Removing Gratuities Onboard at Guest Services

[MommaBear55]

2 hours ago, andrewwilliamnewman said:

For clarity and transparency, and the reason for the post in the first place...

 

I removed gratuities on day 3/4 of a 7 day cruise. I tipped the cabin steward on day 1, i tipped the dining room staff daily. I had the UBP, so gratuities were included with that. 

 

Service was good/the same each day before and after the removal of gratuities - however i was cautious that i had done something that is frowned upon by some.

 

The unknown factor I was referring to was myself wondering if on day 4 or 5 or 6 or 7, the stateroom attendant or the dining room staff are made aware that gratuities are removed, and what/if any difference this would make for them - for example, does this have a negative effect on them from management, do they get questioned why, or is it just something that happens hundreds of times per cruise and its completely normal.

 

We are a family of 4, a 7 day cruise, gratuities for us are $500-600 give or take. 2 Adults, 2 Under 5s. The same $18/20pppd being charged for both adults, a 4 year old, and a 9 month old baby makes no sense to me - which was the whole reason for the time I asked for the gratuities to be removed, and I went forward tipping as and when I felt deserved.

 

 

And hopefully that amount was $500 to $600, as your children are people too, and may actually be more work than adults. 

[ONECRUISER]

23 hours ago, Billy Baltic said:

On our recent Odyssey sailing the dining room staff allocated to us, performed like we had removed the gratuities. Maybe they mixed us up with someone else 🙂. 

Ha, yeah! Now did have a couple Cabin Attendants not clean my Cabin well. I'm SOLO always, Cabin is always PU everything put away but one time saw little piece Cookie on floor, 12 days later was still there. He'd never Vacuumed once. Also doing longer and B2B's and longer realized bedding wasnt getting changed all the time. Suspected it once, year later it happened for sure. Always put tiny mark in corner my sheet so if does happen again I'll know. Funny thing in 4 Decades I never had bad Waiters. Worse could say is I'm one First in MD and couple times they'd hold off serving each course and bring all tables out same time. This when others showed up 15min late. Post CV hasnt been issue though. Best,10+ yrs ago the Head Waiter had them bring me Chops Steaks down instead of what get from MD Kitchen. He did this on 3 different Fall Repo Cruises. Few Decades ago when most ate all meals in Main Dining if the Waiter or Asst received poor ratings they'd have to work WJ following Cruises and no Tips. Back then WJ was more a Semi-Formal for Dinner, table clothes, candles and could eat off MD Menu. Was kind of a Training and Retraining for Wait Staff. When a new Ship came out they'd take about 10% top performing Staff from older Ships to go on the New one

[ONECRUISER]

3 minutes ago, MommaBear55 said:

And hopefully that amount was $500 to $600, as your children are people too, and may actually be more work than adults. 

Been while since my Kids were 2-10yrs old but Wait Staff always worked well to take care of them, even better then did me! I was Single Father raising 3 Kids, 2 don't Cruise now but have great Memories when we'd Cruise. That said IF my Kids were not treated at least same as paying passengers, we received bad Poor Service service, defiantly would decreased some of their Tips. This was long before Auto Tips. Last 3 Cruises Staff was standing at Guest Services going down the line first nite, about 20% those in line were removing Auto Tips... My oldest Daughter was just turned 12 and almost 13 on 2 Cruises most the Staff thought she was my Wife and Mother to my 2 and 4yr olds, her Siblings. 

[Tatka]

4 hours ago, not-enough-cruising said:

When I go to a steakhouse in my  hometown; does the price of my meal fluctuate dependent on me tipping or not? No, it doesn’t, neither do cruise-fares. 
 

Your potluck analogy would only work (loosely) if you were comparing it to someone that does not tip at all. I have NEVER advocated a “no-tips” stance. 

 

I explained above how cruiselines autogratuities work.

It is not your hometown steakhouse.

