Riviera on Code Red again

[RJB]

It was reported by an publication called Outbreak News Today, but on closer examination, they were referencing the February outbreak not the current one.

Does not really matter since they seem to have an outbreak every other week. The story is the same, just change the dates.

[hiccups]

Sorry, do not agree with you. Same people going on different ships and they do not get it. A few weeks ago about 60,000 people left from Ft. Lauderdale in one day and none of those 6 or 7 ships got sick. Do those other cruise lines pre screen their passengers for their hygiene? Think not. There is a problem with the ship or the crew and not the passengers.

 

I'm sure this point has been raised at some time during the ongoing trouble with Riviera, but just because other ships may not be "Code Red" does not mean they don't have passengers with some form of noro. Most of those other ships carry between two and three times the number of passengers that Riviera does, and so the 3% of passengers necessary to trigger an investigation is much larger.

Edited April 3, 2016 by hiccups

[RJB]

I'm sure this point has been raised at some time during the ongoing trouble with Riviera, but just because other ships may not be "Code Red" does not mean they don't have passengers with some form of noro. Most of those other ships carry between two and three times the number of passengers that Riviera does, and so the 3% of passengers necessary to trigger an investigation is much larger.

So, what is your point?

[chengkp75]

So, what is your point?

 

The point being that the noro problem may not be limited to the Riviera, but that the vast majority of ships in the greater Miami area have passenger capacities such that the same number of ill passengers as Riviera have may not even trigger the 2% special reporting level, let alone the 3% level where there is any public notice. You have no idea whether the Riviera is an isolated case or part of a much wider problem where Riviera is noticed because of the smaller sample size. But I would suspect that this point is meaningless to you.

[janecambridge]

It could be that Riviera has a large majority of vulnerable passengers.... Older,mature....( just going by recent postings on age)therefore they are more susceptible to the consequences of food poisoning.

 

Oysters have a very high risk of carrying Noro virus and should be very thoroughly cleaned before eating raw or cooking...could there be an alternate switch in staff for this mundane job?

In the Uk we now have some norovirus free oysters,which cost the earth! But we have had some severe high cases of norovirus from oysters in some contaminated waters..

[cassandra44]

We are going on the transatlantic on April 11 ...we are all concerned about the recent code red with so many days at sea. Would someone on the private charter please keep us informed about developments?

If there are more cases will they be posted on the CDC site....i am not sure whether Oceania is still obliged to report while on private charter.

Many thanks.

[chengkp75]

We are going on the transatlantic on April 11 ...we are all concerned about the recent code red with so many days at sea. Would someone on the private charter please keep us informed about developments?

If there are more cases will they be posted on the CDC site....i am not sure whether Oceania is still obliged to report while on private charter.

Many thanks.

 

Yes, they are still required to make the same reports. Just remember, all ships report within 24 hours of arrival at the first US port, whether or not any AGI cases have been reported. At the 2% of passenger or crew reporting AGI threshold, a special report has to be made, and daily reports after that, but remember, these are not listed on the CDC website. It is only when the 3% threshold is met that anything is listed on the website. So technically, a ship could sail for weeks with 2.5% of the passengers ill, and no notice would be made on the CDC website. That isn't the case in reality, as multiple weeks of 2% special reporting would trigger an inspection team to the vessel, but even then, it may or may not be noted on the website.

[Pet Nit Noy]

It could be that Riviera has a large majority of vulnerable passengers.... Older,mature....( just going by recent postings on age)therefore they are more susceptible to the consequences of food poisoning.

 

You've just described the demographic for all the Oceania ships, yet Riviera seems to be experiencing Noro more often than any of the other ships in the fleet.

[RJB]

You've just described the demographic for all the Oceania ships, yet Riviera seems to be experiencing Noro more often than any of the other ships in the fleet.

Very good pick up. Kinda shoots down that theory

[janecambridge]

Valid point,but where are the other ships picking up passengers.? Is Riviera suffering on the days it leaves Miami or other ports...?

[sammiedawg]

Hi!

We are currently aboard the Riviera. Recently learned that there is a noro epidemic in the Miami schools and many of the schools have had to close for several days at a time. This has been going on most of the winter. Perhaps having the Miami travel agents come on at embarkation is not the smartest thing to do!

Rhea

 

*****The information about a bad Noro winter in Miami is the most significant piece of news on this thread. Every ten days or so 1000 plus new passengers pass through Miami to get to the ship via a plane, airport terminal, bus, hotel, restaurants, taxi, cruise terminal, etc. The bottom line is that there are thousands of opportunities each cruise for a new passenger to come in contact with Noro. The same thing is happening in reverse when they disembark and head home , possibly explaining why some posters got sick shortly after arriving home.

