Veendam failed latest cdc inspection

[sansterre]

BUT -- it is my understanding that when a cruise ship gets a failing score, they have -- I think -- 60 - 90 days to make all the recommended corrections.

From my limited information on the subject, the Vendam should be reinspected in about a month. So I think your statement above is correct.

[Salacia]

BUT -- it is my understanding that when a cruise ship gets a failing score, they have -- I think -- 60 - 90 days to make all the recommended corrections.

From my limited information on the subject, the Vendam should be reinspected in about a month. So I think your statement above is correct.

 

Quoted from http://www.cdc.gov/nceh/vsp/desc/about_inspections.htm

What happens if a ship fails an inspection?

 

Ships that fail inspections are re-inspected within a reasonable time period of the failure

[Cruzin Terri]

I don't know if it matters (and it should not) but the inspections were performed in two different locations.

On April 19 the inspection took place in Fort Lauderdale.

On August 19 the inspection took place in New York.

 

While I realize there should be a set protocol for the inspection, could it be possible that the one performed in FL was not as thorough as the one in New York?

Just saying and thinking out loud! I have no idea how these inspections are conducted.

 

I do know that in FL there were passengers that were continuing on to NY on April 19. (I do know that everyone must disembark and go through immigration and customs in FL.) In NY on August 19 all of the passengers would have disembarked.

Could this have made a difference in the inspection?

Terri

[Salacia]

I don't know if it matters (and it should not) but the inspections were performed in two different locations.

On April 19 the inspection took place in Fort Lauderdale.

On August 19 the inspection took place in New York.

 

While I realize there should be a set protocol for the inspection, could it be possible that the one performed in FL was not as thorough as the one in New York?

Just saying and thinking out loud! I have no idea how these inspections are conducted.

 

I do know that in FL there were passengers that were continuing on to NY on April 19. (I do know that everyone must disembark and go through immigration and customs in FL.) In NY on August 19 all of the passengers would have disembarked.

Could this have made a difference in the inspection?

Terri

 

Wow, that's a good question. My understanding is that all US Vessel Inspectors follow the same manual, which is also supplied to ships docking in US port, and it is that standard manual (http://www.cdc.gov/nceh/vsp/pub/pub.htm ) upon which ships' inspection scores are based.

Regards,

Salacia

 

P.S. Just to add that yes, New York security/inspectors have been playing by the book, and taking security/health inspections very seriously in recent years based on what I have observed. Perhaps more so than other cities, for obvious reasons.

[erewhon]

 

Yesterday, DH and I were at Canada Place in Vancouver and checking out the Volendam - my all-time favourite ship - and he noted how shabby she is looking. Hoping she gets spruced up soon but maybe someone who has recently been on her can attest that all is well onboard.

 

Hi startwin,

Your comment makes me feel very sad for the Volendam.

[E-500]

I don't know if it matters (and it should not) but the inspections were performed in two different locations.

On April 19 the inspection took place in Fort Lauderdale.

On August 19 the inspection took place in New York.

 

While I realize there should be a set protocol for the inspection, could it be possible that the one performed in FL was not as thorough as the one in New York?

Just saying and thinking out loud! I have no idea how these inspections are conducted.

 

I do know that in FL there were passengers that were continuing on to NY on April 19. (I do know that everyone must disembark and go through immigration and customs in FL.) In NY on August 19 all of the passengers would have disembarked.

Could this have made a difference in the inspection?

Terri

 

You make a good point about two different locals. The cruise industry is very important to the economy in S. Florida, but has far less impact in NYC. Does it make sense to have the inspectors tread lighter in FLL and not rock the boat? (Pun intended)

[Salacia]

You make a good point about two different locals. The cruise industry is very important to the economy in S. Florida, but has far less impact in NYC. Does it make sense to have the inspectors tread lighter in FLL and not rock the boat? (Pun intended)

 

Yes, except that CDC VSP inspectors are Federal employees, so the economy of different states should not be a factor. -Salacia, often naïve

[E-500]

Yes, except that CDC VSP inspectors are Federal employees, so the economy of different states should not be a factor. -Salacia, often naïve

 

Yes, but they live in the community and don't operate in a vacuum.

