Real ID vs passport

[slidergirl]

On 8/2/2019 at 11:10 PM, Robinsoncruiseso said:

One short cruise, my dh and I only brought EDL (WA) and our NEXUS card. Not sure why we did not bring passport. Anyway, in Los Angeles, they would not accept either and said I needed passport. Well obviously, they were incorrect. I sent off an email to their superiors when I got home and they replied back and told me to carry a copy of their response stating EDL was compliant as well as the actual policy.  This was only a couple years ago, so not all agents know the acceptable documents. Now I bring my passport, NEXUS, EDL, boaters card, and Costco card 

just to be safe. 

I chuckled when I saw you mention traveling with your Costco card.  My now-ex once lost his DL on a trip down to Arizona (dropped it in the rental car, we found out later).  When he got to the TSA checkpoint, he realized it was lost.  The smurf let him pass because he had his Costco card (with photo) and his bobsled federation jury license (with photo)...

 

A little point:  The Utah DL is a permutation of a REALID license - it has an outline of the state with "Utah USA" inside of it instead of the usual star.  The state legislature didn't want to be dictated to and turn the DL into a "national ID card".  BUT, we still had to show all the documentation required by the REALID rules.  So, now the state has to re-issue new licenses to those of us who have licenses which expire after October 2020 with that little gold star.  Wasting money to spite themselves...

 

I'll just keep my Global Entry and Passport Card in my wallet...

Edited August 12, 2019 by slidergirl

[RocketMan275]

32 minutes ago, slidergirl said:

I chuckled when I saw you mention traveling with your Costco card.  My now-ex once lost his DL on a trip down to Arizona (dropped it in the rental car, we found out later).  When he got to the TSA checkpoint, he realized it was lost.  The smurf let him pass because he had his Costco card (with photo) and his bobsled federation jury license (with photo)...

 

Here's a chuckle for you.  I was returning to Camp Casey, Korea where I had to show military ID to get back on post.  I didn't realize this till later but I had showed them my University Of Oklahoma Student ID instead of my military.  Obviously, the MP's weren't paying a lot of attention.

[sparks1093]

10 hours ago, hallux said:

Maybe your Vermont one does, my NY-issued EDL has a "banner" at the top that says "Enhanced" and the US flag in the lower right corner, no gold star...

All of the exemplars I've seen have the gold star but NY could be different. I just received my renewed EDL and it's not in color, more of a grey scale. Almost seems like a step back. Has the Enhanced Driver's License banner, US flag and star in black print.

[sparks1093]

6 hours ago, chipmaster said:

RealID etc. etc, in the end if you leave the country and need to re-enter why is there any discussion about not bringing and having your Passport, it is the only universally accepted document when traveling?

Because for some cruises and for land border crossings US citizens have a choice and don't need a passport. I know, you would never leave the US without one, but millions of travelers do because not having a passport works for them.

[sparks1093]

5 hours ago, RocketMan275 said:

As of October 1, 2020, every air traveler 18 or older will need a Real ID-compliant driver's license or another accepted form of ID to fly within the United States.  A passport will suffice.

That may or may not be extended but it's not just to fly, it's to enter any property under Federal jurisdiction where ID's are checked, such as a Federal building.

[calliopecruiser]

2 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

because not having a passport works for them.

 

So far.

I understand not having a passport if one can't or doesn't want to travel......but for anyone who travels, it seems very short-sighted not to have a passport. 

[Ferry_Watcher]

2 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

All of the exemplars I've seen have the gold star but NY could be different. I just received my renewed EDL and it's not in color, more of a grey scale. Almost seems like a step back. Has the Enhanced Driver's License banner, US flag and star in black print.

 

Washington State has a red banner across the top where the words Enhanced Drivers License is located.  There is an American flag by the photo, and an Evergreen Tree rather than a star (as WA is the Evergreen State).

 

I appreciate Ms. Sparks1093 knowledge on all things related to Travel ID issues/questions.  She knows her stuff!

Edited August 13, 2019 by Ferry_Watcher
deleted non-needed info

[sparks1093]

9 hours ago, calliopecruiser said:

 

So far.

I understand not having a passport if one can't or doesn't want to travel......but for anyone who travels, it seems very short-sighted not to have a passport. 

I can travel to a foreign country by turning left out of my driveway and driving 8 miles. If that is the only travel that I can or will do (I know many people in my village that this applies to) what does a passport get me that one of the alternatives doesn't? The same thing applies to closed loop cruises, for many US citizens it is the only travel they are likely to do. Everyone has different travel patterns and travel documentation needs to fit those needs. When we started cruising we knew that we wanted to travel internationally by air at some point, but we had no idea when that would be so we decided to wait to get passports until that day arrived. That day was 2015 and that is when we got our passports.

