways and the Crows nest. Now I'm wondering if there was a problem with the ventilation system.

Otherwise we had no complaints about the Veendam and we enjoyed our cruise.

 

This ship is trending in the wrong direction. In business, trending is very important. This failed inspection raises big red flags for me.

Whatever happened to the Signature of Excellence? Holland America is losing its way if ships continue to sail in this condition. I'm very disappointed.

[Cruzin Terri]

The CDC report disgusts me. I also noted HAL has not submitted their corrective action report which shocks me even more. In my city a restaurant that fails an inspection may be shut down for 3 days, corrective action must be proven on reinspection. If the restaurant fails repeatedly it can be closed down. I would not knowingly patronize any restaurant that failed an inspection, sorry but I'll take my business elsewhere. WIthin the last year a much beloved historical restaurant closed its doors, service, physical appearance and food had been declining but what sealed the deal was a failed health department inspection. People voted with their feet and business died.

 

I would not book a ship with any recent inspection issues. I would want to see several subsequent inspections documenting imrpovement.

 

I have been on Veendam twice, Europe in 2007 and March 2012 in South America. In march, we did not have any AC or plumbing problems but we talked to people who did.

We were anytime diners and noted every night how short staffed the dining room was, resulting in very very very slow service, long wait times. The food was pretty good, the waiters worked their butts off but they had way too many tables. I sensed something had changed but I couldn't put my finger on what it was. Now I can speculate if the front of the house was understaffed the back of the house was in even worse shape.

I complained on my comment card about the slow dining room service, I complained about the ship being excessively smokey, another issue I never encountered before. The explorations cafe reeked of smoke most of the time as did some hallways and the Crows nest. Now I'm wondering if there was a problem with the ventilation system.

Otherwise we had no complaints about the Veendam and we enjoyed our cruise.

 

This ship is trending in the wrong direction. In business, trending is very important. This failed inspection raises big red flags for me.

Whatever happened to the Signature of Excellence? Holland America is losing its way if ships continue to sail in this condition. I'm very disappointed.

Pat,

Good to see you posting. We had some slow service in the MDR with late dining until we asked to have our table changed and then we had great service.

We had no plumbing or a/ c problems but the CDC report disturbs me and I would think twice about going back on the Veendam again.

 

Terri

[innlady1]

Pat,

Good to see you posting. We had some slow service in the MDR with late dining until we asked to have our table changed and then we had great service.

We had no plumbing or a/ c problems but the CDC report disturbs me and I would think twice about going back on the Veendam again.

 

Terri

 

We had a wonderful cruise to Bermuda on May 6, and I have been thinking about booking the Canada/New England round trip Boston to Boston next August. So will keep my ears and eyes open for stats on the Veendam. It's amazing to me that from May until August, the ship slid downhill so quickly.

[lovetocruise2020]

:( so sad!

[sppunk]

And you know it will take more than 3 weeks to repair the problems, because you are a licensed mechanical seaman? :confused:

We were on the ship in Aug of 2010 (two years ago) & we did not have or see any of the problems which you state will take longer than three weeks to fix..Since you know so much, please tell us how a ship could receive a 93 in April & a 77 in Aug (four months later) if it would take more than three weeks to repair..

Betty

 

They can't remove the dining room rusted fixtures without a long drydock. It has been this way for years now, giant net included.

 

That stands alone as a reason. And doesn't including the HVAC issues and repeated water leaks/pipe breaks that are rampant all over with no rhyme or reason for the location. Bungee chords holding piping together on the promenade can't be fixed in active cruising, most certainly.

 

Listen I loved Veendam's size and decor and crew and most of the food (though Lido was a disaster if no glasses or plates, but that's a staffing issue I'm sure). But there are serious issues. The report doesn't change that, it only shows a lack of care at best and sense/training at worst by senior officers (cited directly from this report).

 

There is more than one major problem on this ship.

