Allure propulsion issues?

[Clarea]

13 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

No.   No floating docks big enough, even to try the cofferdam thing, the largest have been sold/moved to the West Coast.  Most of the graving docks that do commercial work on the East Coast wouldn't hold the Vista, let alone Allure.  I believe Grand Bahamas is trying to purchase a floating dock from China or Singapore.

 

So if something happened to one of the Oasis class ships where they had no propulsion (can't think of how this might occur), their only option would be to tow it to Europe.

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, twodaywonder said:

I was replying to this. "As I say, there are savings with pods, in fuel efficiency, and in capital cost, but there are drawbacks as well, such as not being able to repair the pods without drydocking, something that shafted propellers can do with divers, or internally in the ship" You mention nothing about bearings. Just repairing. You do say shafted PROPELLERS. Not bearings.

Well, you know, "shafted propellers" include a whole lot more than a propeller, like a shaft, shaft bearings, shaft seals, electric motor, and in some cases a hydraulic system to change the pitch of the propellers.  Just like azipods are more than a propeller, it is a shaft, a seal, bearings, and an electric motor, as well as the portions of the system inside the ship.  Perhaps I should have been more specific and stated "shafted propeller system", but then I would have had to have you say that ABB builds "podded propulsion systems" and not "pods".  And, just so you know, many times with azipods, when repair is not going to be accomplished in the near future, divers will remove the blades from the "podded propulsion system's" propeller to allow the ship to apply the brake to the shaft and keep it from "windmilling" in the water flow of the ship moving through the water, which could continue to damage the bearings.  So, again, yes, you can change a propeller without going into drydock.  

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, Host Clarea said:

 

So if something happened to one of the Oasis class ships where they had no propulsion (can't think of how this might occur), their only option would be to tow it to Europe.

They could do what I thought they were going to do with Vista, and that is to attach a cofferdam to the bottom of the ship (if the cofferdam is empty, it will try to float up under the ship and force itself against the hull to seal with a rubber gasket.  They would sink the cofferdam, position it under the ship over the pod, and pump it out.  If they made it long enough to stick out beyond the stern of the ship, they could bring the cofferdam sides up beyond the ship's waterline, and have an open area where a crane could lower stuff into the cofferdam.  This kind of thing is done quite regularly with offshore oil rigs that are too large for conventional drydocks.

[ALWAYS CRUZIN]

3 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

Well, you know, "shafted propellers" include a whole lot more than a propeller, like a shaft, shaft bearings, shaft seals, electric motor, and in some cases a hydraulic system to change the pitch of the propellers.  Just like azipods are more than a propeller, it is a shaft, a seal, bearings, and an electric motor, as well as the portions of the system inside the ship.  Perhaps I should have been more specific and stated "shafted propeller system", but then I would have had to have you say that ABB builds "podded propulsion systems" and not "pods".  And, just so you know, many times with azipods, when repair is not going to be accomplished in the near future, divers will remove the blades from the "podded propulsion system's" propeller to allow the ship to apply the brake to the shaft and keep it from "windmilling" in the water flow of the ship moving through the water, which could continue to damage the bearings.  So, again, yes, you can change a propeller without going into drydock.  

I would love to see how they change this without going into dry dock. That would be very interesting for sure.

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, twodaywonder said:

I would love to see how they change this without going into dry dock. That would be very interesting for sure.

 

Exactly the same way they do it in a drydock.  They weld lifting points to the bottom of the ship over the propeller, you attach chain hoists to the propeller, you attach the hydraulic jack to the propeller and pop it off the taper, then maneuver the propeller off the shaft and out from under the hull with multiple chain hoists.  It is more difficult for divers, but it is doable, and has been done.

 

Oh, and by the way, that is the largest propeller in the world, capable of more horsepower than all three of Allure's azipods put together.

