How Does RCI Treat Their Employees?

[Ocean Boy]

I'll help you out here, Leaveitall;

 

 

Nice post... thanks.

[Cruzaholic41]

Glad to help, just got back from sea this week.

 

I also really appreciate your posts. You and Aquahound seem to be our resident experts when it comes to behind the scenes stuff - you on logisitics/technicals, him on regulations/laws.

[mommabean]

May your life suck and you go bankrupt if you are one of those that spends too much on tipping the staff!!!!!!

 

I understand your point. But I believe one can never be too generous, when it's by choice, not force, but it is possible to be too tight.

 

Gina

[pinkroses]

I think that they are treated well and fairly, yes they do work hard and longer hours than most that cruise. However many of them have worked on board for many years and obviously keep coming back for more. Also we have witnessed many being promoted over the years to Middle and Upper Management posts, so yes I think quite well :D

 

You did great! I chased that stupid bug around my screen trying to get rid of it ! Now who is stupid!?:rolleyes:

[LuckiStac13*Majesty*]

I too have several good friends that work for Royal Caribbean, and also several that have retired from RCI. Those friends include people from Miami/Pier Management, and also from Guest Relations, Dining Room and Housekeeping departments.

 

Obviously, we all know life is not perfect and earning a living sometimes isn't fun or without problems. But the majority of my friends really are and have been pleased with their careers with the company. It is very, very hard work with sometimes poor/demanding conditions, also extremely long hours without a single (full) day off for months at a time. They work for their tips. They're away from their families for the majority of their lives, which is very hard. But they get to travel the world, meet so many people from different walks of life, and earn a good living. Much more, usually, than they would make at home.

 

All of the people I know who have retired look back on their days on ships with extremely fond memories and really miss it. It's a special kind of environment, of which I'm sure most of us can attest to as passengers. The crew enjoy it too, for the most part.

 

You'll always have disgruntled employees, no matter what company it is, but I think the majority of crew members and staff are treated pretty well.

Edited August 21, 2014 by LuckiStac13*Majesty*

[TEXASMUNK]

thank you for your added comments...Do ya think I may have hit a nerve? Have we uncovered a staff stiffer? LOL

[hirent]

We took a behind the scenes tour on Carnival and saw a portion of the lives that the crew members live. The HR manager who was the hostess for the tour was from South Africa and had been in the cruise industry for a number of years. Our waitress was from Romania and she was in her 12th year with Carnival; she had a 17 year old daughter back home and sent money home.

What we learned was, most of the cruise industry is similar (RC and Carnival more so). The typical contract is 6 months on ship and 2 months off. Almost all crew have their next contract in hand before they finish their current one and leave for home.

The money that they make is almost exclusively savings, since they don't have to pay rent, mortgage, utilities etc., plus food is free/included. Interesting thing about food, crew menus are usually on a 28-day cycle. Most crew wouldn't be eating food like this back in their home countries nor in unlimited quantity.

It is hard work but they have to work in shifts and labor laws don't allow them to work more than 8 hours in any given 24 hour period. Typically it was 4 hours on, 8 hours off, 4 hours on and 8 hours off. Shorter work shifts but requires a lot of adjusting.

All in all, if they take a liking to it (and most do), they make & save a lot of money compared to what they could back home.

Edited August 21, 2014 by hirent

[chengkp75]

We took a behind the scenes tour on Carnival and saw a portion of the lives that the crew members live. The HR manager who was the hostess for the tour was from South Africa and had been in the cruise industry for a number of years. Our waitress was from Romania and she was in her 12th year with Carnival; she had a 17 year old daughter back home and sent money home.

What we learned was, most of the cruise industry is similar (RC and Carnival more so). The typical contract is 6 months on ship and 2 months off. Almost all crew have their next contract in hand before they finish their current one and leave for home.

The money that they make is almost exclusively savings, since they don't have to pay rent, mortgage, utilities etc., plus food is free/included. Interesting thing about food, crew menus are usually on a 28-day cycle. Most crew wouldn't be eating food like this back in their home countries nor in unlimited quantity.

