Furious with Holland America!

[rochelle_s]

I understand your frustration with the situation and the loss of your things. I really do. But Holland America has a clear policy for this, as outlined in the information they provide to you before you leave on the cruise. Failure to read the information does not negate Holland America's responsibility or liability.

 

I do hope your bags have identification inside (as well as on tags), so that in the event they are eventually found, they can be returned to you. And it can happen.

 

 

Thanks for your comments. Yes their is identification inside.

 

As to Holland America's responsibility, once I had a top go missing that I had sent to the laundry. HAL was very good about it and reimbursed me. Technically they probably had no obligation to do so but they did. There is a difference in contractual obligation and taking responsibility when things go wrong. It would be very difficult at this point to convince me that our bags went missing from the terminal building. If this does happen in the port terminal buildings then I think it is the cruise lines obligation to come up with a better system. Even airlines take more responsibility than HAL does.

 

That said I did understand what you were saying.

 

 

Rochelle

[rochelle_s]

It is always possible that another passenger moved your bags into their cabin overnight, and walked off the ship with them. I am not big on surveillance cameras in general, but in your case they might have helped.

 

No that is not possible. As I stated in my original post; I went to the cabin and got the two suitcases. I wheeled them out to the midship elevators. There was about 4 stewards there and one of them took them from me. I then headed down the stairs to the casino where I had to be before 11 PM in order to cash out my card.

 

I told Guest Relations they could look to see the accuracy of this on their camera surveillance. There would have definitely been cameras in our cabin hallway and in that atrium elevator area (deck 9).

 

 

 

 

Rochelle

Edited July 8, 2014 by rochelle_s

[oskarNZ]

Rochelle, sorry to hear about this unfortunate series of events. Not just the lost luggage and lack of compensation, but also the poor communication you received from HAL throughout the whole process. I too would be upset.

I hope better news is coming your way soon. :)

[Stratheden]

No that is not possible. As I stated in my original post; I went to the cabin and got the two suitcases. I wheeled them out to the midship elevators. There was about 4 stewards there and one of them took them from me. I then headed down the stairs to the casino where I had to be before 11 PM in order to cash out my card.

 

I told Guest Relations they could look to see the accuracy of this on their camera surveillance. There would have definitely been cameras in our cabin hallway and in that atrium elevator area (deck 9).

 

 

 

 

Rochelle

 

I will certainly be doing the same. The thought never crossed my mind when I place my bag outside on the last night of the cruise that it might not be there in the morning. I have never ever heard of this happening before.

 

 

 

Rochelle

 

So which did you do - place your bags outside the door or wheel them down to the midships elevators?

If you wheeled them down to the elevators are you sure it was a steward that you gave them to?

 

You may have given them to someone who wasn't HAL.

[SoCal Cruiser78]

No that is not possible. As I stated in my original post; I went to the cabin and got the two suitcases. I wheeled them out to the midship elevators. There was about 4 stewards there and one of them took them from me...I told Guest Relations they could look to see the accuracy of this on their camera surveillance. There would have definitely been cameras in our cabin hallway and in that atrium elevator area (deck 9)...

 

Sorry, I guess I missed the part about your handing them off directly to a HAL staffer. I know the cruise lines generally neither confirm nor deny the existence of cameras onboard. So they may not confirm or deny that they were able to see you hand over your bags.

 

Best of luck to you in recovering your bags, or at least being made whole financially.

Edited July 8, 2014 by Ryndam2002

[Krazy Kruizers]

Sorry that this happened to your mother and you.

[kazu]

I do hope this gets rectified in some way.

 

Yes, I do know HAL's liability and yes we do trip insurance. ... BUT

 

I don't understand how they could lose two bags. P'Dam is not a large ship and I have seen them collect luggage. Very quick unlike other ships and extremely efficient.

 

This is mind boggling to me and I would have thought that HAL would want to get to the bottom of it.

