Turn Down to be reduced to once a day 2023!

[Joebucks]

43 minutes ago, eroller said:

 

Not sure that is the point.  No one really needs to take a cruise for that matter.  It’s a luxury.  
 

It’s more about dumbing down the experience and charging more for less.  Cruises have been so successful because of the value and overall experience.  So much more than a hotel.  Start to make it more and more like a hotel and continue to erode the value, and the industry could be in for a continued rocky road.  
 

Of course there will always be apologists that don’t care what the cruise line does (blind loyalty) and tell the “whiners” to move on.  Like sheep in a heard.  Followers.  Doesn’t really help anything.  Most of us complain because we actually care about the product and experience and want it to thrive.  We are invested in it.  I want it to evolve in a positive way, not erode down the toilet.  

 

Some of us understand the environment we're in. What the economics look like. What the average cruiser wants. I don't go in my local restaurant and yell because prices went up and they have less staff. Same with the hotels, and everything else. 

 

Those demanding tablecloths and a second set of towels have plenty of options out there. Most of you just don't want to pay for it. You want everything at the same price as 1990s, with all of the new bells and whistles, with luxury service, ignoring the billions of COVID debt. The numbers don't add up. Still, the world revolves around you. If everyone booked only the suites and the Haven, then you can make your noble stance. Few care as much as you do.

 

Meanwhile, us apologists continue to book what is sufficient to us, and we enjoy ourselves. Our whole lives, we watch people who always need to find something to be mad about. We chuckle and shrug at your constant outrage. I could list 20 ways this environment has negatively impacted me. A second set of towels every day isn't even a thought in my mind.

[YangtzeCruiser]

On 12/29/2022 at 9:19 AM, Honolulu Blue said:

It was Carnival Corporation, of which Princess is a subsidiary that was responsible for some, but not all, of the fineable dirty deeds.

 

From the Cruise Industry News article at Norwegian Cruise Line Trimming Stateroom Cleaning, Cutting Crew Roles - Cruise Industry News | Cruise News :

 

• Epic - January 8
• Sky - January 13
• Jewel - January 14
• Sun and Breakaway - January 15

 

The Crew Center article at Norwegian Cruise Line to Reduce Stateroom Cleaning Services | Crew Center (crew-center.com) added (I'm quoting):

 

The new company policy will be rolled out to the entire fleet in the following three-month period, expected to be completed with the Norwegian Pearl on March 31, 2023.

Good thing we're on the Jan 3 sailing of the Sky! 🤠

[Lakesregion]

While two visits a day for top notch room service may end with NCL as the year unwinds, there is no need to go towel short. Just have a chat with your room steward when you first board and tell them how many towels you will need to satisfy your entire days usage. If you shower twice a day then you will need two sets. If they fail to comply with such a simple request then one can always delete the service charge from their account. And you can visit the pool area and "Borrow" the number of towels you will need for the length of your cruise.

 

Those seeking to feel even better than NCL with their claim of environmental savings can shower every other day or maybe just once per week. 

Edited January 1, 2023 by Lakesregion

[Mr FZ]

Why in the world would anyone want turn down more than once a day?  Do you go into your cabin and re-make the bed after the steward has completed thr turn down?  Very silly complaint. 

[asmit4]

Well...thanks folks! This has been highly entertaining. I had no idea so many took some fresh towels and a room refresh so seriously. 

[ChiefMateJRK]

1 hour ago, Lakesregion said:

If you shower twice a day then you will need two sets.

What?!

[Cruising Lynne]

12 hours ago, newbe dave said:

Thank you for saying what I and many others were thinking. If the value of the total price of cruising, including all costs such as taxes, fees, service charges, etc, are higher than you will value the experience: you have to option to find another vacation to suit your wishes. 

 

If you are so upset by this announcement that you want to never spend your money with NCL again, please spend your money elsewhere. And take your drama with you. Buh-Bye.

People expressing their disappointment in some of the recent changes does not necessarily mean that they "never want to spend money with NCL again". No need to be so dramatic about it.

[njkate]

10 hours ago, asmit4 said:

Well...thanks folks! This has been highly entertaining. I had no idea so many took some fresh towels and a room refresh so seriously. 

I think what upsets some is NCL is cutting services on the heels of a $4pp per day increase in DSC. It doesn’t sound like much but for a family of 4 the DSC is now $80 per day.

[hallux]

21 minutes ago, njkate said:

I think what upsets some is NCL is cutting services on the heels of a $4pp per day increase in DSC.