 

By the way... Try to vacation on land in US with everything included as on cruises and let us know how much this will cost you.

Edited August 14 by Tatka

[not-enough-cruising]

4 minutes ago, Tatka said:

 

I explained above how cruise line autogratuities work.

It is not your home steakhouse.

 

By the way... try to vacation on land in US with everything included as on cruises and  let us know how much this will cost you.

I don’t need your explanation about how “auto gratuities” work. They aren’t gratuities, period; end of story. Royal makes them 100% optional for a reason. 
 

What a land based vacation costs is completely irrelevant to the discussion. The cost of a vacation means absolutely nothing to me 

[Tatka]

50 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

I don’t need your explanation about how “auto gratuities” work. They aren’t gratuities, period; end of story. Royal makes them 100% optional for a reason. 
 

What a land based vacation costs is completely irrelevant to the discussion. The cost of a vacation means absolutely nothing to me 

 

  They do not make them 100% optional. They allow to remove it in case of bad service. Which is used by people mostly to lower amount or not to pay at all.

 

   Yes. It is very relevant because whole business model is completely different and many people use it because it is more affordable and convenient.

 

  Your last sentence is very cute. Too bad your actions do not support  it. 😉

Edited August 14 by Tatka

[footzz]

On 8/13/2024 at 6:02 AM, andrewwilliamnewman said:

Hello all.

I know this is a touchy topic...

 

Well OP, have you drawn any conclusions from the s#!tstorm that quickly ensued after swatting the gratuities/tips hornets nest? I really can't blame you if you don't care to reply.

[andrewwilliamnewman]

15 minutes ago, footzz said:

Well OP, have you drawn any conclusions from the s#!tstorm that quickly ensued after swatting the gratuities/tips hornets nest? I really can't blame you if you don't care to reply.

I totally understand the whole, back-end staff having money taken away from them if they are removed/reduced, and the in-person team being handed cash, benefits only them...

 

However, if this money handed over is indeed pooled, then what difference does it make to remove and give cash, compared to leaving the auto's on. Maybe its receiving the gratification directly from the staff who deal with you daily basis is a nice thing to receive, and the expectation/hope that they will go above and beyond for you since they know for fact the cash can't be removed or taken away like the autos.

 

Its a tough one, its a tricky one, and its a highly debated topic, which causes anger/frustration/resentment towards some who choose to remove, and vice versa with those who remove and do things differently in a way they deem fit.

 

End take it that removing on last day is the best way to ensure any such list does not include your cabin, if indeed you are to go ahead with this...

 

And if we knew for a fact it is pooled, then tipping similar amounts in person will likely give you more thankfulness from those who attend you, and give you more personal happiness, yet make no difference at the end of the day.

 

I don't know is the best thing to do...personal choice at the end of the day I suppose!

[not-enough-cruising]

9 minutes ago, andrewwilliamnewman said:

I totally understand the whole, back-end staff having money taken away from them if they are removed/reduced, and the in-person team being handed cash, benefits only them...

 

However, if this money handed over is indeed pooled, then what difference does it make to remove and give cash, compared to leaving the auto's on. Maybe its receiving the gratification directly from the staff who deal with you daily basis is a nice thing to receive, and the expectation/hope that they will go above and beyond for you since they know for fact the cash can't be removed or taken away like the autos.

 

Its a tough one, its a tricky one, and its a highly debated topic, which causes anger/frustration/resentment towards some who choose to remove, and vice versa with those who remove and do things differently in a way they deem fit.

 

End take it that removing on last day is the best way to ensure any such list does not include your cabin, if indeed you are to go ahead with this...

 

And if we knew for a fact it is pooled, then tipping similar amounts in person will likely give you more thankfulness from those who attend you, and give you more personal happiness, yet make no difference at the end of the day.

 

I don't know is the best thing to do...personal choice at the end of the day I suppose!

Transparency about the process from the cruise line would certainly help a lot of people with this process and their decision on how to handle it.

