Rhine water levels 2022 and similar topics

[SometimesCruiser]

17 minutes ago, notamermaid said:

Not only size matters of course. Hull design and where the propeller is, materials used, the water tanks etc.  All the physics. Differentiating between 110m and 135m river cruise ships can only be an approximation.

 

From conversations with our captain on the Visionary, one of our group learned that it also makes a difference whether the ship is moving downstream or upstream, even between sister ships!  There are lots of variables in play that we who are not in the industry could easily overlook!

 

Overall, I was happy with our ship swap experience with Avalon, though it meant one additional packing/unpacking event and a handful of additional hours on a bus.  I hope the weather breaks soon so that the cruise lines can resume more normal operations. 

[notamermaid]

20 hours ago, gentlemancruiser said:

When the river become narrow it makes for slower and tight bends.   

It is an important aspect on the Elbe according to AnhaltER1960. The bends of the shallow river are a problem. On the Rhine so far 135m barges are still managing round the bends at the Lorelei rock. That is where there is one way traffic regulated with traffic lights. Of course they sit very high in the water now with some of them only having 1/4 of normal load. So if you are light enough you can still navigate the bends very carefully...

 

The much reduced load can result in a financial loss and therefore, to prevent that, one logistics company stopped operating on that section of the Rhine. Trimodal transport is standard anyway, so a lot of goods are now on trains and lorries, but capacity is partly reaching its limits there.

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

9 minutes ago, SometimesCruiser said:

From conversations with our captain on the Visionary, one of our group learned that it also makes a difference whether the ship is moving downstream or upstream, even between sister ships!  There are lots of variables in play that we who are not in the industry could easily overlook!

That is fascinating about the sister ships. Have briefly learnt of that, something with laws of physics of course, I mean about the upstream and downstream difference. But details of that is for all those with a mind for that, not me!

 

The variables are very important to me. When you think about it, it makes sense that in the offices no one can actually tell you days before if your ship will be sailing. Unless the captain phoned them up on the same morning that you call the office. Or unless it is on the Bavarian Danube right now where almost nothing goes... But there for example the situation could change again at least a little this weekend. We will see. Fingers crossed.

 

I understand when phone reps have no real clue regarding a certain itinerary, but I still think the communication could be better with their customers. By the way, Arosa have posted online which cruises right now on the Danube are running.

 

Oh, about Emmerich. That was interesting. More later.

 

notamermaid

 

 

[gentlemancruiser]

2 hours ago, steamboats said:

There was a post by KD today answering the question why some of their ships can´t cruise while others do. And the clear answer was that the draft has nothing to do with the size of the ship. The Rhein Galaxy has 175 cm and can´t cruise anymore while another ship only draws 120 cm. 

 

steamboats

Thanks Steamboats!!!  I was trying to explain that earlier. 

[notamermaid]

Emmerich. Normally not a place that is of much interest beyond those that deal with the Rhine or go there for a specific reason, but now the town on the Lower Rhine is in the international news. For a figure: 0. In a word: zero. Obviously hitting the German headlines and being a photo op par excellence, the zero appearing on the gauge at Emmerich has attracted attention beyond our borders. But the gauge actually fell further into minus. You should find some news in English when you google Emmerich Rhine. It fluctuates of course so here is a quick screenshot to record the zero:

 

It is not yet clear what will be the new record put in the files at the end of the year as the daily fluctuation is levelled out for the statistics. The previous record (NNW) was 7cm.

 

One German business article with a nice shot of the bridge at Emmerich:

https://www.handelsblatt.com/unternehmen/handel-konsumgueter/niedrigwasser-neuer-rekord-tiefstand-rhein-pegel-bei-emmerich-sinkt-auf-null/28602542.html

 

notamermaid

 

[gentlemancruiser]

2 hours ago, notamermaid said:

 

On a personal note, I am not fully friends with KD. Working in the tourism industry I have experienced negative things with the company and I find it hard to shake that off.

 

notamermaid

 

We had to taken an excursion boat in the Wachau Valley when our river cruise ship wasn't able to make it.   Will NEVER do one of those excursion boats again.  We were packed onboard like cattle.  Top deck was standing room only, no shade anywhere, just standing for 45 minutes was terrible.  Indoor lower deck was packed with people eating and if you were stuck there you could only see the river bank.   We had to push and shove our way to disembark an Durnstein.

   

Edited August 16, 2022 by gentlemancruiser

[notamermaid]

That sounds rather uncomfortable. Sounds as if they were getting it to more or less maximum capacity. So far, I have not had the displeasure of that. The ships I have been on were busy but pleasant. Apart from one but that was a school party with "intrinsic hazard" . I have often wondered what that would be like. For example, the Loreley Star: A ship of 11.20m width and 50.2m length with 600 people on board??

 

I mentioned earlier that there are companies besides KD. Here is the one that operates, among others, the Loreley Star: https://loreley-linie.com/

 

notamermaid

 

[Canal archive]

It’s pouring!

[notamermaid]

31 minutes ago, Canal archive said:

It’s pouring!

