Crown & Anchor Program Revisions - join the merged discussions here

[Lady Chew]

If you asked the public if its a good economical move right now to alienate the loyal customers who have spent thousands with your company and who will keep coming back, in exchange for a few hundred dollars in free drinks/food/concierge perks/benefits, what do you think the majority of the consensus would be?

 

Regardless of what people think of this as a business decision, I doubt there would be a lot of sympathy for people complaining about the loss of unlimited free booze and the companionship of an elite group of cruisers in a private lounge on a modern cruise ship during a nice, relalxing vacation on the sea!!

[sealord]

Just wondering, how do the independent cruise specialists/travel agents feel about the changes on the RCCL ships? Thought that would be an interesting perspective.

 

There was one that posted here who said they would be something like "reluctant" to sell RCI in the future.

[ws1965]

Regardless of what people think of this as a business decision, I doubt there would be a lot of sympathy for people complaining about the loss of unlimited free booze and the companionship of an elite group of cruisers in a private lounge on a modern cruise ship during a nice, relalxing vacation on the sea!!

 

 

LadyChew, If your going to quote me, make sure you have the WHOLE quote. I said that in response to CruizinSuz's.

[sealord]

If "sheep" is the title for the folks who have accepted the change then an appropriate name for those that have not would be "whining sheep" or maybe "kool-aid drinking sheep" because as MANY of you have posted you have been "fooled" or "lied to" or several other adjectives posted here into believing that you should only sail with RC so as to attain this holier than thou title of Diamond which now is basicly worthless....

 

So now lets here it....all together now ...baaaaaa whine, whine...baaaaaaaa :p

 

Well, "Celebrity Champion" ... we have all gotten to hear your views. Got it. You don't feel that people who have been 'cheated' should feel cheated. I would suggest that it is 'someone' else who is drinking the Kool-Aid, not those of us who were 'fooled' by dishonest advertising from a company that clearly lacks any corporate integrity. I would suggest that Kool-Aid drinker definition ... or prize ... should go to those who think RCCL and RCI is just "wonderful" regardless of whatever malfeasance they may have foisted upon their best customers. And those 'plusers' and 'suiters' who are going to enjoy the fruits of this malfeasance and think it is just wonderful ... well there are people who will find a lost wallet, keep the money, and throw the wallet in the trash. So be it.

[cruzendude]

There was one that posted here who said they would be something like "reluctant" to sell RCI in the future.

 

I would find that to be most likely a "less than totally honest" reply if a TA said that...more likely someone still "butt hurt" over losing their benifits...

 

Why would a TA be reluctant to sell a cruise line who's perks now are pretty much just like every other cruise lnes? And even less likely why would a salesperson not sell a customer a cruise that the customer desired.... I can't see either of those 2 scenerios happening...

[Lady Chew]

LadyChew, If your going to quote me, make sure you have the WHOLE quote. I said that in response to CruizinSuz's.

 

excuse me ..... ? I was responding to your post, giving my opinion regarding the question you posed!!

[bigboffs]

We have over 40 cruise credits on RCCL and have been loyal to Royal for years, totally ignoring other cruise lines. With the advent of RCCL cost reduction policies, while not cancelling already booked cruises, we have expanded our horizon.

 

Recently, we have sailed on three Princess cruises and are at their "Platinum" level (reached after 5 cruises). Both RCCL and Princess offer a quality cruise, with pluses and minuses for each.

 

For traveling with a family of children up to teens, the newer RCCL ships of the Voyager class and above, are easily a better choice. For those without such families, the Radiance class of RCCL and the newer Princess ships have a lot in common.

 

Interaries and food are personal choices not really amenable to objective criteria.

 

As to cost, and going for the best cabin for money spent, Princess is the better deal. As to benefits, Princess does not have a concierge lounge; however, with the huge dollar savings over RCCL, a lot of drinks of all types can be bought. Not being much on alcohol, we enjoy cappachino and Princess allows the purhase of a coffe card for $25 for 15 specialty coffes and unlimited coffee/tea/hot chocolate at various bars around the ship. Princess also has onboard self use laundry facilities with washers, dryers [charge for each] and no charge irons with ironing boards on almost every cabin deck and a 24 hour buffet. As platinum, each passenger gets 250 FREE internet use minutes.