 

One cruise line, I believe it was Princess, recently published a fairly transparent article about their process. The auto gratuities on that particular line were pooled, not on the ship that you were sailing, but across the entire fleet. The pooled tip were then dispersed amongst the staff, partly to satisfy salary requirements, partly as gratuity, and partly as bonus for performance as well as retention. The pooled gratuities went to many positions that you would never think about being a tipped position.

[footzz]

5 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

The pooled gratuities went to many positions that you would never think about being a tipped position.

So, in other words, as far as Princess Cruises are concerned, the collected monies aren't really gratuities.They are really a wage subsidy and a 'service fee' .

[Mapleleafforever]

We took a year off cruising and did an AI in the DR this past winter. I put a bill on my pillow every morning, tipped the bartenders daily and nightly, gave our dinner waiter a tip after dining nightly, and every morning I tipped the beach attendant for reserving us some loungers under a massive beach umbrella in a prime spot and brought the kiddos some sand and water toys. 

 

We spent no more than 50 dollars daily on tips for a family of 4 and didn't think twice about the people behind the scenes because that's the resort's responsibility. Received top notch friendly service from everyone, 

 

Oh, I also tipped the concierge at check-in to get a very nice upgraded room. 

 

We're on Freedom next year and I think I may just keep up with the daily tipping of those I deal with directly. 

[not-enough-cruising]

4 minutes ago, footzz said:

So, in other words, as far as Princess Cruises are concerned, the collected monies aren't really gratuities.They are really a wage subsidy and a 'service fee' .

Again, don’t quote me on Princess, I’m 99.8% sure that was the cruise line written about, but not 100% sure.

 

Yes, that’s exactly right, the gist of the article was just as you stated; a very small percentage of the gratuity money collected was used for actual gratuities.

Edited August 14 by not-enough-cruising

[CruiseDad-NYC]

On 8/13/2024 at 10:22 AM, gmerick said:

FWIW:  I remove auto gratuities.

 

I read court summaries of several lawsuits between the Norwegian Seafarers Union (the collective bargaining agent for RCI crewmembers).  These court summaries are easily found online by searching for "Norwegian Seafarers Union" in any search engine. 

The employer will pool all auto gratuities, beverage receipt tips, (both automatic and added to the receipt), all specialty dining receipt tips (again, both automatic and added to the receipt), as well as any other tips that are not given directly to a crew member as cash.  The pool is not specific to a sector (dining, stewards, hotel, etc).  The pool is across multiple ships.  Several of the summaries indicate the pool was not fleetwide, as the Orient ships were not pooled with the Caribbean ships.

The pool of all those tips is divided up by the number of pool shares allocated by employment contract to every non-management crew member.  Some members have a much smaller pool share than others, I could not find a breakdown of pool share by position.  The employment contract also specifies a minimum pool share allocation for that crew member.  If the calculated pool share does not meet that minimum, the employer (RCG) will make up the difference.

The court summaries for lawsuits filed by cabin stewards indicate their take home pay is somewhat on the order of 20% from contract base pay, 30% pool shares, and 50% cash tips.

 

As others have said, you do what is right for you.  The above is only part of the process I went through to find out what was right for me.

 

This is consistent with my research as well (i.e., the crew are paid a fixed salary that the cruise lines fund from the automatic gratuities.  If the automatic gratuities don't cover the fixed salaries, the cruise line makes up the difference.  If there is any left over, the crew is eligible for a bonus, which usually turns out to be very nominal (e.g., $50 per month), which is one of the reasons why the ask to be mentioned by name in the cruise surveys.  Your automatic gratuities aren't going directly to the crew members (e.g., cabin attendant and waiters) with whom you come in contact - they are going into a pool.  If you really want to tip crew members, give them cash and hand it to them directly).