Yup, it's a cascade.  First was the announcement of "best day/week/month" of bookings.  Next breath was the increase of the DSC by 25% for balcony and below (club balcony and Haven might have had a lower % increase as the Club Balcony had a higher starting point but is now the same cost as the balcony and below instead of its own rate). Now they're saying that we're spending more and getting less.

 

Yes, inflation is a thing and things cost more, I get that.  That accounts for MAYBE a 10% increase in the DSC, but to go up TWENTY FIVE PERCENT, especially as you're announcing your bookings are up?  THEN you announce a reduction in the service people have come to expect?

 

What's next?  Are they going to install laundry chutes for us to send our towels down when we want fresh ones and put out tables of fresh towels in the elevator lobbies so we can grab them when we need or want fresh ones?  Of course charging us "for the convenience"...

 

Don't get me wrong, I've certainly enjoyed my cruises on NCL, but Princess was running a deal in December that I could have sailed in a balcony for less than 50% more than my studio on NCL, similar itinerary with drinks, WiFi and 'crew appreciation' already included.

[JIMESOPUS]

@halluxAnd that's why I'm happy to read that other brands are coming into the NY market full time, only RRC across the river and NCL sailed year round. With the increase cost of NCL we are going to try MSC out of Brooklyn this fall, the grass may not be greener on other side but with this nudge from NCL, I'm willing to try.

 

Happy New Year

[newbe dave]

10 hours ago, Cruising Lynne said:

People expressing their disappointment in some of the recent changes does not necessarily mean that they "never want to spend money with NCL again". No need to be so dramatic about it.

Do these people have the same level of vocal disappointment for the hotel industry that does not service rooms daily in most cases? Do they also fly off the handle when asked to pay for services beyond their reservation (parking, tips, better room, etc)? Do they constantly ask where every dollar you spend at a business goes to feed their unquenchable curiosity? Do they demand to see all financial data for a business they happen to patronize? 

 

These questions all sound stupid. But they have all been asked of NCL in this tread.

 

My point is that the cruise industry is barely hanging on financially. That is shown in their published financial statements. I appreciate that they are trying to tighten their financial belt in ways that will have minor impacts to their product (If having extra towels is so important to you, you should be willing to talk to your steward to address it versus blabbing constantly about it here).  To harp and whine about these minor changes when you see all other industries do similar or worse makes no sense to me. 

[Barb Nahoumi]

On 12/29/2022 at 8:14 AM, ziggyuk said:

I can see this resulting in even more rubbish being dumped in the hallways.

That can happen.  We stayed in a hotel recently, and when our basket needed emptying, we were told to put it in the hall. Eventually, a housekeeping person came to take care of it.

[Honolulu Blue]

18 minutes ago, hallux said:

What's next?  Are they going to install laundry chutes for us to send our towels down when we want fresh ones and put out tables of fresh towels in the elevator lobbies so we can grab them when we need or want fresh ones?  Of course charging us "for the convenience"...

Little to do with NCL, but this post reminded me of my residence hall days where we used to throw trash (not laundry) down chutes and go to a small room occasionally where we could exchange dirty laundry for clean. No room attendants for us mostly broke college students, but at least we didn't have to tip.

[Barb Nahoumi]

I don't care about the elimination of the PM Turn-down service.  We can turn down our own bed, but I am upset that NCL announced a hike in the DSC, followed by a service cut.  We prepaid our DSC, so the up-charge won't affect us now.

 

 People will be lined up at Guest Services, asking to reduce their DSC payment.  

[Lionkingrichard]

57 minutes ago, hallux said:

Yup, it's a cascade.  First was the announcement of "best day/week/month" of bookings.  Next breath was the increase of the DSC by 25% for balcony and below (club balcony and Haven might have had a lower % increase as the Club Balcony had a higher starting point but is now the same cost as the balcony and below instead of its own rate). Now they're saying that we're spending more and getting less.

 

Yes, inflation is a thing and things cost more, I get that.  That accounts for MAYBE a 10% increase in the DSC, but to go up TWENTY FIVE PERCENT, especially as you're announcing your bookings are up?  THEN you announce a reduction in the service people have come to expect?

 

What's next?  Are they going to install laundry chutes for us to send our towels down when we want fresh ones and put out tables of fresh towels in the elevator lobbies so we can grab them when we need or want fresh ones?  Of course charging us "for the convenience"...

 

Don't get me wrong, I've certainly enjoyed my cruises on NCL, but Princess was running a deal in December that I could have sailed in a balcony for less than 50% more than my studio on NCL, similar itinerary with drinks, WiFi and 'crew appreciation' already included.

It is not just inflation. Cost are up, fuel, food and WAGES.

 

I posted in a different thread that NCL pays employees 2 times as much as CC.

