when did cruising become so sloppy

[Gilpet]

Oh dear, I think the request not to be flamed was a little optimistic :). I totally disagree with your viewpoint but I also totally respect your right to state it...........yes, I know I'm paraphrasing something that somebody (who I can't remember) said but it's true.

 

My husband doesn't own a tux nor does he want to either own or hire one and that's his choice, but on formal nights he does wear a dark suit with a shirt and tie, so we do adhere to the guidelines but I really don't let what other people are wearing make a difference to my enjoyment of the meal or my cruise in general.

 

I would be interested to know what the people who are considered to be "slobs" are wearing! Is it just a lack of tux or suit that makes them a slob?

 

Gill

[gjkubel]

The answer is over the last 10-15 years as cruising for the big companies has moved from a niche vacation to a mass market vacation. The clientelle is obviously different and so too is the target audience of the companies (RCCL, Carnival, Princess, Norwegian, etc.).

 

Frankly, the vacation you are looking for -- cruising of the 1980s, is no longer the business RCCL is in. Prices, adjusted for inflation, are dramatically lower, and the target audience is now families -- not the older and wealthier demographic of yore. If that is still the vacation YOU are looking for, then it is time to say goodbye to RCCL and their relatively low prices and pay for something like Crystal/Silversea, which, when adjusted for inflation, is practically the same price.

 

It is also time to face facts that you are or are soon to be the minority. You can complain that there is no longer a dress code and you miss the good old days. But in the good old days Song of America was the biggest cruise ship in the industry and the target audience was vastly, vastly different. The fake nostalgia of fancy Atlantic crossings doesn't appeal to families and RCCL is adjusting itself to the (not so) new target audience. Most vacations don't have formal nights. Why should cruising? Because it used to? Seems like a silly answer when you think about it...

Edited March 3, 2014 by gjkubel

[fitzy123]

I agree and disagree with you. Some things that you mentioned do bother me. Although I have kids do I want a vacation with kids running wild around me because their parents don't want to supervise? Absolutely not. We should always be courteous of others and how they want to vacation. Even when we sit on the deck to get some sun my family tries to talk quietly due to not wanting to disturb people around us. I also believe if an area says adult only like a Solarium it should be honored. That is not a suggestion, but a rule. It just really isn't that much to ask with all the other spaces your kids can be.

 

That said, I do disagree about your comments on formal night. I feel like some people on these boards assume because people don't want to dress up that we are somehow of a lower class. Not always the case. Maybe we have to dress up so much in our everyday life we see vacation as a place where we don't want to have to stand in heels that hurt our feet, etc. Maybe the guy who has to dress up for work all the time or sits in meetings with ties on just does not want to wear one on his vacation. They can call it formal night all they want but as I recall isn't it even listed as a suggested attire? It isn't exactly breaking a rule or snubbing others if you don't follow the suggestion and it isn't always lazy either. It is a personal choice. We usually dress up in cocktail attire the first night but honestly by the 2nd formal night we have either skipped or we go in a little less formal but still dress as to not completely stand out and remain respectful to the suggestion. I also agree with the above poster. On the NOS last spring break we had to really look around to see people that were really bucking the suggestion on the dress code in the dining room.

 

I feel on a cruise it is my job not to be rude to others and not let my kids be rude to others. We respect others space and follow the rules. We don't let our kids run wild and we use the dining room to teach our girls manners. However, I do not feel it is my job to dress in my best formal wear so that you enjoy your cruise more.

 

Debbie

 

Well said!!! I couldn't agree more! I never understood why people get so worked up over what others are wearing.

[legaljen1969]

I do think the mass market cruise industry has migrated toward a more casual style of dress and attitude. To some degree it has become more "sloppy", which some would read "more relaxed." I think it is more "relaxed" than it used to be. That said, my husband would be thrilled if the "suggested attire" allowed him to wear shorts and a collared golf shirt every night. I enjoy dressing up a little more. My husband is a retired Marine and I really miss the chance to go to the yearly Marine Corps birthday ball- so a cruise is my chance to dress up and make up for what I miss. No, he does not take dress blues. He usually only takes a nice dark suit even for formal night. But that's when we get good pictures together. Last year we went out to dinner at fairly nice restaurant for our anniversary dinner. The previous year he had seen people in there with shorts. He insisted that he could wear shorts this year as well. I told him that he could either go to the restaurant in pants and treat our anniversary like a special occasion, or we would not go to this place. He chose to wear pants.

