Cancelling Cruises because of the C word

[BrianI]

On 3/11/2020 at 12:03 PM, Heatherlea10 said:

I'm hoping that's the case as we only have the occasional drink onboard and usually book shore excursions beforehand as the popular ones sell out before boarding.

Whatever ABTA say they cannot override the legal requirements as defined in the Package Travel and Linked Travel Arrangements Regulations 2018.

Brian

[terrierjohn]

This is part of the reply I recently had from P&O when I found I had cancelled just 24hrs too soon to qualify for a full refund, and tried to persuade them to give me a full refund as well.

It was not unexpected but certainly at variance with the fact that passengers who had cancelled prior to the first offer, but after some date in Feb, would now receive a FCC to compensate for the percentage they had initially lost.

 

I was sorry to learn that you were disappointed with the option you decided to take following changes to the policy. As I am sure you can appreciate it is an ongoing, ever evolving situation with the Coronavirus that we are closely monitoring each day. At each stage of this pandemic we have been putting our guests at the forefront of everything we do. All guests will of course taken different options at different stages of this journey and therefore the decision has been made that whatever option the guest took at the time will remain. I can assure you this stance from P&O Cruises is for all guests with no exceptions and I would like to apologise for any upset this may bring.

[staygulf]

2 minutes ago, terrierjohn said:

This is part of the reply I recently had from P&O when I found I had cancelled just 24hrs too soon to qualify for a full refund, and tried to persuade them to give me a full refund as well.

It was not unexpected but certainly at variance with the fact that passengers who had cancelled prior to the first offer, but after some date in Feb, would now receive a FCC to compensate for the percentage they had initially lost.

 

I was sorry to learn that you were disappointed with the option you decided to take following changes to the policy. As I am sure you can appreciate it is an ongoing, ever evolving situation with the Coronavirus that we are closely monitoring each day. At each stage of this pandemic we have been putting our guests at the forefront of everything we do. All guests will of course taken different options at different stages of this journey and therefore the decision has been made that whatever option the guest took at the time will remain. I can assure you this stance from P&O Cruises is for all guests with no exceptions and I would like to apologise for any upset this may bring.

What were the circumstances of your cancellation? Was it just because you didn’t want to take your chances or was it health concerns?

[terrierjohn]

5 minutes ago, staygulf said:

What were the circumstances of your cancellation? Was it just because you didn’t want to take your chances or was it health concerns?

I cancelled after P&O announced they were offering a FCC for the previously lost percentage of the cruise fare. The following day Boris announced that over 70s should not holiday abroad or cruise, and P&O changed their terms yet again.

[staygulf]

1 minute ago, terrierjohn said:

I cancelled after P&O announced they were offering a FCC for the previously lost percentage of the cruise fare. The following day Boris announced that over 70s should not holiday abroad or cruise, and P&O changed their terms yet again.

Shame, I can see the frustration. 

[PRINCESSTHE BEST]

4 hours ago, staygulf said:

But you don’t seem to have taken my point on board. If they do cancel the cruise your contract becomes “frustrated” and null and void so they would have to return your deposit. Am I wrong?

Yes, I believe you are. If the passenger fails to pay the balance they forfeit their deposit and their booking is cancelled. If, in the following weeks the cruise is cancelled, you are no longer a client and have no connection whatsoever with either the cruise or indeed P&O.

[jeanlyon]

Agree.

[arlowood]

1 hour ago, staygulf said:

.  ABTA.  act in the cruise lines’ interest not yours. I wouldn’t pay any attention to their erroneous advice. 

 Doesn't matter whether you pay attention to the ABTA recommendation or not. In some cases travel companies are simply refusing to provide a cash refund. My wife is in this position with a local coach company who cancelled her trip but are only offering a credit note that can be redeemed at some undefined future date.

I know you have stated in the past that you could threaten the company within a winding up order/petition. But my understanding is that to carry that threat through you could be faced with legal costs of up to £1000 and in my wife's case the sum involved is only £400 or so.

I suppose there might also be a route via the Small Claims Court but I think many companies are sitting tight and hoping that fear or inertia will stop people going down the litigation route

Edited March 26, 2020 by arlowood
spelling

[staygulf]

2 minutes ago, arlowood said:

 Doesn't matter whether you pay attention to the ABTA recommendation or not. In some cases travel companies are simply refusing to provide a cash refund. My wife is in this position with a local coach company who cancelled her trip but are only offering a credit note that can be redeemed at some undefined future date.

I know you have stated in the past that you could threaten the company within a winding up order/petition. But my understanding is that to carry that threat through you could be faced with legal costs of up to £1000 and in my wife's case the sum involved is only £400 or so.

I suppose there might also be a route via the Small Claims Court but I think many companies are sitting tight and hoping that fear or inertia will stop people going down the litigation route

You can’t start winding up proceedings unless the debt is over £750. A small claims court would be her best option and costs very little. As a poster on here said earlier if the contract is frustrated because it cannot be performed it becomes Null and void so a full refund should be expected. 

[staygulf]

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Law_Reform_(Frustrated_Contracts)_Act_1943

[PRINCESSTHE BEST]

P&O booking conditions clearly say ‘if P&O cruises do not receive the balance by the due date, we reserve the right to end the contract between us and resell the accommodation held for you, which will also result in the forfeiture of your deposit’.

[staygulf]

4 minutes ago, PRINCESSTHE BEST said:

P&O booking conditions clearly say ‘if P&O cruises do not receive the balance by the due date, we reserve the right to end the contract between us and resell the accommodation held for you, which will also result in the forfeiture of your deposit’.

