Prediction: Formal Nights gone by 2020

[bUU]

The selling off of old "classic" tonnage, being replaced by much larger ships designed as amusement parks at sea, multi-generational vacations...

This is an important point. The proprietary sentiment regarding how things should be is misplaced because the foundation for it was generated from substantially smaller ships with substantially different products offered. Those folks who are saying this is the way it always used to be a no isn't it a shame are missing the point. Those sentiments only have legitimacy on the smaller ships from which their legacy came.

 

 

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[John&LaLa]

I think it's no great shakes, but when you consider the costs involved it is not insignificant.

 

I don't know what Royal can buy those lobster tails for wholesale. I can buy frozen medium tails about $5 per. I'm sure Royal pays significantly less. Regardless, they are paying for thousands of them. Someone at the office must know the correlation betwen lobster tails and photo sales. And there will be your key.

 

The first formal night does not have lobster

[OCruisers]

Hopefully, they'll be totally gone by 2020.

They are certainly not what they use to be now.

While we enjoyed them when everyone was actually in formal attire, we have no problem in changing with the times.

[42CruiseCrazy]

There isn't enough seating in the specialty restaurants for your plan unless you're willing to admit just how unpopular formal nights are. The battle has been lost when you have to pay to get people to dress formally.

 

 

 

I probably didn't make my idea as clear as I could. Firstly, on our last Carnival cruise, the number of people dressed in Formal attire would not even fill a large table let alone the entire steakhouse. And the number of men with jacket and tie would not fill more than five tables (including their wives). Secondly, my idea was to make the evening free of charge with a special dining room menu for formal night, served only in the steakhouse.

However, on second thought, a section of the MDR would probably be more financially acceptable to the cruise line.

 

 

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[RocketMan275]

I probably didn't make my idea as clear as I could. Firstly, on our last Carnival cruise, the number of people dressed in Formal attire would not even fill a large table let alone the entire steakhouse. And the number of men with jacket and tie would not fill more than five tables (including their wives). Secondly, my idea was to make the evening free of charge with a special dining room menu for formal night, served only in the steakhouse.

However, on second thought, a section of the MDR would probably be more financially acceptable to the cruise line.

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As soon as it is offered as "free", the numbers will change.

 

There have beeb various suggestions for how to make formal nights special again. JMHO, but any thing sufficiently special would be too expensive.

 

I knew formal nights were "dead" during the roll-out of dynamic dining. DD, with it's rotation through multiple venues with one venue as always formal might have worked. Within a month of Quantum's debut, there was a report that gentlemen who showed up at the formal dining venue (Grande) without jackets were given one. However, there were too few jackets, many which didn't fit, so gentlemen were told to just drape it over their arms as they walked to their table. Since there were insufficient jackets, once they arrived at their table, the waiters escorting them would take the jackets so other gentlemen could have a jacket to carry to their table.

 

At.that point, i realized that formal nights would not last long, If all it takes to be recognized as formal is carrying a jacket to the table, you might as well have the matre'd carry a jacket through the MDR on a long pole. Same effect.

[zdad59]

If they don't enforce anything, it's meaningless.

 

Agree....In this suggested scenario, the dress code must be strictly enforced on the formal dress level of the MDR

[LMaxwell]

Agree....In this suggested scenario, the dress code must be strictly enforced on the formal dress level of the MDR

 

No, you're missing the whole point, there won't BE any formal nights in the MDR in this scenario. This would save on food costs. It may even drive more people to specialty dining, increasing revenue.

 

You can dress up 1, 2, 7 nights if you wish. But there would be one designated Royal Night with meet the Captain / Photos, maybe some live music and dancing on Promenade, Atrium, or maybe an evening champagne toast on the exterior decks. I envision a string of themed activities, totally optional, participate or not, and this way no one gets rubbed the wrong way by what's going on at dinner, because there is no formal dinner and no pretense of one.

 

IMO, Royal, and other lines, gave up "formal" years ago along with the food, service, special touches and atmosphere. The MDR used to be the best food and service, and no longer is, and I think anyone arguing otherwise is really grasping at straws. So Royal may as well stop being "half pregnant" and just get on with the MDR being a nice dining experience, but it is not fine dining. They don't need strict adherence at dinner because they have refused for years to provide a special dinner atmosphere or food. So move the dress to the 9's out of the MDR and to other venues where they could use it to generate more revenue (champagne sales, photo sales, etc.)

[TNcruising02]

With most MDRs having three large levels, why not just make one level a formal night level, that can be selected at booking? It would do a few things...

1. Give those that want to do two formal nights (assuming 7 day cruise) a place to dine with those of similar mind.

2. Give RCL a true read on the demand for formal nights

3. Allow riff raff like me to wear more casual clothes to dinner. (I still say no flip flops, swimwear, or tank tops).

 

Thoughts??

 

I think it's a great idea. If anything, the people who select to participate in formal nights when they book the cruise could be seated in the same area. RCL could post the dress code for formal night when the person is making the selection.

 

I will never participate in formal night and can't imagine hauling formal clothes on a cruise. However, I see that many people enjoy it. They deserve an area where they can dine with other people who appreciate the effort. Then I could dine in the more casual area and not have to eat at the buffet.

