Suites/Retreat Are Getting Pricey

[crusinthrough]

8 minutes ago, billc23 said:

Then do not try a river cruise or a Galapagos sailing!

I already know neither are for me. 

[billc23]

4 hours ago, Cruise a holic said:

I have family members that sail frequently and lately have been sailing on the MSC in the Yacht club and love it- might give it a try.  Service supposed to be excellent and the price lower then our go to lines Celebrity and Royal- we sail only in suites.

I would also like to point out that the MSC YC has inside cabins as part of the YC. When sailing with a multigenerational family, I booked interior cabins for the grandkids and they had access to all the special YC amenities.

[Cruise a holic]

4 minutes ago, crusinthrough said:

I barely noticed the tattoo parlor.  It just looks like another ship shop, which I avoid on all cruise lines.  No children is one of the things you didn’t think you needed until you don’t see them… LOL

They were giving some weird infusions on our last Royal cruise.

[LXA350]

For what you get on the Retreat the prices are not justified. As some of you said, you can cruise on a real luxury cruise line and get better for the same or less.

 

It starts with the little details in the Suite, the products in the bathroom are not anymore from a high end company such as LeLabo, Hermes or Bvlgari. For the slippers, at least on a recent cruise these were also cheap and not like before from Frette for instance. At least in the Royal Suite and above a Dyson Hair dryer would be a stanard amenity to excpect.

 

Luminae, is in my view a complete failiure, except for the design especially on the E ships which is beautiful the food concept is terrible. They try to make it high end but then to meet the North American taste, a concept that just doesn't work. Also, Luminae should offer much more freshly sourced high end products starting from the selection of fruits and vegetables. I understand that especially on certain itinararies it is logistically not possilbe to load provisions for the whole ship on ports of call, but for the Retreat / Luminae which basically is a Luxury Cruisliner within a large ship the concept should be focused on freshness and exclusivity + offer a variety that meets the North American, European and Asian travellers just like in every Exclusive Hotel or Luxury cruise Ship. Therefore I would excpect to be served freshly caught fish, the freshest local vegetables and fruits to be sourced at each port of call and not the same medium to poor quality product available on the whole ship. One more example is the Smoked Salmon at breakfast, a joke of what for poor quality it is.

[paulh84]

Celebrity has almost 8 years of pricing data on E class Retreat alone. Then to add to that, they have thousands of people literally handing them their price ceiling through MoveUp bids. They know exactly what people would be willing to pay. You are voluntarily giving them that number. It really puts them in a position to charge exactly what keeps suites full. That price may be comparable to another "luxury" line. But, that's like saying you can buy a Toyota for the price of a BMW so the BMW is obviously the best option while taking nothing else into consideration. 

[20165]

24 minutes ago, billc23 said:

If you desire a Celebrity Retreat like experience I would recommend MSC Yacht Club. You will be a VIP - escorted onto the ship, escorted to venues on the ship to the front of the line, special elevator access by using your key card/wrist band, etc. - a hierarchy you may enjoy OR not. The class system created on various cruise lines embarrasses some and others expect and enjoy the extra special treatment if paying more for the cabin. 

 

Silversea and Regent tends to treat passengers mostly the same when you leave your cabin. No special pool deck, no special dining room... and the overall experience is great. 

 

I have not sailed on the luxury lines in the Caribbean yet - I do have 3 weeks booked on Silversea late January 2025 - so at this time I can only recommend MSC Seaside class over the Retreat from my experience. 

Unfortunately, we made the mistake of sailing MSC non yacht club a couple of years ago and every time i even mention it as an option, my wife has PTSD...  One of the worst if not the worst cruise we've been on and we have been on a lot.

We have been on NCL in the Haven and that sounds like a similar experience, but it has also gotten very pricy, actually in line with the higher-end lines.

[billc23]

12 minutes ago, 20165 said:

Unfortunately, we made the mistake of sailing MSC non yacht club a couple of years ago and every time i even mention it as an option, my wife has PTSD...  One of the worst if not the worst cruise we've been on and we have been on a lot.

We have been on NCL in the Haven and that sounds like a similar experience, but it has also gotten very pricy, actually in line with the higher-end lines.

That is unfortunate. The Yacht Club is a great product. As Mark Twain supposedly wrote:

 

"We should be careful to get out of an experience only the wisdom that is in it—and stop there; lest we be like the cat that sits down on a hot stove-lid. She will never sit down on a hot stove-lid again—and that is well; but also she will never sit down on a cold one anymore."

 

 

Edited September 15 by billc23

[gfkcruiser]

On 9/9/2024 at 2:02 PM, Syd58 said:

I saw Feb. prices for an s1 in Retreat on Beyond in February for 10 days in Caribbean priced at $20k+.(for 2j  Ouch. Perhaps prices were lower to start with. Or maybe I need new glasses..