 

All of the combinabilities of benefits that RCCL has dropped are still available on Princess.

[hellosailer]

Well, "Celebrity Champion" ... we have all gotten to hear your views. Got it. You don't feel that people who have been 'cheated' should feel cheated. I would suggest that it is 'someone' else who is drinking the Kool-Aid, not those of us who were 'fooled' by dishonest advertising from a company that clearly lacks any corporate integrity. I would suggest that Kool-Aid drinker definition ... or prize ... should go to those who think RCCL and RCI is just "wonderful" regardless of whatever malfeasance they may have foisted upon their best customers. And those 'plusers' and 'suiters' who are going to enjoy the fruits of this malfeasance and think it is just wonderful ... well there are people who will find a lost wallet, keep the money, and throw the wallet in the trash. So be it.

 

Oh come off it ...........talk about exaggeration.:eek: No-one has been cheated!! It has often been discussed that the contract says that the loyalty benefits can change at any time. I have never seen it written anywhere that we would get free drinks for life!!! And regular posters on CC have seen many posts about the CL overcrowding and how we expected that at some point, RCCL would have to take action.

 

The airlines are all 'cheating' when they change their loyalty programmes? I don't think so!!! Nothing is forever!!! Adults with intellect understand this perfectly well - the Company has financial problems and the rats seem to be jumping ship, having enjoyed all the benefits.

 

See, I can be rude too!!!:D It was very nice to do it - fed up with feeding y'all tea and sympathy and receiving insults in return!! Especially enjoyed the nautical reference.

 

As I said previously, by all means change lines - I hope you will enjoy free drinks and a CL Lounge without booking a suite on the other lines of your choice.

 

And to all Diamond cruisers who are reasonably sane and can post without resorting to insults - I respect your feelings on the subject and had it been my decision, I would have done things rather differently. But the situation in the CL and the free drinks, had got out of hand. RCCL made their decision - we shall have to wait and see if they change their minds.

[sealord]

I would think that it might be hard for folks to answer that question until they see how they enjoy their experience with another cruise line.

 

You may be correct. But they have made a number of 'changes', and I don't see any that "I" would call 'enhancements. It looks like an across the board cut that reduces the 'enhancements' in a number of areas. So the sum total of the changes will probably still have a negative effect on (my) bookings unless some of the 'enhancements' are reversed also. The Concierge Lounge is relatively well 'hidden' and is not an 'in your face' item to those who cannot go there. But, when they start 'roping' off areas where the 'steerage' class are prohibited, then they will start to offend people who will start to feel 'second' class ... not special.

 

But people make plans when they make a booking ... hotels, air transportation, pet boarding arrangements, vacation scheduling. These things can be difficult to change, so it would seem to me that the number of 'cancellations' will be relatively small as compared to the future 'bookings' that will simply not happen. I have one firm booking, and one on-board 'open' booking that I do not intend to change or cancel, but my next cruise will undoubtedly be on someone else. And future bookings on RCCL will simply be a matter of 'shopping' ... not 'loyalty'. If the CL were to magically reappear for the "Diamond" level, that of course would be a part of the 'shopping'.

[sealord]

See, I can be rude too!!!:D It was very nice to do it - fed up with feeding y'all tea and sympathy and receiving insults in return!! quote]

 

Well, I was responding to cruzendude, but it is nice to see that one of the 'other' folks I was thinking about correctly identified the recipient list. To characterise your 'postings' as 'tea and sypathy', while saying you were pleased with the change, would be a tad disengenuous. Actually, I was responding to all of those who seem to be rejoicing at someone else's loss. It is rather 'insulting'. So if for whatever reason you 'identify' with 'my' 'insulted' group ... so be it. No one should be insulted by my remarks if the 'shoes don't fit'.;)

[FrancescaH]

Oh come off it ...........talk about exaggeration.:eek: No-one has been cheated!! It has often been discussed that the contract says that the loyalty benefits can change at any time. I have never seen it written anywhere that we would get free drinks for life!!! And regular posters on CC have seen many posts about the CL overcrowding and how we expected that at some point, RCCL would have to take action.

