P&O cancellation / Medical questionnaire

[Cpot]

The day before I was due to cruise I completed P&O’s online health declaration. Having recently recovered from a chest infection I answered the question about having had a cough in the last 10 days yes. All other Covid related questions were answered no. I had expected to be asked further questions about the nature of my cough, but instead I received a message telling me the cruise was cancelled & that I would have to contact my insurance company as there would be no refund! I had also booked the cruise for my sister in law whose holiday was also cancelled because I had booked from my address. I immediately called P&O to explain that my cough was not Covid related or infectious only to be told that nothing could be done. To say I was devastated is an understatement and I certainly don’t intend letting this go. I’m wondering if anyone else has had a similar experience or maybe any helpful advice?

Many thanks

[wowzz]

Unfortunately,  the moment  you pressed the "yes" button you were doomed.  The decision is final and cannot be appealed. 

Your honesty is to be applauded, but you should,  basically, have lied.

If you had joined the forum only a couple of weeks ago,  you would have seen that the same thing happened to another cruiser,  with the same result.

I hope you manage to get satisfaction from your insurance company, but fear that you might be in for a lengthy battle.

[funinhounslow]

Your circumstances are covered at paras 22 and 23 of P&O’s terms and conditions. 
 

https://www.pocruises.com/legal-and-privacy/booking-terms-and-conditions

 

[Yorkypete]

We were honest on our recent cruise on Britannia and having covid 3 days into the cruise we missed all ports ,being isolated for 7 days. It is disgraceful that the P&O policy encourages peoploe to blatantly lie about covid or any non infectious illness. I often get a cold as seasons change and believe me I would now lie. I cannot believe P&O because if you answer no and embark on the ship coughing they will ignore it. I hope you are successful in your actions and we are considering legal action also, althoough slightly different.

[JDB78]

1 hour ago, Yorkypete said:

We were honest on our recent cruise on Britannia and having covid 3 days into the cruise we missed all ports ,being isolated for 7 days. It is disgraceful that the P&O policy encourages peoploe to blatantly lie about covid or any non infectious illness. I often get a cold as seasons change and believe me I would now lie. I cannot believe P&O because if you answer no and embark on the ship coughing they will ignore it. I hope you are successful in your actions and we are considering legal action also, althoough slightly different.

I wouldn't say they encourage you to lie. Think we just live in different times now. We're used to having minor coughs or colds and ploughing on still turning up for work, doing your shopping etc. Unfortunately Covid has changed all that and think there is an expectation now that people will be responsible and not be in close contact with people if they think they might have a virus. Also companies have a responsibility to keep people 'safe'. I know the measures are pointless but they have to be seen to be at least going through the motions. The last thing cruise companies accusations that they are irresponsible and that cruising is not safe.

 

You could say that well P&O should do the right thing and give a refund. Then you run into the possibility that people could just effectively cancel their holiday 2 days before and expect a refund. 'Yeah sorry we're not coming, I've got a cold, can I have a refund'.

 

Obviously shocking what has happened to the OP but, I honestly don't really see a better way around things. The company can hardly say yes come on board sniffs and sniffles, coughs and colds welcome. Yet I wouldn't expect many to admit to a minor illness if it meant their holiday being cancelled and a lengthy fight just to get a refund. Bad situation all round but don't think you can 'blame' P&O. Just a sign of the times and hazard of the industry they are in?

[molecrochip]

Two questions occur: we’re those the booking terms at the point of booking, remembering that only favourable changes can be imposed later; and is the term a reasonable one. The term isn’t reasonable on a stand alone basis however another term requires back to back coverage by an insurance policy.

 

My thought here is that, I’m not sure that any insurance policy covers medical cancellation as widely as P&O are applying it. On this basis , the risk is uninsurable, the term unreasonable and P&O would lose in a court of law.

 

So keep fighting and don’t take no for an answer.

[Harry Peterson]

52 minutes ago, molecrochip said:

Two questions occur: we’re those the booking terms at the point of booking, remembering that only favourable changes can be imposed later; and is the term a reasonable one. The term isn’t reasonable on a stand alone basis however another term requires back to back coverage by an insurance policy.

 

My thought here is that, I’m not sure that any insurance policy covers medical cancellation as widely as P&O are applying it. On this basis , the risk is uninsurable, the term unreasonable and P&O would lose in a court of law.

 

So keep fighting and don’t take no for an answer.

Goodness, that's a surprising answer, Moley!  Spot on, though.......😉

[davecttr]

Why don't P&O just require people answering YES to the cough question to have a negative LFT test at the terminal. In the olden days answering a question with yes had you being screened by a medical professional at the terminal.

