Buffet Bugs

[555]

5 minutes ago, Cruise Raider said:

I don’t place the blame on the cruise lines or insurance companies.  The blame solely lies with those that know they are sick and don't take any measures to isolate themselves from others.  Would they do the same at home?  Some do, some don’t.  It’s the ones that don’t that are the problem.  
I know if I’m sick at party time, I turn down any invitations I may have received.  I contracted CoVid from someone at a party that wasn’t honest about their health and missed out on a free cruise.  😖 

I stick with my statement on commending the OP for self isolating when feeling sick!    It won’t be a foolproof solution but they probably saved hundreds of others from also getting sick.  
 

It's one thing if you know for certain that you are sick but many times, you're not really sure.

Like having Covid or a cold coming on. 

[ldubs]

14 hours ago, Cruise Raider said:

We’ve always bought the Princess insurance (now we have an annual policy) so, instead of lying on the form, we did cancel one of our cruises.  
I can’t imagine being willing to lie about my health for selfish reasons.  It’s shameful anyone would do that.  

 

Shoot, folks would brag about it here on these very forums.  

[ldubs]

2 hours ago, Cruisemeister2002 said:

There would not be this problem if cruise lines and insurance company's got their act together. People who have coughs and cold won't forgo their cruise because unless you have a doctors certificate (sick note) they won't pay out and the cruise line takes your money and you lose your cruise also. Last year I cruised with P&O in March/April a 35 nighter to the Caribbean, USA/Mexico. The amount of people who had coughs was beyond belief. Neither I or my wife had any problems when we boarded, but she had a few days where she was in the cabin. I tested us for Covid but the tests were negative. Although a section of our ship had men sectioning off a corridor in order to spray the area. This disclaimer that you sign saying you haven't been ill in the last two weeks is bunkum as nobody will want to be turned away from a cruise they have maybe saved all year for and most working class people can't afford to lose thousands.

 

I agree with your comments except the last sentence.  The money is spent whether they go or not.  I think it is that no one wants to waste money.   If it cannot be afforded is a different issue.  

Edited July 27 by ldubs

[ldubs]

Oops - double post..  

 

Edited July 27 by ldubs

[cruzsnooze]

On 7/26/2024 at 9:30 AM, dockman said:

No gloves don't stop airborne but IMO every bit helps...consider yourself lucky to have never been sick...i am overall a pretty healthy guy with around 100 total cruises but every now and then something gets me and so anything i can do to mitigate my risk is ok with me.

I agree in Principal that something is better then nothing to mitigate risk however my concern is that it becomes false sense of well being. People think to use hand sanitizer too often not knowing it only works for 2 maybe 3 times in a row and then it's ineffective. 

[dockman]

1 hour ago, cruzsnooze said:

I agree in Principal that something is better then nothing to mitigate risk however my concern is that it becomes false sense of well being. People think to use hand sanitizer too often not knowing it only works for 2 maybe 3 times in a row and then it's ineffective. 

No idea who says hand sanitizer works only 2 or 3 times then ineffective and don't see any claim like that on a google search so maybe you can share the source of that info.

[karatemom2]

17 minutes ago, dockman said:

No idea who says hand sanitizer works only 2 or 3 times then ineffective and don't see any claim like that on a google search so maybe you can share the source of that info.

Agree. That claim is absolute rubbish. Hospitals regularly use sanitizer as an adjunct to hand washing and when hand washing is not an option. Anyone claiming it is ineffective is stating information that has no basis in fact, science, or reality. 

[edspec]

People are often sick and contagious before they realize something is amiss.  Also, the constant references to people coughing...could be a nervous tick, a throat tickle, who knows?  I read reviews and people say they have Covid because someone on an excursion was coughing and they just know that's where they got it...sounds like a Salam Witch Hunt to me.  

Your immmune system needs to be exposed to germs to work properly.  If you're constantly wearing gloves, using hand sanitizer, wiping surfaces,  and avoiding crowds then you will end up picking up any bug that comes round.  The hygiene theatre that Covid is responsible for really needs to stop.

 

[dockman]

59 minutes ago, edspec said:

People are often sick and contagious before they realize something is amiss.  Also, the constant references to people coughing...could be a nervous tick, a throat tickle, who knows?  I read reviews and people say they have Covid because someone on an excursion was coughing and they just know that's where they got it...sounds like a Salam Witch Hunt to me.  