Good. We have scattered showers close to the North and Baltic Seas, but the real water will come Thursday afternoon. It looks pretty heavy in the forecast symbols. I expect we will read a weather warning on Thursday morning. No wonder the river gauge forecast at Maxau shows a huge spike after Thursday. The level may rise by 60cm in 24 hours it says. That would be a lot of rain. Looks like the perfect weather pattern Thursday into Friday over the Rhine catchment area. Hope it is not too much in one place.

 

notamermaid

 

[CielBleu]

51 minutes ago, Canal archive said:

It’s pouring!

So happy to hear this!  What areas along the river?  I hope it is widespread.

[RDVIK2016]

16 hours ago, CILCIANRQTS said:

Treasures draft is 1.2 meters.

Viking longship drafts vary from 1.5 to 2 meters.

New longship Egdir has a 1.6 meter draft.

Definitely an advantage to Treasures.

I am prone to take those 1.5m and 1.6m drafts of the Viking Longships with a grain of salt.  Actually  Binnenschifferforum lists Egdir as having a draft of 2.0 m.  The draft can be a bit variable, although not much on a passenger vessel. Longships' maximum draft is just about always listed as 2 meters and it seems that they operate as if their minimum operational draft is not less than about 1.8m. 

RDVIK

[notamermaid]

Further down the river after Emmerich we soon hit the Dutch border and the first gauge there is Lobith. I am not familiar with the structures and reading the gauges in the Netherlands, so do not really mention them. Needless to say, the drought has also reached that country. Weird when you think about it, a country that has a substantial area as officially being under sea level. A Dutch online newspaper (?) has compiled photos of the situation on the Waal in Summer 2021 and now. What a difference between the two years: https://www.gld.nl/nieuws/7749793/de-waal-vanuit-de-lucht-het-verschil-tussen-nu-en-vorig-jaar

 

notamermaid

 

[FirstTimeCruiser2002]

20 minutes ago, notamermaid said:

Further down the river after Emmerich we soon hit the Dutch border and the first gauge there is Lobith. I am not familiar with the structures and reading the gauges in the Netherlands, so do not really mention them. Needless to say, the drought has also reached that country. Weird when you think about it, a country that has a substantial area as officially being under sea level. A Dutch online newspaper (?) has compiled photos of the situation on the Waal in Summer 2021 and now. What a difference between the two years: https://www.gld.nl/nieuws/7749793/de-waal-vanuit-de-lucht-het-verschil-tussen-nu-en-vorig-jaar

 

notamermaid

 

Wow!
That’s terrible!
praying for rain!!

[CPT Trips]

11 hours ago, notamermaid said:

Just caught on web camera coming upstream out of the Rhine Gorge and approaching Rüdesheim, the MS Vivienne:

 

Remember you can look at this yourself on: https://heimatzeithotels.panomax.com/bingen

 

The MS Vivienne is the refurbished MS River Concerto By Grand Circle Cruise Line and she is 110m long.

 

notamermaid

 

Now I need to do a search. We cruised on the River Concerto a couple times. I’m interested to see how she looks after refurbishment. 
Search finished. https://valueworldcruises.com/cruise-ships/ms-vivienne/
She is definitely a different ship. Previously, no suites, now it has a few. The top two decks now have French balconies, previously top deck had real balconies with space deducted from cabin and the next deck down had sealed windows. Much more modern look. 

[notamermaid]

16 minutes ago, CPT Trips said:

We cruised on the River Concerto a couple times.

This is the B2B company that now has the Vivienne: https://navibelle.com/fleet/vivienne

 

It is interesting to follow some ships of where they have ended up. "My" ship the Belvedere is the ex-Avalon Poetry.

 

notamermaid

 

[Canal archive]

So much better than ‘scrap and replace’ very eco friendly. All joking aside Scenic redid almost their whole fleet. Tastes change and so do our expectations so we get a sparkling new ship to cruise in and the companies can flaunt it without the cost of a complete new vessel.

[momofthre3]

On 8/11/2022 at 10:08 PM, gentlemancruiser said:

The PO river is dried up too.   Not sure you'll do much cruising there.

Today we got a call that our August 21 Uniworld cruise was still on. Then several hours later it has officially been cancelled. No surprise with what all Ive read over the last month tracking the situation. However on the task of finding some replacement. 

[worldtraveller99]

That is terribly short notice momofthre3 - I hope they have given you a full refund? I am glad we let them book the flights for us. If that happened to us we would give up and just book a hotel to drive to in England.

[notamermaid]

2 hours ago, momofthre3 said:

Today we got a call that our August 21 Uniworld cruise was still on. Then several hours later it has officially been cancelled. No surprise with what all Ive read over the last month tracking the situation. However on the task of finding some replacement. 

Sorry to read that you cannot experience the S.S.Antoinette. I would say come anyway but quite frankly on the Rhine it is dry, parched and other ships do not have much water either. Not sure if land trip is your thing. Perhaps the Netherlands or a river cruise from Cologne downstream towards the Netherlands? They are still running. Accessible is the Moselle. The rare Moselle-only itinerary is done by bike & barge cruises.Viva Cruises does one in September on a large ship, August sailing sold out. Frankfurt to Nuremberg is still on, if you can find such an itinerary. The Seine? Or use a CroisiEurope ship on the Rhine and hope for the best?

