Breakaway: What's Going on with the Toilets?

[Georgia_Peaches]

I've just read the first 5 reviews that pop up for Breakaway.  All are pretty negative, which I take with a grain of salt.  But, each review mentions trouble with the toilets flushing consistently, if at all.  Anyone just off Breakaway (or on it currently) have any intel on toilet flushing problems?  Solutions?  We embark on Sunday.

[KeithJenner]

I don’t have any first hand experience, as we didn’t have any trouble, but a couple of other people on our Breakaway cruise in April said they had trouble.

 

I have also heard of similar problems on other ships but it seems to be more of an issue on the Breakaway at the moment.

 

it is notable that both the people who mentioned it to us said they had had problems on other ships in the past. I wonder whether it also has something to do with how you flush it (how long you hold it or where you press), so if you haven’t had any problem before then maybe you will be ok.

[Lupush]

I have found the toilets to be a bit tempermental on many of the ships I've been on due to the suction system that is used.

[dbrown84]

I didn't know this was an ongoing problem reported by others.  I did have a problem with my toilet consistently flushing on my cruise last month.  Whenever it wouldn't flush, I had to raise the lid back up, and let it close again (sometimes with a little more force).

[PistolPete13]

The Chief Engineer on the Escape had a Q&A Session on my trip last month and this question came up.  The toilets work on a shared vacuum system.  Enough pressure needs to build up before any flush happens.

 

During "prime times" the toilet may fail to flush until the system builds up enough pressure.  I'm sure the system is divided by floors or sections on each floor.  If everyone is trying to flush, well, take a number!

[don't-use-real-name]

Could be the lingering effect of a previous maintenance issue - not completely clearing the line of an obstruction.

Main culprit is a kids diaper or toy that jams the system and requires a root-o-rooter device to remove it.

 

Another thing is the ole college prank of flushing several commodes at the same time to disable the system.

Takes a while for the system to reset.

 

While the vacuum flush does not require a great deal of water to operate the system a dry heave means that

there is insufficient lubrication to move the debris downstream and exit.

 

The vacuum assist plumbing is virtually the same as is on aircraft except that 50 or so cabins will be on the

same pipe line. You will know when there is trouble when maintenance has several cabinet doors open in

the passageway trying to locate and remove the jam (and you are politely requested to stand clear while

they work) stuff happens and spatters.

Trivia ever wonder why the commodes in the cabin are most always mounted to same wall as the passageway

wall - ease in servicing without interruption to the cabin occupants.

That flush button is mounted behind the commode lid and is designed such that the lid should be lowered on the

bowl to decrease back splatter and increase the vacuum efficiency - NOT lowering the lid does not help !

 

It ain't Rocket Science even though there is a vacuum in space.

 

 

[roger001]

On a cruise once, don't remember the ship, and we had constant toilet flushing problems along our group of cabins.  It was a case of some cabin putting wrong type items into the toilets and flushing.  Finally, the Captain use his public announcement emergency, into the rooms, override and said in no uncertain terms that if the ship can identify the cabin doing this, they would be removed from the ship.   No more trouble.   

[gooch47]

Actually, our our most recent Breakaway cruise our toilet flushed TOO well.  If you lifted the lid before it was done flushing, it would overflow and you played heck getting the water to stop.

[Georgia_Peaches]

1 hour ago, don't-use-real-name said:

That flush button is mounted behind the commode lid and is designed such that the lid should be lowered on the

bowl to decrease back splatter and increase the vacuum efficiency - NOT lowering the lid does not help !

 

It ain't Rocket Science even though there is a vacuum in space.

 

 

Appreciate the thorough explanation.  I had no idea that lowering the lid aided in the flush capacity of the toilet but being on a vacuum system, that makes perfect sense.  Again, many thanks!