 

 

How about those of us in wheelchairs who have patiently worked their way to diamond since we can't sail in suites as an accessible suite doesn't exist till the Oasis is on line? The closest we can get is a JS which is what my family of 3 book. Are we cheated in that we will never be able to sail a Radiance class and use the CL until we're Plus? When we first decided to cruise I read other's views and RCCL seems to be one of the best in terms of accessibility throughout the ships (especially the newer ones) and I don't want to risk trying a line that isn't equally accessible. I have been told via email after I complained on this very issue that if in an accessible JS we can request CL access but it's never been presented to me as an option when I book. Shouldn't we (those who need accessibles) have equal chance to use the CL without the extra work of making it happen?

 

A couple of us in this situation have commented but very few seem to care if it's just a couple of disabled folks who can't access the Lounge.

[swmichigan cruiser]

I have to be honest I haven't read all the posts on this subject. A little background on me. My wife and I are both Diamond with 6 cruises in the future booked with RCCL. Am I pleased with the changes they are making? Nope. Am I going to cancel those 6 cruises? Probabily not. After those 6 cruises will I look at other cruiselines? Certainly.We have also cruised on HAL,NCL, Carnival and Princess but not for a long time so not sure about about comparisons. But I never had a bad cruise on any of them. I'm not sure RCCL really wants as much repeat business as they have been getting. For us we have been on so many cruises we never buy there overpriced pictures, the RCCL excursions, spa treatments etc etc. If they sell me a discounted cabin because I'm a frequent cruiser wouldn't they make more profit selling the same cabin to a new cruiser at a higher price and also having the new cruiser buy all the extras. Also new cruisers wouldn't be aware of the changes that they have made. If that is the case it might be a shortsighted decision. A lot of frequent cruisers get asked by there friends, family and co-workers who they cruise with. With the changes they are making the responses might be different then what they were in the past. Just my opinions.

[jensenbeach]

I can't understand why some, who have little or no feeling regarding the loss of the Diamond CL feel the need to "bully" and insult clients who felt they were let down. What is the "payback?

There are some who feel the Corporation had offered something of value if they were loyal and then yanked it off the table after some actually went out of their way to qualify for that value.

If someone doesn't care either way then they have not lost anything and therefore it would be interesting to know the motive for attacking those who felt let down by RCL? Or even participating in the thread? We are ones who did go out of our way to qualify for Diamond and felt let down. The only effect it will have on us is that where previously we considered the plus of being Diamond, that no longer has any weight and brings a whole host of other cruise ships options we did not consider in the past.

[beachbuzzard]

OK, well it is getting very close to us booking a all-inclusive in place of the Bermuda cruise in August. We would never have looked prior to this change. And the honest truth is that we looked at other cruises and were going to stay with RCCL if we stayed with a cruise (it was the best time fit). But if there had been another line with a similar length, we would have been interested in that too.

 

Yes, we only have three cabins booked (one balcony and two interiors), but we are only a small part of the puzzle. How many more like us are there? How many other vacations that you could have written down RCCL in stone that we now decide to try something else will there be?

 

IF RCCL sells out the August 15 cruise to Bermuda, then I guess they won't miss us. But if they don't, then our $6k plus drinks/casino/excursions is gone.

 

I still don't think it was the best business decision to open up loyal customers to other options. Time will tell.

[TRadle]

[quote=FrancescaH;19059650

A couple of us in this situation have commented but very few seem to care if it's just a couple of disabled folks who can't access the Lounge.

 

 

I think that since there is no qualifying suite for you than access to lounge should be available.