[sparks1093]

8 hours ago, Ferry_Watcher said:

 

Washington State has a red banner across the top where the words Enhanced Drivers License is located.  There is an American flag by the photo, and an Evergreen Tree rather than a star (as WA is the Evergreen State).

 

I appreciate Ms. Sparks1093 knowledge on all things related to Travel ID issues/questions.  She knows her stuff!

That's Mr. Sparks1093 to you🤣. It has been a while since I've looked at the exemplars for EDL's and evidently things have changed.

[Ferry_Watcher]

2 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

That's Mr. Sparks1093 to you🤣. It has been a while since I've looked at the exemplars for EDL's and evidently things have changed.

 

LOL - and all this time I thought sparks1093 was the delightful woman in the photo!

[calliopecruiser]

3 hours ago, sparks1093 said:

what does a passport get me that one of the alternatives doesn't?

 

Stability......Thinking that the current requirements won't change is what's short sighted about not having a passport to travel internationally.  Passports are required for international travel virtually anywhere else in the world, and thinking that somehow Americans will always be allowed to forgo that requirement is hubris.  Things in international relations are changing fast all over the world (moreso with the current US administration) and believing in special status to travel internationally (without a passport) won't serve well in even the middle term (let alone the long term), I think. 

[sparks1093]

15 minutes ago, calliopecruiser said:

 

Stability......Thinking that the current requirements won't change is what's short sighted about not having a passport to travel internationally.  Passports are required for international travel virtually anywhere else in the world, and thinking that somehow Americans will always be allowed to forgo that requirement is hubris.  Things in international relations are changing fast all over the world (moreso with the current US administration) and believing in special status to travel internationally (without a passport) won't serve well in even the middle term (let alone the long term), I think. 

Meh, things in this hemisphere (where we have alternatives to passports) aren't changing all that much. If things do happen to change then we'll have plenty of notice. How many years did it take to implement the WHTI? Spending money now just in case you have to spend it later? Not something I would be in a hurry to do (but if someone else wants to, well, that's their business).

[SRF]

19 hours ago, slidergirl said:

A little point:  The Utah DL is a permutation of a REALID license - it has an outline of the state with "Utah USA" inside of it instead of the usual star.  The state legislature didn't want to be dictated to and turn the DL into a "national ID card".  BUT, we still had to show all the documentation required by the REALID rules.  So, now the state has to re-issue new licenses to those of us who have licenses which expire after October 2020 with that little gold star.  Wasting money to spite themselves...

 

Better than idiotic Maryland.

 

They issued REAL ID licenses, with the Gold Star, to people without any paperwork.  Now, they have to get all those people to come in to provide proof that they actually are qualified for a REAL ID card.

[SRF]

On 7/31/2019 at 2:02 PM, Blondilu said:

But now I'm curious, is that true?  Would a Real ID work in place of a regular driver's license and a birth certificate?  In the dream we were doing a round trip out of San Francisco to Mexico.  Closed loop, right?  I tried to look it up and couldn't really find anything specific to cruising.  The thing is when I got the Real ID I had to show them all kinds of ID including my passport.

 

No, because the law that allows DL and BC was written before REAL ID.  So for a closed look cruise a REAL ID DL is just a DL.

[sail7seas]

On 8/12/2019 at 1:08 PM, RocketMan275 said:

As of October 1, 2020, every air traveler 18 or older will need a Real ID-compliant driver's license or another accepted form of ID to fly within the United States.    A passport will suffice.[\I]

 

 

Doesn't a valid, current passport trump  All other forms of I.D?

[sparks1093]

45 minutes ago, sail7seas said:

 

 

Doesn't a valid, current passport trump  All other forms of I.D?

For travel, yes. Many stores here won't accept them as ID for alcohol or tobacco.

[All That Jazz]

Passports prove citizenship but not residence. An ordinary drivers license or state ID proves residence. A "real ID" is accepted by the federal government for "official purposes." You can google for a list of what qualifies as "real ID" and is defined as "official purposes."

 

If your cruise is other than a closed loop cruise, you will need passport (and perhaps visas.) If you fly internationally you will need a passport (and perhaps visas.) If you fly domestically......everyone should have this figured out by now.

 

 

[hallux]

10 minutes ago, All That Jazz said:

everyone should have this figured out by now

You would think.  Even with the delayed deadline (extended a year due to recent events) there will STILL be people clueless and unprepared ID-wise.