Riviera is the ship home ported in Miami for the winter.,

 

Of course passengers can and do pick up Noro anywhere in the world and bring it back to cruise ships.

[pthjudy]

*****The information about a bad Noro winter in Miami is the most significant piece of news on this thread. Every ten days or so 1000 plus new passengers pass through Miami to get to the ship via a plane, airport terminal, bus, hotel, restaurants, taxi, cruise terminal, etc. The bottom line is that there are thousands of opportunities each cruise for a new passenger to come in contact with Noro. The same thing is happening in reverse when they disembark and head home , possibly explaining why some posters got sick shortly after arriving home.

Riviera is the ship home ported in Miami for the winter.,

 

Of course passengers can and do pick up Noro anywhere in the world and bring it back to cruise ships.

If in fact there is a bad noro situation in the Miami area, the unknown factor in why Riviera is suffering more than other Miami based ships could be, IMHO, attributed to those workers who load food and supplies onto the ship prior to each departure. Yes, Oceania screens on ship personnel, but what screening or controls are monitoring those working on the dock? Given that I have no idea if the same people load up the same ship each sailing, but if so, they too need to be isolated if ill. We too are on the April 11 TA and I am trying to lessen my anxiety by thinking of all possible (even implausible) scenarios.

[eroller]

*****The information about a bad Noro winter in Miami is the most significant piece of news on this thread. Every ten days or so 1000 plus new passengers pass through Miami to get to the ship via a plane, airport terminal, bus, hotel, restaurants, taxi, cruise terminal, etc. The bottom line is that there are thousands of opportunities each cruise for a new passenger to come in contact with Noro. The same thing is happening in reverse when they disembark and head home , possibly explaining why some posters got sick shortly after arriving home.

Riviera is the ship home ported in Miami for the winter.,

 

Of course passengers can and do pick up Noro anywhere in the world and bring it back to cruise ships.

 

 

 

I live in the Miami area. There is no noro epidemic here. In fact reading this thread is the first I've ever heard of it. It's simply not true.

 

I have read recently about 200 students becoming ill with norovirus at Miami University OF OHIO. Not Miami Florida people! Just love the way rumors get started. UGH

 

http://college.usatoday.com/2016/02/25/norovirus-miami-university-of-ohio/

Edited April 3, 2016 by eroller

[cassandra44]

Does it develop quickly after exposure? If so wouldnt there be several cases of people obviously sick while waiting to board?

[Pet Nit Noy]

Does it develop quickly after exposure? If so wouldnt there be several cases of people obviously sick while waiting to board?

 

According to the Mayo Clinic web site, "Signs and symptoms usually begin 24 to 48 hours after first exposure to the virus, and last one to three days. You may continue to shed virus in your feces for up to three days after recovery."

 

Most disturbingly, it also says, "Some people with norovirus infection may show no signs or symptoms. However, they are still contagious and can spread the virus to others."

 

http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/norovirus/basics/symptoms/con-20029968

[pthjudy]

According to the Mayo Clinic web site, "Signs and symptoms usually begin 24 to 48 hours after first exposure to the virus, and last one to three days. You may continue to shed virus in your feces for up to three days after recovery."

 

Most disturbingly, it also says, "Some people with norovirus infection may show no signs or symptoms. However, they are still contagious and can spread the virus to others."

 

http://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/norovirus/basics/symptoms/con-20029968

The CDC has to be aware of a Noro Ned or Noro Nellie onboard. If he/she were a steward, the ill people would be clustered in one group of cabins. Evidently that is not so. So that leaves every other crew function. I wonder if there is a test to determine a carrier and if they have done that. This makes the most sense as to why Riviera has continued problems.

[RJB]

*****The information about a bad Noro winter in Miami is the most significant piece of news on this thread. Every ten days or so 1000 plus new passengers pass through Miami to get to the ship via a plane, airport terminal, bus, hotel, restaurants, taxi, cruise terminal, etc. The bottom line is that there are thousands of opportunities each cruise for a new passenger to come in contact with Noro. The same thing is happening in reverse when they disembark and head home , possibly explaining why some posters got sick shortly after arriving home.

Riviera is the ship home ported in Miami for the winter.,

 

Of course passengers can and do pick up Noro anywhere in the world and bring it back to cruise ships.

Every 10 days there must be 50 to 60000 new people passing thru the airports, cruise terminal's taxi's and buses. There are many ships home ported in Miami for the winter. Why only Riviera passengers?