[Lady Chew]

... The Concierge Lounge is relatively well 'hidden' and is not an 'in your face' item to those who cannot go there. But, when they start 'roping' off areas where the 'steerage' class are prohibited, then they will start to offend people who will start to feel 'second' class ... not special ...

 

Are you saying that it's okay to be "first class" when you use the CL, because "steerage" class isn't admitted, but it's not fair for you to be designated as "steerage" where someone else is designated "first class" in another area of the ship??

 

The CL is just as roped off as the pool seats ... those of us traveling in steerage can't even see inside!!

[PSCruiser]

Are you saying that it's okay to be "first class" when you use the CL, because "steerage" class isn't admitted, but it's not fair for you to be designated as "steerage" where someone else is designated "first class" in another area of the ship??

 

The CL is just as roped off as the pool seats ... those of us traveling in steerage can't even see inside!!

 

It's like you are not even reading Sealord's point - why comment?

[temple1]

Very well said, but the sheep just don't get it.

And, Cruzendude, in particular, I would love to know your cruise history and C&A status. Let me guess - the recent changes have no impact, to speak of, on you, and you are only posting for your perverse amusement.

 

I suppose this is directed at anyone who is not weeping and pulling their hair out over the Diamond folks loss of the CL. I'm not a Diamond level cruiser, it will be a few years before I get there, but it looks like benefits for ALL levels have been decreased. So, it seems that it does affect all C&A members. Because no one goes to teh CL lounge for the free drinks.

[TRadle]

It's like you are not even reading Sealord's point - why comment?

 

 

I think LadyChew read the post she quoted and her interpretation was the same as mine. Her comments are just fine and she has just as much right to view her opinions as anyone else. :rolleyes:

[hellosailer]

I think that since there is no qualifying suite for you than access to lounge should be available.

 

Well, we have managed to qualify using a handicapped cabin!! No, we can't get double credits if that's what you mean!!

 

However, I do know a lady who ALWAYS travels in a large suite and she is totally confined to a wheelchair. There is, of course, a lot of extra space in a suite. I don't know about the bathrooms - this is our biggest problem in a regular cabin, but I suspect it is far easier to cope in a suite!!

 

Have you tried a suite?

[sealord]

It's like you are not even reading Sealord's point - why comment?

 

Thanks cruiser ... but I think I have a better point to make. It came to me like an epiphany while walking the dogs ... actually right in front of the San Francisco Theological Seminary ... hmm.

 

We have all been assuming or viewing the facts in chronological order. But, as of necessity, the 'plan' had to be executed somewhat in reverse. I'm not sure it is good to have a sufficiently 'devious' mind to figure this out ... finally ... but it probably stems from my military planning experience.

 

Here's my hypothosis.

 

1. RCCL decided that the Crown & Anchor 'Diamond' program had 'succeeded' beyond their expectations, and they now had too many Diamonds to accomodate easily in the CL. So instead of 'expanding', like any 'successful' enterprise might do they did the following.

 

2. Solution: The decision was made to renege on the Diamond benefits deal. That is, take the CL away from the Diamonds.

 

3. Dilemma: To simply take that benefit away from all of C&A would be too blatent and too obvious, and would really annoy all of their C&A people. They might lose business.

 

4. Solution to the Dilemma: We will create Diamond Plus 'in order to give recognition to our 'really' frequent cruisers'. This of course would be a substantially smaller number of people than the Diamonds. (Some might notice that the additional benefits of Diamond Plus {until now} were far from 'earthshaking'.)

 

5. Allow a short period of time to pass with the Diamonds and Diamond Plus commingling in the CL with the suite people, and others (Golds and Platinums) still striving to achieve that level so they can get the only 'substantial' benefit of the C&A program ... the CL. The utilization of overflow lounges will give the appearance that all is well.

 

6. Execution: After the Diamond Plus 'program' has had some time to sink in we announce ... ta da ... 'new enhanced C&A benefits', and the Diamonds are 'enhanced' right out of the CL. Problem solved ... just toss out honesty and integrity, and replace them with expediency.

