This Thread Is To Be Used For All Discussions About HAL's On Board Smoking Policies

[Aquahound]

What about converting Northern Lights to a smoking lounge, then make the casino non-smoking? On all the cruises I have been on with HAL, the only time there is ever more than a handful of people in NL is when they have trivia. Such a nice place, underutilized. The bar is never open. They use the casino bar is service is even offered.

 

I believe they have gotten rid of the northern lights on the eurodam.

 

They forgot to ask me, but my recommendation would have been this. Move the piano bar to Northern Lights, which would have far better sight lines than the current oddly designed piano bar, and remove the barrier wall so it would have a full service bar to sit at while still see the piano. Then, make the current piano bar a connoisseur club/smoking lounge. The small little bar window can be used to sell brandies, etc. But again, they didn't ask me. ;)

[sparrc]

The bottom line is there are smokers and non smokers on this forum who choose to sail HA for what ever their reasons, but there are certain smokers who make that group of smokers come across as inconsiderate and obnoxious. I am a smoker, I booked HA three years ago not knowing that they had balcony smoking. I would go to the designated smoking areas on the ship when I wanted to feed my addiction. I wasn't aware that balcony smoking was permitted until halfway through the cruise. But before that I had made my decission that I wouldn't sail with any other line because I enjoyed the ambience of the ship and the size of it. I have since sailed 3 times with HA and not because of balcony smoking. If they were to stop it tomorrow it would not be a big issue with me. I do believe though it should be stopped in the Casino. It stinks and that is coming from a smoker. The allocated area out the back of the Lido stinks. So much so that I find I can't bring myself to go out there and enjoy a cigarette. There should be an allocated area where the smokers can go that don't impede on the enjoyment of on non smokers. I limit my smoking whilst on board so that others don't have to endure the foul smell of cigarettes. If there were someone on my adjoining balcony I wouldn't even consider lighting up.

[Tom-n-Cheryl]

The bottom line is there are smokers and non smokers on this forum who choose to sail HA for what ever their reasons, but there are certain smokers who make that group of smokers come across as inconsiderate and obnoxious. I am a smoker, I booked HA three years ago not knowing that they had balcony smoking. I would go to the designated smoking areas on the ship when I wanted to feed my addiction. I wasn't aware that balcony smoking was permitted until halfway through the cruise. But before that I had made my decission that I wouldn't sail with any other line because I enjoyed the ambience of the ship and the size of it. I have since sailed 3 times with HA and not because of balcony smoking. If they were to stop it tomorrow it would not be a big issue with me. I do believe though it should be stopped in the Casino. It stinks and that is coming from a smoker. The allocated area out the back of the Lido stinks. So much so that I find I can't bring myself to go out there and enjoy a cigarette. There should be an allocated area where the smokers can go that don't impede on the enjoyment of on non smokers. I limit my smoking whilst on board so that others don't have to endure the foul smell of cigarettes. If there were someone on my adjoining balcony I wouldn't even consider lighting up.

 

Well reasoned and considerate.

 

I'd say my "addiction" to some extent is taking a chance in the casino - or going there for "the thrill". I'd go whether smoking was permitted or not, but I certainly appreciate a smoke free (or limited smoke) environment. At least I'm free to come and go as desired, which is more than can be said for the crew.

 

Tom

[cruz chic]

The bottom line is there are smokers and non smokers on this forum who choose to sail HA for what ever their reasons, but there are certain smokers who make that group of smokers come across as inconsiderate and obnoxious. I am a smoker, I booked HA three years ago not knowing that they had balcony smoking. I would go to the designated smoking areas on the ship when I wanted to feed my addiction. I wasn't aware that balcony smoking was permitted until halfway through the cruise. But before that I had made my decission that I wouldn't sail with any other line because I enjoyed the ambience of the ship and the size of it. I have since sailed 3 times with HA and not because of balcony smoking. If they were to stop it tomorrow it would not be a big issue with me. I do believe though it should be stopped in the Casino. It stinks and that is coming from a smoker. The allocated area out the back of the Lido stinks. So much so that I find I can't bring myself to go out there and enjoy a cigarette. There should be an allocated area where the smokers can go that don't impede on the enjoyment of on non smokers. I limit my smoking whilst on board so that others don't have to endure the foul smell of cigarettes. If there were someone on my adjoining balcony I wouldn't even consider lighting up.

Thank you for being so considerate.