[PelicanBill]

Yup. The vacuum thing.  I wait a minute and try again.  And sometimes it's the actuator - I had a cabin that didn't seem to want to flush at all... until I learne to "punch" the button.  And then it was fine! (4 times on Breakaway)

[zqvol]

3 hours ago, Georgia_Peaches said:

I've just read the first 5 reviews that pop up for Breakaway.  All are pretty negative, which I take with a grain of salt.  But, each review mentions trouble with the toilets flushing consistently, if at all.  Anyone just off Breakaway (or on it currently) have any intel on toilet flushing problems?  Solutions?  We embark on Sunday.

 

Toilet flushing problems are almost always the direct result of a passenger improperly disposing of items in the toilet. When that happens it doesn't just impact their toilet it impacts a whoe block of them.

[rattanchair]

On the Breakaway you have to lower the lid on the toilet to access the flush button. Our cabin had 2 toilets ,neither worked when one stopped.

Edited June 22, 2019 by rattanchair
additional info

[chengkp75]

Okay, another vacuum toilet 101 class.  First off, the toilet lid has absolutely nothing to do with the flushing function.  Raising the lid during a flush has absolutely nothing to do with the amount of water used in a flush, nor does closing the lid "increase the flushing efficiency".  The main reason to close the lid is because the button is behind it, end of story.

 

Unlike the toilets in your house, there is a valve that separates the toilet bowls from the drain piping that carries away the waste.  This allows the entire waste piping system to be kept under a vacuum at all times.  This vacuum sucks the waste down (or in some cases, up, the piping and along to the engine room.  When you press the button to flush (and this is a mechanical valve), it sends vacuum from the piping system through a small tube to a mechanical timing device.  This mechanical timing device is driven by the vacuum in the piping system, and sends vacuum along further small tubes to a water valve, and a "discharge" valve.  The water valve is timed by the timer, and admits about 1 liter of water per flush, there is no level control or connection to the lid.  If the water continues to flow for an excessive amount, or overflow, the water valve has failed.  The "discharge" valve opens to connect the contents of the toilet bowl to the waste piping, and the contents of the bowl are sucked away, and then the discharge valve closes, and the water valve stays open to refill the bowl.

 

Just like in your house, the drain piping combines the waste from all the toilets until it reaches the single pipe that leaves your house.  Now, imagine taking your vacuum cleaner hose, and sticking a ball in the end.  At some point in the hose, this ball will likely get stuck, and there will be no vacuum at the end of the hose (your cabin toilet).  But if instead of a hard ball, you took a large blob of peanut butter and smeared it over the end of the hose, then that blob, due to its ability to change shape, will likely move all the way down the hose to the vacuum bag.  While it is moving, there will be no vacuum at the end of the hose (your cabin toilet), but once it makes it to the bag, and the hose is clear, vacuum will be restored to the end of the hose.  Simplistic, but a fair analogy of a vacuum toilet system.

 

So, toilets that fail to flush are caused by obstructions in the vacuum piping, typically things that should not have been flushed in the first place.  Things that my crew have roto-rooted out of drain pipes on NCL ships include crew uniforms, hand towels, face cloths, dinner napkins, swimwear, underwear, paper towels, baby wipes, diapers, and women's sanitary products.  Depending on how far along the waste piping the offending article got, it may only block your toilet, or a couple, or a hundred, until it can be removed from the system.

 

There are times when due to a lot of flushes in one area of the ship the vacuum will be present at the toilet, but insufficient to actuate a flush cycle.  Regardless of how low the vacuum is when you press the flush button, you have initiated the mechanical timer, and the toilet will flush when vacuum is restored, the well known "phantom flush" that may take place minutes to hours later depending on when vacuum is restored.

 

There can also be problems if you "poke" the flush button, as this is as noted, not an electrical switch but a mechanical device.  A firm push on the button, not a quick poke, usually works best.

 

A vacuum toilet does not need water to "move things along".  It will move dry "product" as well as your vacuum cleaner at home picks up Cheerios or your shop vac picks up nails.  

 

You're right, its not rocket science, but it is amazing how much inaccurate information is out there, including that dispensed by the vast majority of the crew.

