Letter I sent Carnival over Adult Only Pools

[SNJCruisers]

Carnival caters to new travelers and families, but there are other lines that cater to an older adult crowd...They have their nitch

Carnival's primary family oriented cruise line competitors....Royal Caribbean, Norwegian and even Disney all have an adults only pool in the majority of their fleet. No need to compare to the older demographics of Princess, Celebrity and Holland American.

[SNJCruisers]

Carnival is clearly the leader in family cruises.

Ever hear of Disney?

[jimbo5544]

Ever hear of Disney?

 

 

By raw numbers not even close.

 

 

Sent from my iPhone

[AdGuyMG]

 

Ever hear of Disney?

 

Disney has 4 ships and sails 13,000 people per week. Carnival has 26 ships and sails 58,000 people per week.

 

Which one are you saying is the leader in attracting families?

[Aquahound]

Carnival is clearly the leader in family cruises.

 

Clearly? In what way would you say CCL is "clearly the leader" in family cruises? Product? I'd say Disney has more of a family product. Numbers? RCI carries more passengers.

 

I agree CCL is a family line, but I'm not sure how you came to the "clearly the leader" conclusion.

[Sonja01]

I think this is a fantastic change. Would certainly make me consider Carnival. A step in the right direction in a modern world. Discriminating against a group of people, when there is nothing to protect that group or people from (such as gambling) is ludicrous.

From the comments I've read on his thread it seems that folks have a problem with the patenting choices of some adults, not the presence of well behaved children. We live in a world made up of many types of people of many ages. Give me happy kids over revoltingly behaved drunken adults any day!

 

 

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[Cyber Kat]

And how many people have threatened to leave over the smoking ban on balconies...tablecloths...water bottles...the changes in earning platinum levels...taking away the past guest party...etc you name it. People on these board think they are a majority of carnival cruisers.... this board is an extremely small section of travelers on carnival.

 

 

 

Carnival caters to new travelers and families, but there are other lines that cater to an older adult crowd...They have their nitch

 

 

Then they won't care when we move on. And we won't care that they don't care, because we will have moved on to other lines.

 

They might care when a number of us sell our stock. [emoji12]

 

 

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[Cyber Kat]

Just from another perspective here... What I feel like Carnival is doing here is really making this the "family brand". Carnival has other brands people... they would love for everyone to cruise where they are most comfortable (within the Carnival parent company that is). Princess has wonderful adult only areas.

 

I get it, I understand why people are upset, but, I also understand what Carnival is doing here. If a certain % of Carnival passengers travel with kids and are complaining that the pool is too crowded, they are going to cater to that higher % group. They know that they can offer their other lines to people who don't want to be bothered with kids. My wife and I did princess for our honeymoon, loved it. It really wasn't that much more expensive.

 

Now, all Carnival needs to do to help people make the move to the better suited line is to open up the loyalty programs across lines so that you aren't penalized after being very high up with one line and wanting to switch. As long as they get your money, I don't know why they would care.

 

 

But what about people who decide to go to other lines that are NOT part of the Carnival family? Wonder if they are considering that.

 

 

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[Badfinger]

Then they won't care when we move on. And we won't care that they don't care, because we will have moved on to other lines.

 

They might care when a number of us sell our stock. [emoji12]

 

 

Sent from my iPod touch using Forums

 

Too funny. Do you know how the stock market works? When you sell your stock...somebody else buys it...maybe an individual investor such as yourself, a mutual fund, etc. And if nobody else wants to buy it...you cannot sell it (unlikely). Carnival is under no obligation to buy unwanted share back from investors. It has absolutely zero impact to Carnival Corporation. They have about 500 millions shares issued and the average daily trade volume is 3.5 million shares or so. Yeah...sell your couple hundred shares..that will show them what's what! Round up a couple hundred of your CC friends and sell all your shares and really show them. That would increase the daily volume on one day by 1% at most.

[S.S.Oceanlover]

I think this is a fantastic change. Would certainly make me consider Carnival. A step in the right direction in a modern world. Discriminating against a group of people, when there is nothing to protect that group or people from (such as gambling) is ludicrous.