[ALWAYS CRUZIN]

4 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

Exactly the same way they do it in a drydock.  They weld lifting points to the bottom of the ship over the propeller, you attach chain hoists to the propeller, you attach the hydraulic jack to the propeller and pop it off the taper, then maneuver the propeller off the shaft and out from under the hull with multiple chain hoists.  It is more difficult for divers, but it is doable, and has been done.

 

Oh, and by the way, that is the largest propeller in the world, capable of more horsepower than all three of Allure's azipods put together.

I have read that they are so precisely balanced that if they ding it when install one. They must remove it,. Is that true?

[Clarea]

18 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

They could do what I thought they were going to do with Vista, and that is to attach a cofferdam to the bottom of the ship (if the cofferdam is empty, it will try to float up under the ship and force itself against the hull to seal with a rubber gasket.  They would sink the cofferdam, position it under the ship over the pod, and pump it out.  If they made it long enough to stick out beyond the stern of the ship, they could bring the cofferdam sides up beyond the ship's waterline, and have an open area where a crane could lower stuff into the cofferdam.  This kind of thing is done quite regularly with offshore oil rigs that are too large for conventional drydocks.

 

Hard for me to visualize the cofferdam, I'll look for some photos or youtube videos.

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, twodaywonder said:

I have read that they are so precisely balanced that if they ding it when install one. They must remove it,. Is that true?

They are balanced, but minor knicks don't matter.  If they put a major dent in it, then they would have to straighten it, and there are still some old timers out there that can straighten a propeller blade by eye.  Every propeller that has been in the water for more than a few months will have knicks, dents, and bends on it, and marine growth like barnacles and sea weed.  Yes, it will increase vibrations, but until it becomes noticeable, it is just left.

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, Host Clarea said:

 

Hard for me to visualize the cofferdam, I'll look for some photos or youtube videos.

Think of a shoe box with no top as the cofferdam, and your living room coffee table as the ship.  You fill the box with water and it sinks below the top of the coffee table.  Move the box under the top of the table, and raise it by inflating bladders on the outside of the box, until the open top of the box rests against the bottom of the coffee table top.  Now, when you pump the water out of the box, it becomes buoyant, and wants to float up, but the coffee table keeps it from rising, so the box forces itself harder and harder against the table top.  This aids the seal around the edge of the box, and keeps the water out.  You now can work inside the empty box in shirt sleeves.

 

Here is a link to a company that does a lot of cofferdam work, mostly closed types, that remove the sea water from the outside of a section of hull so that a dent can be cut out and replaced, but the concept is the same:

 

http://www.subseasolutions.com/underwater-weld-repairs.php

 

Two day wonder may also like to look at their page on underwater propeller repairs, and how they can balance a propeller in place, under water.

[Clarea]

Thanks very much!

[John&LaLa]

1 hour ago, Host Clarea said:

 

So if something happened to one of the Oasis class ships where they had no propulsion (can't think of how this might occur), their only option would be to tow it to Europe.

 

And that's why I'm stockpiling essential supplies 

[John&LaLa]

34 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

They are balanced, but minor knicks don't matter.  If they put a major dent in it, then they would have to straighten it, and there are still some old timers out there that can straighten a propeller blade by eye.  Every propeller that has been in the water for more than a few months will have knicks, dents, and bends on it, and marine growth like barnacles and sea weed.  Yes, it will increase vibrations, but until it becomes noticeable, it is just left.

 

You used to see propeller blades that were modular and bolted to the foredeck.

[Thorben-Hendrik]

4 hours ago, John&LaLa said:

 

Didnt Oasis cross with two pods?

