Warning - do not sail Celebrity with young children

[Thorpeys]

This is a long post as I feel those with children need to be fully informed.

 

To precis the concerns experienced are:

- dangerous ratio of staff to children

- unsecure children's facilities where a child can get out at any time

- Unwelcoming staff

- Children told on initial sign up they couldn't play

- Large age range together

- When going to help children get shoes on was told that parents weren't allowed inside, having previously never been told this despite doing so. Children then didn't receive help from staff member.

- Not secure pick up (no use of password)

 

We are currently on the Eclipse with our 4 and 5 year old children. We went on a 14 night cruise with P&O in March and our children absolutely loved the kids club and couldn't wait to get to the fun factory here on the Eclipse. We went to sign them up on the first day and were greeted by one member of staff. We were filling out the forms so the children got some toys out to play with as nothing was available to entertain them. They were quickly told that it was not time to play and was just open house for sign up. They promptly put the toys away and we left. Not a very warm and welcoming start. The Fun Factory area is not secure and children can get out without adult help in to the rest of the ship with open deck only being one level below.

 

They went for their first session the following day. My concerns began to increase. Again only one member of staff. The age ranges had been put together so it was 3-8year olds. The children seemed to have had a good time, saying they had played a Cars game on the X Box.

 

After a couple of sessions I asked a member of staff whether there was always just one adult. I counted atleast 11 children. She explained that yes that was normal. I explained that in the UK that wouldn't be acceptable or safe having just 1 adult in the room.

 

I went to guest relations to ask for a copy of their policies for the Fun Factory. I was initally told by a dissmissive member of guest relations that I'd need to ask the Fun Factory directly. A very helpful lady from guest relations then intervened and arranged an immediate appointment with the manager of the youth provision. Her name is Sarah in guest relations and I will specifically name her because she deserves credit as she was very responsive.

 

I went up to see the manager of the youth provision and explained my concerns re staffing ratio and a number of other concerns which are listed at the top of this post. She said that she was not allowed to give me any policies as they are company property. She told me the staffing ratio is 1 adult to every 15 children aged 3-5yrs. I again raised my concern and shock that only 1 adult was present with this many young children. When I asked what would happen should a child make an allegation about a member of staff I was told that the facility had cameras. This seems rather reactive than proactive. I also pointed out that if a child suddenly became unwell (asthma attack, epilepsy etc) that one adult would have to look after that one child meaning the remaining children would have no supervision. The youth manager said she would liaise with her manager in Miami re policies. I would not be letting my children access the provision as I deemed it unsafe.

 

After 48 hours I'd had no response so went to see the youth manager again. She explained that her manager in Miami had confirmed they were following all procedures correctly and I could have a copy of the ratios. I made it clear that I wanted to have a copy of Celebrity's safeguarding/child protection policy and as my children had/could access it I felt this should be available. I did not feel my concerns had been taken seriously and asked how to make an official complaint. The youth manager did not know and told me to ask guest relations.

 

By this point my children were playing Lego (which we had gone out and purchased ashore) and Uno in the martini bar or Sky Lounge (when available as this is often shut at peak times for 'private functions'). I do apologise to any guests we disturb but we are trying to be as discreet as possible but from talking to fellow passengers they are enjoying engaging with our children and having them around. Other passengers have been shocked when we have explained the situation and fully understanding of our situation and happily engage the children to keep them occupied. One couple said they had noiced more children than ever before around the ship, so I did explain that it might be because the Fun Factory might actually be the Not-So-Fun-Factory. They said they would make sure all their friends and family were aware not to take children on Celebrity.

 

I went to guest relations and again the unhelpful guest relations officer and the helpful one were present. The unhelpful one was well... unhelpful and the helpful one did her best. I asked how to make a formal complaint and apparently one was already logged by the youth manager! They both went and consulted with their manager the head of guest relations who was sat behind a screen. I asked to speak to him directly in the end and he came out to speak with me. I was told I could not have a copy of what had been logged as the complaint as it was information passed between departments but that it had been sent to Miami and head of youth provision for Celebrity wide was aware. I again asked for a copy of the safeguarding/child protection policy. Again no clear information about whether there even is one. We will wait and see if one ever appears.

 

I understand that this practice is acceptable within US policy, although find this horrifying but for a ship that sails out of Britain for the season you would have thought they would consider British policy and expectations. There appear to be plenty of staff in all other departments accept the children and youth provision.

