Vaccines and Minors under 12 - NCL is moving the goalpost!

[tinkr2]

@JennKachYes it is literally impossible. I kept trying to plan an extended family one to Alaska. Someone was always pregnant or baby to young or in finals week. I thought, wow, everyone says they are done being pregnant and Ill try again, just found out that 2 of them are antivaxxers. UGH . I was so mad they came to family get together and hugged all over my stage 4 cancer mother in law. I found out their status after the event. But still a lot of little kids that aren't eligible yet no matter the beliefs.

[bstel]

7 hours ago, Oakman58 said:

  In my opinion any parent who wants to bring an unvaccinated child on a cruise ship is incredibly selfish.

why?  we just sailed on Carnival in October with our 2 unvaccinated kids.  In our case being on the ship is actually safer than going to walmart or going to school.  We drove to the terminal so no airplanes.  100% crew vaccination, 95%+ passenger vaccination.  only kids under 12 were unvaccinated.  vaccinated passengers needed a antigen test 48hrs prior to sailing and unvaccinated passengers needed a PCR 72hr prior AND antigen test at the pier.  Masks were recommended/required indoors.

 

So please tell me how the above scenario is more dangerous to my kids?  Seems the exact opposite.  Hell, one of my kids has spent more time out of school this year than in-school due to quarantine for close contacts (5 weeks total).  And he has never gotten COVID from these close contacts (verified through multiple PCR tests).  In the elementary school setting the only people vaccinated are admins and teachers, so lets say less then 20%.  No testing is required to get into the school.

 

So to me looks like the ship is an ideal place for unvaccinated kids to be.

[kpjb]

8 hours ago, Heymarco said:

As a parent of a child who can’t get a vaccine yet, we don’t feel valued. What they are actually saying is that it’s all about $ and children are no longer our future. If they really cares about children, why not let them on a cruise ship like the other lines where Covid numbers have been so much better than anything on land? Or should parents just keep them in the basement for 2+ years? It really doesn’t make sense.

 

Not being able to take a cruise on one specific cruise line = lock them in the basement for 2 years.  Gotcha.  Too bad there's literally zero other vacation options available.

 

[CruizinKittie40]

1 hour ago, bstel said:

 

 

So to me looks like the ship is an ideal place for unvaccinated kids to be.

Yeah for YOUR KIDS.  Not for other people.  Do you not understand how incredibly selfish that is?!

[CruizinKittie40]

29 minutes ago, kpjb said:

 

Not being able to take a cruise on one specific cruise line = lock them in the basement for 2 years.  Gotcha.  Too bad there's literally zero other vacation options available.

 

I guess they can't afford Disney?? 

[Oakman58]

2 hours ago, bstel said:

 

So please tell me how the above scenario is more dangerous to my kids?  Seems the exact opposite.  Hell, one of my kids has spent more time out of school this year than in-school due to quarantine for close contacts (5 weeks total).  And he has never gotten COVID from these close contacts (verified through multiple PCR tests).  In the elementary school setting the only people vaccinated are admins and teachers, so lets say less then 20%.  No testing is required to get into the school.

 

So to me looks like the ship is an ideal place for unvaccinated kids to be.

 

So on the cruise I guess you kids didn't leave the ship.  No shore excursions, etc.  No way I would put unvaccinated kids at risk.

Edited November 4, 2021 by Oakman58

[ChiefMateJRK]

4 minutes ago, Heymarco said:

You have vaccine to protect you, please leave our children out of it.

I don't believe that @CruizinKittie40is the one that introduced your kids into this discussion.  Vaccines absolutely provide some level of protection, but 100% vaccination provides the safest environment for all of us (and allows us to roam freely without silly masks and other "protective" measures).

[bstel]

2 hours ago, CruizinKittie40 said:

Yeah for YOUR KIDS.  Not for other people.  Do you not understand how incredibly selfish that is?!

