July start!!

[asalligo]

Just now, ontheweb said:

You do not have to answer, and the cruise line does not have to let you sail.

Actually Florida House Bill 747 if passed will make exactly that a crime in Florida. 

[stellarose]

again, we can all agree to disagree.  if the cruise line wants proof to cruise- then if you want to cruise - do it - get vaccinated. 

 

and if someone uploads fake documentation about vaccination- then that is on them- 

 

do I like teaching in a mask 8 hours a day? no but this is my job to educate high school students- so I do it bc it is my job and I love my job. 

[asalligo]

2 minutes ago, IntrepidFromDC said:

I wonder if that extends to businesses that are not on Florida ground, but docked.  This just feels like another yucky battle between a state and the federal government.

Desantis said on Fox news April 19th that is specifically applied to cruise lines and that if the wording needed to be changed he would do so. 

[asalligo]

2 minutes ago, harkinmr said:

That is an executive order only.  Not legislated action.  Yet.  And it will not apply to cruise lines no matter what the Governor says.  They are international commerce and travel.  State has no say.  If a cruise line requires a vaccine confirmation and a passenger does not want to provide that confirmation then they don't sail.  It would be really ironic (trying to be kind here) if the Governor would challenge this and hold up sailing from Florida just to prove a point.  He's been stomping about and filing lawsuits to get cruising going.  

HB 7047 

[harkinmr]

1 minute ago, asalligo said:

Actually Florida House Bill 747 if passed will make exactly that a crime in Florida. 

Laws are challenged all the time.  This one will be too.  Lots of schools and universities will want to have vaccine requirements, not to mention hospital systems and even some business that are involved in large events.  They have a right to do so, provided it is not discriminatory in its application.

[harkinmr]

2 minutes ago, asalligo said:

HB 7047 

Not passed yet.

[harkinmr]

4 minutes ago, asalligo said:

Desantis said on Fox news April 19th that is specifically applied to cruise lines and that if the wording needed to be changed he would do so. 

Lol.  Not happening no matter what the Governor says.

[asalligo]

Just now, harkinmr said:

Not passed yet.

I know, but I bet this stops Carnival from requiring the vaccine. If they ever had plans to in the first place and I know of course they will if the CDC requires it, but their current guidelines do not.  

[harkinmr]

2 minutes ago, asalligo said:

I know, but I bet this stops Carnival from requiring the vaccine. If they ever had plans to in the first place and I know of course they will if the CDC requires it, but their current guidelines do not.  

No it won't.  Please see my posts #51, 57 and 59.  

[WhaleTailFlCruiser]

I would hold off on getting too excited. I have a feeling CDC is going to find some way to screw the cruise industry again.

[asalligo]

10 minutes ago, harkinmr said:

No it won't.  Please see my posts #51, 57 and 59.  

I know the 95% to avoid test cruise rule. No one has talked about specific requirements for this value. Will this just be a question? Or this easily printable covid vaccine card that anyone can download and print online? 

 

 

 

Edited April 29, 2021 by asalligo

[harkinmr]

2 minutes ago, asalligo said:

I know the 95% to avoid test cruise rule. No one has talked about specific requirements for this value. Will this just be a question? Or this easily printable covid vaccine card that anyone can download and print online? 

 

covid-19-shot-card.pdf 46.88 kB · 2 downloads

It will be written proof of vaccine required.  I understand the fraud issues.  They've been well publicized.  Two things: (1) the cruise lines are going to have to certify to the CDC that they have the vaccinated passenger and crew cohort documented.  That's legal liability, so they are surely going to do the best they can to meet the verification and certification of status; and (2) if anyone wants badly enough to cruise and goes the fraud route, it is a felony under US law and subject to a 5 year prison sentence if discovered.  Quite a high price to pay for the effort.

[asalligo]

1 minute ago, harkinmr said:

It will be written proof of vaccine required.  I understand the fraud issues.  They've been well publicized.  Two things: (1) the cruise lines are going to have to certify to the CDC that they have the vaccinated passenger and crew cohort documented.  That's legal liability, so they are surely going to do the best they can to meet the verification and certification of status; and (2) if anyone wants badly enough to cruise and goes the fraud route, it is a felony under US law and subject to a 5 year prison sentence if discovered.  Quite a high price to pay for the effort.