If you are looking at the cost of February 2025 sailings now, yes they are high as lower end sells out fast for that time of year.  Even IV and others are high if ship is not sold out.   We booked Ascent for February 2026 in February 2024 while onboard.  Decided to go with low end suite after sailing in Beyond suite this past February.   Had originally booked SV as no IV for me in the Caribbean again.  Would be hard pressed to pay the same suite price on an S class.  Really liked the retreat area with the pool.  

[chemmo]

When we first started cruising higher suites on Celebrity the discussions on CC were how poor the offering was compared to other lines including RC. No suite lounge, no suite restaurant, no drinks packages, no mini bar set up. If I remember correctly one free speciality dining meal. You were paying a substantial amount for a bigger room and two bottles of spirits…

 

Now the offering is more inclusive but often hard to navigate (especially for new cruisers) as Edge class have everything (lounge, deck, restaurant) whereas other ships have a mix and match of availability….However, many cruise E and have issues…

 

Quite simply I think you need to start any holiday search with what is important to you…There are benefits of smaller cruise lines and advantages with each of the different ‘ship in a ship’ variations.

 

We started browsing for our next cruise knowing we wanted to revisit certain places in the Caribbean. We then knew it had to be 8+ days. Despite the hurricane season September/October suited us…Dining was really important as was a decent room for three adults. With a thirty year age range entertainment had to be varied too. A suite deck would have been nice but not vital as the rooms we were considering had a good balcony. A good variety of restaurants was important…

 

We ended up booking the Reflection. We have a room we like at a price we are comfortable with. We may not be in a ship as chic as some of the smaller options or as new as the E class but we have a ship where the focus is on what we want. 
 

We found out long ago when travelling we preferred hotels with fridge and microwave to one with multiple *****. Similarly now we are finding out it isn’t the name of the cruise ship or cruise line that is important, it is how it fits in to what we want at this moment in time. May not have suited us yesterday, may not suit us tomorrow but is our best option now…

[Syd58]

1 hour ago, billc23 said:

If you desire a Celebrity Retreat like experience I would recommend MSC Yacht Club. You will be a VIP - escorted onto the ship, escorted to venues on the ship to the front of the line, special elevator access by using your key card/wrist band, etc. - a hierarchy you may enjoy OR not. The class system created on various cruise lines embarrasses some and others expect and enjoy the extra special treatment if paying more for the cabin. 

 

Silversea and Regent tends to treat passengers mostly the same when you leave your cabin. No special pool deck, no special dining room... and the overall experience is great. 

 

I have not sailed on the luxury lines in the Caribbean yet - I do have 3 weeks booked on Silversea late January 2025 - so at this time I can only recommend MSC Seaside class over the Retreat from my experience. 

Of all our Retreat cruises, we were escorted up to the pre-departure lounge only once using a private elevator for Retreat guests; on only one other, we were escorted off the ship to a common point with a lengthy line of all departing guests. There doesn’t appear to be much consistency. I think their pricing has got out of whack with the services received, especially given that you can get essentially a complete Retreat experience on luxury lines like Silversea and Seabourn for less money.

Edited September 15 by Syd58

[Syd58]

1 hour ago, paulh84 said:

Celebrity has almost 8 years of pricing data on E class Retreat alone. Then to add to that, they have thousands of people literally handing them their price ceiling through MoveUp bids. They know exactly what people would be willing to pay. You are voluntarily giving them that number. It really puts them in a position to charge exactly what keeps suites full. That price may be comparable to another "luxury" line. But, that's like saying you can buy a Toyota for the price of a BMW so the BMW is obviously the best option while taking nothing else into consideration. 

The problem with this analysis is you’re assuming the process is stagnant. It is not.  As more and more Retreat customers find they possibly might have a better experience on luxury lines like Silversea or Seabourn for less money, they may begin to jump ship. It is at this point that Celebrity would need to make a decision regarding pricing or risk losing these customers forever. With this said, it should be remembered that both Celebrity and Silversea are both owned by the same parent company, so in essence, they would not be losing customers to another company if they moved to Silversea. RCL would likely want to take a close look at its product differentiation and related strategies though. My guess is they will adjust Silversea prices upward - we are already beginning to see this happen. For anyone considering Silversea, I would advise them to take a look and book now as RCL’s current pricing strategy for Silversea may not last long, We have several Silversea cruises booked over the next couple of years at great prices. Prices have increased since we booked and will likely continue to be adjusted upward.