 

So, if you were to accept this hypothesis, it would become apparent that the Diamond Plus level was created 'specifically' to provide a vehicle for taking the CL away from the Diamonds and providing incentive (I don't think so) to the Diamonds to cruise like crazy and become 'Plus'. And this plan allows them to not expand the CL, get rid of the overflow lounges, and yes improve the bottom line a 'little'.

 

So the 'appearance' was that this decision was made two weeks ago. I don't think so ... the 'plan' happened 'before' Diamond Plus was announced. The timing of the plan was all that had to be determined. Just my opinion.;)

[Lady Chew]

thanks, TRadle!!

I think it's kind of an interesting commentary on human nature ... here you have people bemoaning the loss of a priviledge that sets them apart from the "regular" cruisers, yet when the shoe is on the other foot ... that type of priviledge isn't fair, or is only used by show-offs!

my post, my opinion

This thread has been really interesting and very entertaining ... I hope it continues!!

[TRadle]

Well, we have managed to qualify using a handicapped cabin!! No, we can't get double credits if that's what you mean!!

 

However, I do know a lady who ALWAYS travels in a large suite and she is totally confined to a wheelchair. There is, of course, a lot of extra space in a suite. I don't know about the bathrooms - this is our biggest problem in a regular cabin, but I suspect it is far easier to cope in a suite!!

 

Have you tried a suite?

 

Yes. However, on Celebrity's M class ships the Sky Suites that connect to the Penthouse Suite have a separate shower and tub. The bathroom is enormous with room for a chair. The prices are the same as a regular Sky Suite. Now, Celebrity has a piss poor loyalaty program...but they offer an outstanding cruise and these cabins are top notch.

 

On Royal ships the GS is pretty good space wise. However, the bathroom wouldn't work well with a w/c. It is a tub/shower combo. Same with the JS...tub/shower combo. I haven't sailed above the GS.

[Benita]

The Geneses of "The Plan"

Thanks cruiser ... but I think I have a better point to make. It came to me like an epiphany while walking the dogs ... actually right in front of the San Francisco Theological Seminary ... hmm.

 

Actually,Sealord, I don't think it was all that thought out. RCL saw how many people were becoming Diamond and took it into account when they started building larger ships - hence they built a lounge for the Diamond and Diamond Plus sailers on the larger ships. These ships are huge and amazingly expensive and tend to command a higher price.

The Concierge lounge on the other ships were way too small to accomodate everybody. Rather than taking over another room or bar area and creating another lounge for the Diamonds and Diamond Plus, they decided to exclude the Diamonds in the hopes they would sail on the larger ships, where they would still have the concierge lounge (same thing, even though the name has changed to Diamond lounge).

Look at their ship's positioning. There used to be several choices of RCL ships sailing out of the Ft. Lauderdale/Miami area. Now, unless you want a 3 or 4 nighter, your only option is the Freedom class, soon to be replaced by the Oasis. They are hoping to fill these ships with passengers, and by "pushing" the Diamond members towards them (as well as the Floridians who cruise all the time), they have a larger customer base.

I am not defending this - I am just pointing out why I think this happened.

[hellosailer]

Yes. However, on Celebrity's M class ships the Sky Suites that connect to the Penthouse Suite have a separate shower and tub. The bathroom is enormous with room for a chair. The prices are the same as a regular Sky Suite. Now, Celebrity has a piss poor loyalaty program...but they offer an outstanding cruise and these cabins are top notch.

 

On Royal ships the GS is pretty good space wise. However, the bathroom wouldn't work well with a w/c. It is a tub/shower combo. Same with the JS...tub/shower combo. I haven't sailed above the GS.

 

Yes, I had noticed that the js had tub/shower combo. Really surprised that there isn't a walk-in shower in GS. Americans are so big on showers, I am surprised they don't complain. And considering how many elderly people are in suites, I don't know how they manage getting in and out of the baths easily.

 

But I thought there was a js handicapped - is that two credits?