Service Dogs!

[sunlover12]

People who bring dogs on a cruise ship that are not true service dogs are unbelievably self-centered.  They care about no one but themselves.  Then to bring them into a dining room adds to the absurdity.  They should stay at home if they cannot bear to be away from their pet.

What is wrong with these people?!

[LHT28]

23 minutes ago, Jancruz said:

Im checking on this with the boss..I would not be happy with a dog in the dining room..

 

Jancruz1

Jan  it is just my opinion  but if  they are allowed on the  ship as  a service animal  they have to be allowed where ever the owner goes

It is just too bad there is not any regulations on what can be designated a service animal & what questions the cruise lines can ask to be sure they a true service animals

 

I believe  the ADA   rules  state you cannot ask what disability a  person has (privacy issues)  so may also pertain to a Service dog being allowed or not

JMO

[Rob the Cruiser]

1 hour ago, sunlover12 said:

People who bring dogs on a cruise ship that are not true service dogs are unbelievably self-centered.  They care about no one but themselves.  Then to bring them into a dining room adds to the absurdity.  They should stay at home if they cannot bear to be away from their pet.

What is wrong with these people?!

 

They are entitled and rules don't apply to them.

[skiladyldp]

On our one and only Princess cruise, someone had a dog in the dining room and they fed it at the table.  Yep, it had a little bow.

[tocruiseguy]

8 hours ago, Flatbush Flyer said:

Here's the Oceania policy - UK version  (see item 12):

https://www.oceaniacruises.com/Documents/Legal/13534/UK_TicketContract-062514.pdf

 

As for the U.S., The key to ADA interpretation of "yea or nay" on a bona fide service animal is the requirement to provide "reasonable accommodation" to an individual with disabilities.

IMO, the confined environment of a ship, when it is at sea, cannot reasonably accommodate the health and safety needs of our four legged friends. 

 

In Canada I believe it is much harder to obtain a certificate for an emotional support animal , and it must be a dog.....so we don't see ducks and turkeys on our flights....

 

Bottom line here, is it seems the "rights" of the dog and dog owners trump the rights of a human who may be severely allergic to dog hair.  

 

"If you are travelling within Canada with a dog* as an emotional support or psychiatric service animal, you must advise Air Canada Reservations 48 hour in advance of travel, and provide supporting documentation in the form of an original letter on the letterhead of a licensed mental health professional (e.g. a psychologist, a psychiatrist, the general practitioner who is treating the passenger's mental or emotional disability, or a licensed clinical social worker), dated within one year of your departure date". 

[pinotlover]

OOooKkaay!

 

since starting and ending in the US, who can imagine a service dog on a RTW?

 

Buckle down! Having the cabin AFTER that dog has relieved itself 180 days therein prior to your cruise in that cabin!

 

Another Cruise on Insignia that might be high risk!

[roger b]

48 minutes ago, pinotlover said:

OOooKkaay!

 

since starting and ending in the US, who can imagine a service dog on a RTW?

 

Buckle down! Having the cabin AFTER that dog has relieved itself 180 days therein prior to your cruise in that cabin!

 

Another Cruise on Insignia that might be high risk!

We have just had dinner with the Cruise Director and she said that there had been complaints about the dog. 

  But this was nothing, a couple that bought their French Bulldog aboard and dressed it in a camaflage outfit for dinner. 

[tocruiseguy]

Just now, roger b said:

We have just had dinner with the Cruise Director and she said that there had been complaints about the dog. 

  But this was nothing, a couple that bought their French Bulldog aboard and dressed it in a camaflage outfit for dinner. 

We haven’t been on an Oceania cruise yet, but are booked for next year.  I must say, the reasonableness of posters on this subject is making me think I picked a good cruise line, in some circles questioning the rights of an animal there would be fireworks from some posters.  So far seems everyone who has posted on this subject is in agreement..... 

[Tansy Mews]

4 hours ago, Jancruz said:

Im checking on this with the boss..I would not be happy with a dog in the dining room..

 

Jancruz1

 

If it is a genuine, harness-wearing, no petting service dog, they are allowed to be in the dining room, I believe. But the question to ask is why are fake service dogs being allowed on the ship. 

[LHT28]

2 hours ago, Tansy Mews said:

 

If it is a genuine, harness-wearing, no petting service dog, they are allowed to be in the dining room, I believe. But the question to ask is why are fake service dogs being allowed on the ship. 

probably because the cruise line cannot ask what disability  the pax has  & there is  no national regulations board for service animals

Anyone can buy a certificate saying their  pet is a service  animal

[Jancruz]

10 hours ago, roger b said:

I  have an idea for the marketing  dept   why don't  they run a special cruise for dog owners  ,a definate sell out !!

Sorry Roger I suggested that two years ago FDR vetoed it..