 

Sometimes it is about showing those you cruise with (probably a husband, wife, parents or other person you care about) that you honor them enough to make it a special occasion and put in some effort at least for one meal. I do not give a rip about other people at the table or on the ship (in general) but I do expect MY travel companions to dress appropriately and within guidelines. They expect the same of me.

 

To each his own.

 

OP, I agree with your assessment that things have gotten a little out of hand in some ways. It has gotten "more relaxed" and maybe "too relaxed" at times. I think there is a time and place for some things and now people just don't care. I agree that people have gotten to the point where they think "I paid for it, I can do as I please." People who purposely don't follow the "rules" are everywhere. They are the people who take flash photos in the show where they announce "no flash photos." They are the people who think it is okay to talk on their cell phone at a normal conversational tone in a movie. They are the same people who went asked not to allow their children to swing from the stair rails, continue to do so and then sue the ship when their kid falls off and breaks his arm.

 

Inconsiderate people are inconsiderate people. There is a different between inconsiderate, sloppy and relaxed.

[royalfirsttimerhelp]

The answer is over the last 10-15 years as cruising for the big companies has moved from a niche vacation to a mass market vacation. The clientelle is obviously different and so too is the target audience of the companies (RCCL, Carnival, Princess, Norwegian, etc.).

 

Frankly, the vacation you are looking for -- cruising of the 1980s, is no longer the business RCCL is in. Prices, adjusted for inflation, are dramatically lower, and the target audience is now families -- not the older and wealthier demographic of yore. If that is still the vacation YOU are looking for, then it is time to say goodbye to RCCL and their relatively low prices and pay for something like Crystal/Silversea, which, when adjusted for inflation, is practically the same price.

 

It is also time to face facts that you are or are soon to be the minority. You can complain that there is no longer a dress code and you miss the good old days. But in the good old days Song of America was the biggest cruise ship in the industry and the target audience was vastly, vastly different. The fake nostalgia of fancy Atlantic crossings doesn't appeal to families and RCCL is adjusting itself to the (not so) new target audience. Most vacations don't have formal nights. Why should cruising? Because it used to? Seems like a silly answer when you think about it...

 

this!

[legaljen1969]

Most vacations don't have formal nights. Why should cruising? Because it used to? Seems like a silly answer when you think about it...

 

Most vacations may not state explicitly that they have a formal night. But I would venture to say that a lot of family vacations include a night where the family dresses up a little more to go out for a nicer dinner in a special place. I know mine does. On every vacation since I was a child there has been one night when we were all expected to step it up a notch or two and do something special. The rest of the time, it was pretty much shorts and tees or bathing suits and cover ups.

 

People have many reasons why they choose specific vacations or destinations. Some choose a place that allows them to really have a formal and first class experience with dress up nights and high dollar dining. Other people choose a place where they can just unpack a suitcase that contains a bathing suit, one pair of shorts and one t-shirt for the week and they go out and shoot/catch their own dinner and prepare it. If you don't like what a specific vacation entails and the guidelines for the experience you should prepare to have, then go on a different vacation.

 

That goes for those who want a formal experience and are not getting it on a mass market line AND for those who think cruising is too formal. That's the really neat thing about cruising now. There are a lot of different venues that allow you to relax or glam up as you choose. Where else can you get a vacation where you can glam it up or wear your swimsuit every single day, see different ports, drink and not have to worry about having a DD or calling a cab. It's truly still the most "all inclusive" vacation there is- from amenities to the people you meet.

[houstoncruisers2001]

My wife dresses up all seven nights. If that is what makes her happy then i am happy. The least i can do is to try to not look like a slop hog sitting next to her for a couple of hours. We usually stay dressed for the evening too, but I don't care what others have on. To each their own.

[kruzerci]

No flames here. I agree. The whole mentality of cruising has turned into "how can we make it cheap and casual?"

 

It certainly isn't what it used to be. Cruising used to be an upscale vacation. Now it seems like Panama City in the Caribbean, particularly on short cruises.

 

We still love cruises because we love the ocean and the sun, but cruising isn't the same thing we fell in love with years back.

[TEXASMUNK]

Cruise lines need to fill their ships.

[Arizona Cruz Chic]

I also agree with you.

 

Its what our society has become. Have you looked around at the grocery store, restaurants or mall lately? Flying also has me cringing lately, some of these people look like they just rolled out of bed! Some you wonder if they even showered? :eek:

 

I believe that we have entered a new wave of cruising...casual, come as you are kind of thing. Until cruise lines either change their policy or enforce the current suggested dress codes things will not change, it will only become the new way of cruising.