[LMaxwell]

I think it's a great idea. If anything, the people who select to participate in formal nights when they book the cruise could be seated in the same area. RCL could post the dress code for formal night when the person is making the selection.

 

I will never participate in formal night and can't imagine hauling formal clothes on a cruise. However, I see that many people enjoy it. They deserve an area where they can dine with other people who appreciate the effort. Then I could dine in the more casual area and not have to eat at the buffet.

 

I agree it is a good idea, but for those so inclined to dress up, I fear it's not going to be enough for them. I really think Royal will throw in the towel and if you want the food from formal night you can find it as a pay extra on the menu all nights / specialty dining. They'll move the revenue to liquor, souvenir, photo sales. Maybe add on to the formal theme with special themes in the casino to drive more deposits there.

 

What happens when someone books 'formal' and decides they don't feel like it and there is no room in a casual dining room? I don't think they could fill 1 level of a dining room with two shifts of fixed seating for formal (and remember, only larger ships have 3 level dining rooms). What about those who want the formal dining but do not want a fixed dining time? Too much fragmentation, too difficult to manage.

 

'Formal Night' will be truly dead in the MDR; it will be moved out of the MDR and become something different and new. People thinking they'll get a small section of the MDR where dressing up unlocks a premium meal are totally in dream land. I don't begrudge them their wishes, but it's not going to happen. The Grande didn't work out exceptionally well. If it had, and other aspects, DD would be alive and well.

[wolfcathorse]

we used to pack our formal night clothes...until it got to be an issue with luggage space. Then I started noticing that not everyone dressed up. Now we're the ones not dressing up, and the Captain doesn't care. I saw some ladies getting their picture taken with the captain in their tank tops and shorts, and I thought, why not me. So now, I only pack one pair on long pants (just in case) in case we're eating in the MDR. We've spent more time in the pool eating solely in the WJ that I don't think we're ever go back to eating in the MDR. On FR in May, we ate MTD in the MDR wearing long pants etc and were seated at a table with a couple in their bathing suits/cover-ups and another couple in their shorts. I'm not going to bother packing formal night clothes and long pants anymore

[riclop]

Why wait that long??

[LMaxwell]

Why wait that long??

:D I enjoy your posts across the forums. You usually manage to hit the point in one sentence.

[ColoradoGurl]

I can see them dropping it down to 1, and then to none, and I agree that they will do away with free lobster simultaneously. Once Royal realizes how much money that saves them, they'll be gone for good.

 

Now that cruises have become an "every-man's" vacation and not just a well-off-retired-person's vacation, they are starting to adapt to the new mainstream clientele. Most of the people who cruise are working people who really want to just relax and enjoy vacation and leave their work clothes at home, rather than cruising to socialize and have a reason to get dressed up again. There are always going to be people who still enjoy the dressing up, but they'll probably just start to push those people to specialty dining.

 

They're following the money, and there are more mainstream people who cruise now, and the people who've been around forever are getting a lot of free perks in the form of free drinks and discounted rooms. They've been-there-done-that and probably aren't spending as much on the same old things they've done a million times. And there simply just aren't enough of those people to make as much money on compared to the mainstream population. They make their money on the newbies, and the newbies don't want to spend 3 hours of their vacation time getting dressed up and sitting through dinner in uncomfortable clothing.

 

 

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[John&LaLa]

Do you work in a tuxedo?

 

Never understood why people equate a tuxedo to work clothes?

 

Actually tuxedos work very well on a cruise. The waistband is generally expandable. 😉

 

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[ColoradoGurl]

Do you work in a tuxedo?

 

Never understood why people equate a tuxedo to work clothes?

 

Actually tuxedos work very well on a cruise. The waistband is generally expandable. [emoji6]

 

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Haha. Well no, you've got me there. I guess I just mean having to adhere to a dress code in general and having to bring more formal attire than a vacation usually requires. To me, putting on a fancy dress or putting on a sundress takes the same amount of time if you're only talking about the dress. But as a woman, the makeup and the hair that goes with the fancier dress takes an extra hour of time, and a lot more room in my suitcase because of all the products involved. Unfortunately I'm just not naturally gorgeous enough to wear a formal dress with a bare face, haha.

 

 

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[John&LaLa]

Haha. Well no, you've got me there. I guess I just mean having to adhere to a dress code in general and having to bring more formal attire than a vacation usually requires. To me, putting on a fancy dress or putting on a sundress takes the same amount of time if you're only talking about the dress. But as a woman, the makeup and the hair that goes with the fancier dress takes an extra hour of time, and a lot more room in my suitcase because of all the products involved. Unfortunately I'm just not naturally gorgeous enough to wear a formal dress with a bare face, haha.