Jancruz1

[Jancruz]

4 hours ago, Tansy Mews said:

 

If it is a genuine, harness-wearing, no petting service dog, they are allowed to be in the dining room, I believe. But the question to ask is why are fake service dogs being allowed on the ship. 

And how do we know they are fake service dogs..

Jancruz1

[Petoonya]

5 hours ago, Jancruz said:

And how do we know they are fake service dogs..

Jancruz1

I have a nephew who trains service dogs and this is a question he gets asked frequently. While there is no tried and true way to discern it, there are "signs" that point to a dog being a "comfort" dog vs. a service dog. A service dog is an extensively and professionally trained (and very costly) animal with a job to do. A comfort dog as most of us know is one who accompanies his/her owner to provide security (No training required and one could literally have their doctor attest to the need for ones' 150lb Great Pyrenees to accompany them on Sirena).

 

Some good ways to tell the difference:

1. Carried or pushed in a cart (comfort). A service dog is on the alert/ready to work

2. They're not on a leash (comfort). A service dog is always leashed, and if not is firmly under owners control..

3. They're pulling on a leash (comfort). A service dog has impeccable manners on a leash.

4. Barking or whining (comfort). A service dog only barks when there is an impending medical emergency.

5. They're sniffing everywhere. (comfort). A service dog has a job to do and scents are a distraction.

6. Stealing food off the table or fed from the hand (comfort). One of the first tasks a service dog learns is to resist temptations.

7. They look nervous (comfort). Socialization pointing towards calm and confidence is the hallmark of a service dog.

8. They seek attention (comfort). Service dogs only have eyes for their owner and don't seek pats or belly rubs.

9. Aggression- barking, growling, lunging (comfort dog). Some service dogs are trained in protection but only bark or growl if commanded by their owner to do so.

 

As mentioned earlier even if you politely inquire why someone has an animal the ADA protects the owner from answering any questions. Sadly comfort animals and "fake" service animals put unfair scrutiny on owners who truly rely on their dogs for medical services.

 

[roger b]

1 hour ago, Petoonya said:

I have a nephew who trains service dogs and this is a question he gets asked frequently. While there is no tried and true way to discern it, there are "signs" that point to a dog being a "comfort" dog vs. a service dog. A service dog is an extensively and professionally trained (and very costly) animal with a job to do. A comfort dog as most of us know is one who accompanies his/her owner to provide security (No training required and one could literally have their doctor attest to the need for ones' 150lb Great Pyrenees to accompany them on Sirena).

 

Some good ways to tell the difference:

1. Carried or pushed in a cart (comfort). A service dog is on the alert/ready to work

2. They're not on a leash (comfort). A service dog is always leashed, and if not is firmly under owners control..

3. They're pulling on a leash (comfort). A service dog has impeccable manners on a leash.

4. Barking or whining (comfort). A service dog only barks when there is an impending medical emergency.

5. They're sniffing everywhere. (comfort). A service dog has a job to do and scents are a distraction.

6. Stealing food off the table or fed from the hand (comfort). One of the first tasks a service dog learns is to resist temptations.

7. They look nervous (comfort). Socialization pointing towards calm and confidence is the hallmark of a service dog.

8. They seek attention (comfort). Service dogs only have eyes for their owner and don't seek pats or belly rubs.

9. Aggression- barking, growling, lunging (comfort dog). Some service dogs are trained in protection but only bark or growl if commanded by their owner to do so.

 

As mentioned earlier even if you politely inquire why someone has an animal the ADA protects the owner from answering any questions. Sadly comfort animals and "fake" service animals put unfair scrutiny on owners who truly rely on their dogs for medical services.

 

On reading this post on the criteria  of a service  dog this one is definitely a comfort dog , it is being petted everywhere, being carried and calm to the point completely inert.

[StanandJim]

33 minutes ago, roger b said:

On reading this post on the criteria  of a service  dog this one is definitely a comfort dog , it is being petted everywhere, being carried and calm to the point completely inert.

All marvelous points, but how much time, effort and money are we willing to ask O to expend on behalf of weeding out the fakes?

A better solution might be for every person who sees such an animal to pointedly tell the owner how disdainful we find the practice, and to ostracize the dog and the owner.

 

In short, each pet of that.......well .....Pet, is sending the wrong message-

[Roccaforte]

I think it’s time for cruise ships and airlines to stop this nonsense of allowing comfort animals on board.  Imagine occupying a cabin after a dog has spent seven or more days relieving itself   on the floor or balcony.  Until the pet can use the toilet, wipe and flush it should stay home.  As far as their owners - take a pill 😜.  Humans with allergies should have the right to a clean environment.

[Rob the Cruiser]

1 hour ago, StanandJim said:

All marvelous points, but how much time, effort and money are we willing to ask O to expend on behalf of weeding out the fakes?

