Different perspective on the Rotterdam (and it ain’t good)

[OVgirl]

We have never had a cruise with many problems, but after reading experiences like this, I worry about our luck running out.

[DeeniEncinitas]

3 hours ago, CM1984 said:

We were April as well, first time on the Rotterdam, and first time in a Lanai... We enjoyed our cruise, but yes, the ship was showing her age, and we will cruise HA on larger ships from now on.  It definitely is our cruise line.

The only real problem we had was the A/C stopped working after the 2nd day, and after many complaints, they brought us a large fan, apologized profusely and gave us a free dinner in the Pinnacle, plus $350 in OBC.  Others In our row of cabins were having the same problem, a problem that obviously required more in-depth HVAC crew to repair.  We understood even more so since DH has been in the business for 60 years.

So many things can go right, and unfortunately, too many went wrong on OP’s cruise.  I agree, hard copy letter must go to HAL, that way, problems are documented to be addressed.

Yes, please let us know if you hear back, with the hopes things can be corrected on the ship and service. 
 

And by the way, we haven’t been on bunches of cruises like others, this was our fifth on a HA ship, and the Rotterdam had the best water of any ship EVER!  No need for bottled water....

What Lanai stateroom were you in?

Thank you

Denise😊

[aliaschief]

10 minutes ago, mkkao924 said:

 

I respectfully disagree.

 

Not everyone reading the forum registers and posts, and much less cruisers know about Cruise Critic. These complaints reveals the tip of the iceberg and it provides other people insight about what to look out for.

 

To me, any sewage problem bigger than clogging toilet/sink is unacceptable. You really don't see THAT MANY sewage related issues on other lines' forum.

 

I agree food is subjective - to a degree. If the quality is totally subjective then there will be no such thing as "best dining on cruise" award, Michelin star system, or even Yelp reviews. They exists, and thousands and millions of people trust them. They don't represent all the opinions, but they reflect majority's opinion.

 

Lastly, people don't go on a cruise for a business (I wish I could!), 100% of the people are on a cruise for a vacation. We pay to enjoy, not to suffer. All these comments, good or bad, will somehow influence how I make a decision on itinerary, timing, ships, or even cruise or not.

Valid point! Everyone has to make their own decisions.

[AncientWanderer]

13 minutes ago, mkkao924 said:

 

 

Lastly, people don't go on a cruise for a business (I wish I could!), 100% of the people are on a cruise for a vacation. We pay to enjoy, not to suffer. All these comments, good or bad, will somehow influence how I make a decision on itinerary, timing, ships, or even cruise or not.

 

You entire post was spot on, mkkao924, but I quote this last part because to me, this is the bottom line.  

For us, cruises have been a wonderful escape from the unavoidable trials and tribulations of everyday life.  It's so lovely to be in a clean and pretty environment, eating nice food, enjoying sea air, seeing new places, mingling with excited fellow travelers and interacting with polite, well-trained crew members.  

 

Our last few HAL cruises, we've seemed to almost have to buck ourselves up to enjoy ourselves despite a lack of delivery of most of these cruise features.  That's just silly.  We don't have HAL Stockholm syndrome.  We're reading reviews carefully and planning our vacations accordingly.

[BayWatching]

18 hours ago, Dunelm said:

Had a completely different experience on the Rotterdam, so I am sorry that you experienced the opposite.  I hope, though, that you try a different line.

We probably will. 

[BayWatching]

1 hour ago, GlennG said:

I want to thank BayWatching for his thoughtful and provoking review of the Rotterdam.  In February, my wife and I made inquiries about the Rotterdam, and more specifically, the Lanai staterooms.  To summarize, we chose not to cruise on the Rotterdam because of the information that cruise critic members provided for us.  This ship has had more than its share of problems, and we are grateful for this forum, as it provides really useful information on Holland America Line and its ships.  While we always expect the "apologists" to contribute to this forum, we understand that when numerous people share the same concerns about the Rotterdam, it seem prudent for us to avoid booking on this ship.  For us, personally, the alternatives on Holland America Line seem to be narrowing.  We don't care for the large ships like the Koningsdam and Nieuw Statendam, so our alternatives are restricted to the Vista Class ships, as well as the Eurodam and Nieuw Amsterdam.  Thank you, again, BayWatching and other Cruise Critic members who have provided such good information for us.  You have helped us to avoid unpleasant vacations in the future.

