Key Bridge in Baltimore collapses into Patapsco River in Baltimore after vessel crashes into support column

[sparks1093]

6 minutes ago, bunnyman said:

That was only a 100 foot section of a deck bridge that spanned the Mianus River in CT. I traveled that route all the time back then; they diverted traffic onto local streets and it was a mess. They did open a temporary crossing with reduced capacity, but it was about 3 months before I-95 was fully open.  And it was only on the northbound side, so they still had the southern span in place. Much different type bridge replacement.  When they recently replace the Tappen Zee Bridge over the Hudson River, it took about 5-years to complete.

I was using that example to show that when there is such a large incident the wheels tend to spin faster, that is all. No way was I trying to draw a parallel between the two incidents. I was also more focused on the opening of the channel than on replacing the bridge.

[PC 462]

27 minutes ago, Wehwalt said:

You're still going to be limited by the clearance under the Chesapeake Bay Bridge (US 50) which I find to be 186 feet. That's going to rule out the newest ships.

That is true. But both of the spans of the Bay Bridge from Annapolis to the Eastern Shore are older than the Key Bridge. One day they will be replaced. In fact, Maryland already has approval for a third span. I hope that higher bridges will be built in the fullness of time.

[Guest]

Philadelphia Cruise Terminal wouldn't be a possible option? (I get CCL would have to work with the port.) Seems like a more logistical option due to how closer it is to Baltimore compared to NYC or Norfolk. Both are at least 4 hours away from Baltimore.

[KmomChicago]

8 minutes ago, At Sea At Peace said:

 

Thanks, I forgot the Brooklyn Terminal.  From what I just quickly read, it has ONE berth?  And that is what Carnival uses?

 

One berth at Brooklyn Pier 12, yes. Princess and Cunard use it so no problem for Carnival when not in use by sister brands. 

[KmomChicago]

Just now, Afttastic said:

Philadelphia Cruise Terminal wouldn't be a possible option? (I get CCL would have to work with the port.) Seems like a more logistical option due to how closer it is to Baltimore compared to NYC or Norfolk. Both are at least 4 hours away from Baltimore.

People are saying the ships don’t fit.

[paulypride]

3 minutes ago, KmomChicago said:

People are saying the ships don’t fit.

also the river has so much mud on the bottom the draft is no good in Philly. If it were a Fantasy class ship, maybe. 

[jimbo5544]

19 minutes ago, Wehwalt said:

There's space for at least five to dock at Manhattan at the same time, but I don't know if they have the facilities for four of them to turn around (customs, baggage, check-in, etc).

It has been a while, but I do not remember a ton of options like 5 open docks, and there are contracts for things like that....but all options are a good thing, especially right now.

[ozzie0075]

3 minutes ago, KmomChicago said:

One berth at Brooklyn Pier 12, yes. Princess and Cunard use it so no problem for Carnival when not in use by sister brands. 

 

MSC uses Brooklyn every Sunday so that would rule that out. Manhattan looks like the best option outside of Norfolk.  I wouldn't be surprised if they cancel the next couple of sailings on the Legend and send it to dry dock early. That would give them a few weeks to figure out what to do with the Pride when it returns. 

[jimbo5544]

23 minutes ago, bunnyman said:

That was only a 100 foot section of a deck bridge that spanned the Mianus River in CT. I traveled that route all the time back then; they diverted traffic onto local streets and it was a mess. They did open a temporary crossing with reduced capacity, but it was about 3 months before I-95 was fully open.  And it was only on the northbound side, so they still had the southern span in place. Much different type bridge replacement.  When they recently replace the Tappen Zee Bridge over the Hudson River, it took about 5-years to complete.

Think it was only one side of the highway, apples and skyscrapers.

[KmomChicago]

2 minutes ago, jimbo5544 said:

It has been a while, but I do not remember a ton of options like 5 open docks, and there are contracts for things like that....but all options are a good thing, especially right now.

If it’s accurate, the NYC cruise port schedule shows no more than 3 in port most days and usually far less.

[jimbo5544]

Just now, KmomChicago said:

If it’s accurate, the NYC cruise port schedule shows no more than 3 in port most days and usually far less.

sounds about right

[mz-s]

1 minute ago, ozzie0075 said:

 

MSC uses Brooklyn every Sunday so that would rule that out. Manhattan looks like the best option outside of Norfolk.  I wouldn't be surprised if they cancel the next couple of sailings on the Legend and send it to dry dock early. That would give them a few weeks to figure out what to do with the Pride when it returns. 

 

I don't think they can just move up a drydock on a whim like that.

[KmomChicago]

1 minute ago, ozzie0075 said:

 

MSC uses Brooklyn every Sunday so that would rule that out. Manhattan looks like the best option outside of Norfolk.  I wouldn't be surprised if they cancel the next couple of sailings on the Legend and send it to dry dock early. That would give them a few weeks to figure out what to do with the Pride when it returns. 

I hope not. We’re in spring break and then entering shoulder season. Would be willing if it were me, with my little schoolchildren, to cooperate with whatever hoops (ie boring bus rides) to get on the ship.

[CatDadWV]

46 minutes ago, At Sea At Peace said:

 

I'm thinking so - at least for Legend for this Sunday.  Piers 88, 90 and 92 appear to be double sided (up to 6 ships; however the website states FIVE 1,000 foot long berths for cruise vessels) and the schedule for this Sunday is only RCCL Anthem, MSC Meraviglia and Norwegian Getaway.

 

Carnival also has to ramp up to restart for the April 5th Venezia, so, it just looks like the right choice.

I hope they announce their plans soon, as I'm booked on the transatlantic sailing departing 15-April.  I have flight and hotel bookings that I need to change.  Not a peep on their website as of yet.

