mjkacmom Posted July 21 #226 Share Posted July 21 11 minutes ago, Goldenknight said: THIS! NCL did absolutely nothing wrong. If there were 150 people on this excursion, it's noteworthy that everyone else made it back to the ship on time except this family. Now, the 3 adults in this family are not going to admit to anyone, especially now, that when the show ended, they decided to go shopping, buy drinks, or use the restrooms. They gambled on there being more buses, ready to take them at their whim. Moreover, it is not the duty of the tour operator or bus drivers to search the town, looking for the missing family who chose to take their time when the show ended. There are always people who luv2whine and sometimes pesky facts get in the way of their whining. The only unfortunate aspect of this is NCL paying out any reimbursement whatsoever for poor decisions made by people who won't take responsibility for themselves. The show (tour) ended, get on a bus like all of the other NCL guests who managed to board on time. I think the problem was there weren’t seats on the bus and they were told by a tour employee (not a ncl employee) that another bus was coming. Now if this was an independent excursion ncl wouldn’t have owed them anything at all, so I can see why ncl is offering compensation since they vetted the company. I think it’s possible the tour company screwed up, at least their employee. 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare ontheweb Posted July 21 #227 Share Posted July 21 45 minutes ago, Goldenknight said: THIS! NCL did absolutely nothing wrong. If there were 150 people on this excursion, it's noteworthy that everyone else made it back to the ship on time except this family. Now, the 3 adults in this family are not going to admit to anyone, especially now, that when the show ended, they decided to go shopping, buy drinks, or use the restrooms. They gambled on there being more buses, ready to take them at their whim. Moreover, it is not the duty of the tour operator or bus drivers to search the town, looking for the missing family who chose to take their time when the show ended. There are always people who luv2whine and sometimes pesky facts get in the way of their whining. The only unfortunate aspect of this is NCL paying out any reimbursement whatsoever for poor decisions made by people who won't take responsibility for themselves. The show (tour) ended, get on a bus like all of the other NCL guests who managed to board on time. Do you think it is the responsibility of the tour operator's bus driver to check that those boarding belong on that bus? If and when you let others on, you are depriving a seat to someone who has paid for the tour. Do you think it is the responsibility of the tour operator's bus driver to know if there is another bus and to not give out incorrect information? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare ontheweb Posted July 21 #228 Share Posted July 21 2 hours ago, omahabob said: You should read my comment again. I did say they have a quality responsibility, and are responsible for vetting. I said they do not bear responsibility for, or a financial compensation liability for, mistakes made by a tour operator. Their contract plainly says so. They didn't take responsibility for that mistake, because they weren't responsible for it, and they did not compensate for it. They reimbursed cruise interruption expenses in accordance with their published policy and contract. They also reimbursed the fine and offered a future cruise discount as a goodwill gesture. I have reread your post, and we are going to still disagree. They make a big point about your safe taking cruise line excursions because they thoroughly vet the operator. To me that means that they must stand behind them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julig22 Posted July 21 #229 Share Posted July 21 Just now, ontheweb said: Do you think it is the responsibility of the tour operator's bus driver to check that those boarding belong on that bus? If and when you let others on, you are depriving a seat to someone who has paid for the tour. Do you think it is the responsibility of the tour operator's bus driver to know if there is another bus and to not give out incorrect information? There is another scenario in play - the other ship in port. Family says people on the bus had tickets for the other ship and the driver wasn't checking. Does that mean that people from any ship were getting on any available bus - or that they were trying to get on the wrong bus that was filled with passengers for the other ship? Since there was another ship in town that was leaving several hours later, the driver may have been absolutely correct that there would be another bus - just not right away. But that driver could have also offered information regarding the shuttle that should have still been running. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omahabob Posted July 21 #230 Share Posted July 21 51 minutes ago, ontheweb said: I have reread your post, and we are going to still disagree. They make a big point about your safe taking cruise line excursions because they thoroughly vet the operator. To me that means that they must stand behind them. Fair enough. But if 'stand behind them' means taking responsibility for the operator's mistakes, particularly financially, they'd have to completely rewrite their contracts. They'd probably sponsor far fewer excursions too. But I have no problem with us disagreeing. Wouldn't be the first time. And I don't hold grudges or bear animosity just because someone disagrees with me. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sailingships Posted July 21 #231 Share Posted July 21 (edited) 1 hour ago, julig22 said: Family says people on the bus had tickets for the other ship and the driver wasn't checking. Does that mean that people from any ship were getting on any available bus - or that they were trying to get on the wrong bus that was filled with passengers for the other ship? For most of the NCL shore excursions we have been on, the guide usually remembers who we are and we all have number sticker on our clothes corresponding to the number on the bus. If we tried to get on the bus again and were told it was full i wouldnt just stay off but would speak up explaining, we belonged there and showing my ticket stub. It would be up to the guide to check out who didnt belong on the bus. It also means someone was slack. the guide or the passengers who might have the right number but the wrong bus and ship. As the bus has signs giving the number and the name of the excursion and the name NCL right on the front of the windscreen, theres no reason the passengers try to get on the wrong bus. Last year we were on the Jewell and in port with the Bliss for a couple of Alaska stops.. I dont remember anyone getting on the wrong bus The excursion name might have been the same but the numbers on the busses were not. Also the busses usually dont arrive at a stop and leave all the same time. Edited July 21 by sailingships 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sailingships Posted July 21 #232 Share Posted July 21 1 hour ago, Goldenknight said: use the restrooms. We are older folks who do use the restrooms a bit more than the younger crowd, but we always make sure the guide knows we are going We have never been left behind. Also the guide usually tells you when to be back to the bus or the meeting place. We always make sure we are back early. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julig22 Posted July 21 #233 Share Posted July 21 28 minutes ago, sailingships said: As the bus has signs giving the number and the name of the excursion and the name NCL right on the front of the windscreen, theres no reason the passengers try to get on the wrong bus. You are correct that there is no reason to try BUT that's not always the case. I've seen it happen. I'm just pointing out that if there were people on the bus with tickets for a different cruise ship then either those people are on the wrong bus or the family was trying to get on the wrong bus. 28 minutes ago, sailingships said: Also the busses usually dont arrive at a stop and leave all the same time. Guess you've never done a Lumberjack show excursion. NCL offers multiple excursions that end at the show, so yes, all the busses -for all the ships at Ward Cove- will be there to pickup passengers and take them back. For the ships with short port times (Bliss and Encore), there is no time to do anything extra after the show. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare Georgia_Peaches Posted July 22 #234 Share Posted July 22 5 hours ago, Goldenknight said: Now, the 3 adults in this family are not going to admit to anyone, especially now, that when the show ended, they decided to go shopping, buy drinks, or use the restrooms. They gambled on there being more buses, ready to take them at their whim. But did this actually happen or is this speculation? I didn’t see anything in the article to suggest the family went of on their own to shop, buy drinks and use the restroom. Perhaps I missed it. If this is the case then why would NCL make the concessions they have for this family? Genuinely curious. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
julig22 Posted July 22 #235 Share Posted July 22 3 minutes ago, Georgia_Peaches said: But did this actually happen or is this speculation? I didn’t see anything in the article to suggest the family went of on their own to shop, buy drinks and use the restroom. Perhaps I missed it. If this is the case then why would NCL make the concessions they have for this family? Genuinely curious. Of course it's speculation - but certainly plausible since they were the last ones to leave. As to NCL making concessions - it's not uncommon for a company to just bite the bullet and take responsibility for something they could have pushed back on - easier than dealing with the bad press. You know the whole thing about bad headlines, retractions on page 25 if different facts come to light. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omahabob Posted July 22 #236 Share Posted July 22 44 minutes ago, julig22 said: ...You know the whole thing about bad headlines, retractions on page 25 if different facts come to light. Please tell me we're NOT going to 25 pages here. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare BirdTravels Posted July 22 #237 Share Posted July 22 8 hours ago, Distinctive-Destinations said: I’ve been on the cruise, I realize that. They could leave Victoria a hour later too. It would be a matter of getting those Non-NCL shuttle busses to run after midnight to get people back before the 12:30 all aboard. And we know... that the ship won't wait for Non-NCL shuttle busses.... if you miss the last one. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare ontheweb Posted July 22 #238 Share Posted July 22 11 hours ago, omahabob said: Fair enough. But if 'stand behind them' means taking responsibility for the operator's mistakes, particularly financially, they'd have to completely rewrite their contracts. They'd probably sponsor far fewer excursions too. But I have no problem with us disagreeing. Wouldn't be the first time. And I don't hold grudges or bear animosity just because someone disagrees with me. I see it as the cruise line taking responsibility for making the passengers whole. If they want they can go after the tour operator, especially if it can be shown to be to at least some extent negligent. And not allowing passengers back on the bus because you are full because you did not check to see if those boarding were boarding the proper bus is negligent. I do agree no grudges. We can agree to disagree as long as we are both respectful of the other's position. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omahabob Posted July 22 #239 Share Posted July 22 8 hours ago, ontheweb said: I see it as the cruise line taking responsibility for making the passengers whole. If they want they can go after the tour operator, especially if it can be shown to be to at least some extent negligent. And not allowing passengers back on the bus because you are full because you did not check to see if those boarding were boarding the proper bus is negligent. I do agree no grudges. We can agree to disagree as long as we are both respectful of the other's position. I agree that the tour operator totally screwed up, and that NCL has a lot to do to minimize the chance of it happening again. We do not disagree on that at all. NCL lived up to their policy and contractual obligations, and even went the extra mile on a couple of things. But that doesn't mean they're responsible financially for what the tour operator did on the bus. I simply disagree with the assertions here that NCL bears a pecuniary liability for what happened, and should pay damages in some way. Other than the principle of the matter, the cruise contract in several places specifically excludes them from such liability. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare ontheweb Posted July 22 #240 Share Posted July 22 1 hour ago, omahabob said: I agree that the tour operator totally screwed up, and that NCL has a lot to do to minimize the chance of it happening again. We do not disagree on that at all. NCL lived up to their policy and contractual obligations, and even went the extra mile on a couple of things. But that doesn't mean they're responsible financially for what the tour operator did on the bus. I simply disagree with the assertions here that NCL bears a pecuniary liability for what happened, and should pay damages in some way. Other than the principle of the matter, the cruise contract in several places specifically excludes them from such liability. We do agree on more than we disagree and have kept it very civil on the part where we disagree. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tony s Posted July 23 #241 Share Posted July 23 Moderator, time to close? 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WarfRatWA Posted July 23 #242 Share Posted July 23 (edited) Surprised this thread lives on. What if the family, after enjoying the lumberjack show, heard that a place in town had hashbrowns...they, of course, went to find said hashbrowns and missed the coach. That would be NCL's fault, right? Asking for a friend. Edited July 23 by WarfRatWA 1 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oakman58 Posted July 23 #243 Share Posted July 23 (edited) After watching a video from a couple who were on the Bliss and had to get back to the ship after they attended the Lumberjack Show, I can absolutely understand how that group missed the bus. It looked like an absolute cluster**** of passengers waiting for busses. Going forward, NCL needs to implement a plan with their contractor that insures no one is left behind at the pickup station. Edited July 23 by Oakman58 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JamesIowa Posted July 23 #244 Share Posted July 23 Found a pic of the bus driver, this explains a lot! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rare shof515 Posted July 23 #245 Share Posted July 23 3 hours ago, Oakman58 said: After watching a video from a couple who were on the Bliss and had to get back to the ship after they attended the Lumberjack Show, I can absolutely understand how that group missed the bus. It looked like an absolute cluster**** of passengers waiting for busses. Going forward, NCL needs to implement a plan with their contractor that insures no one is left behind at the pickup station. can you share the video? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
omahabob Posted July 23 #246 Share Posted July 23 18 hours ago, tony s said: Moderator, time to close? I was wondering for a time there. But things are now more civil. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oakman58 Posted July 23 #247 Share Posted July 23 2 hours ago, shof515 said: can you share the video? I don't know if it would violate the rules but if you search for Travelling with Teens on YouTube you should find it. It has the word Ketchikan in the title of that video, jump to the 11:30 mark of that video. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
valleyvillage Posted July 24 #248 Share Posted July 24 The video is easy to find and worth it! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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