Appreciate that. My motive was exactly that—share our experience and hope it illuminates others’ choices. Your view of things aligns with mine. 

[Tennessee Titan]

Our experience with Capt van Dreumel and HD Belleghem (numerous TAs) have been nothing but excellent. Both have always bee courteous and caring at all times. Can't imagine the being as described here.....

[SilvertoGold]

45 minutes ago, Tennessee Titan said:

Our experience with Capt van Dreumel and HD Belleghem (numerous TAs) have been nothing but excellent. Both have always bee courteous and caring at all times. Can't imagine the being as described here.....

 

Agree

 

Not sure if this is a reverse case of "a smile is met with a smile"............. or what.  All our cruises on the Rotterdam have been light years superior to this experience, even when on one I wasn't a fan of the HD and GSM at all. Very perplexing.

Edited October 30, 2019 by SilvertoGold

[BayWatching]

13 minutes ago, SilvertoGold said:

 

Agree

 

Not sure if this is a reverse case of "a smile is met with a smile"............. or what.  All our cruises on the Rotterdam have been light years superior to this experience, even when on one I wasn't a fan of the HD and GSM at all. Very perplexing.

Ok. I confess.

 

I was scowling at the pipe closet, thinking “... you’d better not start seeping sewage into my living space, you crummy old rusty pipe...”

 

And I was glaring at the concierge when she wouldn’t reverse a bar charge for a screwed up drink order; at her ghost when she disappeared from the Neptune lounge and had to be tracked down by a steward; and at her cash drawer when she wouldn’t sell the mix of currency I requested AND declined to call the front desk to see if they had the currency I needed. 
 

And I was silently cursing the verandah when its pipes began steadily leaking onto our heads, our furnishings and belongings before we noticed. 
********

I wholeheartedly respect all of the comments here that describe different, better experiences. I am perplexed by the implication that we brought on these bad outcomes by ... not being happy enough? 
 

We’d traveled on HAL before and had far better experiences than this. (As well as multiple cruises on other cruise lines.) We aren’t “problem seekers.” We just expected better service, fewer problems and more responsiveness from the staff for our considerable investment.
 

Is that clear enough? 

[CM1984]

2 hours ago, DeeniEncinitas said:

What Lanai stateroom were you in?

Thank you

Denise😊

 

it was 3368.  Good location, no noise from above.  And I’m sure a/c works fine now.

[Mary229]

I agree with the OP’s assessment of the physical condition of the ship, it should be retired.   As far as the service and food I disagree but we all have different expectations. The sailing turned me off enough not to sail with HaL in 2018 but after being on a Oceania instead I happily returned to HAL for my 2019 sailing and am looking forward to my first sailing on the Volendam in 2020 

[BayWatching]

As the original poster, I can’t wait to hear your report next year. 

[Mary229]

1 minute ago, BayWatching said:

As the original poster, I can’t wait to hear your report next year. 

I sailed the Koningsdam in 2019 and was quite pleased except the ship was far too large for my tastes.  As to the Volendam it is just finishing drydock this month and hopefully will be in good condition for my 2020 sailing (fingers crossed). 

[BayWatching]

4 minutes ago, Mary229 said:

I sailed the Koningsdam in 2019 and was quite pleased except the ship was far too large for my tastes.  As to the Volendam it is just finishing drydock this month and hopefully will be in good condition for my 2020 sailing (fingers crossed). 

That’s partly why the Rotterdam was so disappointing—perfect size. 

[BayWatching]

4 hours ago, AncientWanderer said:

 

You entire post was spot on, mkkao924, but I quote this last part because to me, this is the bottom line.  

For us, cruises have been a wonderful escape from the unavoidable trials and tribulations of everyday life.  It's so lovely to be in a clean and pretty environment, eating nice food, enjoying sea air, seeing new places, mingling with excited fellow travelers and interacting with polite, well-trained crew members.  