Your immmune system needs to be exposed to germs to work properly.  If you're constantly wearing gloves, using hand sanitizer, wiping surfaces,  and avoiding crowds then you will end up picking up any bug that comes round.  The hygiene theatre that Covid is responsible for really needs to stop.

 

The least of my worries is not being exposed to enough germs.

I do not constantly wear gloves, use hand sanitizer etc and do not often get sick....but to not protect myself as best i can when in hyper crowded environments like planes and some parts of cruise ships etc in my estimation is fool hardy.  It would be nice if more people would follow basic hygiene and stay in when sick etc but many don't and won't.

[Kay S]

2 hours ago, dockman said:

so maybe you can share the source of that info.

His cousin's hairdresser's brother-in-law on Facebook.😝😝😝

[Cruise Raider]

5 hours ago, 555 said:

It's one thing if you know for certain that you are sick but many times, you're not really sure.

Like having Covid or a cold coming on. 

A friend of mine felt as though she had a cold coming on and warned us, and based on our comfort level, we could keep or cancel our plans with her.  That was so appreciated and we knew when she said she felt fine, we resumed our plans with her because we trusted her honesty!  
I am only saying that when people that know they are sick and hide it from others and go about mingling in public are the ones that put others at risk for getting sick, too.  Sorry, but we’ve all lost money on one thing or another .. hopefully, we won’t ever be the reason others will suffer from that type of selfishness.  
 

Edited July 27 by Cruise Raider

[555]

22 hours ago, ldubs said:

 

Shoot, folks would brag about it here on these very forums.  

We always filled out the form at home & had it ready to turn in.

We've never been sick once. 

[shandryl]

[pink845]

Stop worrying about the buffet and catching Covid there.   If you have people on your floor who are sick (and you can hear them hacking away), forbid the room steward from spreading germs into your cabin by forbidding he / she from entering your cabin.  They can easily put your clean towels into a plastic bag right inside your door and can remove your old ones that way. No need for them to enter past one foot.  This is what we did.  We still got Covid because we acted too late.

[555]

9 hours ago, pink845 said:

Stop worrying about the buffet and catching Covid there.   If you have people on your floor who are sick (and you can hear them hacking away), forbid the room steward from spreading germs into your cabin by forbidding he / she from entering your cabin.  They can easily put your clean towels into a plastic bag right inside your door and can remove your old ones that way. No need for them to enter past one foot.  This is what we did.  We still got Covid because we acted too late.

I might as well stay home if I'm that paranoid. 

[memoak]

11 hours ago, pink845 said:

Stop worrying about the buffet and catching Covid there.   If you have people on your floor who are sick (and you can hear them hacking away), forbid the room steward from spreading germs into your cabin by forbidding he / she from entering your cabin.  They can easily put your clean towels into a plastic bag right inside your door and can remove your old ones that way. No need for them to enter past one foot.  This is what we did.  We still got Covid because we acted too late.

Many people cough and hack for many reasons they sneeze also many of us have allergies. Sorry but your suggestion goes beyond reasonable on my opinion

[Cruisemeister2002]

On 7/27/2024 at 10:47 PM, Cruise Raider said:

A friend of mine felt as though she had a cold coming on and warned us, and based on our comfort level, we could keep or cancel our plans with her.  That was so appreciated and we knew when she said she felt fine, we resumed our plans with her because we trusted her honesty!  
I am only saying that when people that know they are sick and hide it from others and go about mingling in public are the ones that put others at risk for getting sick, too.  Sorry, but we’ve all lost money on one thing or another .. hopefully, we won’t ever be the reason others will suffer from that type of selfishness.  
 

I don't agree it's total selfishness. Why ? Well many cruise lines have questionnaires before boarding a ship. Which ask's them whether they have had any health problems the two weeks prior to sailing. If they say yes then they will not be allowed on the ship. Here in the UK (Don't know whether it's the same in the USA). If they are not allowed on the ship and haven't got a doctors sick note the insurance company won't pay out and the cruise line takes the persons money. That's where the problem lay's. yes you will always get a few selfish people, but who can afford to lose many thousands of dollars or pounds because they have a cough or cold.

[Dani24]

On 7/25/2024 at 11:47 PM, paddingtonbear said:

Actually it's the airport that is more likely to be the place to catch anything.  Most airlines clean the seats between passengers.  (I don't really trust this but that is what they say and easy to steralise if you want to do it yourself.) But once you are seated and the plane leaves the ground the recirculated air is really safe because it is filtered through a HEPA filter and the air in the plane is turned over every 3 minutes.   