 

Hope you find a nice replacement holiday and that Uniworld is good to you with refunds.

 

notamermaid

 

[Daisi]

Not good news now...the Rhine is closing to barge traffic. 

 

https://theloadstar.com/rhine-closes-to-barge-traffic-with-water-depth-set-to-hit-record-lows/

 

[notamermaid]

Kaub gauge is at 36cm. Meanwhile Emmerich gauge has fallen to minus 2 (again). I think this fixes the lowest ever record at that spot at zero or lower at the end of the year.

 

Will today be the last day of heat and no rain, a return to more pleasant temperatures and better sailing? They say the rain and thunderstorms are only a short thing and the overall weather will not change. It will get hotter again shortly after the clouds have passed through. I just hope it does not produce dangerous heavy downpours in isolated areas. The computer modelling for Maxau gauge has been adjusted and the fast sharp rise is not as pronounced anymore. Still, rain and a rise in water levels is coming. Getting towards the rain and the weather forecast getting more reliable, Kaub gauge forecast now says the river will rise more slowly and we will see figures of 40cm and above from Saturday. The long term forecast still suggests we may see the 78cm at Kaub again next week.

 

Oh and:

23 hours ago, notamermaid said:

On the Rhine so far 135m barges are still managing round the bends at the Lorelei rock. That is where there is one way traffic regulated with traffic lights.

Sorry, bad English. I meant to say there is limited space so in effect you have only one full lane. And passage is regulated with the help of traffic lights that warn before the bends about oncoming ships.

 

notamermaid

 

[luckycruisers2]

On 8/14/2022 at 4:25 PM, FM-R said:

I'm on Basel to Amsterdam embarking 8/30.  If this should be the case, does this mean we get off at Speyer for excursion and get on another boat in Koblenz or is ship change actually just at the Gorge?  Not sure how/where the ship swapping happens.  Thanks!

We’re on the Rhine now from Basel to Amsterdam.  Started on the Viking Eir and switched to the  Viking Mani yesterday.  We left the ship at Strasbourg then bussed to Speyer for our included excursion then on to Cologne.  Yesterday excursion to Koblenz and then a cruise through the gorge with lunch on a local sight seeing boat.  
 

Everything was handled with super efficiency. Day one we were told the ship switch was likely to happen.  We also received an email prior to our trip informing of same.  A couple of paid excursions had to be canceled but we will receive an onboard credit - which if it isn’t spent will be returned to our credit card.  We also received a $25 pp credit for lunch for the day we were off the ship in Speyer.

 

it’s so sad to see the Rhine so low.  Almost no water in places. I’ll see if I can upload an image.

 

The ship switch hasn’t affected our enjoyment at all. Helps if you are informed and educated (thanks to everyone on this forum) and “go with the flow”.  

[notamermaid]

17 minutes ago, Daisi said:

Not good news now...the Rhine is closing to barge traffic. 

 

https://theloadstar.com/rhine-closes-to-barge-traffic-with-water-depth-set-to-hit-record-lows/

 

Thanks for the link, Daisi. That is a Canadian website, right? Never seen it before. The generalization is there, but at least they do not call it "death of river cruising". Still cannot get over that stupid headline. Anyway, in this logistics article they say and quote: "Closure of the German waterway was announced late on Friday as water levels on the Kaub gauge hit 37cm – 41cm is necessary for operations..." and "Barge operator Contargo said: “For reasons of safety we shall largely discontinue our navigation on the Upper and Middle Rhine.”" The first is obviously not correct as barges are still sailing even as I write, but the second I have read in German myself. The company has done that and much cargo is going by rail and road instead.

 

Meanwhile, I read that the large barge - a "Verband" as we call it - that had got stuck during the night near Oberwesel is free and had has moved further up to Bingen. The river was closed to shipping but is now open gain for upstream sailing. Downstream is not possible as the double-width barge is too dangerous to pass. The authorities expect full traffic to resume later today. Video says it had engine problems and needed to throw anchor. It is 190m long and 23m wide! https://www.swr.de/swraktuell/rheinland-pfalz/koblenz/schifffahrt-mittelrhein-gesperrt-motorschaden-100.html

 

notamermaid

 

[notamermaid]

6 minutes ago, luckycruisers2 said:

The ship switch hasn’t affected our enjoyment at all. Helps if you are informed and educated (thanks to everyone on this forum) and “go with the flow”.  

Good to read that! If you can prepare yourself mentally it is easier, isn't it?

 

So good that Viking keeps managing to put people on the small boats in the Gorge. Do you recall the name of the excursion boat?

 

Enjoy the rest of your time on the river.

 

notamermaid

 

[Daisi]

Not sure where it's from @notamermaid, it came up on one of my news sites. I agree, "the death of river cruising" was clickbait, and it will take more than 1 year of low water to do so. If barges are still sailing, then I guess it's taking one company saying that it won't sail as fact that none are sailing.

 

Hoping rain comes soon, not only for vacationers, but for those who depend on the rivers for their livelihoods.