[kennicott]

A few weeks ago there was discussion here whether or not this thread was worthwhile. I noted: "Originally there was a lot of uncertainty as to whether or not, or if so when, HAL would follow suit.----Then there was the question as to whether or not smokers from other lines would in significant numbers switch over to HAL. Back then some commented on doubts as to there being any flood of new guests to HAL just because of the smoking issue, since there was little evidence of smokers changing allegiances.-----Conversely, how many faithful were going to abandon booking with HAL due to their "only game in town" lenient balcony smoking policy.

 

It appears to me two questions have for the most part been proven out by the myriad of posts herein. 1. It looks like HAL is in no hurry to significantly alter smoking procedures on its ships. 2. Now there is considerable evidence that quite a number of smokers have switched to HAL. Before this all began demographics suggested that approximately 8% of HAL's guests were smokers. It has got to be considerably more than that today."

 

Originally there was also a lot of comment to the effect that seasoned HAL cruisers were not seeing much change with regard to balcony smoking, if any. Like some of us pointed out back then it was likely going to take some time to ferret all this out and for ramifications to manifest. I have been watching HAL ship reviews fairly closely every since, and I see more and more of them with comment similar to what 4 star Mariner Bluenose 47 just posted. To wit: "We always book a Verandah because we enjoy being outside and like the privacy. My wife has COPD and is very sensitive to cigarette smoke. We usually found when we went out on the balcony , especially the second week, we had to come back in. Not only were we surrounded by smokers (and not all of it was legal stuff) but foul language and loud talking that absolutely ruined our balcony experience. We should have received a refund back to an Oceanview because of this. We complained about this several times but nothing was done, other than Security trying to catch the pot smokers."

[Lizzie68]

The bottom line is there are smokers and non smokers on this forum who choose to sail HA for what ever their reasons, but there are certain smokers who make that group of smokers come across as inconsiderate and obnoxious. I am a smoker, I booked HA three years ago not knowing that they had balcony smoking. I would go to the designated smoking areas on the ship when I wanted to feed my addiction. I wasn't aware that balcony smoking was permitted until halfway through the cruise. But before that I had made my decission that I wouldn't sail with any other line because I enjoyed the ambience of the ship and the size of it. I have since sailed 3 times with HA and not because of balcony smoking. If they were to stop it tomorrow it would not be a big issue with me. I do believe though it should be stopped in the Casino. It stinks and that is coming from a smoker. The allocated area out the back of the Lido stinks. So much so that I find I can't bring myself to go out there and enjoy a cigarette. There should be an allocated area where the smokers can go that don't impede on the enjoyment of on non smokers. I limit my smoking whilst on board so that others don't have to endure the foul smell of cigarettes. If there were someone on my adjoining balcony I wouldn't even consider lighting up.

 

You are more than considerate, not to mention the voice of reason. I think your neighbours would be fine with finding a mutually-agreed time for you to enjoy your smoke out on the balcony. But it has to be said that the balcony IS a smoking area. For now.;) And yes, we have long advocated for a nice, ventilated indoor area for smokers.

[Lizzie68]

A few weeks ago there was discussion here whether or not this thread was worthwhile. I noted: "Originally there was a lot of uncertainty as to whether or not, or if so when, HAL would follow suit.----Then there was the question as to whether or not smokers from other lines would in significant numbers switch over to HAL. Back then some commented on doubts as to there being any flood of new guests to HAL just because of the smoking issue, since there was little evidence of smokers changing allegiances.-----Conversely, how many faithful were going to abandon booking with HAL due to their "only game in town" lenient balcony smoking policy.

 

It appears to me two questions have for the most part been proven out by the myriad of posts herein. 1. It looks like HAL is in no hurry to significantly alter smoking procedures on its ships. 2. Now there is considerable evidence that quite a number of smokers have switched to HAL. Before this all began demographics suggested that approximately 8% of HAL's guests were smokers. It has got to be considerably more than that today."

 

Originally there was also a lot of comment to the effect that seasoned HAL cruisers were not seeing much change with regard to balcony smoking, if any. Like some of us pointed out back then it was likely going to take some time to ferret all this out and for ramifications to manifest. I have been watching HAL ship reviews fairly closely every since, and I see more and more of them with comment similar to what 4 star Mariner Bluenose 47 just posted. To wit: "We always book a Verandah because we enjoy being outside and like the privacy. My wife has COPD and is very sensitive to cigarette smoke. We usually found when we went out on the balcony , especially the second week, we had to come back in. Not only were we surrounded by smokers (and not all of it was legal stuff) but foul language and loud talking that absolutely ruined our balcony experience. We should have received a refund back to an Oceanview because of this. We complained about this several times but nothing was done, other than Security trying to catch the pot smokers."