 

 

We've flown several times over the last couple of years, on multiple airlines. I have a CO2 monitor that I bring with me to questionable areas. While this device doesn't detect germs in the air directly, it does tell you how much CO2 is present, which tells you a lot about air circulation. Any levels under 800 are considered excellent (outdoors is typically in the 4-500 range). Once you start getting over 1000 you are moving into "poor air quality". At certain levels and lengths of exposure to CO2 you can start seeing health impacts such as headaches and cognitive impairment. And, of course, the higher the number the slower fresh air is replacing the stale air, and the more virus particles or other pollutants could be hanging around.

I have brought this device on all of our flights. It tracks the data for me. I have never seen the CO2 levels on any plane lower than 1100. And I have seen them get as high as 3500 mid-flight. I find they typically hover between the 1500-2000 range. The airport itself has never registered that high. Though it's absolutely still possible to catch something in the airport itself.

What this tells me is that despite the filters, the actual exchange rate is not all that great. If someone sitting in a surrounding seat is sick and expressing that into the air, their CO2 is lingering, along with their virus particles. Studies about who tends to get sick on planes in proximity to the original sick person support this as well.

Personally, we choose to continue to mask in high-risk settings (including places where air quality is really poor). I don't know that I'll ever go back to not masking on a plane (my husband used to often catch illnesses on planes even before COVID, but now with masking he hasn't caught a thing). Our first cruise since the pandemic is coming up and we plan to bring masks for situations we feel warrant them. On all of our travels over the last couple of years (including to some really crowded indoor places) we've stayed healthy with a combination of masking, hand washing/sanitizing, keeping updated on vaccines, focusing on outdoor activities (we've done lots of National Park travel), and aiming to avoid peak times for indoor activities. I'm sure it's eventually going to get us, but an ounce of prevention has so far been worth far more than a pound of cure.

[Cruise Raider]

6 hours ago, Cruisemeister2002 said:

I don't agree it's total selfishness. Why ? Well many cruise lines have questionnaires before boarding a ship. Which ask's them whether they have had any health problems the two weeks prior to sailing. If they say yes then they will not be allowed on the ship. Here in the UK (Don't know whether it's the same in the USA). If they are not allowed on the ship and haven't got a doctors sick note the insurance company won't pay out and the cruise line takes the persons money. That's where the problem lay's. yes you will always get a few selfish people, but who can afford to lose many thousands of dollars or pounds because they have a cough or cold.

Just of note, they will let you on the ship being sick but possibly confine you to your room until you are no longer contagious,  
You may not agree but that doesn’t change my opinion.  Buy the Princess insurance and you can always reschedule by using either the future cruise credits or even cash if you choose to get a doctor’s note.  
I believe anyone that can afford a cruise can afford to be unselfish .. just self isolate.  It’s called being a responsible human being.  

[paddingtonbear]

3 hours ago, Dani24 said:

 

We've flown several times over the last couple of years, on multiple airlines. I have a CO2 monitor that I bring with me to questionable areas. While this device doesn't detect germs in the air directly, it does tell you how much CO2 is present, which tells you a lot about air circulation. Any levels under 800 are considered excellent (outdoors is typically in the 4-500 range). Once you start getting over 1000 you are moving into "poor air quality". At certain levels and lengths of exposure to CO2 you can start seeing health impacts such as headaches and cognitive impairment. And, of course, the higher the number the slower fresh air is replacing the stale air, and the more virus particles or other pollutants could be hanging around.

I have brought this device on all of our flights. It tracks the data for me. I have never seen the CO2 levels on any plane lower than 1100. And I have seen them get as high as 3500 mid-flight. I find they typically hover between the 1500-2000 range. The airport itself has never registered that high. Though it's absolutely still possible to catch something in the airport itself.

What this tells me is that despite the filters, the actual exchange rate is not all that great. If someone sitting in a surrounding seat is sick and expressing that into the air, their CO2 is lingering, along with their virus particles. Studies about who tends to get sick on planes in proximity to the original sick person support this as well.

