Emotional support animal - peacock

[Fouremco]

I wish I was on board a Celebrity ship right now (I bet we all do!) .. on our recent Infinity sailing I again saw that sign at the whirlpool stating, alongside the other rules, that support animals are not allowed in the water. I always hope they are being pro-active, and that no one has ever tried. :o I wanted to take a photo of it but I never took my phone in there - probably a wise move.

 

Anyway, there were a few "Chair Hogs" around, but no "Water Dogs" in sight.

Hardly seems fair for Dexter the Duck (post #7). :(

[cruisestitch]

A few pages back someone mentioned Harley's. There is currently a club on board. Many parked in the atrium today, on display and getting cleaned and polished

 

 

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[NLH Arizona]

The animal HAS to have a proper "Service Animal" vest.

Under the law, service animals do not have to wear a "vest" nor do they have to have any certification. I personally think that all true service dogs should have to be registered; ala, handicap car plates, but unfortunately many organizations and those with service dogs feel that this would be intrusive. If there was a system set up, it would ensure that the dogs are trained. I have a friend with a service dog and the dog under went training and my friend had to go through 18 months of training before he could get the dog.

 

Also, people get confused on the three type of dogs that have been discussed on here.

 

A therapy dog is a dog that might be trained to provide affection, comfort and love to people in hospitals, retirement homes, nursing homes, schools, hospices, disaster areas, etc. They undergo training and are certified. They are not allowed in public buildings unless working. They are not allowed on planes.

Emotional support dogs are dogs that provide comfort and support in forms of affection and companionship for an individual suffering from various mental and emotional conditions. These dogs do not perform a particular task and they are usually not trained. They are only allowed on planes and housing, by law, and are not allowed in public buildings.

A service dog is a type of assistance dog specifically trained to help people who have disabilities, such as visual impairment, hearing impairments, mental illnesses (such as post traumatic stress disorder), seizure disorder, mobility impairment, and diabetes. These dogs are highly trained and are allowed in any place that their owner choses to go. If a true service dog is on a plane, on a cruise, in a restaurant, you probably wouldn't know it is there unless it happens to walk by you. Service dogs, sit at their owners feet, never beg, never look for attention from anyone, never eats from a table, never does its business anywhere other than where it is instructed to go, never growls at someone, never barks unless alerting their owner to an issue with their disability, etc.

[cruzeluver]

While I applaud Delta for wanting to crack down on fraudulent support animals, their new policy as it stands is a problem. It requires proof of vaccinations to be submitted 48 hours in advance for all service animals. This means a blind person with a guide dog would not be able to book a flight leaving in less than 48 hours. That is a problem.

[keithm]

When my DW and I enter the ship she is frequently asked "Why are you bringing this animal on the ship?" She responds with "For financial support!" Works every time! Only documentation needed is credit card.

Too bad I wasn't on your cruise! I'd have you both arrested for fraud the moment we returned to port!

[keithm]

In many cases you can't tell the difference. I have always agreed there are many failings of the ADA.

Then it's DAMN time we did something!! States are now finally beginning to crack down on the fraud. You can just buy all the fake documentation on line. Often listed with a slimebag lawyer's name on how to "get" service animal "certification" It's all a sham created by these slime lawyers, because they know no one will challenge the pet owner(well, not me!) There's a bar/grill in Woodstock Vt. It had a detailed sign on the door refusing Therapy/Emotional support animals. It also stated the owner will ask 2 questions of the (supposed)Service animal owner: (the questions allowed by ADA)If the animal owner refuses to answer the 2 questions or gets belligerent, they will be told to leave immediately or the police will be called. It was without a doubt the best response of a shop owner to the fraud that is perpetrated I've seen. I asked him why he did this. His response was too many tourists trying to bring their damn pets into an eating establishment. He said in the 5 years he's had the sign, he's only had to call the police twice. Worst offenders are Self Entitled New Yorkers thinking it will work for them in VT. Store owners may be too cowardly in NYC. Nice to see some of them have "balls" in VT.!!