 

Kennicott, I do believe that change will come. I'm just not sure I will live long enough, LOL.:eek: However, if you have read the World Cruise blogs, you will also have read that this topic was raised with the President and other big-wigs a couple of weeks ago during the Q&A on the cruise, and they said that change is coming with regard to balcony smoking. I think it is going to be a smoking room on each ship, such as they have introduced on the Noordam. But time will tell.

[kennicott]

Kennicott, I do believe that change will come. I'm just not sure I will live long enough, LOL.:eek: However, if you have read the World Cruise blogs, you will also have read that this topic was raised with the President and other big-wigs a couple of weeks ago during the Q&A on the cruise, and they said that change is coming with regard to balcony smoking. I think it is going to be a smoking room on each ship, such as they have introduced on the Noordam. But time will tell.

 

Thanks and interesting. Gives us a link if you can.

[Lizzie68]

Thanks and interesting. Gives us a link if you can.

 

You'd have to read back through WCB's world cruise blog. But here is the link to the actual blog. http://cruisingwithbillandmaryann.blogspot.ca/

I did report on exactly what was said earlier in this thread, but you can find it in the blog.

[kennicott]

You'd have to read back through WCB's world cruise blog. But here is the link to the actual blog. http://cruisingwithbillandmaryann.blogspot.ca/

I did report on exactly what was said earlier in this thread, but you can find it in the blog.

 

Thanks---I'm assuming you mean Orlando Ashford, President of HAL. If you recall, about a year ago Ashford and his boss, Stein Kruse, addressed another C.C. gathering on a world voyage. If I recall correctly there wasn't any mention of balcony smoking changes then but Kruse insinuated they were going to experiment with some other options, like exclusive smoking areas. My guess is that the one Oak Room and limited smoking in the casinos might be a result of that promise. Now, I tend to look at those actions as simply throwing a bone to the discontented non-smokers, but could be wrong, wish I am in fact.

 

The overwhelming evidence that I see pointing to a do nothing approach to providing fleet wide exclusive smoking lounges is that their new ship is coming out without one. Furthermore, they have had numerous ships in dry dock since he said that and with the exception of that one Oak Room, nothing has changed. Worse yet, as near as I can tell HAL hasn't got a new ship on order right now, meaning at the earliest they won't get another in service until 1919 or 2020.

 

I can't imagine them doing away with balcony smoking without having exclusive lounges under their current circumstances. So at best, 2025 before they eliminate balcony smoking.

[Tom-n-Cheryl]

...

 

I can't imagine them doing away with balcony smoking without having exclusive lounges under their current circumstances. So at best, 2025 before they eliminate balcony smoking.

 

Glad to see there's hope on the horizon. I was concerned that they were going to try and drag this out! ;)

 

Tom

[3rdGenCunarder]

Thanks---I'm assuming you mean Orlando Ashford, President of HAL. If you recall, about a year ago Ashford and his boss, Stein Kruse, addressed another C.C. gathering on a world voyage. If I recall correctly there wasn't any mention of balcony smoking changes then but Kruse insinuated they were going to experiment with some other options, like exclusive smoking areas. My guess is that the one Oak Room and limited smoking in the casinos might be a result of that promise. Now, I tend to look at those actions as simply throwing a bone to the discontented non-smokers, but could be wrong, wish I am in fact.

 

The overwhelming evidence that I see pointing to a do nothing approach to providing fleet wide exclusive smoking lounges is that their new ship is coming out without one. Furthermore, they have had numerous ships in dry dock since he said that and with the exception of that one Oak Room, nothing has changed. Worse yet, as near as I can tell HAL hasn't got a new ship on order right now, meaning at the earliest they won't get another in service until 1919 or 2020.

 

I can't imagine them doing away with balcony smoking without having exclusive lounges under their current circumstances. So at best, 2025 before they eliminate balcony smoking.

 

Sad to say, I think you're right. The fact that recent drydocks have not included making a space into a smoking room is telling.

 

The vague comments about "change coming" are probably just to make nonsmokers think we're being heard.

[richstowe]

I am always in favor of any and all smoking restrictions . Having said that, from a business perspective , why would they do this ? As a result of their failure to move on smoking, they have become the go to cruise line for balcony loving smokers . Are they making this change because they are afraid of losing non-smokers or are they trying to be on the "right side" of of this issue . Either way they won't get any credit from me . Is this just another politically correct act .