It is hard work but they have to work in shifts and labor laws don't allow them to work more than 8 hours in any given 24 hour period. Typically it was 4 hours on, 8 hours off, 4 hours on and 8 hours off. Shorter work shifts but requires a lot of adjusting.

All in all, if they take a liking to it (and most do), they make & save a lot of money compared to what they could back home.

 

Some misleading ideas here. A cruise employment contract does not include any mention of the time off that the person takes. It is generally a one time thing (even for those who have come back for many years). The time that the crew takes off after a contract is their own decision, and is not paid.

 

Crew food is generally catered to the major ethnic types onboard, so the food is similar to what they eat back home (admittedly more of it, and free), and is nowhere near the quality of guest food.

 

You say they cannot work more than 8 hours in any 24, but then you say they work 8 on, 4 off, 8 on, and 4 off. That sounds to me like 16 hours in 24. And the IMO's STCW, which regulates the hours that can be worked by crew, allows the company to choose the work/rest regulation that they want to use, either regulating the maximum hours of work, or the minimum hours of rest. The maximum hours of work are: 14 hours in any 24, and 72 hours in any 7 day period (just over 10 hours per day). The minimum hours of rest are: 10 hours of rest in any 24 (14 hours of work) and 77 hours of rest in any 7 day period (11 hours of rest per day). Guess which one the cruise lines use? The minimum rest hour regime.

 

It is only within the last couple of years, since the implementation of the IMO's MLC 2006 labor convention that overtime was paid for hours in excess of 8 hours per day. And the base wage was reduced to make up for having a higher overtime wage, so that the result was no change to the gross wage. The IMO has set the minimum wage for seafarers as $585 per month.

 

If the crew is single, yes, the money can be considered nearly all savings, but if there is a family, then there is rent/mortgage, food, health care to pay for even while the crewmember is on the ship.

 

Yes, many crew are long time employees, and do the job to earn a good living, much like other "guest workers" from these countries do in foreign countries. It does, however, impose hardships on the crew in that they are away from family for extended periods.

[Bailey & Sophie]

How does the crew get back to their home? I would think that air fares back to, say, the Philippines, or Croatia (or wherever) would be very expensive and I don't think the cruise line pays for that. If they send money back home, how can they save money to go back and forth? Puzzling for me.

[Clarea]

How does the crew get back to their home? I would think that air fares back to, say, the Philippines, or Croatia (or wherever) would be very expensive and I don't think the cruise line pays for that. If they send money back home, how can they save money to go back and forth? Puzzling for me.

The last I heard, the cruise line pays one way, and I forget if it's to go home or come back to work.

[kwazi07]

How does the crew get back to their home? I would think that air fares back to, say, the Philippines, or Croatia (or wherever) would be very expensive and I don't think the cruise line pays for that. If they send money back home, how can they save money to go back and forth? Puzzling for me.

Clarea is right about the money, but he didn't mention the other aspect-the travel itself. The officers can fly out of port of call so they don't have to wait, but most have to wait until they are in the US again. Most crew out of PC fly out of MCO, Miami and FLL crew fly out of Miami. In addition, the cruise line does not arrange airfare conveniently--our steward said that usually they are routed from MCO to Philippines via Timbuktu ;)

[Clarea]

Clarea is right about the money, but he didn't mention the other aspect-the travel itself. The officers can fly out of port of call so they don't have to wait, but most have to wait until they are in the US again. Most crew out of PC fly out of MCO, Miami and FLL crew fly out of Miami. In addition, the cruise line does not arrange airfare conveniently--our steward said that usually they are routed from MCO to Philippines via Timbuktu ;)

That is true. I once saw a crewmembers routing and it was about 5 separate legs with two 12 hour periods in airports between flights.

[Bailey & Sophie]

That is true. I once saw a crewmembers routing and it was about 5 separate legs with two 12 hour periods in airports between flights.

Crazy. They must be exhausted when they get home.

[Clarea]

Crazy. They must be exhausted when they get home.

I think it would be worse coming to the ship, being exhausted and not being able to make up the sleep on the ship.

[mommabean]

The last I heard, the cruise line pays one way, and I forget if it's to go home or come back to work.