 

Our last few HAL cruises, we've seemed to almost have to buck ourselves up to enjoy ourselves despite a lack of delivery of most of these cruise features.  That's just silly.  We don't have HAL Stockholm syndrome.  We're reading reviews carefully and planning our vacations accordingly.

As the OP on this thread, thank you.

[kazu]

3 hours ago, BayWatching said:

I wholeheartedly respect all of the comments here that describe different, better experiences. I am perplexed by the implication that we brought on these bad outcomes by ... not being happy enough?

 

I didn’t see Silver to Gold saying that.

 

But sometimes, when you treat people well (or with a smile) you get a better reaction or co-operation.  I thinks that’s all they were trying to say.

 

No one is disparaging your experience at all. But, the old expression - you get more flies with honey is very true.  

 

I assume the ship was sold out?  To me if it wasn’t, you should have been moved.  Even if it was a sleeping cabin (and keep your current one).

 

 

[BayWatching]

23 minutes ago, kazu said:

 

I didn’t see Silver to Gold saying that.

 

But sometimes, when you treat people well (or with a smile) you get a better reaction or co-operation.  I thinks that’s all they were trying to say.

 

No one is disparaging your experience at all. But, the old expression - you get more flies with honey is very true.  

 

I assume the ship was sold out?  To me if it wasn’t, you should have been moved.  Even if it was a sleeping cabin (and keep your current one).

 

 

Well said, and fair. My wife, our traveling companions and I were cordial and friendly in all interactions with ship staff. So much so that it took TWO calls before anyone grasped the urgency of the raw sewage situation and sent someone to check it out.

 

We never were offered alternative sleeping arrangements—or asked if we desired them. Just the cheap bottle of wine. (Our cabin steward tried mightily to erase the stench, leaving an odd mix of faint sewage and strong disinfectant for the rest of the voyage. He admitted that it happens with some regularity.) 

 

 

Edited October 30, 2019 by BayWatching

[kazu]

6 minutes ago, BayWatching said:

Well said, and fair. My wife, our traveling companions and I were cordial and friendly in all interactions with ship staff. So much so that it took TWO calls before anyone grasped the urgency of the raw sewage situation and sent someone to check it out.

 

We never were offered alternative sleeping arrangements—or asked if we desired them. Just the cheap bottle of wine. (Our cabin steward tried mightily to erase the stench, leaving an odd mix of faint sewage and strong disinfectant for the rest of the voyage. He admitted that it happens with some regularity.) 

 

 

 

I know you are reluctant to do so, but I would really send a letter to HAL.  It would be interesting to know if the ship was sold out (there is usually a sign on embarkation day if it is). BUT some people do have to get off. Medical reasons, emergencies at home, whatever.  Usually a cabin frees up.

I know one couple was not happy with their aft cabin on the Prinsendam (no sewage issues - it was the ‘new’ cabins HAL installed after the drydock and they had a lot of noise and vibration).  HAL couldn’t do anything as the ship was sold out but at the TA portion which was another segment, a couple of cabins freed up and they offered them a “sleeping” cabin and they could still keep their main stuff in their regular cabin and enjoy their aft verandah.  They were quite happy with that arrangement.

 

IF there were cabins available and the ship didn’t offer you a temporary arrangement until the problem was solved then that is really abhorrent.  If they were sold out you were stuck, but me?  I probably would have camped out at the atrium,  And, I’m not a complainer but sewage and I are not good friends 😉 

[Doubt It]

There is a significant presentation of cruise port cancellations and linked poor on board communication this fall 2019 on CC across all lines. 

 

After a debacle of a cruise on Oceania Regatta Oct 2018 (a record 10 individual CC reviews for one cruise - all less than 3 stars - loss of 4 ports, no attempt to substitute ports and where the cruise director was booed for 4 nights in a row), I have come to the conclusion that the cruise industry pays lip service to customer complaints. The cruise industry has less government and consumer regulation than land based vacation industry, and it shows.