 

From cruiselawnews. The median wage at Norwegian is $19,319, compared with $14,706 at Royal Caribbean Group and $8,658 at Carnival.

 

So this is where your hard earned money is going! There are other choices and you can save $4 per day.

 

Enjoy!

[laudergayle]

I would venture to guess that the majority of NCL guests are not avid cruisers. As such they will be less affected by the increased DSC, reduced room attention, non-complimentary breakfast room service, reduction of off-Broadway productions, non-weather related skipped ports.  Ya don’t know what you don’t know.  However, price-resistance may keep these cruisers from ever getting onboard.  If they do, they will experience the “new” NCL and will then decide for themselves if the price/value was worth it.  As for us avid NCL cruisers…well, we know we’re getting sc$#wed.  That being said…I understand the need and will eventually adjust to the new NCL.

Edited January 1, 2023 by laudergayle

[Joebucks]

1 hour ago, hallux said:

Yup, it's a cascade.  First was the announcement of "best day/week/month" of bookings.  Next breath was the increase of the DSC by 25% for balcony and below (club balcony and Haven might have had a lower % increase as the Club Balcony had a higher starting point but is now the same cost as the balcony and below instead of its own rate). Now they're saying that we're spending more and getting less.

 

Yes, inflation is a thing and things cost more, I get that.  That accounts for MAYBE a 10% increase in the DSC, but to go up TWENTY FIVE PERCENT, especially as you're announcing your bookings are up?  THEN you announce a reduction in the service people have come to expect?

 

What's next?  Are they going to install laundry chutes for us to send our towels down when we want fresh ones and put out tables of fresh towels in the elevator lobbies so we can grab them when we need or want fresh ones?  Of course charging us "for the convenience"...

 

Don't get me wrong, I've certainly enjoyed my cruises on NCL, but Princess was running a deal in December that I could have sailed in a balcony for less than 50% more than my studio on NCL, similar itinerary with drinks, WiFi and 'crew appreciation' already included.

 

I love how you get to shrug off inflation as a number that works for you. Having actually hired and managed people, I can tell you our labor went up a lot more than 10% over the past few years. As much as everyone is heated and this 2nd turn down is in everyone's face, the DSC pays for a lot more than that. 

[RNPJN]

On 12/28/2022 at 4:45 PM, ulster-cruiser said:

According to Crew Centre:

Norwegian Cruise Line will reduce cleaning services in guest staterooms aboard all of its ships in 2023. According to a letter sent to crew, the company will adjust the current daily stateroom (turn-down) service provided to guests in all categories below a Suite level. Guests staying in Studio, Inside, Oceanview, Balcony, and Club Balcony Suite will receive once-daily stateroom service. The letter goes on to explain that all other suite and Haven categories will continue to receive twice-daily stateroom service. 

The first ship to implement the new policy will be Norwegian Epic, starting January 8, 2023. The new company policy will be rolled out to the entire fleet in the following three-month period, expected to be completed with the Norwegian Pearl on March 31, 2023.

According to NCL the reduction in daily housekeeping service will have a positive impact on the company’s “commitment to environmental sustainability”, and aligns with current “standard practices in the cruise and hotel industries by conservation of water, energy and reducing the use of chemicals.”

“Over the last two-plus years., the collective hospitality industry has evolved tremendously. From airlines, hotels and cruise lines, a new travel environment has emerged with renewed preferences in all aspects of the guest's travel experience Environmental sustainability is on stage more than ever and will continue to play a crucial role in all business practices now and into the future,” the letter reads in parts.

 

Shocking if true! The future is bleak - what will they take next?

They are canceling shows

[njhorseman]

1 hour ago, Lionkingrichard said:

It is not just inflation. Cost are up, fuel, food and WAGES.

 

I posted in a different thread that NCL pays employees 2 times as much as CC.

 

From cruiselawnews. The median wage at Norwegian is $19,319, compared with $14,706 at Royal Caribbean Group and $8,658 at Carnival.

 

So this is where your hard earned money is going! There are other choices and you can save $4 per day.

 

Enjoy!

 

You don't understand the numbers you're citing. NCL's median wage artificially appears to be much higher than the Royal's and Carnival's because NCL prorated 2021 wages under the assumption of how many days the crew would work in a full year, when in fact the cruise lines were shut down for much of 2021. Carnival and Royal did not do the calculation that way. NCL's deceptive accounting assumption explains why NCL median wages appear so much higher than the competition's.

 

Here's the article that is the source of cruselawnews.com's report:

https://skift.com/2022/07/07/the-highest-paid-cruise-industry-ceos/

"Norwegian based its estimate of the median worker’s pay on the number of days that employee might have worked in a normal year — not the number they worked in 2021, when cruise lines were shut down early in the year and reopened gradually. That led to multiplying an average daily rate of worker pay by 278 — not the undisclosed number of days the median employee actually worked."

