NCL first to remove ALL vaccine requirements.....

[sunviking90]

I hope mods will lock this thread. Nothing productive going on here, and lots of nastiness. Not what I come to these forums for.

[cruisemom42]

4 hours ago, ontheweb said:

Yes, and it seems some passengers get pissed off when protocols are tightened while others get pissed off when protocols are loosened.

 

A point I was just about to make.

 

Who's to say that eliminating the vaccination requirement will result in increased passenger volume for all lines?  It could result in decreased volume for some. 

 

Reading the Oceania forum, members do not seem very pleased with the recent decision to stop requiring vaccination.

 

[Wakepatrol]

7 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

I don't think you understand the stock market. CCL has lost 60% of it's value since resumption. There isn't much lower to go before restructuring (yet today CCL is down about  another 10%). 

 

You can stomp your feet all you want but changes are coming. With the exception of very few countries,  the entire world has removed covid protocols. Like it not, cruises are next. Sadly, assuming you actually believe the fear you keep projecting (and unless a niche market evolves), the only logical thing for you to do is to stop cruising. 

Okay okay

you’re the smartest kid in the class. 

[PhD-iva]

4 hours ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

 

NCL also owns Oceana and they allow 100% unvaccinated right now also. Oceana would be closer to Azamara than HAL. 

Just to clarify, NCLH has announced that unvaccinated pax will be allowed to sail starting in September (don’t remember the exact date….).

Until that date, all pax must be vaccinated to sail on Oceania and sister-line Regent.

[BermudaBound2014]

1 hour ago, PhD-iva said:

Just to clarify, NCLH has announced that unvaccinated pax will be allowed to sail starting in September (don’t remember the exact date….).

Until that date, all pax must be vaccinated to sail on Oceania and sister-line Regent.

Thank you. To be more specific- NCl, oceana, and regent are all following NCLs plan. They are welcoming the unvaccinated beginning in just 3 weeks 3 days (Sept 3) :).  

[AKJonesy]

The bottom line is at the end of the day, the cruiselines are in a real pickle.  You've got half the passengers demanding/requiring/desiring masks, vaccinations and testing.  You've got half the passengers that want the exact opposite.  How do you set policy when you are bleeding money knowing either way, and under the current way the cruiselines are operating, that you can have a policy that is going to please all of these people?  On top of that, you add the fact that the CDC has not been the most accurate with their messaging and it creates a real mess.  

 

I live in a tourism state that has been decimated by covid.  Businesses have failed and many are still struggling to make their way back.  MOre may fail.  You all have seen this with cruiselines canceling many cruises and here it is because there are not enough workers to fill positions.  That is another whole big can of worms.  

 

People have to make choices for themselves.  I think much of the argument among cruisers comes down to the protocols and which side of the fence that people are on.  People don't want to stay home and want to resume cruising, but want the protocols.  Others want to resume cruising but without protocols.  Unless there is a change in the way that the cruiselines operate, IMHO this is not going to be resolved and for a period of time, there is going to be disagreement among passengers as to how the cruiselines should operate.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

the 

[ontheweb]

24 minutes ago, AKJonesy said:

The bottom line is at the end of the day, the cruiselines are in a real pickle.  You've got half the passengers demanding/requiring/desiring masks, vaccinations and testing.  You've got half the passengers that want the exact opposite.  How do you set policy when you are bleeding money knowing either way, and under the current way the cruiselines are operating, that you can have a policy that is going to please all of these people?  On top of that, you add the fact that the CDC has not been the most accurate with their messaging and it creates a real mess.  

 

I live in a tourism state that has been decimated by covid.  Businesses have failed and many are still struggling to make their way back.  MOre may fail.  You all have seen this with cruiselines canceling many cruises and here it is because there are not enough workers to fill positions.  That is another whole big can of worms.  

 

People have to make choices for themselves.  I think much of the argument among cruisers comes down to the protocols and which side of the fence that people are on.  People don't want to stay home and want to resume cruising, but want the protocols.  Others want to resume cruising but without protocols.  Unless there is a change in the way that the cruiselines operate, IMHO this is not going to be resolved and for a period of time, there is going to be disagreement among passengers as to how the cruiselines should operate.  

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

the 

Yes, that is the dilemma in a nutshell.

 

Though I am not sure it is half each way; how about a significant number want it one way and a significant number the opposite way when it comes to protocols.