 

The company buys it to go home. Crew buys their own ticket back to the ship. That way if they skip out, it's on their own money, not the company's. It's their choice if they want to book a more convenient flight or the cheapest one through timbuktu as someone put it. ;)

 

Gina

[mommabean]

How does the crew get back to their home? I would think that air fares back to, say, the Philippines, or Croatia (or wherever) would be very expensive and I don't think the cruise line pays for that. If they send money back home, how can they save money to go back and forth? Puzzling for me.

 

RCI pays for the ticket home. If the crew wants to go back to work, it's up to them to set aside the money for that. Apparently most of them are very good at it since they seem to make it back to the ship.

 

Gina

[mommabean]

thank you for your added comments...Do ya think I may have hit a nerve? Have we uncovered a staff stiffer? LOL

 

Unfortunately I don't think it's a very hard thing to do.

 

Fortunately for the crew, a few of the passengers that experience their excellent service tend to make up for the tight ones. It's too bad there are those who will take advantages of others, be it the crew's service, or the other passenger's generosity, just to get their own entitlements, what they've earned, free perks, whatever they like to call it. Oh, booze.

 

Gina

[kwazi07]

Unfortunately I don't think it's a very hard thing to do.

 

Fortunately for the crew, a few of the passengers that experience their excellent service tend to make up for the tight ones. It's too bad there are those who will take advantages of others, be it the crew's service, or the other passenger's generosity, just to get their own entitlements, what they've earned, free perks, whatever they like to call it. Oh, booze.

 

Gina

 

I have to admit something I am not very proud of...on our first cruise (Carnival) we were planning to tip less than they recommend because we thought the recommended tip was crazy high. However, after seeing how hard those amazing crew members work, we just had to tip them. We actually tipped them a few dollars more. I don't understand how people see these hardworking people and still feel justified to tip less than recommended. :mad:

[mommabean]

I have to admit something I am not very proud of...on our first cruise (Carnival) we were planning to tip less than they recommend because we thought the recommended tip was crazy high. However, after seeing how hard those amazing crew members work, we just had to tip them. We actually tipped them a few dollars more. I don't understand how people see these hardworking people and still feel justified to tip less than recommended. :mad:

 

And I'm always embarrassed about my first cruise, thinking the tip had to be exact and counting out the dollars to make sure it was perfect. Like really - I didn't think I could at least round up?

 

There's a learning curve. Most of us are educable. Not all, but most. ;)

 

Gina

[wassup4565]

The short story is, these people work longer hours and for less wages than they would doing the same work in the US, or most other affluent countries. We can excuse that by saying, oh well, they're earning more than they would in their home countries.

 

But then we're saying some people deserve to earn less because they accidentally got born in the wrong countries, aren't we? Seems like that was a mistake they couldn't avoid, yes? So we cruise cheaply, because cheap labor is supplied by people who were born in the wrong place. I just think we should be honest about it.

 

Do we honestly think these people would leave their families behind for months at a time if they had a better choice, just so they could see the world? Maybe some would, but probably most wouldn't. Do we honestly think if they could find the same work at the same wage at home they wouldn't take that option? Do we honestly think these people could ever afford to take a cruise like we do? Do we honestly think they deserve less and we deserve more?

 

I can't correct the world's skewey way of deciding who has a good life and who doesn't. It's all macro economics and big commerce. I won the lottery and got born in the right place, so I get to take cruises instead of working in the laundry on a cruise ship.

 

But you can bet I tip widely. I won the birth lottery.

[fishtaco]

The short story is, these people work longer hours and for less wages than they would doing the same work in the US, or most other affluent countries. We can excuse that by saying, oh well, they're earning more than they would in their home countries.

 

But then we're saying some people deserve to earn less because they accidentally got born in the wrong countries, aren't we? Seems like that was a mistake they couldn't avoid, yes? So we cruise cheaply, because cheap labor is supplied by people who were born in the wrong place. I just think we should be honest about it.

 

Do we honestly think these people would leave their families behind for months at a time if they had a better choice, just so they could see the world? Maybe some would, but probably most wouldn't. Do we honestly think if they could find the same work at the same wage at home they wouldn't take that option? Do we honestly think these people could ever afford to take a cruise like we do? Do we honestly think they deserve less and we deserve more?