From the comments I've read on his thread it seems that folks have a problem with the patenting choices of some adults, not the presence of well behaved children. We live in a world made up of many types of people of many ages. Give me happy kids over revoltingly behaved drunken adults any day!

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

 

You should patent this phrase.:)

 

Bill

[SNJCruisers]

Disney has 4 ships and sails 13,000 people per week. Carnival has 26 ships and sails 58,000 people per week.

 

Which one are you saying is the leader in attracting families?

I am talking percentages. Over the course of a given year, over 95% of people that cruise Disney are families and that percentage is probably low. With Carnival, 17 weeks out of the year, consisting of summer break and holidays consists of 75% families. The other 35 weeks out of the year consist of 25% families. This would correlate to about 60% adults and 40% families over the course of the year, approx 1.8 million and 1.2 million using the 58 k per week that you stated.

In general, when you think of Disney, you think of Mickey and families and kids with smiles. Does anyone think of families as the first thing that pops in your mind when you think of Carnival?

[lizardhowson]

Lots of naive posters here (i.e. Carnival stock, Carnival market share/demographics, Cruise Critic's impact on the Carnival brand)

 

Go ahead, cancel your cruises, forfeit your deposits, bombard Carnival with letters, petitions, phone calls and ill fitting bathing suits !

 

In reality, the diamonds & platinums will continue to sail Carnival because it makes them feel special, because they are older, set in their ways and do not adapt to change well. Of the 2% of adult Carnival passengers who actually get into the hot tubs or the pools and will potentially be most affected by this change, a few may wander off to other lines.

 

But Carnival ships will continue to sail full.

/Drama

[Party.of.4.NY>>>FL]

I am talking percentages. Over the course of a given year, over 95% of people that cruise Disney are families and that percentage is probably low. With Carnival, 17 weeks out of the year, consisting of summer break and holidays consists of 75% families. The other 35 weeks out of the year consist of 25% families. This would correlate to about 60% adults and 40% families over the course of the year, approx 1.8 million and 1.2 million using the 58 k per week that you stated.

In general, when you think of Disney, you think of Mickey and families and kids with smiles. Does anyone think of families as the first thing that pops in your mind when you think of Carnival?

Yes. In general when I think of Disney Cruise line the first thing that comes to mind are families. More importantly, the second thing that comes to mind is the outrageous prices those families happily pay to sail on their ships. These prices have CEOs of competing cruise lines foaming at the mouth. It is perhaps a business model that they are trying to duplicate. Parents' perspective of "value" becomes totally skewed when it comes to their children. They will pay almost anything if it promises to put a smile on little Susie's face. But until competitors can create competing I.P. (intellectual property), that will never happen for them. Dr. Suess, Shrek, etc. are no match for Mickey, Minnie, and the rest of the gang. This change in pool policy is nothing more than Carnival doing their best to play with the hand they were dealt. If the CEOs were smart they would be on phone with J.K. Rowling (or whomever owns the rights now) trying to secure some Harry Potter I.P. on board their ships. (Just take a look at the success Universal has had in competing with Disney in the "city that Walt built)

 

Side note:

I think many would agree that the casinos on board ships are a cash cow for the cruise lines. If Carnival (or any other cruise line) announced they were considering closing their casinos and converting them to, oh I don't know, an indoor interactive playground for kids, there would probably be a huge uproar on these boards saying "this is outrageous" or "I'm taking my business elsewhere". Why then, does Disney not have any casinos on their ships? I'll tell you why. Kids man, kids! That's where the money is!

 

Edited to add:

Also something to consider:

Think of Las Vegas. A city that relies on tourism to flourish. Many decades ago it was considered an adult destination. Fast forward to today, the image they are trying to convey is that of a family destination. One that the whole family will enjoy.

Edited April 15, 2017 by Party.of.4.NY>>>FL
Adding comments.

[DirtyDawg]

I am so upset over this ! If I wouldn't lose my deposit I would cancel and book with Royal!!!! If you want to send complaint email here is address..... guestsolutionssupport@carnival dot com

 

 

Dear Carnival,

Today I called your customer service department to confirm there will be no more adult only pools. This is a very upsetting matter for our family. I have nothing against children as we have 3 adult sons. However when I book a cruise I want to have a pool that is for adults. I can tell you this will be my last cruise with Carnival unless this rule is changed. Royal has adult only area as does Disney, Celebrity and so many others. Cruisecritic message boards and others are in agreement with me on this matter.