Edited September 15 by Syd58

[20165]

1 hour ago, Syd58 said:

The problem with this analysis is you’re assuming the process is stagnant. It is not.  As more and more Retreat customers find they possibly might have a better experience on luxury lines like Silversea or Seabourn for less money, they may begin to jump ship. It is at this point that Celebrity would need to make a decision regarding pricing or risk losing these customers forever. With this said, it should be remembered that both Celebrity and Silversea are both owned by the same parent company, so in essence, they would not be losing customers to another company if they moved to Silversea. RCL would likely want to take a close look at its product differentiation and related strategies though. My guess is they will adjust Silversea prices upward - we are already beginning to see this happen. For anyone considering Silversea, I would advise them to take a look and book now as RCL’s current pricing strategy for Silversea may not last long, We have several Silversea cruises booked over the next couple of years at great prices. Prices have increased since we booked and will likely continue to be adjusted upward.

Well said and i think our issue is/was, we didnt even think to check the other higher end lines because they were always out of reach for us.  When we start cruising 30+ years ago, we were on a budget which equaled the mainstream lines, then we had kids which also equaled the mainstream lines.  Now that we are traveling with the just two of us for the most part and booking mainly suites, we need to also include the higher end lines in our searches.  

[paulh84]

1 hour ago, Syd58 said:

The problem with this analysis is you’re assuming the process is stagnant. It is not.  As more and more Retreat customers find they possibly might have a better experience on luxury lines like Silversea or Seabourn for less money, they may begin to jump ship. It is at this point that Celebrity would need to make a decision regarding pricing or risk losing these customers forever. With this said, it should be remembered that both Celebrity and Silversea are both owned by the same parent company, so in essence, they would not be losing customers to another company if they moved to Silversea. RCL would likely want to take a close look at its product differentiation and related strategies though. My guess is they will adjust Silversea prices upward - we are already beginning to see this happen. For anyone considering Silversea, I would advise them to take a look and book now as RCL’s current pricing strategy for Silversea may not last long, We have several Silversea cruises booked over the next couple of years at great prices. Prices have increased since we booked and will likely continue to be adjusted upward.

 

The number of cruisers and the amount of cruisers capacity have grown by 37-40% in the past decade. Losing some old customers to new customers isn't a bad thing. They won't tell you they are glad to see you go, but if you get replaced by a higher yield customer they aren't going to chase after you. You're helping them achieve their goals by going elsewhere, especially if you keep it in-house.

[NMTraveller]

On 9/9/2024 at 11:33 AM, sanger727 said:

A celebrity sailing will be a totally different experience than a smaller ship.  If you want the VIP treatment and are willing to accept the downsides of a smaller ship - fewer dining options, less entertainment - then that is probably the way to go.  If you want the VIP treatment and the amenities that come with a larger ship are important to you, then you would have to pay for the Celebrity suite. 

I feel that I get more of the VIP treatment on a smaller ship.  You know all of the staff by the end of the cruise.  More and better attention.  It is easier to cater to less than a thousand than to thousands of cruisers.  The food is much better on the smaller ships.  The amenities of C grade Celebrity entertainment I can do without.

[canderson]

5 minutes ago, NMTraveller said:

I feel that I get more of the VIP treatment on a smaller ship. 

If smaller includes a luxury brand, you should be getting the VIP treatment -- they have FAR better crew:pax ratios than any of the mainstream lines.  Last I checked, for every 2 pax (a cabin) on Silversea, there were about 1.4 crew members working to make the cruise enjoyable.  Granted, Celebrity is one of the best of the mainstream lines in this regard, but at nowhere near that ratio.

 

[mac_tlc]

If price is the determining factor, at least for the cruises I have looked at, you need to split the Retreat in two. Sky Suite/Aqua Sky Suite/Magic Carpet Sky Suite vs Celebrity Suite and above.

 

We have only done the first group. The second is a tad too much $$ for us, although I am tempted! I can see if you are an “RS and above” cruiser that the other lines are very tempting and may offer a better value—- not just “price” but “value”. 
 

When I look at Silversea, which we will do one day, I can often find an X Suite in the first group that is competitive, and that is adjusting for grats. If you compare the second group to anything of SS’s first tier of verandas , X will probably not fare as well. 
 

The real trick is to put a value on inclusions. What are shore excursions worth to you? Entertainment? A bustling casino? Trivia/game shows/other activities? Number of passengers? Atmosphere on the rest of ship? Size of ship? 
 

I guess my point is that I have read a hundred posts in the past 18 months that say “X is much more $$ than SS (or O or RSSC or SB or V). Without much more context, and a discussion of what the cruiser values, that statement is of little value to me and it’s not always true. 

I’ll keep hunting and include some of the above lines. Have O and HAL in 2025 — first time on each, and have been scouring SS’s offerings to find something that fits our current cruise schedule. No luck yet. Hopefully their 2026/2027 sailings come out somewhere around when X’s do.