Edited March 26 by CatDadWV

[IntrepidFromDC]

20 minutes ago, Afttastic said:

Philadelphia Cruise Terminal wouldn't be a possible option? (I get CCL would have to work with the port.) Seems like a more logistical option due to how closer it is to Baltimore compared to NYC or Norfolk. Both are at least 4 hours away from Baltimore.

Dredge the Potomac River and give us a cruise port in DC! 😁 🏴‍☠️ 🍻

[sammee]

11 minutes ago, mz-s said:

 

I don't think they can just move up a drydock on a whim like that.

MSC isn't every Sunday. I left on a 9 dayer at end of January, on a Friday. They don't have a constant 7 day schedule. Here's the link to the sailing schedule for Brooklyn port. Princess, Cundard and another one also leave there.  https://nycruise.com/brooklyn-terminal/schedule-bct/

[Guest]

21 minutes ago, KmomChicago said:

People are saying the ships don’t fit.

 

17 minutes ago, paulypride said:

also the river has so much mud on the bottom the draft is no good in Philly. If it were a Fantasy class ship, maybe. 

 

Thanks - was a thought but wasn't sure. I thought I read a few years ago Philadelphia terminal was used for some cruises - must have been the smaller ships with 100-200 passengers. 😄

[Old Fart Cruisers]

30 minutes ago, sparks1093 said:

I was using that example to show that when there is such a large incident the wheels tend to spin faster, that is all.

as you said, the wheels are already spinning fast!

 

President Biden said at a midafternoon address that the federal government will pay for the cost to rebuild the crumpled bridge and called on Congress to support his plans. The key priority is search and rescue, Biden said, but he said officials will work to rebuild and reopen the Baltimore port “as soon as humanly possible.” He said 15,000 jobs depend on the port

[Guest]

17 minutes ago, ozzie0075 said:

I wouldn't be surprised if they cancel the next couple of sailings on the Legend and send it to dry dock early. That would give them a few weeks to figure out what to do with the Pride when it returns. 

 

I can't say I would see that happening. That would cause a shift to the dry dock schedule and another ship likely bumped or resecheduled? I can see it in cases like the Freedom, but for this...?

[paulypride]

8 minutes ago, ozzie0075 said:

 

MSC uses Brooklyn every Sunday so that would rule that out. Manhattan looks like the best option outside of Norfolk.  I wouldn't be surprised if they cancel the next couple of sailings on the Legend and send it to dry dock early. That would give them a few weeks to figure out what to do with the Pride when it returns. 

The March 31 cruise on the Legend seems to be the one most in jeopardy - but its possible to take that to NYC -  One of the piers in Manhattan is open, NCL Getaway is in the other.  Brooklyn is not open, as the MSC Meraviglia is in port. The same for the 4/7 cruise. 

The 4/15 Transatlantic for the Legend could use Brooklyn, the Venezia is in dock at Pier 88 in Manhattan but the other port is open. 

 

Now for the Pride -  The first cruise out of Baltimore is scheduled for 4/21

MSC Is not scheduled to go out of Brooklyn as the Meraviglia is on a longer cruise on 4/21- so Brooklyn could be an option for that one, BUT she is in dock on the 28th, the return date so that would not be ideal either for the Pride. So if its going to be in NYC, it would likely be Pier 90 or 92 as the NCL Joy is in dock as well. 

 

The same for the 4/28 sailing. 

 

RCCL could use Cape Liberty on 4/4, 4/12 and 4/20

[jimbo5544]

Worrying about paying for the replacement is WAY down the list of what anybody should be worried about.  

[jimbo5544]

1 minute ago, paulypride said:

The March 31 cruise on the Legend seems to be the one most in jeopardy - but its possible to take that to NYC -  One of the piers in Manhattan is open, NCL Getaway is in the other.  Brooklyn is not open, as the MSC Meraviglia is in port. The same for the 4/7 cruise. 

The 4/15 Transatlantic for the Legend could use Brooklyn, the Venezia is in dock at Pier 88 in Manhattan but the other port is open. 

 

Now for the Pride -  The first cruise out of Baltimore is scheduled for 4/21

MSC Is not scheduled to go out of Brooklyn as the Meraviglia is on a longer cruise on 4/21- so Brooklyn could be an option for that one, BUT she is in dock on the 28th, the return date so that would not be ideal either for the Pride. So if its going to be in NYC, it would likely be Pier 90 or 92 as the NCL Joy is in dock as well. 

 

The same for the 4/28 sailing. 

 

RCCL could use Cape Liberty on 4/4, 4/12 and 4/20

I am sure that the South Florida emergency room is looking at all options.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, Old Fart Cruisers said:

as you said, the wheels are already spinning fast!

 

President Biden said at a midafternoon address that the federal government will pay for the cost to rebuild the crumpled bridge and called on Congress to support his plans. The key priority is search and rescue, Biden said, but he said officials will work to rebuild and reopen the Baltimore port “as soon as humanly possible.” He said 15,000 jobs depend on the port

 

I-95 in Philadelphia after the overpass fire was rebuilt within 2 weeks. Then again, they didn't have to remove 5,000 feet of steel from 50 foot waters.

 

I'm curious to see if they go with the quick route to get a replacement up as quickly as possible, or take their time to design one with more safeguards and a higher span that would eventually lead to larger ships coming to the port.

[tscoffey]

1 minute ago, Afttastic said:

I-95 in Philadelphia after the overpass fire was rebuilt within 2 weeks.

Not even in the same league as a bridge this size. 

[Guest]

2 minutes ago, tscoffey said:

Not even in the same league as a bridge this size. 

 

Then again, they didn't have to remove 5,000 feet of steel from 50 foot waters. 🙄