[girlcruiser]

There is also a group with mobility scooters that should ride with that group too!

 

 

 

There was a guy on the Breakaway last week that pushed the wrong button on his mobility scooter and ran into a table and almost wiped out a couple of elderly woman. Yes we also had an emotional support dog in a baby carriage met it in the theatre

After Burn the Floor

 

 

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[dkjretired]

Then it's DAMN time we did something!! States are now finally beginning to crack down on the fraud. You can just buy all the fake documentation on line. Often listed with a slimebag lawyer's name on how to "get" service animal "certification" It's all a sham created by these slime lawyers, because they know no one will challenge the pet owner(well, not me!) There's a bar/grill in Woodstock Vt. It had a detailed sign on the door refusing Therapy/Emotional support animals. It also stated the owner will ask 2 questions of the (supposed)Service animal owner: (the questions allowed by ADA)If the animal owner refuses to answer the 2 questions or gets belligerent, they will be told to leave immediately or the police will be called. It was without a doubt the best response of a shop owner to the fraud that is perpetrated I've seen. I asked him why he did this. His response was too many tourists trying to bring their damn pets into an eating establishment. He said in the 5 years he's had the sign, he's only had to call the police twice. Worst offenders are Self Entitled New Yorkers thinking it will work for them in VT. Store owners may be too cowardly in NYC. Nice to see some of them have "balls" in VT.!!

 

Everything you said is correct however the problem with state laws is that they can't supersede those two questions that a proprietor is allowed to answer. If the person answers those questions there's not much that can be done except to watch the behavior of the animal. If there is bad behavior it should be documented. I have said in the past on other posts that this is something that can be done quite simply on cruise ships. There are cameras and staff all over the place, document these bad behaviors and throw them off at the next port. If they are ESA, that's a different story that the cruise lines have to deal with by new rules.

 

I have also mentioned on other threads that I strongly believe that cruise lines will not do this for PR reasons and also that some of these people could be VIPs. This was sort of backed up in one of the threads possible this one that one of those women with the fake dogs was in one of the high priced suites. Not referring to animals but general behavior, I have seen threads where erratic behavior was condoned on some cruises because the people doing it were big stock holders. I will give you an example of this type of behavior, not on a ship but in Atlantic City. Wife and I were sitting in one of the bars having a drink and enjoying a nice group with a woman lead singer. A drunk gentleman there threw a glass glass at the lead singer and hit her with it and started acting like drunks do, very loud and abuse. The glass had drawn blood on the singer and security was called. Found out later the guy was warned, not ejected from the hotel or arrested. Why, he was a very high roller. I know this because prior to sitting in the lounge wife and I were visiting with a former co worker who was not working security in that casino. Saw her later who told us the outcome.

 

Point is, I believe this happens on ships.

[keithm]

Everything you said is correct however the problem with state laws is that they can't supersede those two questions that a proprietor is allowed to answer. If the person answers those questions there's not much that can be done except to watch the behavior of the animal. If there is bad behavior it should be documented. I have said in the past on other posts that this is something that can be done quite simply on cruise ships. There are cameras and staff all over the place, document these bad behaviors and throw them off at the next port. If they are ESA, that's a different story that the cruise lines have to deal with by new rules.

 

I have also mentioned on other threads that I strongly believe that cruise lines will not do this for PR reasons and also that some of these people could be VIPs. This was sort of backed up in one of the threads possible this one that one of those women with the fake dogs was in one of the high priced suites. Not referring to animals but general behavior, I have seen threads where erratic behavior was condoned on some cruises because the people doing it were big stock holders. I will give you an example of this type of behavior, not on a ship but in Atlantic City. Wife and I were sitting in one of the bars having a drink and enjoying a nice group with a woman lead singer. A drunk gentleman there threw a glass glass at the lead singer and hit her with it and started acting like drunks do, very loud and abuse. The glass had drawn blood on the singer and security was called. Found out later the guy was warned, not ejected from the hotel or arrested. Why, he was a very high roller. I know this because prior to sitting in the lounge wife and I were visiting with a former co worker who was not working security in that casino. Saw her later who told us the outcome.