 

What reasoning is for this change? You are only catering to only families with children. We are middle aged with grown children, so having to share a pool with kids is NOT fun for our demographic. How about young couples or just couples on a cruise? Sorry this change has been made but I guess if there is enough of us leaving Carnival then maybe you will reconsider.

 

Sincerely UPSET customer

 

Hi OP, I'm a member of Cruise Critic and I agree with this change by Carnival so I do not agree with you. Therefore, not all of Cruise Critic message board agrees with you. Please amend your letter and resubmit it to Carnival. Thank You.

[okgirl]

Since almost all ships have a Serenity Adults only area I don't see a problem with the change....It was rarely enforced anyway.

[crusinpsychRN]

24 ships in the fleet...22 have Serenity...2 have Serenity with a pool, Pride and Sunshine. So 2/24 adult only pool.....24/24 kids pool.....24/24 family pool.

 

All Spirit class have pool in Serenity.

[crusinpsychRN]

Since almost all ships have a Serenity Adults only area I don't see a problem with the change....It was rarely enforced anyway.

 

Many don't have pools, just hot tubs. I don't go in the pools, especially when they take on a greenish tinge...

[crusinpsychRN]

Lots of naive posters here (i.e. Carnival stock, Carnival market share/demographics, Cruise Critic's impact on the Carnival brand)

 

Go ahead, cancel your cruises, forfeit your deposits, bombard Carnival with letters, petitions, phone calls and ill fitting bathing suits !

 

In reality, the diamonds & platinums will continue to sail Carnival because it makes them feel special, because they are older, set in their ways and do not adapt to change well. Of the 2% of adult Carnival passengers who actually get into the hot tubs or the pools and will potentially be most affected by this change, a few may wander off to other lines.

 

But Carnival ships will continue to sail full.

/Drama

 

The Diamond with most sailing days on one of my cruises was 29 y/o. Not older, not all set in their ways and not all do not adapt to change well. Change is one thing, rotten changes are another. If you have a white room and paint it light blue that's easy to adapt to. Removing things one comes to expect on a cruise is not easy to like and therefore adapt to.

[crusinpsychRN]

I think this is a fantastic change. Would certainly make me consider Carnival. A step in the right direction in a modern world. Discriminating against a group of people, when there is nothing to protect that group or people from (such as gambling) is ludicrous.

From the comments I've read on his thread it seems that folks have a problem with the patenting choices of some adults, not the presence of well behaved children. We live in a world made up of many types of people of many ages. Give me happy kids over revoltingly behaved drunken adults any day!

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Forums

 

Seems to me it's discriminating against the adults as there is another pool kids use and a kiddy pool on many ships. Now no adult pool. Who's getting the worse deal?

[Cuervosar]

Then they won't care when we move on. And we won't care that they don't care, because we will have moved on to other lines.

 

They might care when a number of us sell our stock. [emoji12]

 

 

Sent from my iPod touch using Forums

 

Actually, they won't notice at all unless you happen to own oh, a million shares or so. The only power a stockholder has is if they own enough shares to exert power over the Board of Directors, and could influence decision making at that level.

 

Nice try though.

[S.S.Oceanlover]

Lots of naive posters here (i.e. Carnival stock, Carnival market share/demographics, Cruise Critic's impact on the Carnival brand)

 

Go ahead, cancel your cruises, forfeit your deposits, bombard Carnival with letters, petitions, phone calls and ill fitting bathing suits !

 

In reality, the diamonds & platinums will continue to sail Carnival because it makes them feel special, because they are older, set in their ways and do not adapt to change well. Of the 2% of adult Carnival passengers who actually get into the hot tubs or the pools and will potentially be most affected by this change, a few may wander off to other lines.

 

But Carnival ships will continue to sail full.

/Drama

 

Not ALL. I have been Platinum with CCL for some time but I haven't cruised on one of their ships since 2011. I have one booked now for next year but not because it makes me feel special. It just fits into our schedule for next year.