Not in my contract it doesn’t

[staygulf]

in the group.
4. All Packages are subject to availability at the time of booking. No Contract shall be made until the deposit (or, where appropriate, the full price) has been paid, whether or not a booking confirmation has been issued, but all money paid to a travel agent shall be treated as having been paid to P&O Cruises. Failure to pay the balance by the due date shall entitle P&O Cruises to cancel the booking and retain the deposit by way of a cancellation charge. Failure to pay any other amount by the due date shall entitle P&O Cruises to cancel the booking and to retain an amount by way of a cancellation charge as set out in clause 38
 

 

Booking and contract are used throughout the terms and do not mean the same thing

[grapau27]

7 hours ago, AndyMichelle said:

I saw on another forum somebody complaining that their refund was taking too long as she says she was quoted 4 to 5 days... 😂😂

Andy 

I paid £70 to pre-book our plane seats to Barbados.

P&O refunded this in a few days.

[PRINCESSTHE BEST]

2 hours ago, staygulf said:

Not in my contract it doesn’t

Page 172 of the P&O brochure (booking conditions)

[staygulf]

1 hour ago, PRINCESSTHE BEST said:

Page 172 of the P&O brochure (booking conditions)

My booking contract refers to their terms and conditions listed on their website which are exactly as I reproduced here. They did not refer me to a brochure. I booked directly with their call centre so cannot be bound to a brochure. No idea why it’s different 

 

 

 

[happy v]

9 hours ago, Selbourne said:

Not yet John, as the cruise is technically still going ahead. We had assumed that we would just write the £350 off because, as Staygulf says, normal T’s and C’s mean that if you don’t pay the balance then you forfeit the deposit. I was making the assumption that P&O will be forced to cancel the cruise and then the deposit would become FCC, but thinking about it, P&O are unlikely to cancel beyond 4 week blocks (to ease cash flow) so, on that basis, my theory is flawed as the balance is due 12 weeks out. Apologies for confusing anyone. That’s another £350 to add to my ‘Coronavirus losses’ list!

Surely as you will be cancelling because of your wifes medical condition you will be able to claim your deposit from your insurance.

[Selbourne]

37 minutes ago, happy v said:

Surely as you will be cancelling because of your wifes medical condition you will be able to claim your deposit from your insurance.

To be honest, I haven’t looked into whether or not my insurance would cover if we cancelled. I would prefer that P&O cancels, rather than me, in order that I can get a 100% refund and not risk an insurance company trying to wriggle out of a claim (as they have a tendency to do). However, that approach relies on P&O doing the honourable thing and complying with the T’s and C’s that were applicable when we made the booking. I would have never doubted that........until now. 

[Selbourne]

As there are a few people on here with more legal knowledge than me, can I ask two questions;

 

1) The 2018 Travel & Package regulations that are often referred to came into affect on 1st July 2018 and only apply to bookings made after that date. When did Spring / Summer 2020 cruises go on sale, as I booked at launch?

 

2) How far back can you dispute a credit card transaction? I have a fear that it may be only 6 months, which won’t cover deposits. 

[happy v]

The date on my booking confirmation is 20 Sept 18.

This will not be the launch date but fairly close as I receive the £100 for the 5% discount debacle.

Edited March 26, 2020 by happy v

[PRINCESSTHE BEST]

1 hour ago, staygulf said:

My booking contract refers to their terms and conditions listed on their website which are exactly as I reproduced here. They did not refer me to a brochure. I booked directly with their call centre so cannot be bound to a brochure. No idea why it’s different 

 

 

 

If the brochure is materially different to the actual contract, alarm bells should start ringing about company integrity. A significant amount of people, particularly older people not internet savvy will rely on the brochure. Another reason perhaps to boycott the company after all this is over.

[sasmisjas]

Has anyone had a refund yet? I cancelled on 17/03/20 but have still not received anything. Got a cancellation notice showing 50% when I should get a full refund as my partner is over 70. 10 minutes later I received a booking confirmation for the same cruise??? I haven’t tried to contact them again as I realise they are inundated but I can’t afford to lose over £3000. Any ideas? 

[grapau27]

10 minutes ago, sasmisjas said:

Has anyone had a refund yet? I cancelled on 17/03/20 but have still not received anything. Got a cancellation notice showing 50% when I should get a full refund as my partner is over 70. 10 minutes later I received a booking confirmation for the same cruise??? I haven’t tried to contact them again as I realise they are inundated but I can’t afford to lose over £3000. Any ideas? 

Carnival office was closed last week but staff are now working from home.

I would contact them by email or phone explaining your situation.

[mrsgoggins]

40 minutes ago, sasmisjas said:

Has anyone had a refund yet? I cancelled on 17/03/20 but have still not received anything. Got a cancellation notice showing 50% when I should get a full refund as my partner is over 70. 10 minutes later I received a booking confirmation for the same cruise??? I haven’t tried to contact them again as I realise they are inundated but I can’t afford to lose over £3000. Any ideas? 

I cancelled on 14/03/20 online requesting a full refund and got the screen showing I would receive a refund with 45 days, but nothing since. No cancellation invoice either.

[staygulf]

48 minutes ago, sasmisjas said:

Has anyone had a refund yet? I cancelled on 17/03/20 but have still not received anything. Got a cancellation notice showing 50% when I should get a full refund as my partner is over 70. 10 minutes later I received a booking confirmation for the same cruise??? I haven’t tried to contact them again as I realise they are inundated but I can’t afford to lose over £3000. Any ideas? 

Cancelled on 16th March for full refund. Received the same 50% charge. 3 hours wait on phone to be told ignore it as computer is sending out letters based on standard cancellation terms faster than they can process the refunds.