No it's not selfish.  I followed the Carnival rules that everyone who booked agreed to, which includes up to 5% of the ship to be unvaccinated (primarily kids under 12).  If you don't like those rules then you can sail only NCL.  I respect NCLs rules and don't expect them to change them as that is their business decision.  If you have the vaccine AND still are afraid of getting sick/dying then maybe travel isn't for you right now.

 

 

Edited November 4, 2021 by bstel

[bstel]

1 hour ago, Oakman58 said:

 

So on the cruise I guess you kids didn't leave the ship.  No shore excursions, etc.  No way I would put unvaccinated kids at risk.

sorry forgot that part.  We did one excursion, a "bubble" excursion through Carnival, as required by Bahamas rules.  So all tour guides were vaccinated.  So the tour was pretty much families with kids under 12.  Very well controlled and no interaction with anyone else.  Plus it was the "Blue Lagoon Island" which is pretty much a private island run by someone other than Carnival that only caters to Cruise ships.  All other stops we stayed on board, and were good with that.

 

Plus if you read the actual statistics the transmission rate for Covid in the Bahamas is actually less then FL (at the time of sailing) and many other states in the US, so kind of debunks the whole international vs US land travel.

 

The key for us was driving to the terminal and avoiding exposure on planes.

 

But to each their own.  That is what is so great as Carnival, RCL, NCL, etc having the ability to have their own rules.

[wally4ever]

I've been sweating over our cruise (embarking December 22), but I'm grateful our daughter is scheduled for dose 1 on Saturday and dose 2 on the 27th.  Sorry it isn't working out with your family.  

[ChiefMateJRK]

1 hour ago, Heymarco said:

B. Thank you for validating my point that the true selfishness is wanting to cruise with 100% vaccination rate even though that not realistic anywhere else in the world.

That's it!!  This is why we (most of us) love NCL right now!  We can escape from "anywhere else in the world" and enjoy a maskless "normal" experience. 😎  It's not selfish, because others can cruise brand x and dance in light circles and wear masks to their heart's content.  Everybody wins!  Why do you want to beat up on NCL when you can just cruise on somebody else's ship?  They made an outstanding business decision and deserve the rewards.

[lizzius]

On 10/31/2021 at 8:34 AM, Oakman58 said:

I'd like to know why you booked this cruise not knowing if or when a vaccine for children under 12 would be approved.   

I'd like to know why NCL took money for passengers who likely wouldn't be able to sail without making reasonable accommodations for altering their reservations.

[ChiefMateJRK]

3 minutes ago, lizzius said:

I'd like to know why NCL took money for passengers who likely wouldn't be able to sail without making reasonable accommodations for altering their reservations.

Are you talking about the deposit??  🤣  That ain't money.  That's couch change....

[lizzius]

4 minutes ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

Are you talking about the deposit??  🤣  That ain't money.  That's couch change....

A person sailing in Nov is a long way beyond final payment.

[All-ready2cruise]

1 minute ago, lizzius said:

A person sailing in Nov is a long way beyond final payment.

That's true. NCL has changed the payment schedule for cruises sailing prior to April 30, 2022 to 60 days but, sailing in December is after final payment now for sure. 

 

 

[kylenyc]

3 hours ago, Heymarco said:

A. @CruizinKittie40 is the one who keeps calling us selfish for wanting to vacation with our families. She is ok with us taking a land based vacation where vaccine rates are much worse, but that we would dare take a cruise is somehow selfish? 🤷‍♂️

 

B. Thank you for validating my point that the true selfishness is wanting to cruise with 100% vaccination rate even though that not realistic anywhere else in the world. Again, we don’t have a choice to vaccinate young kids at this time so it’s reasonable to expect an exception to be made, like every other country and firm on the plant has done.  NCL should just come out and say 18+ only like Virgin and call it a day, they don’t care about families and are hiding behind “safety”. Other lines have proven it works just fine and other restrictions going away in Jan.