 

Point is, I believe this happens on ships.

Outside of Cunard I've not seen any dogs or any other animal. Cruiselines can refuse animals at their leisure as they are NOT registered in the US.

[dkjretired]

Outside of Cunard I've not seen any dogs or any other animal. Cruiselines can refuse animals at their leisure as they are NOT registered in the US.

 

Don't understand the last sentence.

[maggie cruises]

What is this world coming to?

 

I can't believe this

 

I am devastated

 

 

This is downright blatant discrimination and we should fight it

 

Let's organize a "fund me" for this poor emotionally distraught woman

 

 

Fwiw.....NBC got you to view their news didn't they? Bet they put out plenty of "story at 11" teasers too

 

 

 

 

 

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[RDC1]

Outside of Cunard I've not seen any dogs or any other animal. Cruiselines can refuse animals at their leisure as they are NOT registered in the US.

 

Not quite, there was a supreme court ruling in 2005, that cruise ships, sailing from US ports had to comply with ADA where feasible. Where feasible means that they did not have to physically modify a ship to be entirely ADA compliant, but they did need to comply is other ways, and if they modified a portion of the ship, such modifications should include more ADA compliance.

 

The ruling was best summed up in the following statement about Justice Thomas's comment:

 

Justice Clarence Thomas provided the sixth vote holding that the ADA applies. But he joined the dissenters in saying the actual modifications required under the federal law did not extend to changes to a ship’s “physical structure.”

Edited February 3, 2018 by RDC1

[Hydrokitty]

While I applaud Delta for wanting to crack down on fraudulent support animals, their new policy as it stands is a problem. It requires proof of vaccinations to be submitted 48 hours in advance for all service animals. This means a blind person with a guide dog would not be able to book a flight leaving in less than 48 hours. That is a problem.

 

I don't think that's going to happen. Under the ADA Delta cannot refuse to allow a service dog on a plane or in a public place. In order to become a service dog, the animal must have all of its vaccinations and in most states must be identifiable as a service animal. The problem with emotional support animals is that they are NOT required to have any training and the ADA does NOT grant them the RIGHT to be in pubic places, however the DOT All Carrier Access Law allows those with proof of disability to accompany its owner on public transportation. I think Delta is well within its right to insist these animals be vaccinated but I think it's the proof of vaccination that needs to be dated within 48 hours, not the vaccination itself.

[NLH Arizona]

....and in most states must be identifiable as a service animal.

They are only identifiable if their owner is asked if it is a service animal and their response is yes. Neither federal government or any state governments require any vests, specific harness, any id tags, any paperwork, etc.

[keesar]

They are only identifiable if their owner is asked if it is a service animal and their response is yes. Neither federal government or any state governments require any vests, specific harness, any id tags, any paperwork, etc.

 

On our cruise, there was an individual with a well dressed dog who had a hand printed sign saying "Service Dog" on the scooter. When new pastries arrived at Cafe al Bacio, the individual hopped out of the scooter and hustled over to get a berliner. The dog did like the luncheon meat from the buffet.

[NLH Arizona]

On our cruise, there was an individual with a well dressed dog who had a hand printed sign saying "Service Dog" on the scooter. When new pastries arrived at Cafe al Bacio, the individual hopped out of the scooter and hustled over to get a berliner. The dog did like the luncheon meat from the buffet.

If I would have seen them feeding their dog at the buffet, I would have taken a picture of it and sent it to the health department at the next US port. And I'm sure you know that that was no service dog, but a faker.

[keesar]

If I would have seen them feeding their dog at the buffet, I would have taken a picture of it and sent it to the health department at the next US port. And I'm sure you know that that was no service dog, but a faker.

 

I find it ironic that buffets cannot be located near carpeted areas but dogs are allowed to eat in the dining area. The individual held the dog so that the dog could see the choices at the sandwich bar. Then the dog ate off a plate.