[keeponcruising]

They can't remove the dining room rusted fixtures without a long drydock. It has been this way for years now, giant net included.

 

That stands alone as a reason. And doesn't including the HVAC issues and repeated water leaks/pipe breaks that are rampant all over with no rhyme or reason for the location. Bungee chords holding piping together on the promenade can't be fixed in active cruising, most certainly.

 

Listen I loved Veendam's size and decor and crew and most of the food (though Lido was a disaster if no glasses or plates, but that's a staffing issue I'm sure). But there are serious issues. The report doesn't change that, it only shows a lack of care at best and sense/training at worst by senior officers (cited directly from this report).

 

There is more than one major problem on this ship.

 

When do you think they will do a reinspection? Boy, I feel so bad for my sister who will be taking what she thinks is the cruise of her lifetime in less than one month. How can HAL let this happen?

 

Ellen

[innlady1]

We have a great influx of Jamaicans working here on Nantucket so our grocery stores cater to them as well...DH just told me the other day they have a 50 lb. bag of rice! I know they eat rice with almost every meal.

[peaches from georgia]

When do you think they will do a reinspection? Boy, I feel so bad for my sister who will be taking what she thinks is the cruise of her lifetime in less than one month. How can HAL let this happen?

 

Ellen

The violations in the inspection that Veendam failed do not directly affect the pax and will not impact on your sister's cruise whether or not they are all corrected before her cruise. The potential for any problem she might or not have (chances are probably not) on the ship are systems issues such as cabin AC/Heat and plumbing. These are not addressed in the inspection and are long-standing issues on the Veendam.

[Mosaic]

"The violations in the inspection that Veendam failed do not directly affect the pax..."

 

Huh????

[sammiedawg]

The violations in the inspection that Veendam failed do not directly affect the pax and will not impact on your sister's cruise whether or not they are all corrected before her cruise. The potential for any problem she might or not have (chances are probably not) on the ship are systems issues such as cabin AC/Heat and plumbing. These are not addressed in the inspection and are long-standing issues on the Veendam.

 

I disagree, the violations in the report do affect the health and safety of passengers. The purpose of inspections is to protect the customer. In my professional life, I've had a series of jobs working for private and quasi private organizations subject to the inspection process. One job involved serial inspections by the FDA. These inspections were most stressful but of vital importance to protect the public.

I read the Veendam inspection report and this thread late last night. I'm very troubled by it.

We had not been on Holland America in 2.5 years, then we sailed Veendam South America in March. As I wrote last night I knew "something" had changed. I knew all cruiselines have faced financial challenges and have had little cutbacks here and there. Now I know the problems are much more serious.

I hope this thread stays on page 1 for quite some time. Customers need to know what is going on and make decisions accordingly.

[peaches from georgia]

I disagree, the violations in the report do affect the health and safety of passengers. The purpose of inspections is to protect the customer. In my professional life, I've had a series of jobs working for private and quasi private organizations subject to the inspection process. One job involved serial inspections by the FDA. These inspections were most stressful but of vital importance to protect the public.

I read the Veendam inspection report and this thread late last night. I'm very troubled by it.

We had not been on Holland America in 2.5 years, then we sailed Veendam South America in March. As I wrote last night I knew "something" had changed. I knew all cruiselines have faced financial challenges and have had little cutbacks here and there. Now I know the problems are much more serious.

I hope this thread stays on page 1 for quite some time. Customers need to know what is going on and make decisions accordingly.

Of course I am very concerned about the inspection report. It is inexcusable. However, my point is that a pax on the Veendam would not be directly affected or have their cruise experience changed because of these violations. The pax on Veendam on 8/19 when the ship had a 77 score versus those onboard in April when the score was in the 90s had no different experience from a pax perspective because of these violations. Of course there shouldn't be leaking water lines in the galley or food items put on the incorrect shelf, but none of the violations changed anything the pax were aware of. The poster worried about her sister seemed to be concerned that her sister would have a terrible cruise because of these inspection violations yet when you read the entire report the violations do not directly affect the pax so that they would be aware of the violations. The long-standing system problems that have ruined or nearly ruined many pax cruises are not included in the inspection report at all and are not addressed or considered by CDC.