 

The majority of the staff onboard (and most passengers) have been absolutely lovely with our children and much friendlier and warmer towards our children than the children's workers who aren't friendly and are cold and abrupt.

 

So, if you have got this far... if you are happy leaving your 3-5yr old child with 1 adult in a room with responsibility for 15 children with a door that your child can open then cruise Celebrity... if you wouldn't be happy with this... I strongly recommend choosing an alternative cruise line. I can only vouch for P&O's children's facilities which were absolutely excellent and extremely professional and safe.

 

I never in a million years thought I would say that I wished I was on a P&O cruise instead of Celebrity! I love the Celebrity brand and what it offers but if it doesn't provide safe children's facilities we will not be sailing Celebrity again. We all wished we could have got off the Eclipse and on to Ventura when we were docked in Gran Canaria together.

 

I wish I'd had this information prior to booking a Celebrity cruise as this has significantly negatively impacted on the enjoyment of our cruise. We all can't wait to get home and I have never felt like that on any of our 16 cruises before.

[Bo1953]

t - I Am sorry your experience with the Fun Factory was met with less than your expectations compared to your other sailings. Yet, many have never thought of X as being a great line on certain sailings for children at the age of yours.

 

Here in the U.S. there are sailings which specifically tout the children programs on certain sailings, of which I would hope the activities deliver.

 

I Am sure others who have had good or poor experiences with this will chime in shortly.

 

P & O may be the best line for you and the children going forward, or possibly Disney if they have sailings from ports which are convenient for you.

 

bon voyage

[beaveh]

I can understand your frustrations and concerns. I have never considered Celebrity a child friendly cruise line. I think that niche is firmly filled by Royal Carribean. So if I had kids it would not even feature in my choice of cruise option.

I think some people have been lucky with their x cruises and found good staff / facilities. Is there a possibility that UK and USA ideas of child care facilities are poles apart? I doubt they have as much regulation and inspection as anything based in the U.K.

[catperson02]

I echo your concerns. Like you my daughters had loved the children's clubs on P&O ships so were keen to be signed up on our Eclipse cruise in the summer. My daughters both have significant isssues with their joints plus my youngest has asthma and allergies to nuts and some artificial colourings. On P&O all these have been noted plus the medication that my youngest (hopefully) carries. Celebrity showed no interest in this and I was given a dismissive comment of "well we do not allow food in here so her allergies will not be a problem". They were more concerned in telling my daughters that fighting was not tolerated. On the first night all the children were given some strange, sugary fruit tea concoction drink which, thankfully did not trip her allergy.

I did not feel that my daughters were safe so did not send them again. My girls are both teenagers so can and do look out for each other but I really felt that the standard of care was not sufficient. I expressed my concerns and eventually received an emails saying that my concerns had ben noted and they would review their procedures.

Being familiar with how things should be run thanks to my job I would not recommend Celebrity's children's programme to anybody.

[BayAreaBC]

This is good information for those of us who do not wish to cruise with children.

[fshagan]

Staffing ratios for child care for 5 - 8 year olds in the US vary by state. In California, a 1:10 ratio has been mandated for licensed child care facilities for these ages since 1927, and in private home child care later laws require a 1:6 ratio. But camp programs, after-school activities, etc. can have a higher ratio of children to adults.

 

Florida has different standards and can have a 1:25 ratio for 5 - 8 year olds. A ratio of 1:15 would meet the requirement for ages 3 and up. That may be what Celebrity uses.

[Paraveina]

Interesting. I'm in Canada, and I believe in our schools there's a ratio of approximately 25 - 30 students to one teacher for kindergarten (age 5).

[Thorpeys]

I echo your concerns. Like you my daughters had loved the children's clubs on P&O ships so were keen to be signed up on our Eclipse cruise in the summer. My daughters both have significant isssues with their joints plus my youngest has asthma and allergies to nuts and some artificial colourings. On P&O all these have been noted plus the medication that my youngest (hopefully) carries. Celebrity showed no interest in this and I was given a dismissive comment of "well we do not allow food in here so her allergies will not be a problem". They were more concerned in telling my daughters that fighting was not tolerated. On the first night all the children were given some strange, sugary fruit tea concoction drink which, thankfully did not trip her allergy.