[chengkp75]

Hard items, like toys, toothbrushes, crack pipes, coke spoons, or food bones (again, all items that have been retrieved from NCL vacuum pipes) don't tend to make it very far, or even get stuck in the discharge valve, creating the phenomenon known as the "sucking toilet" where the open discharge valve sounds like your vacuum cleaner when you lift it off the floor.  This, and the inability to "travel" too far makes determining who the offending party was that flushed the offending object down the hopper.

[tomservo]

49 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

Hard items, like toys, toothbrushes, crack pipes, coke spoons, or food bones (again, all items that have been retrieved from NCL vacuum pipes) don't tend to make it very far, or even get stuck in the discharge valve, creating the phenomenon known as the "sucking toilet" where the open discharge valve sounds like your vacuum cleaner when you lift it off the floor.  This, and the inability to "travel" too far makes determining who the offending party was that flushed the offending object down the hopper.

 

Chief! (can I call you that?) Good to see you on the NCL boards! Your posts are always super informative, I really appreciate you taking the time to explain how all this stuff works. I'm a big fan - keep up the good work!

[chengkp75]

1 hour ago, tomservo said:

 

Chief! (can I call you that?) Good to see you on the NCL boards! Your posts are always super informative, I really appreciate you taking the time to explain how all this stuff works. I'm a big fan - keep up the good work!

I lurk all the major and many minor lines' boards, but only respond to certain topics.  I will generally answer to anything except "late to dinner", but years in drydocks have made people who yell "Chief" increase my nervous tick and my hair to fall out.

[CPT Trips]

Yo Chief

 

Would you initiate the flush sequence while seated on the unit? Or are there adverse consequences to ones body?

[TMO3CCO1]

After reading the thread my only question is this....If all the cruise ships have the same type of toilet flushing system then why are there so many comments in the reviews about this particular ship.  I consider myself a cruising newbie.  I read all the reviews and information I can to learn the do's and dont's. With my

two previous cruises I never read about any  "flushing" issues and had no flushing issues.  The reviews on the Breakaway it is mentioned several times on several different dates.  To be honest it has me slightly worried....by slightly I mean very slightly. Not enough to change ships, companies or cruises but it does make me think they might need a new "vaccuum" 🙂

 

[chengkp75]

9 hours ago, CPT Trips said:

Yo Chief

 

Would you initiate the flush sequence while seated on the unit? Or are there adverse consequences to ones body?

Never done it myself, that I can remember, but a bit of urban myth as there is clearance under the seat to allow air to enter.

[chengkp75]

8 hours ago, TMO3CCO1 said:

After reading the thread my only question is this....If all the cruise ships have the same type of toilet flushing system then why are there so many comments in the reviews about this particular ship.  I consider myself a cruising newbie.  I read all the reviews and information I can to learn the do's and dont's. With my

two previous cruises I never read about any  "flushing" issues and had no flushing issues.  The reviews on the Breakaway it is mentioned several times on several different dates.  To be honest it has me slightly worried....by slightly I mean very slightly. Not enough to change ships, companies or cruises but it does make me think they might need a new "vaccuum" 🙂

 

Ships will go through periods of very little toilet issues and then periods of lots of issues, it depends on the clientele.  Sometimes issues initiated on one cruise can carry over to the next.  Again, typically it is uninformed, or uncaring, individuals who flush things down the toilet.  And when someone reviews that their toilet had issues, you could likely find hundreds or thousands of folks from the same cruise who did not have issues.

 

Each ship will have 3-6 separate vacuum systems each covering a different area of the ship.  So, even a total failure of one vacuum system will only affect part of the ship, and everyone else can be totally unaware of any problem.  Even within one system, if a clog happens in a line somewhere, the other branch lines that join the main line further downstream will still have vacuum and everyone will be unaware of a problem.

 

And, when a problem does occur, it can be difficult to rectify.  Unlike shoreside plumbing, where toilet waste piping is 4" in diameter, vacuum lines are 1.5" diameter, or about 1/6 the area.  This makes removal of items very problematic at times.  I can remember it taking 3 days of round the clock work to roto-root out a bath towel, and 2-3 days to get a bikini cleared out.