[BermudaBound2014]

50 minutes ago, AKJonesy said:

The bottom line is at the end of the day, the cruiselines are in a real pickle.  You've got half the passengers demanding/requiring/desiring masks, vaccinations and testing.  You've got half the passengers that want the exact opposite.  How do you set policy when you are bleeding money knowing either way, and under the current way the cruiselines are operating, that you can have a policy that is going to please all of these people?  On top of that, you add the fact that the CDC has not been the most accurate with their messaging and it creates a real mess.  

 

Excellent summary. Due to the division among passengers; I believe that the industry is ripe for Niche markets. Overall HAL seems to me to be the most likely candidate of the main stream lines to keep covid protocols for the purpose of attracting the group of passengers who still want covid protocols in place.

 

@ontheweb... You can bet your last dollars cruise lines understand their demographics and what their demographics want in terms of protocols (at least I would hope). If HAL switches to also allow unlimited unvaccinated that will be a strong indicator of how HAL perceives the overall desire of it's consumer base.

 

 

Edited August 10, 2022 by BermudaBound2014

[Mary229]

I think the dilemma is moving far beyond health protocols. This is quickly becoming financial survival.  Added costs due to following CDC guidelines:

 

1. Rebating customers due to positive Covid tests

2. letting customers request an  FCC after final payment date

3. constant testing and quarantining crew with no symptoms

4.  Additional time and staff to handle the extra check in procedures

5. Moth balling cabins for potential isolation units

 

dropping requirements  would

1. leave it up to passengers to find and fund their own insurance in case of need or desire to cancel

2. ditto 1

3.  Freeing crew to work unless symptomatic

4.  Continue to move to enhanced electronic checkin that began prior to 2020, speeding up the process and requiring fewer terminal employees 

5  True 100% occupancy.  I think the current numbers given by cruise lines exclude set asides to comply with health protocols. 
 

cruising is a business just like your hotel, rv resort or any other travel option.  They exist to make money not make everyone happy.  As a business owner I can tell you we often fire customers.  The maxim that the customer is always right is simply a marketing slogan which is not based on reality 

[BermudaBound2014]

Unfortunately, I believe cruise lines are years away from sustainable 100% occupancy. We've got the group that won't sail unless strict protocols are in place. The group that won't sail with strict protocols in place. And we can't ignore the group who will never set foot onboard a cruise ship due to MSM's portrayal of cruising in a petri dish during the heat of the pandemic.

 

OTOH, Princess just had to cancel 11 sailings due to staff shortages. Removing protocols may also help get staff back onboard. According to crew social, a number of staff are waiting to return until mask wearing and mandatory vaccination are removed. 

 

Cruise lines are caught in such a catch 22.

 

 

[Nymich]

12 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

Unfortunately, I believe cruise lines are years away from sustainable 100% occupancy. We've got the group that won't sail unless strict protocols are in place. The group that won't sail with strict protocols in place. And we can't ignore the group who will never set foot onboard a cruise ship due to MSM's portrayal of cruising in a petri dish during the heat of the pandemic.

 

OTOH, Princess just had to cancel 11 sailings due to staff shortages. Removing protocols may also help get staff back onboard. According to crew social, a number of staff are waiting to return until mask wearing and mandatory vaccination are removed. 

 

Cruise lines are caught in such a catch 22.

 

 

Couple all that with inflation and places they can't even cruise to because of war etc...

It is a mess.

[Mary229]

24 minutes ago, BermudaBound2014 said:

HAL seems as good of bet as any to experiment with Niche markets.

 

Gus has only said that he thinks the HAL niche is for the longer and more in-depth journeys.  He has made a point that should cover all ages and families.  I am not so sure they want to continue to be cast as the cruise line for old people.  Many more people are not anchored to a desk anymore not just the retired.  I have relatives who handily take their jobs wherever they wander.  It is a niche someone in the industry should give some thought to.  

[Wakepatrol]

These “Old People “ that HAL caters to is a good gig

Do they smuggle alcohol in listerine bottles? Probably not

 Are they schlepping cases of water and soda aboard? Probably not

Are they lined up at the front desk to remove tips the last  day of the cruise? Probably not

Do they bring ill behaved children aboard ? Probably not

Are they calling headquarters every time the cruise fare drops $5 ?

probably not.

Do they book mostly HAL excursions? Probably 

 

 

 

 

[KroozNut]

Yet another 'splashy announcement', to quote a recent a recent post.. This time HAL! 😁

 

https://www.cruiseindustrynews.com/cruise-news/28050-holland-america-line-simplifies-covid-19-procedures.html?fbclid=IwAR3v1h_mgV1_6_Sp1PJ5vlTOKtVMaNX6oc738-wLOa4iJjBLQ5fna23gnos