Milestone recognition being eliminated

[luckyinpa]

while waiting in line to buy booze with my non refundable missed port credit. there was many boxes of the  sticks on the shelves so they are selling them. no clue what pricing was but the woman that grabbed them said they were 90 a carton at home  so must have been a good deal. 

[Bobbiegentry]

$9.00 per pack = $.45 per stick!!!😳
 

What Were Once Vices Are Now Habits - Doobie Brothers (1974)

[JimmyVWine]

On 9/26/2022 at 2:24 PM, DallasGuy75219 said:

If you are at 750 or 950 days onboard, Princess probably realizes that you're coming back with or without that milestone recognition.

A few random thoughts.  I know that there are exceptions to every assumption, but on balance, I think this statement is probably right.  For those of you who get invited to the MTP luncheons, think about how many people there are in that room.  Now think about how many people just missed the cut.  What percentage of them would bail on Princess if they know that they would not be recognized at a particular milestone?  Princess has to be willing to lose customers with every single decision it makes.  It is part of corporate growth and evolution.  The trick is to gain more than you lose, both in terms of customers and financial bottom line. Sometimes decisions go sideways and the company has to backtrack to return to status quo ante.  But honestly, how often does that happen?  

 

22 hours ago, Kay S said:

Big ships full of families with lots (and lots) of little kids but without the "party drunks" problem.

Actually, that sounds like a very sound business strategy for building toward the future.  We've know for years that cruise lines cannot sustain themselves if they cater primarily to the newly wed, nearly dead and over fed.  Another poster said that this describes Disney Cruise Lines.  Yes, except that DCL does not  have casinos and costs 2x to 3x what Princess costs.  If Princess can produce a DCL product at half the price, it will become the #1 cruise line in its class.  

 

22 hours ago, Kay S said:

forcing a sorry little app on everyone, doing, in short, all they can to to get us old people to go away.

The complaints about the app (and internet on board) often read as if people think that Princess is somehow unique here.  To the extent that Princess is more robust in its app usage, give it 6 months and every cruise line will catch up, and they will all have similar gremlins and glitches.  I have heard nothing but horror stories about DCL's app and internet functionality.  The "old people" can be chased away, but where are they going to go?  Anyone who thinks that app usage isn't going to be standard operating procedure on all ships is delusional.  And anyone who thinks that there is a cruise line out there that is going to roll out a flawless app is even more so.

 

At the end of the day, I can see both sides of this issue.  There is a part of me that thinks that the loyalty perks are little more than crumbs, and so at worst, people are losing is a crumb.  One poster stated that the eggs and bacon in Sabatini's costs no more than they would in the buffet.  And they would taste the same too.  So that cuts both ways.  If the bacon isn't any more special, then the only "value added" is sitting down in Sabatini's.  And to do so, the understaffed ship has to staff that area.  Is losing that perk really important?  But on the other side, there is the notion that if all one is given to eat is a crumb, and that crumb is taken away, then that crumb had a great deal of meaning and value.  Far more value to the receiver than the giver.  So buck up and give it.  I get it.  Assuming that this rumor is indeed true, I wasn't on the Zoom call when this was discussed, so I can't really weigh the pros and cons.   

 

On 9/26/2022 at 2:03 PM, partybarbie said:

It took me 35 years of cruising with Princess to reach 750 days.

And finally...I have to add...that if the statement above is true, then either your picture needs updating or you started cruising when you were 2!!!  😉

Edited September 27, 2022 by JimmyVWine

[mom says]

1 hour ago, cruisequeen4ever said:

Whether or not this is true, some rewards should still be offered to loyal pax as we are the bread and butter and are the ones who will spread the word of how wonderful Princess is. Though every cruise line is making cutbacks, I haven’t read of other cruise lines reducing their loyalty benefits. 

Then you need to read a lot more. Reduction of loyalty perks is happening all over the old mainstream lines. Bread and butter? I don't think so; not any more. Face it- seniors with a limited number of cruises in their future are not the target demographic today.