 

Case in point - my company has a system changing this week (went live on Monday), it's been communicated through several channels over the few weeks.  My boss sent an email on Tuesday reminding people about the change and someone replied acting totally unaware about this change happening.

[navybankerteacher]

On 8/13/2019 at 9:31 AM, SRF said:

 

Better than idiotic Maryland.

 

They issued REAL ID licenses, with the Gold Star, to people without any paperwork.  Now, they have to get all those people to come in to provide proof that they actually are qualified for a REAL ID card.

It does make you wonder about the competence of civil servants.   

 

I can’t help thinking that because so many people seem to be unaware of the upcoming effective date of the  REAL ID requirements, that the date will be=pushed back again.  This time with the rationale that the present shut down made timely compliance impossible.

[hallux]

18 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

I can’t help thinking that because so many people seem to be unaware of the upcoming effective date of the  REAL ID requirements, that the date will be=pushed back again.  This time with the rationale that the present shut down made timely compliance impossible.

As I noted in my previous post, it's already been pushed to Oct. 2021 as a result of the current crisis.

[RocketMan275]

4 hours ago, navybankerteacher said:

I can’t help thinking that because so many people seem to be unaware of the upcoming effective date of the  REAL ID requirements, that the date will be=pushed back again.  This time with the rationale that the present shut down made timely compliance impossible.

I can't help but think that some jurisdictions are fighting REAL ID because it makes it difficult to issue ID to illegal immigrants.

[hallux]

16 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

I can't help but think that some jurisdictions are fighting REAL ID because it makes it difficult to issue ID to illegal immigrants.

And yet New York, which has had RealID-compliant IDs for 10+ years (I've had an enhanced DL long enough that I've renewed it so at least 11 years since I didn't renew this year) recently passed a law allowing illegal immigrants to get a DL so it's definitely not out of the question.

[navybankerteacher]

22 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

I can't help but think that some jurisdictions are fighting REAL ID because it makes it difficult to issue ID to illegal immigrants.

I’m afraid there is real possibility of this being the case. It being somewhat similar to so much of the TV time spent urging participation in the census - which will determine future Congressional district drawing - based solely upon headcount regardless of  voter registrations.

[RocketMan275]

45 minutes ago, hallux said:

And yet New York, which has had RealID-compliant IDs for 10+ years (I've had an enhanced DL long enough that I've renewed it so at least 11 years since I didn't renew this year) recently passed a law allowing illegal immigrants to get a DL so it's definitely not out of the question.

It won't be long before claims are made that REAL ID is discriminatory.  

[njhorseman]

52 minutes ago, RocketMan275 said:

I can't help but think that some jurisdictions are fighting REAL ID because it makes it difficult to issue ID to illegal immigrants.

 

33 minutes ago, hallux said:

And yet New York, which has had RealID-compliant IDs for 10+ years (I've had an enhanced DL long enough that I've renewed it so at least 11 years since I didn't renew this year) recently passed a law allowing illegal immigrants to get a DL so it's definitely not out of the question.

 

26 minutes ago, navybankerteacher said:

I’m afraid there is real possibility of this being the case. It being somewhat similar to so much of the TV time spent urging participation in the census - which will determine future Congressional district drawing - based solely upon headcount regardless of  voter registrations.

No...you're wrong.

 

No state is fighting  REAL ID any longer.There are only two states not issuing REAL ID-compliant licenses, Oregon and Oklahoma, and they both have been granted extensions. Extensions can only be granted by DHS if a state has been determined to be committed to meeting REAL ID standards and has documented plans for meeting the requirements and a target date to start issuing REAL ID licenses.

https://www.dhs.gov/real-id-frequently-asked-questions#EXT

 

"Q. How will DHS determine whether to grant an extension to a jurisdiction?

A.  DHS will consider the following factors in determining if a state has provided adequate justification for noncompliance:

Has the highest level executive state official overseeing the state’s Driver Licensing Authority committed to meet the standards of the REAL ID Act and implementing regulation;

Has the state documented: the status of both and unmet requirements; plans and milestones for meeting unmet requirements; and a target date for beginning to issue REAL ID compliant documents;

Has the state participated in periodic progress reviews with DHS on the status of unmet requirements?"

 

Further, a state can still issue non-REAL ID licenses to anyone who doesn't want to be bothered with going through the documentation process or is unable to for lack of documentation...such as would be the case for an undocumented immigrant. I know New Jersey gives you this option, and I suspect most other states do as well.