 

I say if you like to dress up, please do! :)

 

***

[smeck]

My favorite expression on the subject.

 

I'm on vacation not display.

[micmacmissy]

Try Celebrity. Most people there will adhere to the dress code, and their outfits on "Smart Casual" nights were often nicer than what we saw on Royal's formal nights.

 

I'm not the clothing police by any stretch, but the guy in gross jeans and a tuxedo printed tshirt on formal night in Royal next to our table? Eww.

[GTO-Girl]

I am one of those people who could care less what others are wearing. It certainly doesn't make or break my cruise. I do understand that those of you who have cruised for many years miss the good old days when things were more elegant.

 

But today, whether we like it or not, many areas of our society has gotten more casual.....i.e. casual days at work, dress down Friday's, etc. Couple that with the ridiculous airline restrictions which make people just want to travel as light as possible to avoid all those fees and you find more and more people going casual.

 

We are a couple who does NOT dress to the nines on formal night. In fact my husband likes to wear his dress pants and a nice Tommy Bahama shirt....:eek:.....on formal night and I wear my black pants and a nice top.

 

We have witnessed on every cruise ladies who have pressed themselves into spandex dresses so cheap and small that I have to wonder how in the world their seams are holding!!!! So all I am saying is that putting on a dress/suit does not make you any more "formal", than someone who is neat and clean and dresses nicely.

 

Dress yourself and your family the way you want to and enjoy your cruise.!

[kruzerci]

Try Celebrity. Most people there will adhere to the dress code, and their outfits on "Smart Casual" nights were often nicer than what we saw on Royal's formal nights.

 

I'm not the clothing police by any stretch, but the guy in gross jeans and a tuxedo printed tshirt on formal night in Royal next to our table? Eww.

 

I think we need to try Celebrity.

 

With Royals prices not rising with inflation... how can I put this nicely.... The clientele isn't what it once was, which changes the atmosphere, thus more tuxedo tshirts when they aren't appropriate ;).

[Worn out mailman]

Though it may seem like these boards are filled with "do I have to" type posts, my cruising experience says those folks that don't follow the "suggested" guidelines are in the minority. In my opinion, cruising has not gotten all that sloppy.

 

We just came home yesterday from last week's sailing on Adventure of the Seas.

 

We happened to be seated alongside a family group who wore shorts, and sometimes t's to dinner. We were annoyed each time we saw them, until around day 6 when we conversed with them a bit and realized they were quite nice despite not dressing up. After that, we both regretted judging them.

 

I guess my point is: unless something is overt (for example, someone being noisy) we're at least going to try to relax a little regarding how others behave.

 

As others have said, I think most people observe the guidelines.

[bouhunter]

Well you've managed to start yet another pointless dress code thread, which I'm sure was your intent.

 

Cruising today on the mass market lines is what it is, and isn't going to change. If you don't like "non-conformists" on formal nights you should do some research and spend the money to travel with the tux crowd elsewhere. Otherwise as someone else noted, stop worrying about things you can't change and enjoy your vacation.

 

Personally I could care less what anyone else wears in the MDR. On our upcoming cruise we'll be at Chop's/Portofino 4 nights and Windjammer 3. It has nothing to do with clothing - we just got very tired of the chaotic, loud atmoshpere in the MDR. Beautiful decor but average food with entree choices we weren't interested in most nights.

Edited March 3, 2014 by bouhunter

[comxkid]

It certainly isn't what it used to be. Cruising used to be an upscale vacation. Now it seems like Panama City in the Caribbean, particularly on short cruises.

 

We still love cruises because we love the ocean and the sun, but cruising isn't the same thing we fell in love with years back.

 

Just for fun, I looked up some information. In 1975, the average cost for an interior cabin was $550.00. Adjusting for inflation, that same cabin would cost you $2,391.00. The average cost of a much larger and nicer interior cabin today? $890.00.

 

Cruising can still be an upscale vacation; you just need to be willing to pay for it.

[Desertbelle]

....The thing I love about cruising is seeing people dressed up in the evenings....

 

I support your right to an opinion but I don't agree that it's all so bad as you make it out to be. On a 7 day cruise I might see one misbehaving child or one person dressed inappropriately...hardly enough to make a cruise seem "sloppy"!

 

And, just to be clear, your statement above implies that you have paid for a cruise and you expect people to dress up for your enjoyment...exactly what you are accusing others of doing, paying for their cruise and expecting an experience that is of their own choice.