 

The land based hotel sector and even airlines provide actual $ back or room $ reductions in poor customer service situations - where the consumer actually gets some value, not the ridiculous Future Cruise Credit.

 

After many years of cruising and increasingly being taken for granted by the cruise lines, we too have moved to land vacations; a splendid tour of Austria and Switzerland that beat any cruise taken in total satisfaction.

 

I am not surprised that the Captain provided limited information, sounds like every cruise review and thread that I have read for the last many years.

 

 

[DeeniEncinitas]

10 hours ago, summer slope said:

We will be on the Rotterdam in March as it's the only one going from San Diego in our time frame.  I hope we don't have the sewage problems, but the rest will not ruin a cruise for us.  We cruise to enjoy the scenery and ports of call.  We don't look at the condition of the ship or the lack of service from overworked staff.  Other than the stated problem we wouldn't like, we are at sea and that is the best!!

Will be on her also doing the Panama Canal on the 11th of March! Just chill and relax life is too short and IF a big concern would happen we go with the flow and hope for the best!!! Why cruise if we are always worried! Life as they say is too short and I will not stress on stuff I have no control over. You will have a very enjoyable cruise👍
Smooth Sailings to you

Denise😊

[AlexCherie]

On 10/30/2019 at 11:54 AM, iancal said:

We avoided a cruise on Veendam several years ago thanks to our on line TA.  And thanks to posters on this board.  We were looking at booking a cruise inside the final payment window.  The TA strongly suggested we not book that day and that we shop around a little based on very recent feedback from her customers.  It was at that moment we realized one benefit of dealing with a TA instead of with a cruise line employee-impartial advice.

 

We did not book.  But we did start reading the then current Veendam reviews and the comments on this board from those who had recently been on the cruise and/or were currently on the ship.  

 

These data points saved us from booking what was reported to be a dog of a cruise on what appeared to be a then poorly maintained vessel.  We were not prepared to take a chance with our time or our money.

I'm not the most senior person in terms of sea days - but I'm well above 100. 

The cruise I booked on the Veendam was, far and away, the best cruise I've ever been on (and you would find multiple posts of mine suggesting this). In the days just preceding our trip, there were terrible problems on board - to hear about it from posters on this website. After 25 years of sailing I thought for sure I was going to finally have my bad experience. 

Not to say you whether or not you were given a stay of execution by your TA. Who knows. Truly life is a crapshoot. 

***

What surprises me is that HAL/CCL doesn't employ someone to spend an hour a day reading websites like these and addressing the complaints directly - and even more particular to the OP's comments, why they hadn't been pre-emptive especially to someone spending so much to stay with them. They were a frequent cruiser, and not at all like me ... some rummy that takes the last interior cabin for a song. 

Compare what the OP might have expected if he had stayed at the Four Seasons, The Ritz, or Peninsula Hotels. If someone is spending $16,000 to rest their heads on your pillows ... well, I dunno. This isn't to say that Holland America is any different than Royal Caribbean or Celebrity or Oceania or Seabourn. You'll hear the complaints on every board on this website.

It just strikes me that cruising fails to reach the level of Tier 1 hotels. And hotels frequently don't have a full week or even 15 days to make a good impression. 

Cheers. And regrets to the OP. As we all know, the problem with cruising is that something gets under your skin and then all you have is many days in a row to stew over it. Gets to be like your own pearl. 
 

[Mj17ak]

On 10/29/2019 at 5:41 PM, BayWatching said:

 

Strongest recommendation to future cruisers: book HAL’s Rotterdam IMMEDIATELY if you’re looking for:

—LOUSY FOOD (except for the specialty dining rooms, which HAL seemingly is up-selling by downgrading everything and everywhere else). Dining room: under seasoned, underwhelming ; much-touted “Dive-In” burgers: dry and flavorless. 

—CREAKY SHIP including: 1) stinky sewage seeping into our suite from an adjoining pipe closet 2) leaking pipes above our verandah 3) a fire that resulted in an all-ship alarm awakening us in the middle of the night (reportedly TWO fires in the two weeks immediately preceding our trip.)