 

By the way, I think the slots wear out the key cards. I play them and have had to have my card replaced several times. DH does not and his is fine all cruise

[puppycanducruise]

What an awful situation.

Best of luck getting your luggage or compensation.

[Boytjie]

It's absurd to speculate that someone else would walk off with two pieces of luggage from the same cabin.

 

I don't think it is that absurd. When we flew back from our last cruise someone took my bag off the baggage carousel at JFK. I was watching for out bags as they got on the carousel and both pieces have distinctive handle wraps (orange). I saw my bag and the next thing someone else took it off the carousel. I walked over to them and told them that they took my bag - they got annoyed at me and started argueing that it was theirs!

[cbr663]

So sorry to hear about your lost luggage. About 12 years ago I had my luggage lost by the airlines at the beginning of my trip. I learned very quickly the limits of the airline's liability for replacement. If you cannot afford to lose it, don't take it with you.

 

I was fortunate that a friend worked with the airline. When I told her what happened, she came to the conclusion that there was only one place where the luggage could be - in another city. She then picked up the phone, called an airline employee in that city, asked him to go and search and sure enough, there it was. The luggage was put on the next flight and I received it later that same day.

 

I don't believe I would have ever received it had I continued working with the airline's customer relations department. It was the great thinking of my friend, who worked "on the ground" who solved the problem.

 

If the luggage wasn't at the pier for you on disembarkation, chances are that it is still on the ship. There must be a room on the ship where it would be stored?

[serendipity1499]

Interesting all the HAL apologists saying that the OP should have bought baggage insurance before starting the cruise. I wonder how many of them buy baggage insurance before each cruise? /QUOTE]

 

SNIP

 

We do! On our last cruise on the Prinsendam our Insurance was over $2,600 plus yes over $2600..We were fortunate & received a huge discount on that by our TA , but still paid over $2000 for the insurance..

 

I worked for an International carrier & used to take my chances when I cruised, but after having a close call with a lost bag, realized I was being very foolish by not purchasing insurance.. In addition, I also know that putting things of value in a checked bag is not the smartest thing to do..Anything of value I carry in my hand luggage..

 

The OP is supposedly an experienced cruiser, had a theft on another cruise & did not have insurance.. Suggest you read that thread in it's entirety.. Many of the posters on that thread advised her to purchase insurance in the future, but she decided to take her chances & lost.. And in that case, these are her exact words: Quote On the Grand Princess in April my aunt and I were the victims of a theft onboard. We were not at all pleased with the way the matter was handled and I would like to follow up with a letter to the corporate offices[ Unquote/B].

 

I'm not a HAL apologist either.. Before you sling mud, please read some of my posts! If I think HAL is wrong, I will say so!

Edited July 8, 2014 by serendipity1499

[rochelle_s]

So which did you do - place your bags outside the door or wheel them down to the midships elevators?

If you wheeled them down to the elevators are you sure it was a steward that you gave them to?

 

You may have given them to someone who wasn't HAL.

 

Sorry if I caused some confusion.

 

The first part you quoted was what happened on this trip. The second quote is how I felt in general on the last night on the last night of a cruise.

 

I am positive of who I gave them to. The cabin stewards wear uniforms and the fellows by the elevator where all wearing them. They were not the two gentleman assigned to our cabin though, so I do not know their names.

 

 

Rochelle

[sunsetbeachgal]

We have lost luggage on a trip years ago and I can testify that it is most upsetting. I hope it shows up. We usually do self disembarkation and schlep our own luggage, and think we will opt to do this on our September cruise on the a Prinsendam, assuming they offer this as an option.

 

Since it is such a small ship wouldn't you assume someone on shore walked away with it, either by mistake or deliberately?

[catl331]

So I informed Guest relations that I know for a fact my bags were in the possession of a crew member and I know that they were not in the terminal building in the morning. In my opinion that means they were always in the 'possession' of Holland America and or their crew and I consider them responsible for their loss.