 

I can't correct the world's skewey way of deciding who has a good life and who doesn't. It's all macro economics and big commerce. I won the lottery and got born in the right place, so I get to take cruises instead of working in the laundry on a cruise ship.

 

But you can bet I tip widely. I won the birth lottery.

 

Try donations instead of tipping so widely to those who serve You!

 

Me to be honest about it feel the same rules apply to those born in countries less fortunate than us and not working for a cruise line, they serve our every need whilst on a land vacation to their land and they get worse conditions all around in comparison to cruise staff!

 

You just have to take a look at USA as an outsider to see that many people there are doing it a lot tougher than cruise ship employees so it seems there just isn't enough birth lotteries to win anywhere ;)

Edited August 22, 2014 by fishtaco

[Biker19]

. It's too bad there are those who will take advantages of others, be it the crew's service, or the other passenger's generosity, just to get their own entitlements, what they've earned, free perks, whatever they like to call it.

 

Imagine living in a world in which when you go to the cash register at the store you pay only what the price sticker says, a world in which you pay only what the taxi meter says, a world in which you pay only the price of the meal listed in the menu, yet when you step on a cruise ship you are expected to pay more than the sticker price. Most of the world outside of NA works that way and no amount of guilt tripping or morality police (or name calling) will change that cultural upbringing. :cool:

Edited August 22, 2014 by kemenyg

[Cruzaholic41]

It's too bad there are those who will take advantages of others, be it the crew's service, or the other passenger's generosity, just to get their own entitlements, what they've earned, free perks, whatever they like to call it. Oh, booze.

 

Ain't that the truth. But what can we do? Unfortunately, selfish people are everywhere. :( They'll rush to pay top dollar to cruise on the latest and greatest knowing darn well how the cruising gratuity process works, but then pull some self-entitled BS to justify stiffing the crew. Sad.

Edited August 22, 2014 by Cruzaholic41

[hirent]

Some misleading ideas here. A cruise employment contract does not include any mention of the time off that the person takes. It is generally a one time thing (even for those who have come back for many years). The time that the crew takes off after a contract is their own decision, and is not paid.

 

Crew food is generally catered to the major ethnic types onboard, so the food is similar to what they eat back home (admittedly more of it, and free), and is nowhere near the quality of guest food.

 

You say they cannot work more than 8 hours in any 24, but then you say they work 8 on, 4 off, 8 on, and 4 off. That sounds to me like 16 hours in 24. And the IMO's STCW, which regulates the hours that can be worked by crew, allows the company to choose the work/rest regulation that they want to use, either regulating the maximum hours of work, or the minimum hours of rest. The maximum hours of work are: 14 hours in any 24, and 72 hours in any 7 day period (just over 10 hours per day). The minimum hours of rest are: 10 hours of rest in any 24 (14 hours of work) and 77 hours of rest in any 7 day period (11 hours of rest per day). Guess which one the cruise lines use? The minimum rest hour regime.

 

It is only within the last couple of years, since the implementation of the IMO's MLC 2006 labor convention that overtime was paid for hours in excess of 8 hours per day. And the base wage was reduced to make up for having a higher overtime wage, so that the result was no change to the gross wage. The IMO has set the minimum wage for seafarers as $585 per month.

 

If the crew is single, yes, the money can be considered nearly all savings, but if there is a family, then there is rent/mortgage, food, health care to pay for even while the crewmember is on the ship.

 

Yes, many crew are long time employees, and do the job to earn a good living, much like other "guest workers" from these countries do in foreign countries. It does, however, impose hardships on the crew in that they are away from family for extended periods.

 

 

Good post & information.

But I never said they get two months of paid vacation; a contract inherently implies that you are paid only for the length of the contract. The information I posted was what we learned from the crew of Carnival. A typical employee would do a 6-month rotation and then take 2 months off before starting their next contract. This could of course vary from person to person. Some might want a longer break, some shorter depending on personal preference and what the company requires.

And the shifts on that particular ship (for most crew) was 4 hours, then 8 hours of break; you read it wrong. The shifts could of course be different for different crew members, officers, engineers etc.