[cruzsnooze]

14 minutes ago, mom says said:

 Bread and butter? I don't think so; not any more. Face it- seniors with a limited number of cruises in their future are not the target demographic today.

But we seniors have more money and time to travel and do so in higher end cabins then young families. Working people take one vacation a year usually - but as a senior I take as many as I want and usually cruise 4-5 times a year. 

[JimmyVWine]

3 minutes ago, cruzsnooze said:

But we seniors have more money and time to travel and do so in higher end cabins then young families. Working people take one vacation a year usually - but as a senior I take as many as I want and usually cruise 4-5 times a year. 

This is true. But in order to continue attracting people like you, it has to capture new customers who will become you, only in 30 years' time.  Once your generation of retired cruisers stops cruising, who will be there to backfill the loss?  Princess can't count on people like you coming to them organically without any past history.  Expecting a new customer to jump right in and do 3-5 cruises a year is unrealistic. They have to capture that person when they are 35-50.  Younger would be great too, but perhaps not realistic.  The business model is to both "capture" and "keep".  They desperately want to do both. But if there is ever any tension between the two goals, "capture" has to win out.  It requires an entirely different skill set and product offerings. "Keep" is largely driven by inertia, familiarity and an innate fear of change.  They get to keep their customers largely owing to the fact that the customers aren't incentivized to make a change.  Sure, there are plenty of people with top tier status on multiple cruise lines.  But as you point out, it is hard for young working people to cruise often enough to achieve that.  Multi-Line Top Tier Status is the exception, not the rule.  So that leaves the person asking: "Do I stick with the familiar where I have status, even though the perks of status aren't what they used to be, or do I jump ship and start from scratch elsewhere?"  The cruise line won't keep 100%.  But it will keep enough to sell the limited number of Suites on the ship.      

[PacnGoNow]

11 minutes ago, JimmyVWine said:

This is true. But in order to continue attracting people like you, it has to capture new customers who will become you, only in 30 years' time.  Once your generation of retired cruisers stops cruising, who will be there to backfill the loss?  Princess can't count on people like you coming to them organically without any past history.  Expecting a new customer to jump right in and do 3-5 cruises a year is unrealistic. They have to capture that person when they are 35-50.  Younger would be great too, but perhaps not realistic.  The business model is to both "capture" and "keep".  They desperately want to do both. But if there is ever any tension between the two goals, "capture" has to win out.  It requires an entirely different skill set and product offerings. "Keep" is largely driven by inertia, familiarity and an innate fear of change.  They get to keep their customers largely owing to the fact that the customers aren't incentivized to make a change.  Sure, there are plenty of people with top tier status on multiple cruise lines.  But as you point out, it is hard for young working people to cruise often enough to achieve that.  Multi-Line Top Tier Status is the exception, not the rule.  So that leaves the person asking: "Do I stick with the familiar where I have status, even though the perks of status aren't what they used to be, or do I jump ship and start from scratch elsewhere?"  The cruise line won't keep 100%.  But it will keep enough to sell the limited number of Suites on the ship.      

Here’s the deal.

Maybe you hit a good point!  Maybe that’s why the have the bidding program now?  The suites that are going to be empty by loyalists now, can be filled by new comers bidding their way all the way up to a suite!  In addition 

of course to being a great money maker for PCL.

Kidding aside, they still need us, for now anyway. 🤔

[DallasGuy75219]

1 hour ago, Kay S said:

It's the new business model.  They want to attract new cruisers and stop spending money on the old ones who were loyal and were promised perks.  Princess is not the same company it was pre-covid.

I've been struggling with a polite way to say this, and I'm not saying this to be mean, but some folks seem a bit delusional about their own longevity and how long they may be able to continue cruising. 

