Compensation for Riviera Nurovirus Cruise

[buggins0402]

Again; I disagree. I don't believe that O owes any comp to those getting off the ship today. However, if O embark and sails a new cruise, with that ship, and they have a new outbreak of the virus on that ship, then O has been negligent, imo, and does owe compensation for those travelers. O has a problem, they know they have a problem, and they need to ensure the problem is resolved, imo.

 

I have been on three "sick" ships (two NCL and one Celebrity). Other than having food served in the buffet, more aggressive washy washy girls, and no salt and pepper shakers, I don't think it impacted our overall cruise experience. I was not even close to being inconvienced enough to expect compensation. In fact, I prefer the having the buffet selections served (as O does all the time.)

[vaitape]

Did you miss ports because of the virus?

[RJB]

No, they found a nifty way around it, they do not list port fees, taxes as a line item on the invoice. The O way.

 

Is it really legal? They say it is, but has anyone gone back to court to test weather Oceania is legally complying with their settlement? I would like to see someone try and then it will put an end to what Oceania needs to do or not do.

[rallydave]

Did you miss ports because of the virus?

 

That is a question that none of us can answer. Based on reports from the ship, the ship was denied entry to Bermuda due to the Noro and according to the Bermuda newspaper, the ship skipped Bermuda of their own accord.

 

Who you believe answers your question and you may be right or wrong.

[pinotlover]

Buggins;

 

Would you have been so flippant about it had you been one of those that caught the virus?:rolleyes:

[RJB]

That is a question that none of us can answer. Based on reports from the ship, the ship was denied entry to Bermuda due to the Noro and according to the Bermuda newspaper, the ship skipped Bermuda of their own accord.

 

Who you believe answers your question and you may be right or wrong.

 

Does not really matter as either way they are saving the money that they would have paid in port fees. The money that their passengers paid to them.

[rallydave]

Does not really matter as either way they are saving the money that they would have paid in port fees. The money that their passengers paid to them.

 

Absolutely completely correct RJB. Was simply answering another's question. As you accurately stated, the return of Port Fees and Taxes is due the passenger for any reason the ship misses a port and many cruise lines do just that.

 

It's not rocket science for the Purser to credit each cabin and suite's account. A very simple process much the same way gratuities are charged or anything else that is charged to a large number of passengers. Keeping the money enriches the cruise line and while it isn't a lot of money going back to each passenger, in the whole even for an Oceania ship, it can and often does amount to tens of thousands of dollars.

[buggins0402]

Did you miss ports because of the virus?

 

 

No, which makes the situation that the most recent cruise had very different. I was responding to the thought that there should be blanket compensation for all on the next Riviera cruise....which has not yet missed a port.

[buggins0402]

Buggins;

 

Would you have been so flippant about it had you been one of those that caught the virus?:rolleyes:

 

But, you seem to be saying that all people on the next cruise should be compensated in some way if there is Noro....when we really don't know how much people will be inconvienced.

[RJB]

But, you seem to be saying that all people on the next cruise should be compensated in some way if there is Noro....when we really don't know how much people will be inconvienced.

 

Hope no one on the next cruise will be inconvienced so it could be a moot point.

[kazu]

Did you miss ports because of the virus?

 

 

If you are referring to the Riviera cruise where the noro was, yes, the ship missed Bermuda - 2 days of it as Bermuda REFUSED to allow the ship and it's passengers on the island (their Ministry of Health).

[LHT28]

Hope no one on the next cruise will be inconvienced so it could be a moot point.

It may happen or may not

 

WASH YOUR HANDS

[kazu]

That is a question that none of us can answer. Based on reports from the ship, the ship was denied entry to Bermuda due to the Noro and according to the Bermuda newspaper, the ship skipped Bermuda of their own accord.

 

 

 

Who you believe answers your question and you may be right or wrong.

 

 

I suspect the newspaper reported what it did with a mutual agreement. Quite sure Riviera and O did not want it plastered in a publication that they had a sick ship that was refused to dock.

 

I was onboard and I can assure you I recall the Captain's words at dinner very clearly. The Bermuda Ministry of Health would not grant Riviera permission to dock nor her passengers on the island due to the outbreak on the ship.

[RJB]

I suspect the newspaper reported what it did with a mutual agreement. Quite sure Riviera and O did not want it plastered in a publication that they had a sick ship that was refused to dock.

 

I was onboard and I can assure you I recall the Captain's words at dinner very clearly. The Bermuda Ministry of Health would not grant Riviera permission to dock nor her passengers on the island due to the outbreak on the ship.

 

I think we should believe you !!!

[tommiroke]

I suspect the newspaper reported what it did with a mutual agreement. Quite sure Riviera and O did not want it plastered in a publication that they had a sick ship that was refused to dock.

 

I was onboard and I can assure you I recall the Captain's words at dinner very clearly. The Bermuda Ministry of Health would not grant Riviera permission to dock nor her passengers on the island due to the outbreak on the ship.