How can you be sure that they weren't put out in the baggage claim area and taken by somebody (not a fellow passenger or HAL person) before you got there? :confused: Edited July 8, 2014 by catl331

[DaveOKC]

Sorry to hear about your lost luggage problem. It does seem a bit odd that you lost both of those bags.

 

As to the casino issues, I have a couple of comments. I am an avid video poker player and as such know that the odds of playing them (and other slots I am sure) on a cruise ship are worse that in a land based casino. I do play them a bit, but purely for entertainment value. As to the 2+ weeks from a jackpot on VP, I assume that this means a Royal Flush payout. As you know, a Royal is very hard to get and happens about every 40,000 hands, so one in two weeks does not seem unusual, unless the machines were heavily played.

 

It seems to me that what happened on your Casino offer was that while it was valid for your cruise, it likely had to be redeemed at the time of your booking (common practice). The reason for this is that sometimes the offer is not combineable with other ones from the cruise line. Once they have your booking (especially after final payment), they are less likely to offer you anything to get you onboard - they already have you.

[rochelle_s]

Interesting all the HAL apologists saying that the OP should have bought baggage insurance before starting the cruise. I wonder how many of them buy baggage insurance before each cruise? /QUOTE]

 

SNIP

 

 

The OP is supposedly an experienced cruiser, had a theft on another cruise & did not have insurance.. Suggest you read that thread in it's entirety.. Many of the posters on that thread advised her to purchase insurance in the future, but she decided to take her chances & lost.. And in that case, these are her exact words: Quote On the Grand Princess in April my aunt and I were the victims of a theft onboard. We were not at all pleased with the way the matter was handled and I would like to follow up with a letter to the corporate offices[ Unquote/B].

 

I'm not a HAL apologist either.. Before you sling mud, please read some of my posts! If I think HAL is wrong, I will say so!

 

I really don't understand your vehement instance that I have done something wrong here. Can you please put your preoccupation with insurance aside for just a couple of minutes.

 

What happened in 2009 on Princess was unfortunate. I have stated here and at the time that we shared some responsibility in what happened. I do not know of any insurance policies that cover lost cash and certainly not in that situation. Once again we were not asking for any type of compensation in that situation. We did though feel that the situation at that time was handled very poorly and thus our desire to elevate it further through the corporate offices..

 

Fast forward to 2014. Imagine if you will that we did have our own private insurance and were covered fully for our loss. So now there is no monetary considerations at play. Now here is the kicker... I would still be upset with the loss of our luggage. And yes I would still want to know how and why.

 

There is no reasonable explanation to explain the disappearance of both of our bags.

 

I mentioned the VIP visitors to the ship that day. Even some of the higher ups were not privy to exactly who that might be. Speculation was that they could be from the royal family. We watched the pier from the lido deck while waiting for our colour to be called and there was a very large security presence visible. I am not talking your local security guards I am talking about suit and tie secret service type security details and their shiny black vehicles. Security was tight! No one, either passenger or dock personnel were running willy nilly scooping up suitcases.

 

Now consider the only two bags that are not in the terminal at the end of the day are two bags from the same cabin. How in the world would this be possible? So again I say, I do not believe that they ever came off the ship. The last I know of they were in the possession of HAL crew members. I do not believe any port side personnel ever touched them. Which means they went missing somewhere on the ship which does in fact make it HAL's responsibility.

 

It is their duty to collect the bags and transport them to the terminal building. That clearly did not happen in this case.. I want to know how this is possible. I would love to find out our bags were just misplaced on the ship and that they are just sitting in a storage room waiting to come home. If that is to ever happen they will have to do a very good search for them.

 

You say if HAL is wrong you will say so. Please tell me who can be reasonably and logically responsible for those bags going missing other than HAL? Remember to keep your fixation on financials out of the equation. Whose error is it that those bags went missing?