 

 

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Yep, I can pop my tux on and look fine in about 3 minutes. Plus it matches anything Laura wears. Men have it easy

 

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[pspercy]

Call it what you want, just keep guys in tank-tops out of the MDR, especially if they're wearing ball caps backwards:(

Edited March 29, 2017 by pspercy

[TominNC]

Not that I would ever wear a ball cap to dinner in MDR. But I find it interesting how that bothers so many so much. It wouldn't bother me at all if dozens of guys had caps on. I just can't be bothered with how others dress. Why is a cap offensive? (Let's assume the other clothes are not too revealing and are clean and neat.)

[kawagama]

We have only been on one cruise so far, in 2016 to Alaska. Because of the "formal" nights on this cruise, our packing was a nightmare as we needed clothing for that as well as all the outdoorsy stuff we were doing in Alaska. It was a pain. And, to be honest, I didn't notice a huge difference in the dining room, other than the fact that some of the options were fancier. It was still the same dining room, with the same table cloths, etc. (We weren't on RCI). Dressing nicely for dinner is fine, but the whole formal thing, to me, is just silly. I think that if people want to have that it should be set up in one of the specialty restaurants for those few who really truly want it. From what I have read on these boards, it seems that many of the "old-style" cruise options are long gone, making this form of travel more a casual event. People are looking for deals, cheap cruises, complaining about new fees and lowered standards--and yet want to maintain the guise of luxury and formality? That just doesn't make sense to me. A simple dress code is enough--long pants, proper shoes, and no baseball caps--would be fine in my opinion.

[kawagama]

With most MDRs having three large levels, why not just make one level a formal night level, that can be selected at booking? It would do a few things...

1. Give those that want to do two formal nights (assuming 7 day cruise) a place to dine with those of similar mind.

2. Give RCL a true read on the demand for formal nights

3. Allow riff raff like me to wear more casual clothes to dinner. (I still say no flip flops, swimwear, or tank tops).

 

Thoughts??

 

Great idea!

[Mary229]

I think airline luggage fees were the beginning of the end for formal night. Nobody wants to pack extra evening wear. I am not a fan of formal night, I feel I paid for the cruise and should not be kicked out of the dining room to benefit some else's sense of decorum. Sure if you are invited to the Captain's table by all means dude it up.

[RocketMan275]

I'm not a big fan of baseball caps, but if the gentleman wearing one is over 70 and the cap indicates some veterans affiliation (Vietnam Vet, Etc.), I will defend his right to wear the cap in the MDR and I really don't care who is offended.

[bUU]

Not that I would ever wear a ball cap to dinner in MDR. But I find it interesting how that bothers so many so much. It wouldn't bother me at all if dozens of guys had caps on. I just can't be bothered with how others dress. Why is a cap offensive? (Let's assume the other clothes are not too revealing and are clean and neat.)

When people feel that their personal opinions aren't sufficient to prevail for them, they'll often seek scurrilous rhetorical tricks to try to make those opinions seem more important than they are. What you're referring to can be thought of as a way to demean any variance from what the person voicing the concern considers acceptable - effectively an attempt to rhetorically mentally link (for example) wearing a rolled collar shirt and designer bluejeans with wearing a tank top, cut-off shorts and a baseball cap. For extra measure, I've sometimes seen reference made to turning the cap around, perhaps an insidious attempt at linking variance from what the person voicing the concern considers acceptable to even more nefarious character traits.

[rjrpar]

No, you're missing the whole point, there won't BE any formal nights in the MDR in this scenario. This would save on food costs. It may even drive more people to specialty dining, increasing revenue.

 

 

 

You can dress up 1, 2, 7 nights if you wish. But there would be one designated Royal Night with meet the Captain / Photos, maybe some live music and dancing on Promenade, Atrium, or maybe an evening champagne toast on the exterior decks. I envision a string of themed activities, totally optional, participate or not, and this way no one gets rubbed the wrong way by what's going on at dinner, because there is no formal dinner and no pretense of one.

 

 

 

IMO, Royal, and other lines, gave up "formal" years ago along with the food, service, special touches and atmosphere. The MDR used to be the best food and service, and no longer is, and I think anyone arguing otherwise is really grasping at straws. So Royal may as well stop being "half pregnant" and just get on with the MDR being a nice dining experience, but it is not fine dining. They don't need strict adherence at dinner because they have refused for years to provide a special dinner atmosphere or food. So move the dress to the 9's out of the MDR and to other venues where they could use it to generate more revenue (champagne sales, photo sales, etc.)

 

 

100% agree. Formal nights disappeared years ago. Food quality down and people dressing much more casually. Nothing wrong with this but some posters just won't acknowledge the obvious facts

 

 

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[CruiseTobey]

When people feel that their personal opinions aren't sufficient to prevail for them, they'll often seek scurrilous rhetorical tricks to try to make those opinions seem more important than they are. What you're referring to can be thought of as a way to demean any variance from what the person voicing the concern considers acceptable - effectively an attempt to rhetorically mentally link (for example) wearing a rolled collar shirt and designer bluejeans with wearing a tank top, cut-off shorts and a baseball cap. For extra measure, I've sometimes seen reference made to turning the cap around, perhaps an insidious attempt at linking variance from what the person voicing the concern considers acceptable to even more nefarious character traits.

 

 

Wow! Someone gave their thesaurus a workout! Would you mind repeating that in English please? :D