July start!!

[balcony bound]

7 minutes ago, travelplus said:

Wait a minute here other Countries ask for proof of Yellow Fever vaccination so what's the difference?

I think the difference is being a traveler and being a tourist/vacationer?

I've many times had to show proof of a vaccination when traveling, still have my yellow card.

Edited April 29, 2021 by balcony bound

[lizord]

I'm thinking the cruise lines will cancel all existing sailings (in waves) and put out limited ships, therefore they can charge higher prices, they can decide to not allow kids, and require vaccination on these "new sailings." Plus there will be an increase in guests stuck with FCC with only high priced cruises to use them on. That's how it has worked in every market that has or soon will resume cruising. I don't think they will get clearance and just sail the cruises as scheduled.

[cruisingguy007]

Just now, travelplus said:

Wait a minute here other Countries ask for proof of Yellow Fever vaccination so what's the difference?

 

No one is arguing that they will ask. Simply showing proof isn't the issue. Some here believe that there is a method to guarantee a 95% vaccine rate during a cruise. A government data base of some sort. Asking for proof and requiring proof won't mean that though. There WILL be cheats and usurpers but I don't think it will be as big issue as many think. It's much the same as the questions they ask you when you visit a hospital/medical building etc. It'll end up being a mostly honor system, possibly backed with a flimsy document requirement for theater, and people will continue to pontificate on how you MUST be vaccinated or will simply have to be left behind...lol. As I said, It won't be a big problem; most of us are vaccinated and many are eagerly awaiting the opportunity to vaccinate our kids as well but money, ID's, credentials of all kinds, registrations etc are all forged and many so called "checks" are merely voluntary information based. That's simply the reality, whether people "feel" strongly one way or the other.       

[dallasdan]

Yes I think Hippa would only apply if there was a national database for the cruise lines to access.  The question is what is the proof the cruise lines will require to prove you have been vaccinated.  It may be simply the honor system.  If I have to be vaccinated to cruise I will get the shot, I will not lie or forge documents.  However, I am hesitant about getting a vaccine that is still in the early stages of testing.  My fears may not seem rational to some but I have them.  I don't do well with medications and try to avoid taking any medication.   

[ontheweb]

5 hours ago, asalligo said:

Actually Florida House Bill 747 if passed will make exactly that a crime in Florida. 

IF passed. And IF upheld by the courts.

 

And I believe on a thread somewhere in these boards someone posted the proposed law, and it did have an exception for federal law.

[ontheweb]

4 hours ago, dallasdan said:

The vaccine cards I have seen in Texas only had a sticker on the card.   No insurance taken or information to send to a doctor.  Only brand of vaccine and lot number.  What happens if you lose your card or it gets damaged?  Where would you go to get a replacement?

We were told "Don't lose the card." I have seen others post they were told the same thing.

[Stallion]

I think I found the Data Use Sharing Agreement between the states and federal government but it is unsigned so it could have been amended. Note it requires sharing of certain information with the federal government in order to participate in the federal vaccination program:

 

https://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/covid-19/reporting/downloads/vaccine-administration-data-agreement.pdf

 

Interesting thought after perusing the privacy provisions of the complicated 25 page Data Sharing Agreement between the states and federal government--would an inquiry inputting data from a fraudulent vaccination card  into a database requesting only the absence of data on passengers who DIDN'T appear on the national registry constitute an invasion of the privacy rights of those who do appear in the vaccination database? Not sure the answer to that question but a negative ping would not reveal any private information recovered from each state database.

Edited April 29, 2021 by Stallion

[stellarose]

thank you for clarifying HIPAA.  see a teacher can learn something new. 

[cruisingguy007]

3 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

Exactly.  A person can sign a release for their own information. 

 

While that may be true, do you really think that the states/government is going to let a private company have access to their data base? Never going to happen. Even for places that require vaccines (like schools) they will accept a yellow card or digital printout as proof (both easily made). Even they don't have direct access and take the given "proof". The closest thing is maybe a credit report but the clearinghouse (LexisNexis) is a private entity and even then, each and every instance must be authorized and there are a lot of rules attached and breadcrumbs and such. Those thinking that there will be some easily accessible repository haven't really thought this through. The good news is that the vast majority will go along with the program so there isn't much to worry about. This will not be a huge problem.  