 

Absolutely no reason not to believe you kazu, the question is do we believe the Captain's announcement or do we believe the newspaper? Either possibility is equally possible.

[kazu]

Absolutely no reason not to believe you kazu, the question is do we believe the Captain's announcement or do we believe the newspaper? Either possibility is equally possible.

 

 

Since the Captain told a roll call member that he and head office had been fighting all day to get us into Bermuda I tend to believe the Captain in this case.

 

I cannot fathom "choosing" to bypass a key port where passengers were not only going to spend two days but the first port after crossing the TA.

 

I also think that they might have let the "choose" out or someone at head office did or whatever to delicately skip around the outbreak on board. Choose to skip a port sounds a LOT better than forbidden to enter due to health reasons - JMO though ;)

[hondorner]

Is it really legal? They say it is, but has anyone gone back to court to test weather Oceania is legally complying with their settlement? I would like to see someone try and then it will put an end to what Oceania needs to do or not do.

Technically, you are not paying port fees or taxes. You paid a cruise fare, and Oceania is paying all the port fees and taxes out of their operating funds.

 

It is exactly the same as not paying for individual entertainment shows. If a show has to be canceled, you are not compensated because you never paid an individual fee in the first place.

 

There are many things that are included in the fare. If one does not use any of those things, whether through choice or circumstances, one does not expect compensation for the individual event.

 

Oceania has always been willing and able to offer reasonable compensation for extraordinary events; for example, the compensation provided to contemporary guests impacted by the Insignia engine fire and compensation to future guests when the first three segments of the World Cruise were canceled. However, a missed port is not normally an extraordinary event, and the situation is covered in the Terms and Conditions.

 

I'm certain the legality of incorporating the port fees and taxes into the overall cruise fare has been thoroughly examined by corporate attorneys. I personally believe the amounts are small and the costs of reimbursement would be higher than those costs. If so, is anyone suggesting that Oceania should lose money in order to reimburse what most would consider a pittance?

 

No, I'm not compensated by Oceania in any form. I would make exactly the same arguments about any organization in the same situation.

[tommiroke]

I personally believe the amounts are small and the costs of reimbursement would be higher than those costs. If so, is anyone suggesting that Oceania should lose money in order to reimburse what most would consider a pittance?

 

 

What is different Don in regards to Port fees and taxes they are different than the cancellation of a entertainment show or other onboard activities. The entertainers are paid whether or not the show occurs, food is purchased based on feeding everyone while Port Fees and taxes are specifically paid to a port. Plus, Oceania as well as several other cruise lines based in Florida signed a consent agreement that money for Port Fees and taxes would only be paid to Government Agencies. Keeping those fees and taxes by any of the cruise lines is in violation of the agreement signed.

 

As to the information that is quoted above, another poster stated that while the dollars are relatively small for each passenger, they amount to tens of thousands of dollars being kept by the cruise line. As to it costing a cruise line to reimburse people for the fees and taxes, the reimbursements would be simply added to the passengers accounts by the on board Purser and his or her staff who are already paid to be there so any costs to reimburse the passengers are probably zero and if you want to be picky, there may be unidentifiable costs like electricity, paper, pens, etc. but, the cruise line will not lose any money by refunding the money to the individual accounts so that portion of your post is certainly a red herring and have been on several other cruise lines where ports were missed and in every case, the Port Fees and taxes were reimbursed to our on line accounts so it is done and in more than once case.

[Christine Frances]

Celebrity will refund port fees if missed. Also if you are confined to you cabin with Noro you are credited a per diem rate for the number of days spent in your cabin. Medical visits are free for Gastro issues and they monitor your sea pass card if you are confined to your cabin.

[RJB]

Technically, you are not paying port fees or taxes. You paid a cruise fare, and Oceania is paying all the port fees and taxes out of their operating funds.

 

It is exactly the same as not paying for individual entertainment shows. If a show has to be canceled, you are not compensated because you never paid an individual fee in the first place.

 

There are many things that are included in the fare. If one does not use any of those things, whether through choice or circumstances, one does not expect compensation for the individual event.

 

Oceania has always been willing and able to offer reasonable compensation for extraordinary events; for example, the compensation provided to contemporary guests impacted by the Insignia engine fire and compensation to future guests when the first three segments of the World Cruise were canceled. However, a missed port is not normally an extraordinary event, and the situation is covered in the Terms and Conditions.

 

I'm certain the legality of incorporating the port fees and taxes into the overall cruise fare has been thoroughly examined by corporate attorneys. I personally believe the amounts are small and the costs of reimbursement would be higher than those costs. If so, is anyone suggesting that Oceania should lose money in order to reimburse what most would consider a pittance?

 

No, I'm not compensated by Oceania in any form. I would make exactly the same arguments about any organization in the same situation.