 

Regarding on how hard they work: well, most of us work hard in our respective professions. Just because some work requires physical labor does not mean those people work more than others.

I'm in engineering and most people I know don't have 9-to-5 jobs anymore. We are in offices and the workplace until the job gets done, even on weekends; and there is no overtime pay like for hourly workers.

Athletes and movie stars are paid millions & millions. Do they work hard enough to be worth millions? No. They are just fortunate enough to work and be a part of a product that can earn millions while people like us are paying for it through higher prices on tickets and merchandise. Even on a sports team or movie/television production there is a big disparity in what each person is paid.

Case in point: the recent suit by Jimmy Graham of the New Orleans Saints pro football team. He wanted to get paid like a wide receiver instead of a tight end (the position he plays). A WR is paid more than a TE for similar kind of work (speaking in terms of labor).

 

There is always going to be a pay disparity in this world, nothing we can do will change it. Its just life!

 

For my part, I see tips & gratuities as part of the ticket price. And I'm glad the companies suggest the 'per day' total. This way I don't have to sit and figure out how much to tip each person and how much cash to carry.

Cheers!

Edited August 22, 2014 by hirent

[chengkp75]

Good post & information.

But I never said they get two months of paid vacation; a contract inherently implies that you are paid only for the length of the contract. The information I posted was what we learned from the crew of Carnival. A typical employee would do a 6-month rotation and then take 2 months off before starting their next contract. This could of course vary from person to person. Some might want a longer break, some shorter depending on personal preference and what the company requires.

And the shifts on that particular ship (for most crew) was 4 hours, then 8 hours of break; you read it wrong. The shifts could of course be different for different crew members, officers, engineers etc.

 

Regarding on how hard they work: well, most of us work hard in our respective professions. Just because some work requires physical labor does not mean those people work more than others.

I'm in engineering and most people I know don't have 9-to-5 jobs anymore. We are in offices and the workplace until the job gets done, even on weekends; and there is no overtime pay like for hourly workers.

Athletes and movie stars are paid millions & millions. Do they work hard enough to be worth millions? No. They are just fortunate enough to work and be a part of a product that can earn millions while people like us are paying for it through higher prices on tickets and merchandise. Even on a sports team or movie/television production there is a big disparity in what each person is paid.

Case in point: the recent suit by Jimmy Graham of the New Orleans Saints pro football team. He wanted to get paid like a wide receiver instead of a tight end (the position he plays). A WR is paid more than a TE for similar kind of work (speaking in terms of labor).

 

There is always going to be a pay disparity in this world, nothing we can do will change it. Its just life!

 

For my part, I see tips & gratuities as part of the ticket price. And I'm glad the companies suggest the 'per day' total. This way I don't have to sit and figure out how much to tip each person and how much cash to carry.

Cheers!

 

I was fairly sure you knew about the contract and vacation, but didn't want others to get the wrong idea. I had several in the engine gang who did 3 consecutive 10 month contracts before going home.

 

I don't believe that any cruise ship crewmember in the hotel department works only 8 hours a day. They may do 4 on, 8 off, and then 8 on, but given the fact that crew per passenger has not increased substantially, there is no way they could go from the traditional 14 hour day to 8. The days are frequently broken up for the hotel crew, as their particular jobs only require them to be working at certain hours. Housekeeping traditionally takes the afternoons off, bar staff have the mornings off, and restaurant workers normally only take two of three meals.

 

Deck and engine watchkeepers will stand 4 on, 8 off watches, but will usually have a 4 hour period of required overtime during one of the 8 hour rest periods. Deck and engine dayworkers will work 12-14 hours straight.

 

I know that after 11 weeks of 12 hour days, seven days a week, I'm ready to get off the ship, and when I was doing 4 month trips on the cruise ships, I was totally burned out by that time.

 

Junior officers have the ultimate perk of a single cabin, but you can literally stand in the middle of the room and hold your arms up and touch all four walls. There is a single bed, a student desk, a 2'x2' closet, and a sink. Shower and toilet shared with the room next door. I had a 3rd engineer from the Philippines who not only lived in this room for 20 months, but had his wife in there with him.