norovirus--what would you do

[NoWhiners]

So I read that 2 Princess ships have noro outbreaks and cruises departing later today will be delayed. hubby and I were talking about how noro is handled and how it is spread. i have read that often it is spread due to pax not staying in their cabins. I have friends who have cruised and when they got sick, they didn't tell anyone so they wouldn't be shunned. We have never been sick onboard and I think I would be inclined to stay in my cabin and stay away from everyone. I am wondering if it would be a good idea to let the ships doctor know and also if he would give any drugs to treat symptoms--for free? It seems to me that this is in everyone's best interest.

 

What do you all think? Does anyone have experience with this dilemma? Would the ship charge for the simple drugs needed (anti-diarrheal, anti-vomiting. These are cheap OTC drugs. No antibiotics needed since it is a virus, even though these can be pretty cheap depending on which one is used)? And,as a bonus question, if you got sick and had to miss part (or all) of the cruise sick in your cabin, do you think HAL would give you any kind of credit for a future cruise (just to be nice guys, not because they have to?!

 

ML

 

Go Giants!!

[RuthC]

If I felt as miserable on a cruise as noro makes you feel, I wouldn't want to leave my cabin. I wouldn't have the strength! I would want to stay lying down, not moving a muscle (except when absolutely necessary).

Yes, palative care would be nice to receive. Something for the symptoms, a nurse coming to check on me, and a steward bringing some soft foods and drink every once in a while would be a blessing.

Having noro while traveling alone has got to be so much worse than having a companion to assist.

[kazu]

So I read that 2 Princess ships have noro outbreaks and cruises departing later today will be delayed. hubby and I were talking about how noro is handled and how it is spread. i have read that often it is spread due to pax not staying in their cabins. I have friends who have cruised and when they got sick, they didn't tell anyone so they wouldn't be shunned. We have never been sick onboard and I think I would be inclined to stay in my cabin and stay away from everyone. I am wondering if it would be a good idea to let the ships doctor know and also if he would give any drugs to treat symptoms--for free? It seems to me that this is in everyone's best interest.

 

What do you all think? Does anyone have experience with this dilemma? Would the ship charge for the simple drugs needed (anti-diarrheal, anti-vomiting. These are cheap OTC drugs. No antibiotics needed since it is a virus, even though these can be pretty cheap depending on which one is used)? And,as a bonus question, if you got sick and had to miss part (or all) of the cruise sick in your cabin, do you think HAL would give you any kind of credit for a future cruise (just to be nice guys, not because they have to?!

 

ML

 

Go Giants!!

 

 

I've had the dubious pleasure of sailing on ships with NORO twice :eek: On our first cruise, they asked everyone who was sick to call the doctor's office and quarantine themselves. Those that did got free drugs from the doctor as well as follow up visits from the nurses. Their rooms were deep cleaned, sheets wrapped in plastic, etc.

 

Same protocol on the next cruise but the drugs/medications were NOT free. I was somewhat surprised by that. (no charge for the visit though)

 

The main reason they had trouble controlling the NORO is that SOME people do not quarantine themselves and carry on spreading the blasted thing to anyone within contact.

 

Our friend came down with it - he got no credit for the part of the cruise he missed.

 

I do think that if HAL wants to control the NORO, it's best not to charge for the medications (rumour on the second ship was that some people were not calling as they did not want to pay).

 

Two time is enough for me thank you:) Ironically, although the second ship did charge, they communicated the progress and handled the NORO far better than the first ship IMO. Go figure

[jtl513]

I'd like to think I'd behave, report the sickness and stay in my cabin etc, but if I were in a port I'll likely never be back to like Istanbul or St Petersburg Russia, and I felt reasonably well, I'm not sure I could do the right thing and stay in. :p

[NoWhiners]

I've had the dubious pleasure of sailing on ships with NORO twice :eek: On our first cruise, they asked everyone who was sick to call the doctor's office and quarantine themselves. Those that did got free drugs from the doctor as well as follow up visits from the nurses. Their rooms were deep cleaned, sheets wrapped in plastic, etc.

 

This is exactly what I was thinking, then I read the 2nd experience! i am wondering if I want to be on a cruise ship with you--lightning might strike:D!!

 

Same protocol on the next cruise but the drugs/medications were NOT free. I was somewhat surprised by that. (no charge for the visit though)

 

Do you know how much was charged? to the onboard account? Might be a good use of the onboard credit!

 

The main reason they had trouble controlling the NORO is that SOME people do not quarantine themselves and carry on spreading the blasted thing to anyone within contact.