No reason for me to think you are compensated bye Oceania. Just expressing your opinion. My opinion is that Oceania is paying the port fees from the cruise fare they are charging you. As for the legal issues, Oceania's attorneys are telling them what they want to hear. A court might feel differently. Every civil case in court has two sides to its, with each sides attorneys telling his client that they will win. Be interested to see how that would come out.

[nancygp]

Celebrity will refund port fees if missed. Also if you are confined to you cabin with Noro you are credited a per diem rate for the number of days spent in your cabin. Medical visits are free for Gastro issues and they monitor your sea pass card if you are confined to your cabin.

 

Crystal does the same!! No sea pass cards on Crystal. Port fees are not included in the "cruise" fare as they are an additional fee to the cruise fare.

 

Nancy

[vaitape]

If you are referring to the Riviera cruise where the noro was, yes, the ship missed Bermuda - 2 days of it as Bermuda REFUSED to allow the ship and it's passengers on the island (their Ministry of Health).

 

Yes we were referring to the Riviera cruise that was refused/denied/whatever the current acceptable term.

 

If the ship is not allowed to make port, are the port fees/taxes charged anyway? If they aren't, they should be accredited to the pax.

 

Why does Oceania keep the port fees/taxes if their ships aren't allowed to make port?

[dibel]

While I certainly understand how a virus can spread on a ship, what really shocked me on this cruise was the lack of sanitation enforcement from the very beginning. I've cruised widely but never on Oceania. When we boarded the ship in Barcelona, there was no one to monitor the disinfectant procedures. I continually watched people board the ship after visiting ports with no one from the cruise line monitoring. No warm wash clothes on return unlike what I was used to on other cruises. Even after the outbreak, people were not REQUIRED to sanitize before entering the dining rooms....no one on duty in the gym to monitor. Yesterday, while enroute home, I met a couple on the ship who sailed from Venice to Barcelona. They told me a woman was violently ill on the first cruise and they conjectured that the virus began there...so apparently, Norovirus WAS on the first cruise. If anyone checks the CDC Stats, you'll see that it was far worse than the cruise line let us know. In fact, the real issue is that virtually little information was available. Not good. I put a lot of blame on management for how poorly this cruise was handled. I will not sail this line again.

[sail7seas]

HAL refunds port fees when a ship misses a port.

[roothy123]

Sometimes you get more from a cruise than you pay for, sometimes you get less, and occasionally you get just what you think you'll get. I really don't understand why people want to be reimbursed for every little thing that goes wrong when most things go right, or there are extras given to you that you didn't expect. After all, it's not unusual for 6% of a restaurant's or ship's diners to get a stomach illness, and it's not unusual for people on a ship to miss a port for various reasons. If perfection and no surprises are your goal, it's best to stay at home where you can better control what you eat, who you associate with, and where you go. I also don't understand why people expect that one particular cruise line will do things exactly how other cruise ships do things. I don't want Oceania to drop its served Terrace Cafe policy, or use plastic trays there, or make people departing at 5 AM for a flight take all their luggage off themselves like some other cruise lines do. If we miss an occasional port (even if it's on a TA and I'm yearning for land) or some people get sick, it's not ideal. I'm NOT going to ask to be reimbursed, however. The same kind of talk happened on the new Viking Ocean cruise ship after the ship (launched in April) had some problems in Europe. Money! We want money - and a 100% refund is not enough! Ridiculous. I hate how litigious some Americans have gotten.

 

Here's what CDC has to say about the incident on Riviera:

Investigation Update on the Oceania Riviera

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Cruise Line: Oceania Cruises

 

Cruise Ship: Oceania Riviera

 

Voyage Dates: November 18 – December 2, 2015

 

Number of passengers who have reported being ill during the voyage out of total number of passengers onboard: 74 of 1,160 (6.38%)

 

Number of crew who have reported being ill during the voyage out of total number of crew onboard: 12 of 776 (1.55%)

 

Predominant symptoms: vomiting, diarrhea

 

Causative agent: Norovirus

 

Actions: In response to the outbreak, Oceania Cruises and the crew aboard the ship reported the following actions:

 

Increasing cleaning and disinfection procedures according to their outbreak prevention and response plan,

Collected stool specimens from passenger and crew gastrointestinal illness cases for testing,

Making twice daily reports of gastrointestinal illness cases to the VSP,

Is consulting with CDC on plans for their comprehensive sanitation procedures in Miami, FL on December 2, 2015, including:

planning staged disembarkation for active cases to limit the opportunity of illness transmission to well guests, and

planning for sanitation of terminal and transport infection control procedures.

Three CDC Vessel Sanitation Program environmental health officers will board the ship in Miami, FL on December 2, 2015 to conduct an environmental health assessment and evaluate the outbreak and response activities. Specimens have been collected and tested onboard using a norovirus rapid test; results were positive for norovirus. The specimens will be sent to CDC for additional testing.

Edited December 3, 2015 by roothy123