 

Before learning this, I would pay the automatic gratuities and also pay cash tips (i.e., $10 per day to the cabin attendant and about $10 per day each to the waiter and assistant waiter).  On my 2 most recent cruises, I removed the automatic gratuities and gave my cabin attendant $10 per day and the waiter and assistant waiter each $10 per day in envelopes with their names written on them.  I asked each of them if they are permitted to keep the money or turn it in, and all of them said they get to keep it.  The waiter and assistant waiter said they pool amounts between them.

 

I had wondered if I would have been questioned when I went to guest relations to have them removed, and I was not at all.  They were perfectly courteous and removed them with no problem.  Incidentally, on the last day, there was a note on the final paperwork place in our cabin that included a slip with the cruise line's recommended gratuities and some envelopes were provided. So, at least the cabin attendant knew at the end (and she also knew that I paid her more than the recommended amount).

 

Not saying anybody's right or wrong here and not looking to engage.  People should do what their comfortable with. Just giving my experience.

Edited August 14 by CruiseDad-NYC

[not-enough-cruising]

1 minute ago, Mapleleafforever said:

We took a year off cruising and did an AI in the DR this past winter. I put a bill on my pillow every morning, tipped the bartenders daily and nightly, gave our dinner waiter a tip after dining nightly, and every morning I tipped the beach attendant for reserving us some loungers under a massive beach umbrella in a prime spot and brought the kiddos some sand and water toys. 

 

We spent no more than 50 dollars daily on tips for a family of 4 and didn't think twice about the people behind the scenes because that's the resort's responsibility. Received top notch friendly service from everyone, 

 

Oh, I also tipped the concierge at check-in to get a very nice upgraded room. 

 

We're on Freedom next year and I think I may just keep up with the daily tipping of those I deal with directly. 

Thanks for sharing your land-based experience.

 

Good for you, I can assure you once you modify your tipping protocol for one cruise you will never look back

[shandryl]

On 8/13/2024 at 5:02 AM, andrewwilliamnewman said:

know this is a touchy topic, so I thought I would ask to gauge opinions, and find information from those that have done this...

would you like some popcorn? might be awhile😄

[Mapleleafforever]

10 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

Thanks for sharing your land-based experience.

 

Good for you, I can assure you once you modify your tipping protocol for one cruise you will never look back

Well to be completely honest we've done it once before and wouldn't hesitate to do it again. We were on Allure way back at the end of Feb 2020 (right before the shutdown) and we had my then 2.5 year old and 7 month old daughters with us. We knew we'd be dining in the WJ for every meal and wanted to make sure that we took care of the staff there because we figured that our daughters would make a mess while eating, we were right. The staff there also brought 2 high chairs to us for every meal without even being asked. The WJ staff we came in contact with took great care of us and we reciprocated with generous tips after every single meal which they greatly appreciated. No point in tipping the MDR staff as we didn't step foot in there. We did end up having dinner in Jamie's Italian twice which was excellent and they loved having the kids there and went out of their way to offer to make off menu dishes they knew the kids would devour. 

 

Towards the end of the week the kids got sick (Covid?)  and we needed new sheets and pillows and our stateroom attendant was great. We tipped him that week more than we've ever tipped a stateroom attendant in all our cruises (we're diamond). 

 

Second last day I went to guest services to remove the auto grats and just said we were tipping in cash as we go and it was done, no guilt trips given and no guilt was felt. 

 

Fast forward to last May and we were in a GS on Oasis and left the grats as is and watched them add up on the account daily, it didn't feel right though. 

 

On the last day of that cruise we noticed that guest services had a massive line up starting in the morning and didn't really let up all day into the night. We got to thinking removing auto grats happens more than we thought and we decided we wouldn't hesitate to do it again as we value the personal interaction of tipping as an appreciation for good service. 

[Charles4515]

44 minutes ago, not-enough-cruising said:

 

Good for you, I can assure you once you modify your tipping protocol for one cruise you will never look back

I am never going to go back to direct individual tipping. We did that for years. Having the gratuity auto pay relieves all the tipping stress and I definitely don’t want carry around cash to dispense. The gratuities all go on my card. Standing in line to remove gratuities also not going to do that. 
 