[TiogaCruiser]

I don't have a cruise schedule handy. Does anyone know when veena heads to south America (and out of reach of USPHS CDC?

[MMDown Under]

I don't have a cruise schedule handy. Does anyone know when veena heads to south America (and out of reach of USPHS CDC?

 

24th October, Ft Lauderdale - 8th November, Valpariso, Chile.

[Salacia]

Yes, but they live in the community and don't operate in a vacuum.

 

I didn't know that. I thought the CDC dispatched inspectors to various locations. So you're saying that CDC VPS Inspectors live in the community of the ports they inspect?

[Krazy Kruizers]

On Noordam in Dec, see she scored 99, so thats great. We were on Veendam in Dec, ship was clean, food was VG, we did a 17 N BA to Santiago including Antarctica.

 

It was extremely hot in BA and Montevideo and the AC was fine(just 9 months ago).

 

However upon leaving BA we did sideswipe a container ship, ( the container ship was stationery) taking out 30feet of the rail on the top deck, smash 2 windows in the crows nest bar, and apparently the Captain kept on going trying to get the " hell out of Dodge" . We were apprehended, so to speak, by the Argentinian coastguard and held in BA overnight, until their was an "investigation" of sorts. HAL denied any wrongdoing, I am not so sure. I think money talks in Argentina, but that is just my opinion.

t

I think HAL did not relish the thought of refunding 2000 people 17 night fare over Xmas and New Year on an expensive Antarctic itinerary and then paying for us all to return home,and likely a big discount on a future cruise.

 

Other than this small wrinkle, we had a great sailing on Veendam. I would not sail again for 17 nights on a ship that size. Eurodam is the perfect ship in my opinion, and she is my fave of all ships in all cruise lines.

 

HAL does most things well, but I am mystified by their lack of maintenance on some ships.

The pricing is above their competition, so passengers do expect that they at least pass inspection.

 

On my -- I didn't realize that the Veendam had an "incident" on one of her cruises.

Than you for the information.

[Krazy Kruizers]

The Vessel Sanitation Program requires 2 surprise inspections per year for all non-US Flag ships that call at US Ports.

The VSP Program ends their year on 31 October.

All surprise VSP inspections must take place in US Ports.

The inspectors require a port call of at least 4 hours to perform the inspection.

That's as much as we know.

 

Until a few years ago, the inspections were like clockwork.

Although we did not know exactly when they would come, we could predict a one-month window when they were most likely come to inspect us. During this 30-day window, we would have all F&B crew working many overtime hours, keeping the ships up to the incredibly high USPH standards. But we cannot keep this up for very long periods. It really wears down the crew.

 

Technically speaking it is impossible for a ship to get the 100 perfect score that we all aim for.

Many of the things we do on cruise ships are not allowed by the Vessel Sanitation program:

 

Scrambling whole eggs, setting tables more than 4 hours before a meal, putting unwrapped butter on dining tables, preparing food in dimly lit places like dining rooms, using food from dented cans, having a buffet BBQ under an open sky, serving a rare steak, staff changing diapers in the child-care center, serving fresh oysters, making sushi with cold rice, waiters delivering a birthday cake with candles but no fire extinguisher, finding a live housefly in the dining room - all will result in points deducted and possible failure on the inspection.

 

So if we can guess more or less when the inspection will be taking place, we change many of our procedures for a month or so to play it safe and get a higher score.

 

Now the CDC is claiming poverty. They no longer keep their regular 6-month inspection schedules, making it more likely that they will show up when we do not expect them.

This decreases the chances of getting a perfect 100 score.

But it does NOT increase the chances of a ship gettting caught with so many technical issues like those on Veendam.

 

Incidentally, the ships that do get more of the 100 scores also tend to be the ones with the greatest number of norovirus outbreaks - but not for the reasons you might guess.

 

Newer ships tend to be better built for USPH standards, so it is easier for them to get those higher scores.

Newer ships tend to be larger and more popular; higher numbers of passengers increase the chances of NLV outbreaks.

Newer ships typically sail from North American ports, where NLV percentages in the population are higher.

 

As ships get older, renovations and upgrades often violate USPH technical standards, making it more likely they will lose points

 

Thank you Bruce for this information.