 

Whether or not any of these violations indirectly impact pax is another question, but the ship was allowed to continue sailing because they said the pax were in no danger. Believe me, I am the last person on this board who would be called a cheerleader and I am not defending HAL for failing this inspection. It is outrageous. But directly affecting the poster's sister's cruise if all violations are or are not corrected by the time of her cruise I doubt. None of the current pax complaints have had anything to do with these violations.

 

Would I sail on the Veendam or book a future cruise on it? No. I don't think there is any intention of repairing the systems such as AC and Plumbing and other things that impact the enjoyment of the cruise. Do I think Veendam mgmt has gotten sloppy and that is where the responsibility of the failed inspection lies- yes. Do I think the next inspection will probably come in between 95 and 100- yes. But the deficiences that really are impacting pax enjoyment do not lie in the things that will be quickly addressed for the next inspection.

[mamaofami]

Peaches, with all due respect, I have to disagree with you. The following is an excerpt from the CDC report. While it might not affect people's perceived enjoyment, it certainly is an example of sanitary issues cited many times on Veendam.

 

"Site: Galley-Warewashing Violation: Several managers were observed in the area but they did not shut down the outboard flight-type conveyor warewash machine for repair before the inspector arrived. Every 1 to 5 seconds, the magnetic sensor on the clean end of the in-use outboard flight-type conveyor warewash machine was stopping the machine from running. There was a leak in a water line inside the deckhead directly above the machine and water was dripping into the machine and contaminating the clean dishes after they were sanitized. There was also brown liquid leaking from the deckhead onto the left corner of the clean landing of the machine. Workers were observed taking the contaminated dishes and putting them into clean storage racks. Recommendation: Because of the risks for foodborne illness inherent to the food operation, ensure the supervisor or person in charge of food operations on the vessel demonstrates to VSP - during inspections and on request - knowledge of foodborne disease prevention, application of the Hazard Analysis Critical Point principles, and the food-safety guidelines in this manual. Ensure that the person in charge demonstrates this knowledge: (1) By compliance with these guidelines."

[cruisemom42]

Certain sanitation infractions cited in the report, including issues with refrigeration, proper santization of dishes, and the presence of flies in food preparation areas could certainly impact passengers were they to lead to an outbreak of norovirus or any foodborne illness.

[peaches from georgia]

When do you think they will do a reinspection? Boy, I feel so bad for my sister who will be taking what she thinks is the cruise of her lifetime in less than one month. How can HAL let this happen?

 

Ellen

 

Peaches, with all due respect, I have to disagree with you. The following is an excerpt from the CDC report. While it might not affect people's perceived enjoyment, it certainly is an example of sanitary issues cited many times on Veendam.

 

 

I think where I am not being clear (my fault) is that I was reading the keeponcruising post and concern for her sister's cruise as concern for her perceived enjoyment and replying to her in that light. That was my meaning of 'directly affecting the pax'. I was not saying that there aren't serious issues in the inspection report. I think clearly in my previous posts I have been very concerned about the CDC report and was not trying here to make light of it. There are no excuses for what HAL has allowed management of the Veendam to become. It is very serious. However, some or all of these violations could have been there when you recently cruised the Veendam; you were not aware of them and they did not directly impact your perceived enjoyment of your cruise; your Veendam issues were not those addressed in in the CDC report and current pax have no idea what CDC issues have been corrected or not.

[tangerinebunny]

We each make our own call. I don't eat in restaurants with low health department scores and I'd rather lose my future cruise credits than book with a line that seems to disregard health/safety issues.

 

HAL has the opportunity to correct their mistakes. I assume we're all waiting to see how things go.