There are also people (who leave their un-vaccinated children at home) and people such as me who's a caregiver to vulnerable family members at home (parents, immuno-compromised, underlying condiions, etc.) who want the safest vacation possible and minimize the risk of bringing covid home. For me, bringing COVID home would mean hospitalization and/or death to a parent, or adding a two week quarantine or more resulting in time away from my parents, and private caregiver cost.

 

I agree with those who said that NCL made a business decision to offer a vacation option different from other cruise lines. That's NCL's prerogative. Unfortunately, satisfying your ideal vacation would mean denying others theirs. Sorry, there isn't another cruise line that meets your family's needs. I'm simply glad NCL met mine.

 

Best of luck finding a suitable vacation for your family.

Edited November 5, 2021 by kylenyc

[ChiefMateJRK]

1 hour ago, lizzius said:

A person sailing in Nov is a long way beyond final payment.

It's hard to keep track of when the various complaintents are sailing.  That said, if anybody made that final, non-refundable payment "hoping" that the rules would change, it's their own darned fault.

[ceilidh1]

I'm not sure if I'm missing something here...but I don't understand why folks are coming down so hard on the OP? From what I can gather (and correct me if I'm wrong) the OP is saying that her kids will be double vaccinated in time to meet the vaccination requirements of NCL. If this is true (I'm not doing the math) then why wouldn't they be allowed to sail? Age shouldn't matter - vaccination status should...

[ChiefMateJRK]

1 hour ago, ceilidh1 said:

From what I can gather (and correct me if I'm wrong) the OP is saying that her kids will be double vaccinated in time to meet the vaccination requirements of NCL.

If the kids meet the vaccination requirements of NCL, then why are we even discussing this?

[lizzius]

5 hours ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

It's hard to keep track of when the various complaintents are sailing.  That said, if anybody made that final, non-refundable payment "hoping" that the rules would change, it's their own darned fault.

No, they're hoping that a vaccine will be approved for kids... just like NCL is. Norwegian shouldn't take money from families with kids who only might be able to sail without an avenue for full refunds.

[bkrickles1]

7 hours ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

It's hard to keep track of when the various complaintents are sailing.  That said, if anybody made that final, non-refundable payment "hoping" that the rules would change, it's their own darned fault.

I agree.

I'm sailing Joy 1/15/2022 and my final payment is due 11/16.

My sister in law, who has 2 kids 7 & 8, booked this sailing too.

She was hoping that the kids would become eligible to be vaccinated, but would not have made final payment on the 16th if everything hadn't been approved, as it just was.

Reading the tea leaves, we felt pretty confident it would happen and it has.

I'm so happy that they'll all be joining us.

[mjkacmom]

1 hour ago, lizzius said:

No, they're hoping that a vaccine will be approved for kids... just like NCL is. Norwegian shouldn't take money from families with kids who only might be able to sail without an avenue for full refunds.

It’s approved, I know many who got the first shot already.

[ChiefMateJRK]

8 hours ago, lizzius said:

No, they're hoping that a vaccine will be approved for kids... just like NCL is. Norwegian shouldn't take money from families with kids who only might be able to sail without an avenue for full refunds.

NCL doesn't "take" money.  They allow folks to book, pay a deposit and ultimately pay the balance.  They clearly post their rules and those rules haven't changed.  If somebody fails to read the rules before payment, or reads them but sticks their head in the sand pretending that it will all magically work out for them, then it's their own fault and nobody else's.  It's a big kid's world and most of us don't expect the world to change because we aren't happy.

[Barb Nahoumi]

Perhaps you can rebook your cruise,  when the children will be fully vaccinated.  

[eplanet]

Update:

 

NCL did cancel our cabin, but our PCC was able to get them to reinstate it without our 8 year old on the reservation.  If we are able to prove her vaccination status later this month, they will add her back to the reservation.  We are very happy that NCL stepped up and worked with us on this!

 

Thank you everyone for your understanding and advice.