I did not feel that my daughters were safe so did not send them again. My girls are both teenagers so can and do look out for each other but I really felt that the standard of care was not sufficient. I expressed my concerns and eventually received an emails saying that my concerns had ben noted and they would review their procedures.

Being familiar with how things should be run thanks to my job I would not recommend Celebrity's children's programme to anybody.

 

Interesting to hear I am not alone! I just wish I'd have known this before booking. We loved Celebrity as a couple hence coming back with the children. I didn't think the children's facilitit's would be so bad. A massive lesson learnt at a great cost.

[Sandtrap328]

Well, maybe the families with young children should consider other types of vacations such as a family friendly resort instead of a cruiseline.

 

I wonder how the other patrons of the Martini Bar or Sky Lounge felt with children of 4 and 5 years old playing with Legos at the bar while their parents were drinking martinis.

[A Sixth?]

Interesting. I'm in Canada, and I believe in our schools there's a ratio of approximately 25 - 30 students to one teacher for kindergarten (age 5).

 

Here's my kindergarten class picture when I was a kid in Canada. :p

 

Good memories....

 

[Thorpeys]

This is good information for those of us who do not wish to cruise with children.

 

It definitely is because there are lots of children around the ship due to the poor service offered in the children's facilities.

[Thorpeys]

Well, maybe the families with young children should consider other types of vacations such as a family friendly resort instead of a cruiseline.

 

I wonder how the other patrons of the Martini Bar or Sky Lounge felt with children of 4 and 5 years old playing with Legos at the bar while their parents were drinking martinis.

 

You have made the assumption we were drinking alcohol... we were not. But we do require somewhere to sit with our children.

[ECCruise]

You have made the assumption we were drinking alcohol... we were not. But we do require somewhere to sit with our children.

 

Honestly, and politely, that makes it even worse. What you are saying is that you commandeered between 3 and 4 seats at a bar while no one was taking advantage of what a bar is intended to be used for. Knowing how busy the Martini Bar is on every cruise we have taken, I would find it very rare that adults who wanted to have a drink would not be without seating.

 

Call me curmudgeon or whatever you like, but sailing during non-holiday (US definition of holiday) periods I prefer to not have to share my space with young children.

[Classynfun1]

This post is exactly why we tell people not to bring children on X on this board. It's not because we are child haters! It's because we recognize that X ships and cruises are designed for adults!

[NLH Arizona]

Honestly, and politely, that makes it even worse. What you are saying is that you commandeered between 3 and 4 seats at a bar while no one was taking advantage of what a bar is intended to be used for. Knowing how busy the Martini Bar is on every cruise we have taken, I would find it very rare that adults who wanted to have a drink would not be without seating.

 

I can't believe that there wasn't another place, rather than an open bar/lounge using seats that patrons could use, where the children could play, but seems like there could have been agenda sitting them in an open bar/lounge.

 

To continue to badger guest services about the policies, seems a little extreme to me. I would have just not gone back and entertained my children myself, if I didn't like some of the policies.

 

Also, if certain polices (adult to child ration) are of concern, a call to the cruise line prior to the cruise (or better prior to booking the cruise) would have been in order IMHO.

[bEwAbG]

I can't believe that there wasn't another place, rather than an open bar/lounge using seats that patrons could use, where the children could play, but seems like there could have been agenda sitting them in an open bar/lounge.

 

To continue to badger guest services about the policies, seems a little extreme to me. I would have just not gone back and entertained my children myself, if I didn't like some of the policies.

 

Also, if certain polices (adult to child ration) are of concern, a call to the cruise line prior to the cruise (or better prior to booking the cruise) would have been in order IMHO.

 

Yes, obviously an agenda at play here. Ditto the remark about finding out the adult to kid ratio in advance (and another good point by someone else about the typical size of kindergarten classes).

 

This is a place to park your kids so you don't have to entertain them for a few hours. Whatever valid points made about security (if true) have been offset by the childish response of inconveniencing other passengers because you're mad that the cruise line won't take care of your children in the manner you dictate.

[Gettingwarmer]

P&O have ships for families and ships for adults only, so you know exactly what you are travelling on. It would appear RCC is better for children than Celebrity.

 

 

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[El Crucero]

I recommend the OP cruise exclusively on Disney, they will be happier there. It will be a win/win solution for both them and me.

[CELTICGIRLCRUISER]

Whilst I can understand some your frustrations with the fun club, although reading through it you seem to be letting it spoil your trip which the constant haranguing of the staff.