[Krazy Kruizers]

I disembarked on April 19, not August 19 and my cruise was wonderful. I found the ship very clean and had no problems while on board for 31 days. We did the repo from South America.

Terri

 

Opps -- sorry about that. :o

[BruceMuzz]

I didn't know that. I thought the CDC dispatched inspectors to various locations. So you're saying that CDC VPS Inspectors live in the community of the ports they inspect?

 

US Public Health Service has only about one dozen inspectors in the USA.

They are flown to major US Ports to perform the inspections on about 200 cruise ships annually.

They also travel to the major shipyards in Europe and Asia to inspect newbuilds and offer advice on safer ways to design and build cruise ships.

[kazu]

US Public Health Service has only about one dozen inspectors in the USA.

They are flown to major US Ports to perform the inspections on about 200 cruise ships annually.

They also travel to the major shipyards in Europe and Asia to inspect newbuilds and offer advice on safer ways to design and build cruise ships.

 

thanks Bruce - we're all getting educated:D

[KirkNC]

US Public Health Service has only about one dozen inspectors in the USA.

They are flown to major US Ports to perform the inspections on about 200 cruise ships annually.

They also travel to the major shipyards in Europe and Asia to inspect newbuilds and offer advice on safer ways to design and build cruise ships.

 

Wow only 12, they must be very busy.

[tangerinebunny]

So how are responsibilities divided up? Is the Hotel Manager responsible for kitchen operations?

[Cruzin Terri]

US Public Health Service has only about one dozen inspectors in the USA.

They are flown to major US Ports to perform the inspections on about 200 cruise ships annually.

They also travel to the major shipyards in Europe and Asia to inspect newbuilds and offer advice on safer ways to design and build cruise ships.

So, in effect, the same inspectors could have very well inspected the ship both in Fort Lauderdale and again in New York.

 

Terri

[3rdGenCunarder]

US Public Health Service has only about one dozen inspectors in the USA.

They are flown to major US Ports to perform the inspections on about 200 cruise ships annually.

They also travel to the major shipyards in Europe and Asia to inspect newbuilds and offer advice on safer ways to design and build cruise ships.

 

That's interesting. Many years ago, crew told us that the inspections in NYC were the most rigorous, so I always thought inspectors were local.

[sail7seas]

US Public Health Service has only about one dozen inspectors in the USA.

They are flown to major US Ports to perform the inspections on about 200 cruise ships annually.

They also travel to the major shipyards in Europe and Asia to inspect newbuilds and offer advice on safer ways to design and build cruise ships.

 

 

That is really interesting. I had no idea the Inspectors travel and the point made above could well be true........ it might have been the same Inspectors who checked out Veendam in both FLL as well as NYC.

 

I'm sure those reports have to be signed so maybe it is possible for that to be determined.

 

Surely HAL has that information but it likely is not available to any of us. :o

 

In any case, I am sorry the crew of Veendam has this heavy load to handle but serious corrections must be made. It is clearly unacceptable on all levels.

 

 

 

[Cruzin Terri]

This link may be helpful in understanding a bit more about the inspections. It also explains why some ships are permitted to sail despite a failing grade and others are not.

 

http://www.cdc.gov/nceh/vsp/desc/about_inspections.htm

 

Terri

[CoronaCRZR]

This link may be helpful in understanding a bit more about the inspections. It also explains why some ships are permitted to sail despite a failing grade and others are not.

 

http://www.cdc.gov/nceh/vsp/desc/about_inspections.htm

 

Terri

 

 

Thanks for that link.

This tells me that each ship failing can just keep on sailing......

 

"If a ship fails an inspection because of an imminent public health risk, VSP may recommend that the ship not sail. Imminent public health risks include the following violations:"

[sppunk]

So how are responsibilities divided up? Is the Hotel Manager responsible for kitchen operations?

 

Captain: In charge of everything sailing (engines, propulsion, navigation depts) and iirc environmental

HM: In charge of everything else

[localady]

So how are responsibilities divided up? Is the Hotel Manager responsible for kitchen operations?

Yes. As I understand it, the Hotel Manager is responsible for all kitchen and hotel operations as well as customer service. The heads of Housekeeping, Customer Relations, Beverage services, and all Dining Venues report to them. As I understand, they are also responsible for maintenance of the "hotel" aspects of a ship.