 

We have mostly cruised RCI, with a couple NCL, and a couple Princess ships.:)

 

Bill

[SNJCruisers]

Lots of naive posters here

In reality, the diamonds & platinums will continue to sail Carnival because it makes them feel special, because they are older, set in their ways and do not adapt to change well.

You can add yourself to the list of naive posters. Many on here are guilty of making sweeping generalizations in order to attempt to make a point regarding a particular topic. I am Platinum...older all depends upon who you're comparing me to..set in my ways at times, but Carnival certainly does not make me feel special and I do adapt to change well.

If you expand my signature you'll notice that 17 out of my first 22 cruises were on Carnival, but only 1 out of my last 8 including my upcoming one on the NCL Escape will have been on Carnival. There are many cruisers that are loyal to one line, have seen them on the boards with Carnival, Royal and NCL. Since the percentage of cruisers in general that are on the boards is small, the percentage of those are even much smaller that put all of their eggs in one basket and only sail on one line.

[Elaine5715]

Yes. In general when I think of Disney Cruise line the first thing that comes to mind are families. More importantly' date=' the second thing that comes to mind is the outrageous prices those families happily pay to sail on their ships. These prices have CEOs of competing cruise lines foaming at the mouth. It is perhaps a business model that they are trying to duplicate. Parents' perspective of "value" becomes totally skewed when it comes to their children. They will pay almost anything if it promises to put a smile on little Susie's face. But until competitors can create competing I.P. (intellectual property), that will never happen for them. Dr. Suess, Shrek, etc. are no match for Mickey, Minnie, and the rest of the gang. This change in pool policy is nothing more than Carnival doing their best to play with the hand they were dealt. If the CEOs were smart they would be on phone with J.K. Rowling (or whomever owns the rights now) trying to secure some Harry Potter I.P. on board their ships. (Just take a look at the success Universal has had in competing with Disney in the "city that Walt built)

 

Side note:

I think many would agree that the casinos on board ships are a cash cow for the cruise lines. If Carnival (or any other cruise line) announced they were considering closing their casinos and converting them to, oh I don't know, an indoor interactive playground for kids, there would probably be a huge uproar on these boards saying "this is outrageous" or "I'm taking my business elsewhere". Why then, does Disney not have any casinos on their ships? I'll tell you why. Kids man, kids! That's where the money is!

 

Edited to add:

Also something to consider:

Think of Las Vegas. A city that relies on tourism to flourish. Many decades ago it was considered an adult destination. Fast forward to today, the image they are trying to convey is that of a family destination. One that the whole family will enjoy.[/quote']

Las Vegas is RUNNING away from the "family friendly" destination. It was a loss leader and saw a drop in revenues. While DCL does attract families, it is not 95% and there are Adult Only areas that are enforced. With only 4 ships, DCL has not yet installed a casino but with the introduction of alcohol into the Magic Kingdom now, things are a'changing in Walt's World.

[Elaine5715]

Actually, they won't notice at all unless you happen to own oh, a million shares or so. The only power a stockholder has is if they own enough shares to exert power over the Board of Directors, and could influence decision making at that level.

 

Nice try though.

Even small shareholders can vote against current Board Members. Next year, when the ballots come out, vote no. A few thousand no votes might not change the slate but it might get their attention.

[bingomamma19]

Clearly? In what way would you say CCL is "clearly the leader" in family cruises? Product? I'd say Disney has more of a family product. Numbers? RCI carries more passengers.

 

I agree CCL is a family line, but I'm not sure how you came to the "clearly the leader" conclusion.

 

In value and cost--families choose Carnival. Disney is 3x the cost---rich families choose Disney :) Plus even as a parent myself...I don't want to be a on a cruise line that is kid themed and where most people bring kids. I like the balance of Carnival. (and the casino :) )

 

I am one of the few that is not thrilled by anything Disney--the parks are obnoxiously expensive and not entertaining to me--my 11 year old didn't like it. I had checked in to a Disney cruise awhile back and was shocked at those prices---would never be a consideration.

 

I can take a family of 4 on Carnival for about $2500 balcony cabin for a week, Disney was almost $7000--insane.