 

yep, that's what I read. But it is hard to argue with missing a once in a lifetime port. (see below). Maybe you could go to port, use Purell, avoid contact with pax and public spaces, go right to your cabin. Order room service, if you could eat. I agree with RuthC about this--not sure i'd be able to eat.

 

Our friend came down with it - he got no credit for the part of the cruise he missed.

 

as i suspected

 

I do think that if HAL wants to control the NORO, it's best not to charge for the medications (rumour on the second ship was that some people were not calling as they did not want to pay).

 

makes sense to me. But we always carry basic drugs to treat these symptoms, so that could work. Sort of makes me feel HAL wants everything their way if they charge for the drugs, issue no credit (just to be nice) and expect us to self-report. I think people would report if they knew they were met halfway by HAL??

 

Two time is enough for me thank you:) Ironically, although the second ship did charge, they communicated the progress and handled the NORO far better than the first ship IMO. Go figure

 

see previous note about lightning!!

 

I'd like to think I'd behave, report the sickness and stay in my cabin etc, but if I were in a port I'll likely never be back to like Istanbul or St Petersburg Russia, and I felt reasonably well, I'm not sure I could do the right thing and stay in. :p

 

This is an excellent point and I think this is what i would do too in this situation--as long as I didn't need a batroom;)!!

[kazu]

I believe the fee for the passengers who were charged was $89 from what I heard from comments from others. Yup, you can use obc for that.

 

BTW the second cruise was a 20 day. NORO was conquered and our transatlantic portion was noro free :)

 

The first ship was also a 20 day and they never conquered it. What a dismal way to do a transatlantic.

 

The NORO on the 2nd ship was quite painless. It was on the P'dam and well handled. Moreover, as it is such a small ship they have very stringent codes. I believe the captain said they could not have more than 1 or 2% with it not to go into code red. Both myself and dh were unscathed:D

 

Ah gee, you kind of hurt my feelings that you don't want to cruise with me. Ironically, there were several cc'ers who were on the previous sailing with us, so I guess lightening struck them too.

 

Frankly, I don't think HAL should charge for any meds or care for this. It's in their best interest to get people to report. The more help they give, the more co-operation they should get.

 

It's the people who don't want to miss THAT port that hurts it - if they get on a tour bus, the odds are it has just been spread to a pile more people. (from the Nurse and doctor, not my opinion)

 

Lightening has already struck twice - hopefully never again (where is that darned fingers crossed icon).

 

Fair winds and following seas:)

[ricki]

I know the temptation not to miss a port you were greatly looking forward to or that you might not see again is very strong. But If you have noro virus, you're not going to feel like sightseeing or being very far from a a bathroom. In reality, no matter how careful you are, you're shedding that virus with everything you touch and exposing your fellow passengers as you walk down the gangway and touch the banister, or climb in and out of the tender--and you will spread it to those on shore. It's very disappointing to miss a special port, but s**t happens, especially with noro virus!

 

Ricki

[SwissMyst]

..... In reality, no matter how careful you are, you're shedding that virus with everything you touch and exposing your fellow passengers as you walk down the gangway and touch the banister, or climb in and out of the tender--and you will spread it to those on shore. ......

Ricki

 

 

Huh? :confused:

[ricki]

Huh? :confused:

I'm sorry, I don't understand your "huh?" What part of shedding the virus don't you understand?

 

Ricki

[kazu]

I know the temptation not to miss a port you were greatly looking forward to or that you might not see again is very strong. But If you have noro virus, you're not going to feel like sightseeing or being very far from a a bathroom. In reality, no matter how careful you are, you're shedding that virus with everything you touch and exposing your fellow passengers as you walk down the gangway and touch the banister, or climb in and out of the tender--and you will spread it to those on shore. It's very disappointing to miss a special port, but s**t happens, especially with noro virus!

 

Ricki

 

Ricki - this is exactly what I was told by the nurse and the doctor on both ships - the biggest risk was people who still got off and/or don't quarantine. They didn't say touching the bannisters and stuff - but they simply said the people who say they think they can do it - are highly contagious and the ones who spread it:) I didn't ask the details - but I do know that a tour on the NA came back with 20 of them with it and the blame went to one passenger:eek:

 

It didn't help curtail it on the ship:eek:

[mamaofami]

We had one case of noro that I know of on my recent cruise. The cabin was scrubbed down every day, with the head of housekeeping(at least that's who I think it was) blocking the doorway so people couldn't see what was happening. The men were cleaning with masks on. That went on for two days and we never went into any code. People who were in the cabin next door were told the people had had an asthma attack. Not likely. I was told differently.