[NLH Arizona]

I find it ironic that buffets cannot be located near carpeted areas but dogs are allowed to eat in the dining area. The individual held the dog so that the dog could see the choices at the sandwich bar. Then the dog ate off a plate.

That should not be allowed, as it is against all health codes. Report it and let the cruise line know you will report it to the health department, if you see it again.

[happicruzer]

Having sat next to a lovely women, while we both observed a pet on board - the woman mentioned, how after losing her husband last spring, she planned to get her dog certified so it could be her companion on future cruises.

 

I’ve been on board with service dogs and pets. Yes, you usually can tell the difference.

 

A pet traveling as a service dog under fraudulent papers should be subject to a fine, same as smokers in a room or on a balcony.

 

It is way past time to tighten regulations. If the regulations say, on all four feet or carried, a dog sitting at a dinner table should immediately be removed and the owner fined. And, yes - please leave the peacock home.

 

I have a neighbor with a ‘service’ dog - she goes to work, the grocery store and who knows where else while neighbors take the dog for potty breaks while the dog wears the service vest.

 

Change won’t happen until someone is severely injured by Princess Fluffy.

[keithm]

On our cruise, there was an individual with a well dressed dog who had a hand printed sign saying "Service Dog" on the scooter. When new pastries arrived at Cafe al Bacio, the individual hopped out of the scooter and hustled over to get a berliner. The dog did like the luncheon meat from the buffet.

I would call authorities at embarkation & have that scumbag arrested for fraud!

[keithm]

I find it ironic that buffets cannot be located near carpeted areas but dogs are allowed to eat in the dining area. The individual held the dog so that the dog could see the choices at the sandwich bar. Then the dog ate off a plate.

Under my watch: Photo, then arrest at home port simple as that!

[keithm]

On our cruise, there was an individual with a well dressed dog who had a hand printed sign saying "Service Dog" on the scooter. When new pastries arrived at Cafe al Bacio, the individual hopped out of the scooter and hustled over to get a berliner. The dog did like the luncheon meat from the buffet.

I'd take a pic & tell her I'll be reporting her to the authorities for fraud. That will scare her a bit.

Had a guy in Sam's Club. He came in with this large mutt. The dog hopped up on the table & began eating food off it. I said to a mgr. why nothing is being done. He said "corporate policy" (and too chicken) Well as a private citizen, I can ask the questions too many employees are scared to ask: I said: "Is that a service dog & what service does it do?" The skanky looking guy replies "Yes, it's a service dog for handicapped people"(I've seen the guy several times, NOT handicapped)

"That's not the question I asked. What service does it do?"

Again, "It's for handicapped people". My next response got everyone's attention: "Sir, do you understand that fraudulent use of an animal as a service animal will result in a fine of $2000 & 6 months in jail?" Ahh, the look of fear! The guy gets on his phone to friend/family member saying "this guy is giving me crap about bringing the dog in the store." I held up my phone & said, "Sorry, guy but I'm going to have to call the police & have you arrested. I have taken a picture of you & the dog". He took off really fast out of the store. A few questioned my motives, but more cheered me on! If people do nothing, then crap like this happens. If you threaten a little, the fakers will split & in a hurry! Fear can be a great motivator!

[keesar]

Many of these "service" dogs are just really pets where the owners probably do not want to pay boarding fees or inconvenience others when on the cruise. I did ask the owner what service the dogs does. I was told that the dog monitors blood sugar levels. OMG....

[Hydrokitty]

Keith while I applaud your chutzpah.....you take a chance doing that to people you don't know.

[NLH Arizona]

Many of these "service" dogs are just really pets where the owners probably do not want to pay boarding fees or inconvenience others when on the cruise. I did ask the owner what service the dogs does. I was told that the dog monitors blood sugar levels. OMG....

Actually one of a true service dog's tasks is to alert someone with diabetes that their blood sugar is low.

 

The dog must be trained to take a specific action when needed to assist the person with a disability. For example, a person with diabetes may have a dog that is trained to alert him when his blood sugar reaches high or low levels.

https://www.ada.gov/regs2010/service_animal_qa.html