You are saying that risk of 5 years in prison would stop you from trying to cruise. Every day on this board I think I am surrounded by cruise fans and then I see something like this. 

[cruisingguy007]

28 minutes ago, IntrepidFromDC said:

I wonder if that extends to businesses that are not on Florida ground, but docked.  This just feels like another yucky battle between a state and the federal government.

 

I have zero doubts this ends up in court and then a protracted battle on appeal as it works it's way up. The emergency use authorization provides an articulable argument to circumvent any vaccine requirements. Plus there have always been religious exemptions or simply bringing a friendly doctors note excuse. This is far from settled. The question is what will the policy be in the interim?  

[asalligo]

My money is still on Carnival just asking the question and trusting that you answered honestly. We shall see. Plus that 5%. That means you can let more than 200 unvaccinated cruisers and around 50 unvaccinated crew. 

Edited April 29, 2021 by asalligo

[harkinmr]

5 minutes ago, asalligo said:

You are saying that risk of 5 years in prison would stop you from trying to cruise. Every day on this board I think I am surrounded by cruise fans and then I see something like this. 

Ummm.  Yes.  

[naxer]

From the Miami Herald https://www.miamiherald.com/news/business/tourism-cruises/article251020944.html:  

But in Florida, Governor Ron DeSantis said he will prevent cruise companies from guaranteeing everyone on board their ships has received the vaccine, complicating company efforts to safely restart cruises.

DeSantis’ office did not respond to a request for comment about the new CDC rules.

[harkinmr]

1 minute ago, naxer said:

From the Miami Herald https://www.miamiherald.com/news/business/tourism-cruises/article251020944.html:  

But in Florida, Governor Ron DeSantis said he will prevent cruise companies from guaranteeing everyone on board their ships has received the vaccine, complicating company efforts to safely restart cruises.

DeSantis’ office did not respond to a request for comment about the new CDC rules.

Yup.  He says a lot of things.  Just because he says it doesn't make it so.  He has no authority over cruise lines.  See my posts #51, 57 and 59.

[CruisingFromLA]

My assumption is that the cruise lines will make us sign a document to give them permission to access the state databases to verify that we are legit actually vaccinated. You do not sign, you do not cruise. Same thing with the doctors office. If you do not sign all their forms, the doctors have a choice not to have you as a patient (ER is a  different story). This pandemic has shown us that a lot of people cannot be trusted to do the right thing. There has already been instances where people create fake covid tests or are buying fake covid vaccine documentation. A third party will most likely be utilized to verify all passengers are vaccinated.

[dallasdan]

As far as I know in Texas there is not a state data base to access.  Plus with Hippa laws I don't see how a cruise line can access the data base.  We would have to sign a document with the data base that allows access for each entity that accesses the information.  I also don't see it being a felony to forge the document since the ones I have seen are only printed cards and not official government documents. 

[stellarose]

my records are from my doctor's  office and you can't fake that- I don't think..

 

if someone wants to cheat - go ahead.  we can't fight everyone.

Edited April 29, 2021 by stellarose

[balcony bound]

My experience with the Department of Health during vaccination does not lend to believing their records are complete or correct.

[firefly333]

3 minutes ago, dallasdan said:

As far as I know in Texas there is not a state data base to access.  Plus with Hippa laws I don't see how a cruise line can access the data base.  We would have to sign a document with the data base that allows access for each entity that accesses the information.  I also don't see it being a felony to forge the document since the ones I have seen are only printed cards and not official government documents. 

I agree with everything except that you say they cant make it a felony to forge a card.

 

Except for cruising there are few reasons to make a fraudulent card. I cant see it becoming that common.

 

I agree they would have you sign something saying you are vaccinated when you board on the health screening form.

[Flip flop lady]

So... just playing devils advocate. So your not allowed to ask why someone has a service animal, but you are allowed to ask if someone has had a vaccination.🤔

[dallasdan]

people are going to cheat the system.  Just look at all the ones that smuggle alcohol.  Forging a vaccine card that cannot be verified would be easy.