 

What did impress me was that I stayed on board when we tendered to HMC. The minute the passengers disembarked the tender, there was crew wiping down all the seats and backs of the seats. They were being extra careful. HMC was our last stop. I don't know what percentage you need to be in code red.

 

I agree with Ruth that if I had noro and was as sick as I've read people get, I wouldn't be able to leave the cabin. But, Ruth, don't forget that those who have a companion to assist them, will also have that companion getting sick.

[SwissMyst]

Tourista and dozens of other names for G.I. distress problems - Dietary precautions - Imodium - Pepto-Bismol and travel have long gone together. Never travel anywhere without all of them.

[ricki]

Ricki - this is exactly what I was told by the nurse and the doctor on both ships - the biggest risk was people who still got off and/or don't quarantine. They didn't say touching the bannisters and stuff - but they simply said the people who say they think they can do it - are highly contagious and the ones who spread it:) I didn't ask the details - but I do know that a tour on the NA came back with 20 of them with it and the blame went to one passenger:eek:

 

It didn't help curtail it on the ship:eek:

 

You are absolutely right, Jacqui! If only people would voluntarily quarantine themselves (and their partner) for the duration of the illness, the ship would be able to control the spread of the virus quickly.

 

Ricki

[SwissMyst]

You are absolutely right, Jacqui! If only people would voluntarily quarantine themselves (and their partner) for the duration of the illness, the ship would be able to control the spread of the virus quickly.

 

Ricki

 

 

If people only stopped putting their fingers in their eyes, mouth and nose, the ship would be able to control the spread of virus. Bugs do not have tiny little legs and walk into other people's bodies. They get carried there on their victims own fingers. (Unless there is a food-borne transmission) Yes, carriers should self-quarantine, but more critically other passengers need to watch where they put their own fingers. (Purell "cleansed" or not.)

[catl331]

how long is the incubation period---not a few hours I don't think. Wash, Wash, Wash and keep hands away from mouth etc. but you still might get it. I still believe that it is very easy to catch it on the plane and bring it to the ship where it will appear in a few days.:(

[sail7seas]

Noro patients often do not know that for days after their symtoms have abated, they are still contagious. Once they feel better they hurry out and about and are still spreading the virus.

 

[DFD1]

Fox News just ran a story about 3 cruise ships with Noro outbreaks and passengers returning sick. Must have been a fairly large number of passengers. Too bad.

 

According to one of the "live from" blogs, the Amsterdam has just gone code red down at the bottom end of South America and I believe there is a Princess ship in that same area with a Noro outbreak.

 

There may be updated news that alters this report.

[RuthC]

I agree with Ruth that if I had noro and was as sick as I've read people get, I wouldn't be able to leave the cabin. But, Ruth, don't forget that those who have a companion to assist them, will also have that companion getting sick.

I had something that could very well have been noro once. I was visiting my sister, and "something" went through that house, one after the other we were down for the count.

It was all I could do to move to the bathroom when I needed. Otherwise, staying flat on my back took all the strength I could muster. Sitting up was not gonna happen!

 

Carol, I will agree with your last statement about a companion getting sick only to the extent that the companion "may" get sick, not "will". We have had many reports on this board that one person in a cabin got sick, while the other stayed well.

Even if both do get sick, it's more likely to be sequential and not both in the worst phase at the same time. There's a little room to help each other there. Being alone with "it" would be awful.

[RMLincoln]

The closest I've gotten to noro was a traveling companion, my brother in a separate cabin.

 

He was miserable! He went to the infirmary, got drugs that knocked him out, no charges, he slept all day, missed a port, was quarantined for 24 hours and his sail card would not have allowed him off the ship if he had tried but the flag on his account and sail card allowd him to order non-standard room service. His wife and we did not get sick and in 24 hours he was feeling 90% and the fine the next day. This was on Carnival Spirit 2008

 

I was on Amsterdam 2009 with code orange for a week and then code red for the last 3 days of our 21 day sail. (This was before they did the code orange for the first day on board but i"m not sure that woul dhave mattered.) It was very inconvenient in code red - and a huge amount of work for the crew! The library was closed, computers not available, no hot tubs or T-spa pool. Some activities were canceled, no dessert extravaganza, etc.

 

I would hope that the cruise line would do whatever they could for a sick passenger free of charge to keep the virus from becoming an outbreak. But they didn't ask me.... m--

[kazu]

how long is the incubation period---not a few hours I don't think. Wash, Wash, Wash and keep hands away from mouth etc. but you still might get it. I still believe that it is very easy to catch it on the plane and bring it to the ship where it will appear in a few days.:(

 

 

Incubation period on the Nieuw Amsterdam was 24 hours - if the nurse designated you good to go and you were healthy - all was well.