 

[hallux]

1 hour ago, Joebucks said:

I can tell you our labor went up a lot more than 10% over the past few years

Over the last few years, sure.  The DSC has gone up more than this one time over the last few years - the last time was less than a year ago but was only $1 or so (someone posted the numbers earlier in the thread).  And the reality is that some people (myself included) work for companies that issue MERIT-BASED wage increases rather than COLA increases so wages are hardly keeping up with the increased costs of fuel to get to work and food to be put on the table.  For the first time in quite a few years I got a 3% raise last year, and I'll be lucky to get similar this year.  Why do I work for them still?  I get some flexibility on work hours, I like the people I work with and a cumulative SIX WEEKS of time off each year (PTO and floating holidays, company holidays are in addition to that) is very difficult to give up.

 

So, yes, while it's understandable that the costs are going up this reduction in services immediately following a 25% increase in a cost many see as directly related to that service IS hard to swallow, especially when you hear that some crew members are facing a wage CUT as well.

[Lionkingrichard]

58 minutes ago, njhorseman said:

 

You don't understand the numbers you're citing. NCL's median wage artificially appears to be much higher than the Royal's and Carnival's because NCL prorated 2021 wages under the assumption of how many days the crew would work in a full year, when in fact the cruise lines were shut down for much of 2021. Carnival and Royal did not do the calculation that way. NCL's deceptive accounting assumption explains why NCL median wages appear so much higher than the competition's.

 

Here's the article that is the source of cruselawnews.com's report:

https://skift.com/2022/07/07/the-highest-paid-cruise-industry-ceos/

"Norwegian based its estimate of the median worker’s pay on the number of days that employee might have worked in a normal year — not the number they worked in 2021, when cruise lines were shut down early in the year and reopened gradually. That led to multiplying an average daily rate of worker pay by 278 — not the undisclosed number of days the median employee actually worked."

 

I'm sure skift has all the numbers, you can read this thread. NCL is hiring!

 

 

[njhorseman]

14 minutes ago, Lionkingrichard said:

I'm sure skift has all the numbers, you can read this thread. NCL is hiring!

 

 

That ad is for Pride of America crew, not international crew. Because POA is US-flagged and based in Hawaii crew is paid in accordance with US and Hawaiian law, which is not the case for crew  on the rest of NCLH's fleet, which are all foreign-flagged ships.

POA crew comprises only a small percentage of total NCLH crew as POA is only one of 19 NCL ships and only one of about 30 NCLH ships.

Edited January 1, 2023 by njhorseman

[coscab]

I clean our cabin as much as I can with disinfectant spray as soon as we get in it.  When I am able to engage the room steward I tell he/she we don't need daily service, just fresh towels. I spread the bed over, there are only two of us in the cabin so not difficult to keep it tidy.

I do not want someone cleaning my bathroom after being in multiple other bathrooms, etc. transferring possible flu germs or other germs.

I let them know the first day that they will still be tipped generously and I do not remove the DSC. 

I know most people don't feel they are on vacation if they make their own bed or clean their own bathroom but we prefer it this way and appreciate that the steward understands. 

We got the sweetest thank you note from our steward on MSC in November.

[Lionkingrichard]

8 minutes ago, njhorseman said:

That ad is for Pride of America crew, not international crew. Because POA is US-flagged and based in Hawaii crew is paid in accordance with US and Hawaiian law, which is not the case for crew  on the rest of NCLH's fleet, which are all foreign-flagged ships.

POA crew comprises only a small percentage of total NCLH crew as POA is only one of 19 NCL ships and only one of about 30 NCLH ships.

Yes I knew you would post that. Most workers are on 8 month contracts and they can go home for 4 months. Most I have talked to come back after 2 months. That's your 278 days.

 

I have talked to many that have been with NCL for 5 years. They love it.

[njhorseman]

4 minutes ago, Lionkingrichard said:

Yes I knew you would post that. Most workers are on 8 month contracts and they can go home for 4 months. Most I have talked to come back after 2 months. That's your 278 days.

 

I have talked to many that have been with NCL for 5 years. They love it.

You don't seem to understand that the NCL numbers cited by cruiselawnews.com that were taken from skift.com are phony because they're for 2021, when no one worked 278 days since NCL didn't resume cruising until July 2021 and did so with a limited number of ships operating at reduced capacity.

 

Further contracts are not typically 8 months in length. For example if you read the POA ad you've cited you'll see that the wages they are listing are based on a six month contract.