 

But she had no revenue passengers 

That's the point! 👍

Too much risk transporting 8000 people in the middle of the Atlantic with engine problems!🙄

Also she would be limping all summer long in the Med..... and if they have to cancel Med sailings because it gets worse.... that means 💵 💵💵🤑

Edited July 12, 2019 by Thorben-Hendrik

[John&LaLa]

35 minutes ago, Thorben-Hendrik said:

That's the point! 👍

Too much risk transporting 8000 people in the middle of the Atlantic with engine problems!🙄

Also she would be limping all summer long in the Med..... and if they have to cancel Med sailings because it gets worse.... that means 💵 💵💵🤑

 

No limping, headed straight to Cadiz if/when we make it to Barcelona 

[Thorben-Hendrik]

Just now, John&LaLa said:

 

No limping, headed straight to Cadiz if/when we make it to Barcelona 

Ohh yes..... mixed up with the original Oasis drydock planning..... 🙄 😱

[FanofMinnie]

Thank you for all of this helpful information! It sounds like they are giving people a great deal of advance notice, so I will just wait and see what happens in the future. I am really looking forward to cruising on Allure. 

[Vitesacd]

If I book and its cancelled, will I be refunded and compensated? 

[Clarea]

3 minutes ago, Vitesacd said:

If I book and its cancelled, will I be refunded and compensated? 

 

For sure one of the options will be a full refund, but that refund will only be money that has been paid to RC.  They will not refund any airfare (but sometimes will cover change fees but not fare differences) or prepaid hotel charges.

 

They would normally also offer price protection on similar cruises of their choice and on board credit based on stateroom category.

[chengkp75]

15 hours ago, John&LaLa said:

 

You used to see propeller blades that were modular and bolted to the foredeck.

Those are for a controllable pitch propeller, where the blades rotate on the hub to change the pitch.  QE2 used to have two sets, since one prop is right handed and the other left handed.  I haven't seen anyone carrying azipod blades lately. They are similar, but instead of a round "boss" or bottom of the blade that has seals and rotates to change pitch, azipod blades have square "bosses" that are curved to form a quarter of the circumference of the propeller hub.

[Thorben-Hendrik]

6 hours ago, Host Clarea said:

They would normally also offer price protection on similar cruises of their choice and on board credit based on stateroom category.

Most likely not for this TA - nothing close and TA's are so rare in 2020 with Indy cancelled and already rebooked...🙄

[Clarea]

3 minutes ago, Thorben-Hendrik said:

Most likely not for this TA - nothing close and TA's are so rare in 2020 with Indy cancelled and already rebooked...🙄

 

I agree, if there is northing remotely comparable, then probably cancel with refund and OBC for another cruise.  Possibly even some FCC.

[Lionesss]

Having just sailed the Allure June 30. 

 

And since there TV has little offerings of channel selections.....I watched the updates on the map provided by the bridge.

 

Well do not get too excited, every 20 second intervals it changed...

 

During which the one showing the front view from the camera on the ocean  was a black void yup camera broke.

 

Now our speed  depending where we were in ....ranged from 15.1----19.5  (Knots)????

Unless they were lying, but we seemed to be cruising pretty fast some days.

 

And when you watched the wake at the back of the ship, there were 3 uproars of the waves (for lack of better description).

 

So, we were not compromised.

 

Now mind you when we sailed on May 5th.  the times on port days were changed to accommodate the problem.

 

I guess the western route has no problems.....????? trade winds???  Dunno

 

Too all those on upcoming cruises, safe travels.

 

And If I was stranded at sea on a ship with no knotts/hour........I guess I would just attribute it to BRANDON..

(Sorry another thread)

 

 

Sea Ya

 

🙂

[Clarea]

8 minutes ago, Lionesss said:

  ... I guess the western route has no problems.....????? trade winds???  Dunno

 

 

Could be the distance between the ports is close enough that no changes had to be made.

[Thorben-Hendrik]

56 minutes ago, Host Clarea said:

Possibly even some FCC.

Cancelled Indy TA offered a good FCC!👍😇

[Clarea]

20 minutes ago, Thorben-Hendrik said:

Cancelled Indy TA offered a good FCC!👍😇

 

Did that FCC have a restriction to be used only on another TA?