LOW-BROW SERVICE from a Neptune Suite concierge, a benefit for which we paid handsomely after excellent service on a prior HAL voyage. She refused to reverse bar charges for a rum-and-coke that was delivered as a gin-and-coke and an in-suite honor bar soda that wasn’t drunk; she “apologized” for the raw sewage seeping into our suite with a cheap bottle of wine and a short, impersonal typed apology; and, she assured us we would LOVE the next port of call literally moments before we learned that the port would be skipped due to bad weather. It was inconceivable to us that she hadn’t already been alerted to that. (And if she hadn’t, that’s a different problem altogether.) 

All this, for $16K! 

Speaking of bad weather, I am not blaming HAL for skipping five ports and replacing them with two alternative stops and three addl nights at sea or in port. Safety, as the captain told us, is #1. So this review isn’t biased because of that—at all. 

On the other hand, going the extra mile to meet his passenger’s needs apparently was, for the Rotterdam’s captain, priority #23. Responding to passenger‘s concerns about those skipped ports of call, potential financial losses for missing independently-arranged tours, and a desire for more information, his advice was,“You should buy one of our ship WiFi plans.”

As if offering complimentary WiFi for a few hours would ruin his bottom line. 

But speaking of bottom lines, here’s mine: The Rotterdam is doddering. Dining is below average. Customer service  (excluding the loyal stewards and dining staff who are doing their best) is subpar. (But America’s Test Kitchen live shows are phenomenal. Those ought to be offered every day.) 

Something is rotten on the Rotterdam. And until someone does something about it, it’s Bon Voyage, Holland America!

 

On 10/29/2019 at 5:41 PM, BayWatching said:

 

Strongest recommendation to future cruisers: book HAL’s Rotterdam IMMEDIATELY if you’re looking for:

—LOUSY FOOD (except for the specialty dining rooms, which HAL seemingly is up-selling by downgrading everything and everywhere else). Dining room: under seasoned, underwhelming ; much-touted “Dive-In” burgers: dry and flavorless. 

—CREAKY SHIP including: 1) stinky sewage seeping into our suite from an adjoining pipe closet 2) leaking pipes above our verandah 3) a fire that resulted in an all-ship alarm awakening us in the middle of the night (reportedly TWO fires in the two weeks immediately preceding our trip.)

LOW-BROW SERVICE from a Neptune Suite concierge, a benefit for which we paid handsomely after excellent service on a prior HAL voyage. She refused to reverse bar charges for a rum-and-coke that was delivered as a gin-and-coke and an in-suite honor bar soda that wasn’t drunk; she “apologized” for the raw sewage seeping into our suite with a cheap bottle of wine and a short, impersonal typed apology; and, she assured us we would LOVE the next port of call literally moments before we learned that the port would be skipped due to bad weather. It was inconceivable to us that she hadn’t already been alerted to that. (And if she hadn’t, that’s a different problem altogether.) 

All this, for $16K! 

Speaking of bad weather, I am not blaming HAL for skipping five ports and replacing them with two alternative stops and three addl nights at sea or in port. Safety, as the captain told us, is #1. So this review isn’t biased because of that—at all. 

On the other hand, going the extra mile to meet his passenger’s needs apparently was, for the Rotterdam’s captain, priority #23. Responding to passenger‘s concerns about those skipped ports of call, potential financial losses for missing independently-arranged tours, and a desire for more information, his advice was,“You should buy one of our ship WiFi plans.”

As if offering complimentary WiFi for a few hours would ruin his bottom line. 

But speaking of bottom lines, here’s mine: The Rotterdam is doddering. Dining is below average. Customer service  (excluding the loyal stewards and dining staff who are doing their best) is subpar. (But America’s Test Kitchen live shows are phenomenal. Those ought to be offered every day.) 

Something is rotten on the Rotterdam. And until someone does something about it, it’s Bon Voyage, Holland America!

Sorry to hear of your issues on the Rotterdam.  We are currently on the Rotterdam and will be disembarking in Civitavecchia on 2 Nov.  Our experience has been quite different; we really enjoy Rotterdam’s intimate size where nothing is too far away.  We have found the food and service in the Lido buffet and Pinnacle Grill to be very good.  We have not experienced the main dining room, so I cannot comment on that but have heard good comments from other passengers.  