 

HAL's first course of action would be to look harder for those bags. Next they should be seriously looking at how this could have happened. And again I reiterate that had it been a single bag, I could think of it as a one-off unfortunate situation. When it was both bags from the same cabin then something just isn't right. It should be HAL's responsibility and job to find out what that something is.

 

That is what the core issue is.

 

 

 

Rochelle

[navybankerteacher]

Sorry if I caused some confusion.

 

The first part you quoted was what happened on this trip. The second quote is how I felt in general on the last night on the last night of a cruise.

 

I am positive of who I gave them to. The cabin stewards wear uniforms and the fellows by the elevator where all wearing them. They were not the two gentleman assigned to our cabin though, so I do not know their names.

 

 

Rochelle

 

I know how frustrating (and costly) having luggage go missing is - and HAL's responses have only added to your problem. Do you think that bringing to the elevator - rather than leaving them in the hall outside your cabin might be involved? That should not in any way justify the loss - or HAL's unhelpful responses.

[Dawn1004]

Geeze...if I had a case with $4,000 worth of gear in it I'd be pretty peeved too. I'd be peeved if it was just my clothes and tourist souveniers ( which would be significantly less than $4k)

[rochelle_s]

We have lost luggage on a trip years ago and I can testify that it is most upsetting. I hope it shows up. We usually do self disembarkation and schlep our own luggage, and think we will opt to do this on our September cruise on the a Prinsendam, assuming they offer this as an option.

 

Since it is such a small ship wouldn't you assume someone on shore walked away with it, either by mistake or deliberately?

 

The port of Ijmuiden is pretty much out in the middle of nowhere. The terminal building is very small. I have added a couple of pictures.

 

The port is remote and we were the only ship there. The ship was charging $15 dollars for a shuttle to the local train station.There is no public around. Even if an outsider did come around they would be seen. As I mentioned in an earlier post there was also the heightened security present this day. This is not a port where someone could get lost in the crowds...as there are none. When you disembark the ship you are brought by shuttle to the building. Similar in size to a large garage. You go in one door..pick up your luggage in the building and exit on the other side. Even the use of porters seemed limited. Most people we saw just walked out with their own bag. Not sure how anyone could have left with an extra two. More so, two from the same cabin.

 

 

Rochelle

[rochelle_s]

I know how frustrating (and costly) having luggage go missing is - and HAL's responses have only added to your problem. Do you think that bringing to the elevator - rather than leaving them in the hall outside your cabin might be involved? That should not in any way justify the loss - or HAL's unhelpful responses.

 

Yes in some strange way I do. How and why though I cannot explain.

 

Rochelle

[DaveOKC]

Cruise lines always have their disclaimer clauses in their contracts. They have them about every little thing. It does not mean they they can never be held responsible for things that happen aboard their ships.

 

Even if I had insurance to cover lost luggage. Or even if HAL had offered to pay the full amount. I would still be angry. My possessions are gone. Some items had a sentimental value-- can you put a price tag on that? Something happened to our luggage. I am sorry if you can't see that when both bags from the same cabin are the only ones to go missing --something fishy is going on. There is no reasonable explanation for it. I might believe in a coincidence but this one is too great for even me to believe. I didn't get the impression Guest Relations was believing it either.

 

I have home insurance. If my house were to burn down I would have coverage for my things. Money cannot replace everything though. And if I felt someone had purposely set fire to my house I would be more than just upset I would be pissed off.

 

Love away at HAL all you like but something happened to our bags and I would like anyone to provide me with a reasonable and logical explanation.

 

 

Rochelle

 

As I stated already, it does seem odd that your two suitcases both turned up missing. Then I see that you had $4000 in items in one of them, so I was wondering if you had anything very valuable (like electronics, etc) in one or both of them? Could this be the reason they disappeared?

 

My brother used to work in baggage for a major airline and he told me soe terrible stories on what goes on.