I can only see removing the gratuities working for people who don’t intend to tip. I don’t trust that people who remove tips have noble intentions and will tip in cash. 

Edited August 14 by Charles4515

[shandryl]

3 minutes ago, Mapleleafforever said:

 On the last day of that cruise we noticed that guest services had a massive line up starting in the morning and didn't really let up all day into the night. We got to thinking removing auto grats happens more than we thought and we decided we wouldn't hesitate to do it again as we value the personal interaction of tipping as an appreciation for good service. 

True Story! Very entertaining to watch on the sidelines! We would try and get front row seats so we could hear the complaints & arguments re: extra charges/poor service and of course gratuities.  😄😄

[Husky1987]

16 minutes ago, shandryl said:

would you like some popcorn? might be awhile😄

 

I always find it quite hilarious when tipping threads start out with "I don't mean to stir up a hornet's nest, but..."

[The Scurvy Pirate]

2 minutes ago, Husky1987 said:

 

I always find it quite hilarious when tipping threads start out with "I don't mean to stir up a hornet's nest, but..."

The other is "I am not one to gossip, but did you hear...."

[cruisegirl1]

3 hours ago, MommaBear55 said:

And hopefully that amount was $500 to $600, as your children are people too, and may actually be more work than adults. 

Agree.  Has anyone taken a look at the mess a young child leaves after a meal? 

 

M

[not-enough-cruising]

47 minutes ago, Charles4515 said:

I am never going to go back to direct individual tipping. We did that for years. Having the gratuity auto pay relieves all the tipping stress and I definitely don’t want carry around cash to dispense. The gratuities all go on my card. Standing in line to remove gratuities also not going to do that. 
 

I can only see removing the gratuities working for people who don’t intend to tip. I don’t trust that people who remove tips have noble intentions and will tip in cash. 

I experience no stress from direct tipping 

 

I have never waited in line at GS, just make a phone call from my room, usually late at night when I know they aren’t busy 

 

Fortunately, your lack of trust in me has little bearing on what I do. 

 

[cruisegirl1]

For those who remove auto tips. do you generally  have the same money allocated for tips? 

 

So, for a family of 4, who removes $18/pp/day ($504) are you actually tipping those who serve you for dining and cabin service  directly  at $72 each day.  This doesn't include  tips for bar dinks,  specialty dining, spa, etc  which are not included in the $18/pp/day  auto tips

 

Or, do you find you save money by removing auto tips and generally don't tip direct  staff who serve you  a total of $72/day. 

 

What do you do about the server who gives you ice cream at the pool, pizza at Sorento's, brings you an iced tea in the buffet.   Do you provide tips for those individuals as well?   

 

 

Thanks M

[yogimax]

3 minutes ago, cruisegirl1 said:

So, for a family of 4, who removes $18/pp/day ($504) are you actually tipping those who serve you for dining and cabin service  directly  at $72 each day. 

An excellent question!

 

I note that those who are touting the removal of tips always respond with a generalization such as "I tip my room attendant and waiter."

 

They never indicate how much they tip.  My guess is that most (not all) tip well below the recommended amount.

[kirtihk]

On 8/13/2024 at 11:25 AM, Vibe said:

Even though most employees (house keepers and food servers etc) don’t retaliate when they are mistreated by condescending behavior or reduced compensation; an employee that has reached their breaking point will unfortunately seek revenge.  
We are so fortunate to have the time and money to cruise, the crew accepted their position with the cruise lines with the current tipping compensation method in place. Even though I don’t agree with it, I leave the automatic tipping in place so that I contribute to the agreed upon method. I give extra cash to those that go over and above.

The idea was cruise lines replaced cash gratuities/tipping with auto ones (they just called it differently (the service charge or whatever) at that point).