 

Incubation on the Prinsendam was 48 - 72 hours (may have been a different strain? not sure). On the NA there were at least 3-400 sick at one time. I believe the max on the Prinsendam was 40 or 50. It's a smaller ship, but I also suspect they may have more stringent codes as the thing can fly through pretty fast.

 

I talked to one cc'er who washed her hands off - never put her hands to her mouth but still got it - so who knows? there but for the Grace of God:D I didn't

[kickboxrca]

I've been on a HAL cruise where Noro was rampant ... they issued a code red - no help yourself at the buffet, no rolls on the table, and no salt/pepper shakers. Neither of us got sick, and by 3 days into the cruise, the code red was lifted.

 

On Princess, I'm CONVINCED the passengers that were in our cabin previously had been sick (the cabin stank no matter what we said to the steward), and yes, one of us got sick. We didn't get any medication for free, and from what I heard going around the ship, lots of other people were sick - nothing was ever said on board, and no precautions were taken during mealtimes. I'd rather know than not know and at the very least be able to take some additional precautions myself.:eek:

[lcand1923]

On the last cruise we took (not HAL), my Dad came down with what I think was Noro. He was quarantined to his cabin, but I had to take him via wheelchair to Sick Bay every day so that they could give him saline via IV and monitor his condition. Several people in the same section of the ship came down with a similar condition. (I met their travel companions in the buffet as we tried to get the food that the doctor prescribed. It was NOT available via Room Service. None of us could figure that one out.) At first we thought it was food poisoning, but when we compared WHERE we had eaten and what we had eaten, we figured it was Noro. All of the affected passengers came down with the symptoms on the first or second night on the ship.

[sail7seas]

I had something that could very well have been noro once. I was visiting my sister, and "something" went through that house, one after the other we were down for the count.

It was all I could do to move to the bathroom when I needed. Otherwise, staying flat on my back took all the strength I could muster. Sitting up was not gonna happen!

 

Carol, I will agree with your last statement about a companion getting sick only to the extent that the companion "may" get sick, not "will". We have had many reports on this board that one person in a cabin got sick, while the other stayed well.

Even if both do get sick, it's more likely to be sequential and not both in the worst phase at the same time. There's a little room to help each other there. Being alone with "it" would be awful.

 

 

 

You're right, Ruth.

 

Years ago, I had Noro on Veendam and DH did not get it.

 

I was sick for about 18-24 hours and though weak felt considerably better rather quickly.

IMO, if you are able to keep down enough water/gatorade/fluids to not dehydrate, I think it better to take as few, if any, meds as possible. Let it run through your system and clear it away.

 

I do think there are a number of strains of Noro like viruses, thus the reason one does not get an immunity once they have had it. The next time exposed, it could be a different strain.

 

 

 

[HokiePoq]

Just back from the Rotterdam where we were on Code Red for 8 days and expected to be so until we got back to San Diego. We were pleased to get off a few days before that. HAL made those who were doing the next cruise as well get off, delayed embarkation a couple of hours, and was going to fumigate/clean the entire ship before the new folks got on. Well done IMHO.

I agree with the OP that one should be honorable about this and with Ruth that one would not want to be away from one's plumbing anyway.

I cannot say for sure what caused our outbreak but it occurred a day or two after we left Fanning Island. Our port talk person told us there was no plumbing on the island and the high tide line was the facility on the island. No way I'd have gotten in the water there but we saw a number of folks in swimming (no islanders). Another person thought it was caused by the Kiss the Fish ceremony crossing the equator, but my money is on Fanning Island. All passengers were not told what we learned in the port talk.

[mamaofami]

 

Carol, I will agree with your last statement about a companion getting sick only to the extent that the companion "may" get sick, not "will". We have had many reports on this board that one person in a cabin got

 

I guess I was under the impression that this virus was so contagious that if one person in a cabin got sick, the other one would too and that they asked the person who wasn't sick to remain in the cabin so they wouldn't spread the virus.

 

Judy, I read your comment that you were sick and your DH didn't get it.

 

I also realized on my last cruise that it's almost impossible to keep your hands clean all the time. If I went to the ladies room prior to going to the show lounge, used the paper towel to open the bathroom door and then threw it into the container they provide, I would touch the rail as I walked down the stairs in the show lounge and then touch the seats.

 

When there's no code red, everyone is using the same serving spoon in the Lido to get their food. I would much prefer having someone serve me. And, when using the purell as you enter the MDR, and then putting your hands on your seat as you pull your chair in, you have undone the purell precaution.

 

I think the only thing we can reasonably do to protect ourselves is wash wash, wash.