[david05]

Clause 22 may well be an unfair term and definitely open to challenge, especially when P&O make no attempt to investigate what sort of cough it is or what causes it. This smacks of being a very arbitrary decision.

[Megabear2]

I can confirm that ABTA are extremely interested in this following my conversation with them.  I am currently in discussions with them, Holiday Extras and supposedly P&O.  I am due a reply from the latter next week.  

 

If a suitable reply is not forthcoming in that reply I am instructed to make a formal complaint to ABTA and also the ASA as it is blatantly clear that the advertising is incorrect and misleading.  I personally would go so far as to suggest fraudulent as they must be aware the policies do not cover these risks - I've spoken to 14 insurers with the same reply.

 

Travellers on P&O and Cunard are affected by this issue and ABTA have commented unofficially that this is clearly a policy to tie in with Carnival, the US parent company, of removing all restrictions.  Ironically buried in the US and Australian terms of Cunard is a requirement for them to pay FCC to affected guests with US or Australian bookings.

 

If, as I suspect, P&O try to cut some deal with me which unfortunately they have tried previously, I intend on this occasion to refuse.  I have put them on notice I will be contacting various consumer agencies on the issue if they do not sort the issue for all travellers, not just individuals.

 

To the OP I suggest lodging a complaint with ABTA immediately as there is nothing to best lost in raising the issue - the more the merrier! I would also suggest taking the issue up with any legal entity you may have access to - check free home insurance free legal lines, credit card legal help and any work or union related help lines.  Definitely don't let it go unchallenged.  

 

If you need "proof" of the insurance issue, please refer to the Holiday Extras thread I started where Adam Edinburgh's reply on what his company will not cover is posted.

 

I have a swaive of material on this issue!   If you want to contact me direct let me know - I'm not sure if this site allows personal contact but I'm sure we can find a way.

 

To everyone else  including those who have said it's an okay policy, I can assure you it's not according to the governing body of travel.

[bobstheboy]

8 hours ago, JDB78 said:

I wouldn't say they encourage you to lie. Think we just live in different times now. We're used to having minor coughs or colds and ploughing on still turning up for work, doing your shopping etc. Unfortunately Covid has changed all that and think there is an expectation now that people will be responsible and not be in close contact with people if they think they might have a virus. Also companies have a responsibility to keep people 'safe'. I know the measures are pointless but they have to be seen to be at least going through the motions. The last thing cruise companies accusations that they are irresponsible and that cruising is not safe.

 

You could say that well P&O should do the right thing and give a refund. Then you run into the possibility that people could just effectively cancel their holiday 2 days before and expect a refund. 'Yeah sorry we're not coming, I've got a cold, can I have a refund'.

 

Obviously shocking what has happened to the OP but, I honestly don't really see a better way around things. The company can hardly say yes come on board sniffs and sniffles, coughs and colds welcome. Yet I wouldn't expect many to admit to a minor illness if it meant their holiday being cancelled and a lengthy fight just to get a refund. Bad situation all round but don't think you can 'blame' P&O. Just a sign of the times and hazard of the industry they are in?

Very little I agree with.

 

PO should be more responsible and to tell people to contact their insurance when they know they're not covered, is almost fraudulent.

 

I could go on but others have eloquently covered this topic.

[bee-ess]

7 hours ago, molecrochip said:

Two questions occur: we’re those the booking terms at the point of booking, remembering that only favourable changes can be imposed later; and is the term a reasonable one. The term isn’t reasonable on a stand alone basis however another term requires back to back coverage by an insurance policy.

 

My thought here is that, I’m not sure that any insurance policy covers medical cancellation as widely as P&O are applying it. On this basis , the risk is uninsurable, the term unreasonable and P&O would lose in a court of law.

 

So keep fighting and don’t take no for an answer.

 

How can we find out what the T&C's were when we booked, I don't imagine that P&O would give us a copy of the terms when we booked.

[cruising.mark.uk]

If I were the OP, I'd be minded to 'forget' the recent correspondence I'd had with P&O and turn up at Southampton to board this cruise as if the exchange described in the first post had not happened.  At best, that would lead to a conversation with a human being at the point where the answers to the medical questionnaire became an issue, providing the OP a chance to argue their case and, potentially, be allowed to board.

 

If, following that conversation, boarding was still not allowed, I'd recommend the OP insist on a letter signed by the ship's doctor saying that they had been denied boarding on medical grounds.  As was clear from the previous thread discussing this, a signed letter from a medical professional would hopefully satisfy most insurers.  It would certainly give an increased chance of an insurance payout compared with where the OP is at the moment, which seems to be merely a 'computer says 'no'' situation.  And, involving the ship's doctor in the conversation might just make them see sense and allow boarding in any case.  Nothing to lose in my view (except for a journey to Southampton and back) and, potentially, plenty to gain...