 

The Martini and Sky Lounge are definitely not the place for your children to be playing with lego.

 

I am not a Ogre or child hating but if these bars are open at the time, for adults to relax and have a drink preferably it should be without children playing or even in there at all.

 

Call me old fashioned (I am still in my 40s) but children don't belong around a bar/drinking environment.

 

I am sorry to say I also think there was an agenda (selfish one) choosing these places to sit and let your children play.

Edited October 26, 2016 by CELTICGIRLCRUISER

[sennen]

This is a place to park your kids so you don't have to entertain them for a few hours. Whatever valid points made about security (if true) have been offset by the childish response of inconveniencing other passengers because you're mad that the cruise line won't take care of your children in the manner you dictate.[/quo

 

 

This quote is so wrong about being mad at the cruise line for not taking care of there children. Here in the UK firms have a duty of care and that would include a suitable amount of adults to children in childcare. This cruise line should make it clear that they do not have a policy to look after children safely.

 

I am surprised that the USA is so slack in child care what happens if a child has an accident who is left to look after the other children. What happens if a child gets out who is responsible, surely its the cruise line they have the duty of care. The parent leave they children there in good faith if you are offering childcare it must be done correctly.

 

I have no children but still feel that if they cannot look after children correctly what hope for adult guests.

[dkjretired]

I recommend the OP cruise exclusively on Disney, they will be happier there. It will be a win/win solution for both them and me.

 

I guess you haven't read the numerous posts on this board where parents have said their children enjoyed Celevrity kids clubs more than Disney's because there were less children. My children grew up with Celebrity's kids clubs and preferred them to other lines. I am not discounting what the OP said but I do ignore those who tell others not to take their kids on a Celebrity cruise unless they have actually taken kids on Celebrity. They simply don't know what they are talking about since each child is different.

[dkjretired]

This post is exactly why we tell people not to bring children on X on this board. It's not because we are child haters! It's because we recognize that X ships and cruises are designed for adults!

 

Your opinion not shared by thousands of families.

[NHCRUISIN]

I agree entertaining your children in a martini bar is not the best choice. I know I wouldn't be thrilled if the cruise I paid good money for and waited all year for had children playing legos in the bar I wanted to have a drink in.

Maybe if you want to do a cruise geared for children you should select a Disney cruise, if you want a cruise that suits you better leave the children with grandparents or friends. Seems like you are doing more complaining at guest relations than enjoying your cruise, if you don't feel comfortable with the staff or its numbers entertain them and spend time with them in other areas of the ship besides the bars.

[QE2_Fan]

I guess you haven't read the numerous posts on this board where parents have said their children enjoyed Celevrity kids clubs more than Disney's because there were less children. My children grew up with Celebrity's kids clubs and preferred them to other lines. I am not discounting what the OP said but I do ignore those who tell others not to take their kids on a Celebrity cruise unless they have actually taken kids on Celebrity. They simply don't know what they are talking about since each child is different.

 

 

 

+1

 

People on here openly recommending not to take your kids on Celebrity as they prefer not to sail with kids? Where do you get off?!

 

They advertise and market for families and kids club facilities so it's not unreasonable to expect those services to deliver no different to any other service onboard.

 

But to the OP, I'm surprised based on your knowledge and concerns that you had not better investigated these prior to sailing.

 

Personally my kids started using kids club a little older (7yo) and have loved every visit. My daughter has cried having to leave her wonderful carers at the end of the cruise. So seems a very different experience to what you've encountered.

 

 

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[Thorpeys]

I just want to be clear about the points raised about the children being in the Martini bar and the Sky Lounge. They were not sat at the bar, the majority of the times these bars were not even open and we sat in a corner out the way of anybody else that happened to be there. It was not at peak times and we were in no way taking up space so others were left without seats. We were simply finding somewhere inside out of the way of others.

 

We have really enjoyed previous Celebrity cruises hence trying this line with our children. Prior to sailing I did not realise how unsafe Celebrity would be for children.

 

To those who have said we should have checked staff ratio beforehand, it had not even crossed my mind that we would be in this position.

 

I do not feel I have hounded staff about these issues. Raising it once with reception who directed me to the youth provision manager. I then returned after 48 hours for an update. Unsatisfied I then went back to guest relations.

 

My intention was simply to make people aware of the concerns we have encountered so people can make an informed decision.