 

Meanwhile Princess has to evolve with the times and remain relevant to younger cruisers who will be cruising for much longer than the Baby Boomers who are resisting aging (and change) so fervently.  Maybe COVID, due to its disproportionate impact on seniors, exposed this vulnerability in its business model to Princess.

 

Carnival Corporation already has Holland America and doesn't need to set up Princess for a fight over the same demographic. 

 

6 minutes ago, cruzsnooze said:

But we seniors have more money and time to travel and do so in higher end cabins then young families. Working people take one vacation a year usually - but as a senior I take as many as I want and usually cruise 4-5 times a year. 

That's an overly broad generalization. There are seniors in every income bracket, from poverty level to billionaires.  Undoutedly every cruise also has some seniors who scrimped and saved on their fixed incomes just for that inside room on their single annual cruise.  I'm 43 with a full-time job and cruise 5-6 times a year.

[JimmyVWine]

1 minute ago, PacnGoNow said:

Kidding aside, they still need us, for now anyway.

100%.  They need you now, and they need your children and grandchildren later.  But in order to have them later, they need them now, if that makes any sense. 

[cruzsnooze]

9 minutes ago, JimmyVWine said:

  The business model is to both "capture" and "keep".  They desperately want to do both. But if there is ever any tension between the two goals, "capture" has to win out. 

 

.  But it will keep enough to sell the limited number of Suites on the ship.      

There is no reason for tension, they could keep both .  I think enough suites aren't selling out currently and cruising has taken a big hit post pandemic and that's why this new bidding process is taking place. The value aspect of their higher end suites is just stupid. When I choose to spend $1000 PP PD I go to more inclusive lines with more interesting itineraries like Regent or Oceania or Lindblad. Princess is cresting it's own monster with suites of excess of 1700 sq. ft. 

[JimmyVWine]

1 minute ago, cruzsnooze said:

There is no reason for tension, they could keep both .  I think enough suites aren't selling out currently and cruising has taken a big hit post pandemic and that's why this new bidding process is taking place. The value aspect of their higher end suites is just stupid. When I choose to spend $1000 PP PD I go to more inclusive lines with more interesting itineraries like Regent or Oceania or Lindblad. Princess is cresting it's own monster with suites of excess of 1700 sq. ft. 

Well, on your first point, there is always tension between capture and keep.  Always has been, in every business.  On your point about Suites, I think Princess is starting to agree.  On the new Sun Princess, they are introducing quite a few cabins in a altogether new category called Signature Suites.  They are Mini-Suites that come with all the Suite perks.  So instead of a 1700 sq. ft. cabin, you get a 313 sq. ft. cabin that is treated as a Suite.  I have not priced out a cruise on Sun yet so I don't know what the price delta is between a Mini-Suite, a Signature Suite and a 600 sq. ft. "traditional" Suite.  But Princess has obviously detected an interest in suite perks in a smaller cabin, which presumably comes at a lower price. 

[Kay S]

9 minutes ago, DallasGuy75219 said:

I've been struggling with a polite way to say this, and I'm not saying this to be mean, but some folks seem a bit delusional about their own longevity and how long they may be able to continue cruising. 

 

Meanwhile Princess has to evolve with the times and remain relevant to younger cruisers who will be cruising for much longer than the Baby Boomers who are resisting aging (and change) so fervently. 

Possibly you should have struggled a little more. 🙂  Yep.  I'm old.  I'm going to die, so it makes perfect sense for Princess to cut my perks and change everything I liked about it.  No point trying to keep me coming back.   You convinced me!  Where's the plank?  Gotta go walk it.

[Astro Flyer]

Princess attracted me in my mid 30s with their casually elegant cruise experience. And nearly 40 years later they are evolving away from that cruise experience that made them so successful. Obviously they need to attract younger generations for longterm success but what’s unknown is whether they’ll attract more by being cool instead of being casually elegant.