[rochelle_s]

Geeze...if I had a case with $4,000 worth of gear in it I'd be pretty peeved too. I'd be peeved if it was just my clothes and tourist souveniers ( which would be significantly less than $4k)

 

 

I would have never thought we would have that much in our bags also. We were really surprised how quickly it adds up and we do not have high end name brand clothes. As an example;

 

• 6 pairs of sock @ $5 each = $30
  
• 8 pars of underwear @ $15 each = $120
  
• 6 bras @ $38 each = $228
  

 

I am almost at $400 for basic underwear. Have not even started to add in clothes, shoes and formal wear for 3 nights. Then watch how quickly the little stuff adds up. We were amazed actually.

 

 

Rochelle

[LMaxwell]

 

Imagine if you will that we did have our own private insurance and were covered fully for our loss. So now there is no monetary considerations at play. Now here is the kicker... I would still be upset with the loss of our luggage. And yes I would still want to know how and why.

 

There is no reasonable explanation to explain the disappearance of both of our bags.

 

The reasonable explanation is that the bag was either inadvertently or deliberately taken by someone else. Not much else than that.

 

I don't blame you for being upset, but being upset won't fix anything here. Any rational person would be upset at losing luggage. If you had insurance you'd be remunerated for the money you are out for the luggage. You didn't, so you won't. It's just that simple.

 

It seems to be that HAL suggested you use insurance, and then told you they'd pay a remainder that insurance didn't pay. Seems to me like that $100 per person would be representative of a deductible amount, hence the word remainder. I do not see their letter as a promise to pay in lieu of insurance.

 

Quite frankly, many complaints I read on CC revolve around people NOT taking adequate insurance coverage and then looking at how to complain to or expose the cruise line to negative publicity to extort money out of them. We always purchase insurance. We hope to never HAVE to use it, but if we DO need to, we know what is covered and how it will be handled. We do not place ourselves at the goodwill of the cruiseline or beg or cajole them into special dispensation. I'm also getting a bit sick of my insurance premiums and payments to cruiselines subsidizing goodwill gestures towards those that do not elect to take the same coverages.

 

A tip for the future; first photo on camera is our contact information. Second photo is first piece of luggage, third photo, next piece of luggage. I make sure our names are not only on the luggage tags but also inside the luggage. The straps keep the luggage together in event of zipper breakage and help to identify our bags in a unique way. Having photos means showing someone exactly what is missing.

 

I do hope your bags somehow materialize and that you get back items that you feel are irreplaceable, but as to compensation you elected to forgo that coverage. Just like the casino; you gambled and lost.

[rochelle_s]

As I stated already, it does seem odd that your two suitcases both turned up missing. Then I see that you had $4000 in items in one of them, so I was wondering if you had anything very valuable (like electronics, etc) in one or both of them? Could this be the reason they disappeared?

 

My brother used to work in baggage for a major airline and he told me soe terrible stories on what goes on.

 

My mothers most valuable item was her back up trifocal glasses.

 

Mine unfortunately was a silver rope necklace. I would never usually put anything like that in my suitcase but in this situation on the last formal night I had taken off my jewelry and placed it in my evening bag. It was one of the last items I had put in the suitcase. My intention was to trade out the space with my toiletry bag in the morning prior to checking the suitcase in at the airport.

 

Fortunately my electronics, laptop and iphone were with me.

 

 

Rochelle

[cbr663]

I know how frustrating (and costly) having luggage go missing is - and HAL's responses have only added to your problem. Do you think that bringing to the elevator - rather than leaving them in the hall outside your cabin might be involved? That should not in any way justify the loss - or HAL's unhelpful responses.

 

This was my first thought. Taking the bags to the elevator and handing them off to any steward who happen to be there is not the normal procedure. So many of the processes on the ships are repetitive and they work because of the repetition. Any break in the repetition and the process breaks down.