[sail7seas]

Kennicott, I do believe that change will come. I'm just not sure I will live long enough, LOL.:eek: However, if you have read the World Cruise blogs, you will also have read that this topic was raised with the President and other big-wigs a couple of weeks ago during the Q&A on the cruise, and they said that change is coming with regard to balcony smoking. I think it is going to be a smoking room on each ship, such as they have introduced on the Noordam. But time will tell.

 

HAL has been 'suggesting' there would soon be a change to smoking policy for years. A number of Captains, Hotel Directors, GRM's etc have told us time and again HAL was going to stop verandah smoking. My DH didn't live long enough to see that happen. I doubt I will either. :rolleyes:

 

It's a dodge of the issue by HAL. Tell us what we want to hear and we'll go quietly about our way.

 

[Lizzie68]

Thanks---I'm assuming you mean Orlando Ashford, President of HAL. If you recall, about a year ago Ashford and his boss, Stein Kruse, addressed another C.C. gathering on a world voyage. If I recall correctly there wasn't any mention of balcony smoking changes then but Kruse insinuated they were going to experiment with some other options, like exclusive smoking areas. My guess is that the one Oak Room and limited smoking in the casinos might be a result of that promise. Now, I tend to look at those actions as simply throwing a bone to the discontented non-smokers, but could be wrong, wish I am in fact.

 

The overwhelming evidence that I see pointing to a do nothing approach to providing fleet wide exclusive smoking lounges is that their new ship is coming out without one. Furthermore, they have had numerous ships in dry dock since he said that and with the exception of that one Oak Room, nothing has changed. Worse yet, as near as I can tell HAL hasn't got a new ship on order right now, meaning at the earliest they won't get another in service until 1919 or 2020.

 

I can't imagine them doing away with balcony smoking without having exclusive lounges under their current circumstances. So at best, 2025 before they eliminate balcony smoking.

 

When pressed by the regular World Cruisers (many of whom do that cruise every year, no I'm not jealous:D) I think they better back it up a bit or their feet will be held to the fire eventually. They cater in every way to the WC people, and they better not be lying or stringing them along. As has already transpired, one ship - the Noordam - has the Oak room for indoor smoking with balcony smoking strongly discouraged. It is a step forward.

[kennicott]

Sad to say, I think you're right. The fact that recent drydocks have not included making a space into a smoking room is telling.

 

The vague comments about "change coming" are probably just to make nonsmokers think we're being heard.

 

Unfortunately, 3rdGenCunarder, so true. From what we know and have heard so far from HAL, somebody would have to be pretty naive to buy into the smoking rhetoric Kruse and minions have peddled so far. Hey, we are HAL world cruisers ourselves, three consecutive months on the Prinsendam even. That esteem and ten bucks gets us a "free" drink in one of their bars. Hard to look at this from the standpoint of the glass is half full instead of half empty when listening to this BS. The old quote, probably not accurate, from the famous Barnum "There is a sucker born every minute", still means a lot in the world of reality.

 

Not that I'm paranoid, but if I am, blame my father. I grew up in the airplane game. I recall one time when I was very young, we were out at one of our hangers, a scheduled flight was supposed to have departed down the coast some time before. The phone was ringing off the wall from those at the destination airport. I recall Dad talking to someone there. The "airplane is just taxing out" he said. I also recall looking at the airplane he was talking about then, it was spread out over the hangar floor with mechanics feverishly trying to put in together.

[kennicott]

As has already transpired, one ship - the Noordam - has the Oak room for indoor smoking with balcony smoking strongly discouraged. It is a step forward.

 

I'm curious, if HAL strongly discourages smoking on balconies on the Noordam, why do they not say anything close to that in cruise contract FAQ's? Here are the current contract rules for all ships including the Noordam:

 

"Is Smoking Allowed On Board?

 

For the comfort of all of our guests, all staterooms (cabins), showrooms and most other indoor areas are designated non-smoking. While smoking is not permitted in staterooms, guests are allowed to smoke on stateroom verandahs. Smoking is also permitted on certain other designated, outside decks. The designated smoking areas for all ships are as follows unless otherwise noted:

 

STATEROOM VERANDAHS

Sea View Bar (not available on ms Rotterdam and ms Veendam)

Outside Decks

Sports Deck

Observation Deck (ms Prinsendam, ms Eurodam, ms Nieuw Amsterdam, ms Noordam, ms Oosterdam, ms Westerdam, and ms Zuiderdam only)

Casino

Active players only, when the casino is open

Designated slot machines only

Each sailing will offer one or more non-smoking nights depending upon the length of the voyage

 

CIGAR and pipe smoking is not allowed anywhere inside the ship; it is only permitted on the outside decks where smoking is otherwise allowed and on STATEROOM VERANDAHS. electronic cigarettes are permitted in staterooms but not in other public areas of the ship other than on outside decks designated as smoking areas.