 

Edited September 27, 2022 by Astro Flyer

[DallasGuy75219]

2 minutes ago, Kay S said:

Yep.  I'm old.  I'm going to die, so it makes perfect sense for Princess to cut my perks and change everything I liked about it. 

You finally understand!

[JimmyVWine]

13 minutes ago, DallasGuy75219 said:

Carnival Corporation already has Holland America and doesn't need to set up Princess for a fight over the same demographic. 

This, exactly.  Carnival Corp. needs to compete with RCCL, DCL and Virgin instead of competing with itself.  All of that says that one of its lines has to trend younger while still staying family friendly and sophisticated.  Hmmm.  I wonder which line that might be?  

[Kay S]

2 minutes ago, DallasGuy75219 said:

You finally understand!

I guess you haven't been following what I've been saying all along.  Princess is trying to get rid of old people.  This is not a surprise to me.  (With any luck, you will not get any older than you are now.)

Edited September 27, 2022 by Kay S

[JimmyVWine]

1 minute ago, Kay S said:

I guess you haven't been following what I've been saying all along.  Princess is trying to get rid of old people.

I think there is a big difference between "trying to get rid of" and "not bending over backwards to cater to."  I don't have access to PCL's sales data, but I'd be shocked to learn that 75% of loyal cruisers over the age of 65 have left PCL and will never come back.  Indeed, I'd be surprised if that percentage was 50%, or 40%, or 30% or even 10%.  I think in reality there is lots of sound and fury, signifying nothing.  The 200-300 voices here on CC are not even close to being representative of the literally millions of passengers who board Princess ships every year. 

[Kay S]

3 minutes ago, JimmyVWine said:

This, exactly.  Carnival Corp. needs to compete with RCCL, DCL and Virgin instead of competing with itself.  All of that says that one of its lines has to trend younger while still staying family friendly and sophisticated.  Hmmm.  I wonder which line that might be?  

I have been taking my snaggle-toothed demographic over to HAL for the last couple of years.  If it weren't for the FCC I have to use up on Princess...

[Doug R.]

So much pearl clutching, so few facts.

[JimmyVWine]

1 minute ago, Kay S said:

I have been taking my snaggle-toothed demographic over to HAL for the last couple of years.  If it weren't for the FCC I have to use up on Princess...

And the Carnival Corp stock price changes not one iota when you make that switch.  People have a tendency to look at PCL in a vacuum instead as one of Carnival Corp's many tentacles.  

[Kay S]

Just now, JimmyVWine said:

And the Carnival Corp stock price changes not one iota when you make that switch.  People have a tendency to look at PCL in a vacuum instead as one of Carnival Corp's many tentacles.  

I know this.  I just hope Corp doesn't decide to "tinker" HAL in the near future.  Further on down the line, maybe, but as my friend DallasGuy says, I'm going to be dead soon.  I really used to love Princess.  Sigh.
 

[JimmyVWine]

8 minutes ago, Kay S said:

I just hope Corp doesn't decide to "tinker" HAL in the near future.

I guess all I can say to this is that most of this thread is built on a rumor (although certain perk reductions are evident irrespective of the rumor mill.)  But to build another supposition on top of that, specifically what may or may not happen to HAL, is a place I can't go. 

[PacnGoNow]

1 hour ago, JimmyVWine said:

100%.  They need you now, and they need your children and grandchildren later.  But in order to have them later, they need them now, if that makes any sense. 

It does.  But, they can have my first born now, if they want. 😂  Just kidding!

[Dunk]

This all sounds like someone confused the elimination of the milestone OBC that we used to get, which did cost them some funny money, with the milestone recognition, which is little to no cost for them. I’d take it with a grain of salt. 

[Doug R.]

8 minutes ago, Dunk said:

This all sounds like someone confused the elimination of the milestone OBC that we used to get, which did cost them some funny money, with the milestone recognition, which is little to no cost for them. I’d take it with a grain of salt. 

Yes, but the pearl clutchers will clutch.