[Harry Peterson]

3 hours ago, Megabear2 said:

I can confirm that ABTA are extremely interested in this following my conversation with them.  I am currently in discussions with them, Holiday Extras and supposedly P&O.  I am due a reply from the latter next week.  

 

If a suitable reply is not forthcoming in that reply I am instructed to make a formal complaint to ABTA and also the ASA as it is blatantly clear that the advertising is incorrect and misleading.  I personally would go so far as to suggest fraudulent as they must be aware the policies do not cover these risks - I've spoken to 14 insurers with the same reply.

 

Travellers on P&O and Cunard are affected by this issue and ABTA have commented unofficially that this is clearly a policy to tie in with Carnival, the US parent company, of removing all restrictions.  Ironically buried in the US and Australian terms of Cunard is a requirement for them to pay FCC to affected guests with US or Australian bookings.

 

If, as I suspect, P&O try to cut some deal with me which unfortunately they have tried previously, I intend on this occasion to refuse.  I have put them on notice I will be contacting various consumer agencies on the issue if they do not sort the issue for all travellers, not just individuals.

 

To the OP I suggest lodging a complaint with ABTA immediately as there is nothing to best lost in raising the issue - the more the merrier! I would also suggest taking the issue up with any legal entity you may have access to - check free home insurance free legal lines, credit card legal help and any work or union related help lines.  Definitely don't let it go unchallenged.  

 

If you need "proof" of the insurance issue, please refer to the Holiday Extras thread I started where Adam Edinburgh's reply on what his company will not cover is posted.

 

I have a swaive of material on this issue!   If you want to contact me direct let me know - I'm not sure if this site allows personal contact but I'm sure we can find a way.

 

To everyone else  including those who have said it's an okay policy, I can assure you it's not according to the governing body of travel.

Your track record in this area speaks for itself.
 

I’m not personally affected by this issue, but I do know how time consuming it is to argue points like this out logically, clearly and comprehensively - and to get clear answers devoid of weasel words.

 

On behalf of everyone in these forums, thank you. 

[Megabear2]

23 minutes ago, cruising.mark.uk said:

If I were the OP, I'd be minded to 'forget' the recent correspondence I'd had with P&O and turn up at Southampton to board this cruise as if the exchange described in the first post had not happened.  At best, that would lead to a conversation with a human being at the point where the answers to the medical questionnaire became an issue, providing the OP a chance to argue their case and, potentially, be allowed to board.

 

If, following that conversation, boarding was still not allowed, I'd recommend the OP insist on a letter signed by the ship's doctor saying that they had been denied boarding on medical grounds.  As was clear from the previous thread discussing this, a signed letter from a medical professional would hopefully satisfy most insurers.  It would certainly give an increased chance of an insurance payout compared with where the OP is at the moment, which seems to be merely a 'computer says 'no'' situation.  And, involving the ship's doctor in the conversation might just make them see sense and allow boarding in any case.  Nothing to lose in my view (except for a journey to Southampton and back) and, potentially, plenty to gain...

Whilst an interesting suggestion it wouldn't help her sister in law or any other of her travelling party denied boarding as they won't have any claim on medical grounds.  I believe the OP is past her sailing date as well.  The problem with the questionnaire is it being completed online with no chance of appeal.  When tests were being done at port you had medical professionals at the terminal who knew how to handle the situation, now as you say its computer saying no.

 

The SIL is assumedly on a different insurance policy and living in a different address, therefore her insurer has no liability under most of the policies I've discussed the issues with them.  If you do not travel as a couple or family residing at the same address you have no recourse at all.

[Megabear2]

1 hour ago, bee-ess said:

 

How can we find out what the T&C's were when we booked, I don't imagine that P&O would give us a copy of the terms when we booked.

If you didn't think to keep a copy at the date of your booking it will assumedly have been booked prior to the amendment on 5 September and therefore should be fairly easy to point out to P&O you booked prior to the abandonment of FCC.  You are entitled to ask for the printed copy in force at the date on your booking confirmation as well although getting this might as you say prove difficult.  

[cruising.mark.uk]

15 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

The problem with the questionnaire is it being completed online with no chance of appeal.  When tests were being done at port you had medical professionals at the terminal who knew how to handle the situation, now as you say its computer saying no.

 

 

So, surely the simple answer and the salutary lesson for others from the OPs sad experience is not to complete the questionnaire online, but to wait until check-in?  

[zap99]

1 minute ago, cruising.mark.uk said:

So, surely the simple answer and the salutary lesson for others from the OPs sad experience is not to complete the questionnaire online, but to wait until check-in?  