We are staying in one of the Pinnacle Suites and have enjoyed excellent service from the cabin stewards and the concierge.  There was an unpleasant odor in the extra bathroom which I believe was from the plumbing in the wall behind the toilet.  Both the concierge and his assistant have been very responsive to inquiries and to requests to have incorrect account charges removed.  The internet has been acceptable for email, surfing, etc. but I was not always successful in loading videos (depends on time of day and location on ship).  

All crew members with whom we have interacted have been very helpful and cheery.  Shore excursion logistics went smoothly.  Bartenders remember orders - No complaints here.  In fact, if I walked up to a bar, I was intercepted by a bar staff member who took my order and delivered it to my table nearby.  They were always very helpful. 

We would definitely sail on the Rotterdam again.

[pete_coach]

On 10/29/2019 at 9:05 PM, cruisemom42 said:

 

I don't think people are necessarily doubting you -- but perhaps they question why you seem to be blaming HAL for what you yourself call "a lot of bad luck".  What you relate could have happened on any cruise line at any time. Avoiding HAL because of it doesn't seem to make sense on the face of it, unless there is something you are not explaining?

I agree, could have happened anytime on any ship on any line.

Also, 04-05? 15 years ago? Things change all the time. 15 years ago is certainly not relevant to today.

I am not defending HAL as we have never been on their line yet we but are booked on Rotterdam this coming Spring.

[AncientWanderer]

Once again, I appreciate the OP's review.  One always has to do a cost-benefit analysis for any cruise.  If, like some, I was heading out of my home port of San Diego to do an easy Panama Canal cruise, I'd probably hold my nose, go and have a good time.  For us, we had booked 30 days onboard that entails spending a lot, flying to Europe, and crossing the Atlantic to come home.  Knowing that the ship is going to dry dock immediately after our cruise, I can't see that any remedial stuff will go on before that.  So we're changing our plans.  

I have no doubt that the ship will still be full.  The itinerary is great, and there will be lots of Europeans who want an interesting crossing to the U.S.   Home port advantage.

[kazu]

32 minutes ago, AncientWanderer said:

Once again, I appreciate the OP's review.  One always has to do a cost-benefit analysis for any cruise.  If, like some, I was heading out of my home port of San Diego to do an easy Panama Canal cruise, I'd probably hold my nose, go and have a good time.  For us, we had booked 30 days onboard that entails spending a lot, flying to Europe, and crossing the Atlantic to come home.  Knowing that the ship is going to dry dock immediately after our cruise, I can't see that any remedial stuff will go on before that.  So we're changing our plans.  

I have no doubt that the ship will still be full.  The itinerary is great, and there will be lots of Europeans who want an interesting crossing to the U.S.   Home port advantage.

 

Bolding is mine.  Seriously?  Hold your nose?  How do you do that when you sleep?

Have you had sewage in your cabin?  I have - on NCL a number of years ago.  I can assure you it’s not an experience anyone wants and then, while they are drying it, you get to listen to the fan and try to sleep.

Holding your nose DOES NOT WORK.  You can’t sleep as I, at least, was nauseous from the smell.  I slept on the deck one night out of desperation - awakened by a security guard - all of a sudden they had a cabin for us.  Amazing.

 

Our cruises on this ship, Rotterdam  have been great, food wonderful, crew fantastic but things can change from week to week even.

 

I remember when we had our Oceania issues and got flamed big time on the O board on my live thread.  My issues were real, just as the OP’s is.

I would NEVER want sewage in my cabin and believe me if it were I would be in their face until they either moved me or I would sleep in the atrium with a sign that says “I can’t sleep in my cabin with sewage seeping in”.  I don’t need a cost analysis - there is no sewage in my home (better not be) and I don’t want it on any cruise ship or a hotel room.  

I enjoy HAL, like the Rotterdam, but if there are issues then a cabin should always be saved to give these people a sleeping cabin.  

Ship happens but shi* is another story.  JMHO.