Personally, we choose to continue to mask in high-risk settings (including places where air quality is really poor). I don't know that I'll ever go back to not masking on a plane (my husband used to often catch illnesses on planes even before COVID, but now with masking he hasn't caught a thing). Our first cruise since the pandemic is coming up and we plan to bring masks for situations we feel warrant them. On all of our travels over the last couple of years (including to some really crowded indoor places) we've stayed healthy with a combination of masking, hand washing/sanitizing, keeping updated on vaccines, focusing on outdoor activities (we've done lots of National Park travel), and aiming to avoid peak times for indoor activities. I'm sure it's eventually going to get us, but an ounce of prevention has so far been worth far more than a pound of cure.

Oh bugger.  Thanks for the heads up. 

I thought it was illegal to wear masks in the US?

We wear masks if the airports are crowded and would like to do so in the US if it is allowed.  We haven't had covid yet.  But we have had a couple of horrific flus in the last 2 years. 

 

Edited July 30 by paddingtonbear

[doghog]

59 minutes ago, paddingtonbear said:

Oh bugger.  Thanks for the heads up. 

I thought it was illegal to wear masks in the US?

We wear masks if the airports are crowded and would like to do so in the US if it is allowed.  We haven't had covid yet.  But we have had a couple of horrific flus in the last 2 years. 

 

Of course you can wear a mask in the U.S.A. 

[paddingtonbear]

1 minute ago, doghog said:

Of course you can wear a mask in the U.S.A. 

I read they were banned in North Carolina? And other states may follow.  

 

nbcnews.com/news/us-news/mask-bans-are-growing-popularity-critics-call-trend-dog-whistle-quell-rcna160218

[doghog]

14 minutes ago, paddingtonbear said:

I read they were banned in North Carolina? And other states may follow.  

 

nbcnews.com/news/us-news/mask-bans-are-growing-popularity-critics-call-trend-dog-whistle-quell-rcna160218

Since 1953, North Carolina's criminal statutes have prohibited the wearing of masks, hoods, or other devices that disguise a person's face or voice so as to conceal identity in certain places.

 

Wear your mask if that makes you comfortable. Personally I hated them and glad we aren't required to wear masks. 

 

We haven't had covid. 

Edited July 31 by doghog

[memoak]

5 hours ago, Dani24 said:

 

We've flown several times over the last couple of years, on multiple airlines. I have a CO2 monitor that I bring with me to questionable areas. While this device doesn't detect germs in the air directly, it does tell you how much CO2 is present, which tells you a lot about air circulation. Any levels under 800 are considered excellent (outdoors is typically in the 4-500 range). Once you start getting over 1000 you are moving into "poor air quality". At certain levels and lengths of exposure to CO2 you can start seeing health impacts such as headaches and cognitive impairment. And, of course, the higher the number the slower fresh air is replacing the stale air, and the more virus particles or other pollutants could be hanging around.

I have brought this device on all of our flights. It tracks the data for me. I have never seen the CO2 levels on any plane lower than 1100. And I have seen them get as high as 3500 mid-flight. I find they typically hover between the 1500-2000 range. The airport itself has never registered that high. Though it's absolutely still possible to catch something in the airport itself.

What this tells me is that despite the filters, the actual exchange rate is not all that great. If someone sitting in a surrounding seat is sick and expressing that into the air, their CO2 is lingering, along with their virus particles. Studies about who tends to get sick on planes in proximity to the original sick person support this as well.

Personally, we choose to continue to mask in high-risk settings (including places where air quality is really poor). I don't know that I'll ever go back to not masking on a plane (my husband used to often catch illnesses on planes even before COVID, but now with masking he hasn't caught a thing). Our first cruise since the pandemic is coming up and we plan to bring masks for situations we feel warrant them. On all of our travels over the last couple of years (including to some really crowded indoor places) we've stayed healthy with a combination of masking, hand washing/sanitizing, keeping updated on vaccines, focusing on outdoor activities (we've done lots of National Park travel), and aiming to avoid peak times for indoor activities. I'm sure it's eventually going to get us, but an ounce of prevention has so far been worth far more than a pound of cure.

If you are planning to mask in any environment that is crowded on a cruise ship I believe you may have to mask pretty much at every event and meal. Theatres, lounges, bars , restaurants, elevator, piazza , buffet, pool deck etc are all going to have a high number of bodies.  You own cabin is one of the few places that won’t be full of people

[Kay S]

3 hours ago, paddingtonbear said:

I read they were banned in North Carolina? And other states may follow.  

 

nbcnews.com/news/us-news/mask-bans-are-growing-popularity-critics-call-trend-dog-whistle-quell-rcna160218

You should avoid Facebook. 🤣