Difficult dilemma.  Not that long ago folk who just didn't feel like going  ,were advised on here. Just tell them you have a cold and get some FCC. There must be a better way, but I don't profess to know what it is.

[Megabear2]

4 minutes ago, cruising.mark.uk said:

So, surely the simple answer and the salutary lesson for others from the OPs sad experience is not to complete the questionnaire online, but to wait until check-in?  

If you don't complete it apparently they cancel you anyway as it's a term of booking.  In March my entire family were hit by covid and had to cancel our 1 April cruise.  One BIL just told his travel agent he wasn't travelling and ignored the questionnaire when it arrived next day. Due to an oversight P&O thought he was still travelling. At 1 minute past midnight on departure day he received an email stating as he hadn't completed the questionnaire his cruise was cancelled.

[Pippa04]

2 hours ago, bee-ess said:

 

How can we find out what the T&C's were when we booked, I don't imagine that P&O would give us a copy of the terms when we booked.

Legally they should but to date I have asked them 9 times to provide a copy from when I booked and they still have not done so.  They come back with further questions every time I ask for them and then take a month (or more) to answer every email.  It's absolutely disgraceful the way they have handled the whole covid issue and could very easily cause them major problems in the future if enough frequent cruisers such as myself follow through with our vow never to cruise with them again.

[Cruisemeister2002]

I wish I had a solution to your problem but sadly I don't. I do however believe that as we know insurance companies will try to wriggle out of paying if they can. I over the last two years have paid out £1300 in insurance policies to cover cruises I booked. The loss of the first £650 was an error on my behalf as I couldn't see the cruise going ahead. Changed the cruise to one going early this year and then the cruise didn't happen anyway, that was last year. Then the one I booked for February this year P&O changed the itinerary, missing all US ports and offered a total refund, extra onboard or to transfer to another cruise, which is what we did. However due to the ship sailing we were not entitled to compensation from the Insurance Company even though it didn't go to where we originally had booked. 

[Yorkypete]

47 minutes ago, Megabear2 said:

They will have to find one.  Im already seeing several cases where people are losing money and trapped between two stools so to speak.  Moving forward we're talking potentially thousands of pounds loss to passengers not taking into account the quarantine farce.  Add to that the health risk of passengers lying to avoid financial loss, particularly at a time when numbers are increasing and new variants are hovering, and the cruise lines are starting into the abyss of negative publicity.

 

Even I'm thinking about starting a FB group to draw people's attention to the situation and I'm totally anti social media. I'm not however going to stand by and risk myself and my family losing thousands of pounds.

Good Luck. There are a number of avenues I am prepared to go down with P&O as regards their rules and regulations which do not make sense and are NOT there for the protection of passengers.There are various points which contradict each other, one of which is that the guest was stopped boarding because of a cough and yet people board whilst coughing but P&O ignore it!

 Anyway, we will see what will happen.

 

[davecttr]

1 minute ago, Yorkypete said:

Good Luck. There are a number of avenues I am prepared to go down with P&O as regards their rules and regulations which do not make sense and are NOT there for the protection of passengers.There are various points which contradict each other, one of which is that the guest was stopped boarding because of a cough and yet people board whilst coughing but P&O ignore it!

 Anyway, we will see what will happen.

 

Yes, to be fair they should refuse boarding to anyone in the terminal who coughs or sneezes or blows their nose more than once.

[Megabear2]

4 minutes ago, davecttr said:

Yes, to be fair they should refuse boarding to anyone in the terminal who coughs or sneezes or blows their nose more than once.

Crikey even I find that draconian!  I cough regularly since my brush with cv in March/April.  Whilst I'm happy to chat with medical staff and be examined I'd be very unhappy at being treated like I have something to hide. 

 

As I've stated elsewhere it is my intention to take a certified covid test before each cruise I'm taking so that hopefully any refused boarding is backed up by a medical document.  For the time being those results are my financial security.

 

Perhaps P&O should make it clear on their we strongly advise you take a test page that if no certified positive test is available you run the risk your insurer may not cover you.  At least it would be a start.

[Cruisemeister2002]

This all reminds me of witches and the ducking stools. Drown and you were not a witch, survive and you were and you were then burnt at the stake. Come clean on you have had a cough, lose your cruise and maybe all your money. Lie and pass something on to fellow passengers who are then isolated and have a ruined cruise. Seriously this situation needs sorting between cruise lines and insurance companies. But it won't be as with the wishy washy terms and conditions laid out by the Insurance companies and the shameful way people who pay Select Prices which state they can choose a cabin are being shuffled to other parts of the ship because P&O can't decide which cabins they want to use for isolation and keep chopping and changing.