 

Whenever I think X is extravagant, I look up the Icon of the Seas and I feel much better😜😜. 
 

mac_tlc
 

 

[Cap_D]

Does anyone actually enjoy the Luminae menus and food quality?  Also, it's the same regardless of which room type booked.  We have found fresher food at the OVC, and the having to ask about the so called classics menu or for kind of fresh vegetables (often skimped on even when one asks) makes the experience taxing.  To be sure there are some good dishes and examples of execution, convenience, space compared to other dining rooms, and of waiters that "sell" the experience, but it definitely should be improved on.  

Edited September 15 by Cap_D

[Syd58]

1 hour ago, paulh84 said:

 

The number of cruisers and the amount of cruisers capacity have grown by 37-40% in the past decade. Losing some old customers to new customers isn't a bad thing. They won't tell you they are glad to see you go, but if you get replaced by a higher yield customer they aren't going to chase after you. You're helping them achieve their goals by going elsewhere, especially if you keep it in-house.

No for-profit business desires to lose customers.

[Syd58]

34 minutes ago, mac_tlc said:

If price is the determining factor, at least for the cruises I have looked at, you need to split the Retreat in two. Sky Suite/Aqua Sky Suite/Magic Carpet Sky Suite vs Celebrity Suite and above.

 

We have only done the first group. The second is a tad too much $$ for us, although I am tempted! I can see if you are an “RS and above” cruiser that the other lines are very tempting and may offer a better value—- not just “price” but “value”. 
 

When I look at Silversea, which we will do one day, I can often find an X Suite in the first group that is competitive, and that is adjusting for grats. If you compare the second group to anything of SS’s first tier of verandas , X will probably not fare as well. 
 

The real trick is to put a value on inclusions. What are shore excursions worth to you? Entertainment? A bustling casino? Trivia/game shows/other activities? Number of passengers? Atmosphere on the rest of ship? Size of ship? 
 

I guess my point is that I have read a hundred posts in the past 18 months that say “X is much more $$ than SS (or O or RSSC or SB or V). Without much more context, and a discussion of what the cruiser values, that statement is of little value to me and it’s not always true. 

I’ll keep hunting and include some of the above lines. Have O and HAL in 2025 — first time on each, and have been scouring SS’s offerings to find something that fits our current cruise schedule. No luck yet. Hopefully their 2026/2027 sailings come out somewhere around when X’s do.

 

Whenever I think X is extravagant, I look up the Icon of the Seas and I feel much better😜😜. 
 

mac_tlc
 

 

Celebrity Sky Suite prices, in many instances, have risen to a level that makes Silversea very attractive. Remember SS is all-inclusive.

[Syd58]

12 minutes ago, Cap_D said:

Does anyone actually enjoy the Luminae menus and food quality?  Also, it's the same regardless of which room type booked.  We have found fresher food at the OVC, and the having to ask about the so called classics menu or for kind of fresh vegetables (often skimped on even when one asks) makes the experience taxing.  To be sure there are some good dishes and examples of execution, convenience, space compared to other dining rooms, and of waiters that "sell" the experience, but it definitely should be improved on.  

We do not care for OVC at all.  Granted, there’s a lot of food, but generally, not the same level of quality of Luminae, IMO. 

[mac_tlc]

18 minutes ago, Syd58 said:

Celebrity Sky Suite prices, in many instances, have risen to a level that makes Silversea very attractive. Remember SS is all-inclusive.

Indeed on some itineraries they certainly have.
 

 The question is, do the SS inclusions have value? To us, some do, others don’t. 
 

mac_tlc

Edited September 15 by mac_tlc

[Syd58]

10 minutes ago, mac_tlc said:

Indeed on some itineraries they certainly have.
 

 The question is, do the SS inclusions have value? To us, some do, others don’t. 
 

mac_tlc

Certainly, gratis included gratuities have value, and for those that desire excursions, they also have value. 

Edited September 15 by Syd58

[paulh84]

49 minutes ago, Syd58 said:

No for-profit business desires to lose customers.

 

They don't want a net loss. One of their major goals is to substantially increase onboard spend. Old stalwarts don't do that. Those people can, and are, being replaced by higher yielding cruisers. 

[Syd58]

1 hour ago, paulh84 said:

 

Edited September 15 by Syd58

[Syd58]

2 hours ago, paulh84 said:

 

They don't want a net loss. One of their major goals is to substantially increase onboard spend. Old stalwarts don't do that. Those people can, and are, being replaced by higher yielding cruisers. 

Even if your assumption that ‘old stalwarts spend less than newer higher yielding cruisers’ holds true, I doubt that this increase in revenue would be more than the loss in revenue from prior guests departing for luxury cruise lines. Of course, both of our assertions are  not substantiated by empirical data at this point.

Edited September 15 by Syd58