 

I don't cruise to make anyone else happy.

[TubbyMrT]

All that is needed for the triumph of bad behavior is for good people to do nothing. Peer pressure, the good kind, makes for a more civilized society. Turning our heads and ignoring bad behavior because it is none of our business allows the bad behavior to escalate. Bad behavior happens all around us, not just on cruise ships.

 

Having the right to do something is not the same as doing what is right.

[ryano]

there are also a lot of highly dramatic drama llamas that make mountains out of molehills.

 

 

Suddenly, if someone doesn't show up in a tux or ball gown to the geriatric prom®, it is made out like they are showing up in their dirty undies, a t-shirt with toe-backy juice stains, a hayseed sticking out of their mouth, a ballcap with a dirty slogan on it, no deodorant, yesterday's ketchup on their chin, and they are probably burning old glory in the process.

 

 

I see a lot of people not dressed very formally, but still dressed very nicely. They aren't the scum of the universe, they just don't see the need to get formal. Enjoy your cruise and leave them alone.

 

If they show up in those actual items... report them to the staff immediately... Don't complain to people on this forum who can't do a single thing about it.

 

exactly!

[comxkid]

All that is needed for the triumph of bad behavior is for good people to do nothing. Peer pressure, the good kind, makes for a more civilized society. Turning our heads and ignoring bad behavior because it is none of our business allows the bad behavior to escalate. Bad behavior happens all around us, not just on cruise ships.

 

Having the right to do something is not the same as doing what is right.

 

So what are you suggesting?

[DrD]

When it got cheaper.

 

Here it comes (ducks.)

[bigque]

I keep hearing "In The Good Old Days" Although we dress for dinner on formal nights (No tux and gowns) I in a suit (Light or dark) and the wife in a dress or pants suit. In my last review of Freedom I mentioned that I saw people in all styles of dress on formal and non formal nights! We dress on formal nights because we just like to do it, but not because we want to feel "Accepted". I noticed what people wore on my last cruise so that I can make it a part of my review since I always read about it on here but I really don't care. This is 2014 and the Good old days is gone but you can still get the Good old days experience on some of the more luxury cruise lines. In the good old days Elvis was considered vulgar, in 2014 those kind of moves are tame. In the good old days, The Beatles hair was considered long, in 2014 men wear hair as long as women. In the good old days, you carried a cell phone in big phone case, in 2014 you carry one in the palm of your hand. In the Good old days married couples did not sleep together on TV, in 2014 everybody sleeps together, husband/wife, boyfriend/girlfriend, man/man, lady/lady, etc. In the good old days I couldn't afford a cruise and could only watch the ships and wished that I could go on one and had no idea how people dressed on any given night on those ships, in 2014 I can afford to cruise and now that I know how people dress on given nights, I have found what is good for some is not good for everyone and I'm glad I am cruising in 2014 (This era of cruising) because I have a choice (suggested) and not a set of have to do rules when it comes to dress! So what I am saying is, it's not 1954, 1964, 74, 94 but 2014 and so has people had to move on from Elvis's swaying hips or the Beatles long hair, so must people move on to an ever changing cruise experience! Just do you and let everybody else do them! This was just MHO! :cool:

[PhoenixDawgCruising]

These threads pop up again and again and I will never understand them. I've been on a few cruises, and as far as I know, the following things never changed depending on whether or not the dude next to me was in a tux or a swimsuit or the woman next to me was in a gown or yoga pants:

 

1. The taste of the food-SAME.

2. The weather-SAME.

3. How much $$ I won in the casino-SAME.

4. The quality of the entertainment-SAME.

5. My cruise experience as a whole-SAME.

 

Wy does anyone care what strangers are wearing??? Make sure you are happy in your own skin, and move on. Other people and their skins, not to mention what THEY choose to cover them in, ARE NOT YOUR CONCERN!!:eek:

[debbs0723]

Geriatric Prom? Holy Moly that is funny. Sounds a little bit like my name for the Renaissance festival but different. Whole different topic though. Ouch talk about getting flames :D

 

We love cruising on Royal. I have seen a change even from our honeymoon in 2000. I think as soon as they started adding ice rinks, zip lines, mini golf, rock climbing etc they were aiming at a younger audience.

 

"Moose out front shoulda told ya on that one" how that was going to change things.

 

We don't own the RCI ships. They do. Trust me if they wanted to make formal night a rule, they would. That is why it is only a suggestion. They have the power to change it.

 

Debbie

Edited March 3, 2014 by debbs0723