 

Any guest who smokes inside staterooms in violation of our policy will be charged a US$250 cleaning fee per day of violation."

[Lizzie68]

I have no idea why you have posted all that but the trouble with coming in late to a conversation is you have missed many pertinent facts. You need to go back aways and read and also follow information posted by others on the forum. The policy above makes no mention of the notice provided to Noordam passengers and reported several times on the forum.

Edited February 26, 2016 by Lizzie68

[Guest debbiejohncruise]

I am always in favor of any and all smoking restrictions . Having said that, from a business perspective , why would they do this ? As a result of their failure to move on smoking, they have become the go to cruise line for balcony loving smokers . Are they making this change because they are afraid of losing non-smokers or are they trying to be on the "right side" of of this issue . Either way they won't get any credit from me . Is this just another politically correct act .

 

This is one of the main reasons we switched from HAL to Celebrity. Our last cruise with HAL we had cigar smokers on both sides of our balcony and it was horrible. Also someone above us flicked their cigarette onto our lounge chair and burned a hole in it. Thankfully it didn't start a fire. We would really love to cruise on HAL again especially their long cruises to Europe but this prevents us from doing that. Has anyone booked Aft balconies? Wonder if the smoke issue would be less if we were on the back of the ship?

[Aquahound]

The vague comments about "change coming" are probably just to make nonsmokers think we're being heard.

 

I totally agree. When other lines made the change, it came as a surprise without years of "changes are coming." They just did it. HAL is like the kid who is afraid to jump into the pool. By the time he gets in, no one want to play with him anymore.

[Browser495]

This is one of the main reasons we switched from HAL to Celebrity. Our last cruise with HAL we had cigar smokers on both sides of our balcony and it was horrible. Also someone above us flicked their cigarette onto our lounge chair and burned a hole in it. Thankfully it didn't start a fire. We would really love to cruise on HAL again especially their long cruises to Europe but this prevents us from doing that. Has anyone booked Aft balconies? Wonder if the smoke issue would be less if we were on the back of the ship?

 

 

Yes, we booked an aft wrap around balcony suite on Oosterdam last summer for an Alaskan cruise. Someone below and to our left smoked cigars, and it did bother us pretty much every day. Obviously balcony smoking, even cigars, is allowed so we did not complain, we just retreated inside. We loved the itinerary and enjoyed our cruise very much, but HAL is not our first choice because of the smoking policy. Cruising Glacier Bay, there were many smokers on deck enjoying the awesome scenery. We know this going on HAL, and we take this into account in our decision making as to whether the itinerary trumps the smoking.

Edited February 26, 2016 by Browser495

[Cruise Junky]

Yes, we booked an aft wrap around balcony suite on Oosterdam last summer for an Alaskan cruise. Someone below and to our left smoked cigars, and it did bother us pretty much every day. Obviously balcony smoking, even cigars, is allowed so we did not complain, we just retreated inside. We loved the itinerary and enjoyed our cruise very much, but HAL is not our first choice because of the smoking policy. Cruising Glacier Bay, there were many smokers on deck enjoying the awesome scenery. We know this going on HAL, and we take this into account in our decision making as to whether the itinerary trumps the smoking.

 

UGH...everytime I read a story like this I cringe. I really would like to take that Koningsdam Itinerary but not with balcony smoking.

[Lady Arwen]

We recently booked Koningsdam in an inside cabin for this very reason. I would rather not deal with the smoke on my balcony and pay for the privilege. We are long time Celebrity cruisers and we hope that we've not made a mistake going back to HAL. We haven't been in an inside cabin in 16 years!

[richstowe]

We recently booked Koningsdam in an inside cabin for this very reason. I would rather not deal with the smoke on my balcony and pay for the privilege. We are long time Celebrity cruisers and we hope that we've not made a mistake going back to HAL. We haven't been in an inside cabin in 16 years!

I completely agree . What about a Lanai cabin . We had one on the Veendam and it was great .

Honestly we enjoyed it more then a regular balcony and there is no smoking on the lower promenade deck.

[Lady Arwen]

I completely agree . What about a Lanai cabin . We had one on the Veendam and it was great .

Honestly we enjoyed it more then a regular balcony and there is no smoking on the lower promenade deck.

 

Please correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't believe there are Lanai cabins on Koningsdam.