A better solution might be for every person who sees such an animal to pointedly tell the owner how disdainful we find the practice, and to ostracize the dog and the owner.

 

In short, each pet of that.......well .....Pet, is sending the wrong message-

 

As much as I would love to confront an inconsiderate comfort dog owner, it probably wouldn't end well. A comment card would be as far as I would go.

[bitob]

Unfortunately, those who abuse the issue of service dogs by taking a dog on a cruise or airline and "calling" it a service dog make us all question whether a service dog for a" non obvious need" (eg emotional support) is the real deal.  Also unfortunate is that the US has no regulations on this matter.  Anyone can buy a certificate and vest on line and call their dog a service dog.

Personally, I find it hard to believe that an emotional support dog cannot be left in the cabin for meals.  It's a different situation from a dog who can detect a seizure coming on or similar situations where the dog needs to be present all the time.   The petting and touching is unsanitary and unacceptable.

 

FYI -- I have two dogs -- I always have two dogs as I cannot imaging living without dogs -- I collect dog art -- I am the ultimate dog lover -- and I find this unacceptable.

[kibutzer]

On 11/17/2019 at 9:09 AM, LHT28 said:

did it have a bow in it's hair & a stroller type cart?

 

If people were petting it

It is not  a service dog

 

If it is the same person we had on one of our cruises   then I think  they just did not want the dog left at home

You read about these "service" animals on other lines

They get dressed up & sit at the table  etc..

 

On 11/17/2019 at 5:27 AM, roger b said:

We were having dinner in Red Ginger  the other night , I had little white dog sitting next to me, on enquiring I was told it was a service dog.

  I don't  know what policy is regarding dogs in the restaurant  on a ship ,personaly I do not like it as people were petting the dog.

    How many dogs will Oceania allow on their  ships as I would not like everyone to bring their  pets !

 

If it is a true service dog owners will not let them be petted while in service, should have a vest or harness, and should be on floor by owner. Otherwise it is a strong violation of food sanitation standards. 

[roger b]

11 minutes ago, kibutzer said:

 

If it is a true service dog owners will not let them be petted while in service, should have a vest or harness, and should be on floor by owner. Otherwise it is a strong violation of food sanitation standards. 

The dog in question is out for a walk today pulling on its lead around the walking track on deck 10, definatly not a service dog as it pays no attention to its owners whatsoever. 

[pinotlover]

Seems the best way to avoid this issue is to not take a cruise starting in a US port. Easy enough for us!

[Noxequifans]

Reading these numerous posts, it is clear to me the difference between service dogs and emotional support/comfort dogs. The best way to control this is for Oceania to make clear that only genuine service dogs are permitted on board. 
 

Anyone planning to board with an animal would be required to notify O when booking a trip. This allows enough time for vetting (no pun). 
 

Yes, extra work for O but important to protect all on board. 

[LHT28]

34 minutes ago, Noxequifans said:

Reading these numerous posts, it is clear to me the difference between service dogs and emotional support/comfort dogs. The best way to control this is for Oceania to make clear that only genuine service dogs are permitted on board. 
 

Anyone planning to board with an animal would be required to notify O when booking a trip. This allows enough time for vetting (no pun). 
 

Yes, extra work for O but important to protect all on board. 

How  would  they confirm the dog is  a real service dog ?

There are NO regulations  for service animals

[LHT28]

1 hour ago, pinotlover said:

Seems the best way to avoid this issue is to not take a cruise starting in a US port. Easy enough for us!

I believe the cruise  started in BCN

[kitty9]

OK, there's a HUGE difference between service dogs and the ubiquitous emotional support animals.  In reality, emotional support animals are not covered by the ADA (as a disabled person since age 2, and as someone who contributed to the original ADA which was known as PL 94-142, ESA's are not mentioned specifically in the law and as you can read in in StanandJim's post only specially trained dogs are considered service animals).  Too many people try and use the ADA to allow them to bring on their pets, for whatever reason, which is something cruise lines and airlines need to comprehensively address.  And the government needs to stop these internet sites that sell the fake service dog papers.

 

Trained service animals never sit on chairs in public venues, they are not allowed to be petted or behave in ways that ESA's behave in public.  This whole issue has gotten completely out of hand with people trying to bring squirrels, tarantulas, snakes, pigs, horses, and just about any animal you can imagine onto planes and buses claiming they need them for emotional support.  

 

I cannot tell you how many strange incidents I've seen with respect to people who bring their foo-foo dogs on cruises.  One woman walked around with her toy poodle in a stroller, another carried her dog in a baby carrier backpack.  Then there was the woman who allowed her Yorkie to poop and pee everywhere, and never cleaned it up.  A friend opened his cabin door to find a lovely gift right there.  He let guest services have it and after that the dog was confined to the owners cabin for the rest of the cruise.