[dlouise]

I live in Miami, and there is NO noro epidemic in this city. I don't know where you get your information, but I would certainly check your source.

Edited April 3, 2016 by dlouise

[MVPinBoynton]

I live in Miami, and there is NO noro epidemic in this city. I don't know where you get your information, but I would certainly check your source.

 

We had Noro issues in our schools in Palm Beach County. Lots of absences.

[chengkp75]

The CDC has to be aware of a Noro Ned or Noro Nellie onboard. If he/she were a steward, the ill people would be clustered in one group of cabins. Evidently that is not so. So that leaves every other crew function. I wonder if there is a test to determine a carrier and if they have done that. This makes the most sense as to why Riviera has continued problems.

 

If there is an asymptomatic carrier, explain why that person does not infect every cruise? See my comments about the trend data that the CDC uses to determine whether or not there is one onboard, and if there was, they would have identified that person by now.

 

Every 10 days there must be 50 to 60000 new people passing thru the airports, cruise terminal's taxi's and buses. There are many ships home ported in Miami for the winter. Why only Riviera passengers?

 

Discounting Port Canaveral, there are 38 ships with more than 2000 pax capacity homeported in the Miami/Ft. Lauderdale area. These ships could be sailing with a total of 2189 theoretically ill passengers without even reaching the 2% special reporting level, let alone the 3% level, EACH WEEK, or about 17,500 theoretically ill passengers over the last two months when the Riviera has had the last two outbreaks, so the 222 ill passengers in the two Riviera outbreaks becomes a pretty small percentage. My numbers are rough and have a few assumptions, but this demonstrates why the Riviera can be called out for a 3% outbreak update when other ships can have far higher patient counts and there is no website notification.

[Pet Nit Noy]

I live in Miami, and there is NO noro epidemic in this city. I don't know where you get your information, but I would certainly check your source.

 

Miami University of Ohio! They're the college with a news-making outbreak of Norovirus. That school is typically mixed up with the University of Miami, but I've never seen them mixed up with the Miami/Dade Country public school system.

 

http://college.usatoday.com/2016/02/25/norovirus-miami-university-of-ohio/

[RJB]

If there is an asymptomatic carrier, explain why that person does not infect every cruise? See my comments about the trend data that the CDC uses to determine whether or not there is one onboard, and if there was, they would have identified that person by now.

 

 

 

Discounting Port Canaveral, there are 38 ships with more than 2000 pax capacity homeported in the Miami/Ft. Lauderdale area. These ships could be sailing with a total of 2189 theoretically ill passengers without even reaching the 2% special reporting level, let alone the 3% level, EACH WEEK, or about 17,500 theoretically ill passengers over the last two months when the Riviera has had the last two outbreaks, so the 222 ill passengers in the two Riviera outbreaks becomes a pretty small percentage. My numbers are rough and have a few assumptions, but this demonstrates why the Riviera can be called out for a 3% outbreak update when other ships can have far higher patient counts and there is no website notification.

Your 2189 sick people would most likely infect quite a few additional people on those ships. If more people are sick than they will infect more people in the same percentage as Riviera. Also the 3% outbreak was not really 3%. It was almost 12% and 9%. Big numbers.

[eroller]

Miami University of Ohio! They're the college with a news-making outbreak of Norovirus. That school is typically mixed up with the University of Miami, but I've never seen them mixed up with the Miami/Dade Country public school system.

 

 

 

http://college.usatoday.com/2016/02/25/norovirus-miami-university-of-ohio/

 

 

Yup. I already posted this earlier.

[chengkp75]

Your 2189 sick people would most likely infect quite a few additional people on those ships. If more people are sick than they will infect more people in the same percentage as Riviera. Also the 3% outbreak was not really 3%. It was almost 12% and 9%. Big numbers.

 

I'm not saying that that many boarded sick, I'm showing how many people could be sick on ships homeporting out of Miami, and there would be no public awareness of it. And yes, the two outbreaks on Riviera were at the higher percentages, but still only 222 people. My point is that Riviera is highlighted as 3+% outbreaks simply because she is a smaller ship, and the percentage is reached quicker.

[vlthom]

I'm not saying that that many boarded sick, I'm showing how many people could be sick on ships homeporting out of Miami, and there would be no public awareness of it. And yes, the two outbreaks on Riviera were at the higher percentages, but still only 222 people. My point is that Riviera is highlighted as 3+% outbreaks simply because she is a smaller ship, and the percentage is reached quicker.

 

Thank you for continuing to be a voice of logic and reason rather than hysteria.