[firefly333]

1 hour ago, lizord said:

I'm thinking the cruise lines will cancel all existing sailings (in waves) and put out limited ships, therefore they can charge higher prices, they can decide to not allow kids, and require vaccination on these "new sailings." Plus there will be an increase in guests stuck with FCC with only high priced cruises to use them on. That's how it has worked in every market that has or soon will resume cruising. I don't think they will get clearance and just sail the cruises as scheduled.

Lol what other cruiseline has cancelled all these cruises to make people buy higher? I'm curious as I havent seen this. I think carnival wouldnt make all those customers mad and cancel and put out new cruises. Never heard of this happening. 

[lizord]

7 minutes ago, firefly333 said:

Lol what other cruiseline has cancelled all these cruises to make people buy higher? I'm curious as I havent seen this. I think carnival wouldnt make all those customers mad and cancel and put out new cruises. Never heard of this happening. 

Every single cruise line that has restarted or will restart soon. No cruise line has operated sailings that were sold before March 2020. I don't know what the cruise lines will do but it is what has happened in every other cruising market. If they need a reason just say for capacity reasons, or use NCLs slogan and say "for the guests convenience"

 

Edit: why operate 2 ships with guests paying $400 a week when you can operate one ship and get $800 a week from all this pent up demand and artificial FCC demand?

Edited April 29, 2021 by lizord
Forgot to mention.

[firefly333]

39 minutes ago, lizord said:

Every single cruise line that has restarted or will restart soon. No cruise line has operated sailings that were sold before March 2020. I don't know what the cruise lines will do but it is what has happened in every other cruising market. If they need a reason just say for capacity reasons, or use NCLs slogan and say "for the guests convenience"

 

Edit: why operate 2 ships with guests paying $400 a week when you can operate one ship and get $800 a week from all this pent up demand and artificial FCC demand?

Ok I'm still not sure what you mean. I cruise mostly carnival and rcl. Rcl has allowed lift and shift if you get cancelled and there is something similar, so lots booked before march 2020. I dont have any $400 a week but I got 3 left on rcl in the 650 to 750 for a week including taxes. Solo rates. 2 more higher and a 1k corner aft I couldnt match now. 

 

I havent seen either line cancel and then add new cruises just to make people lose their good prices they booked early 2020... though I dont have such a good rate on carnival. Should have booked further out in the first place. Carnival makes you rebook canc cruises at higher rates, doesnt protect with lift and shifts. But makes up for it with obc. 

[txgranny]

1 hour ago, ontheweb said:

We were told "Don't lose the card." I have seen others post they were told the same thing.

You could go to the vaccine database in texas ImmChek, everyone who has had the vaccine is in the database. I'm sure that online check in will include your vaccine date(s) and lot #'s for whichever state agency you received your vaccine from. 

[BoozinCroozin]

Vaccine cards are probably going to be on the honor system. It will be part of the 30-day check-in window now. When I got my covid vaccine, I asked the person that was doing it how often she was missing a vaccine card. She said they don't count them nor keep track of them. They had stacks. She said they can be copied and forged so easily. The information on the cards can be found all over the internet. I think they will still do temp checks as precaution, limit crowding at boarding, and just set sail and let everyone get back to normal life.

[TooManyWakeUpsTilWeSail]

2 hours ago, harkinmr said:

HIPAA does not apply in this circumstance because anyone that wants to cruise is going to be providing their information voluntarily and authorizing health authorities to verify it.

Wow.  Common sense.  I’m waiting for one of these folks to now claim freedom of religion as a reason to not vax in order to cruise.  They are quickly running out of amendments to twist in their favor.

[AnitaVacation]

8 hours ago, asalligo said:

Yes, I no longer trust that the CDC is working to safely restart cruising. I really believe they have another agenda on some level. 

[joeyancho]

35 minutes ago, BoozinCroozin said:

Vaccine cards are probably going to be on the honor system. It will be part of the 30-day check-in window now. When I got my covid vaccine, I asked the person that was doing it how often she was missing a vaccine card. She said they don't count them nor keep track of them. They had stacks. She said they can be copied and forged so easily. The information on the cards can be found all over the internet. I think they will still do temp checks as precaution, limit crowding at boarding, and just set sail and let everyone get back to normal life.

Forgery is a felony.  Would you commit a felony in order to cruise?    No?   Why assume others would.  

[AnitaVacation]

2 hours ago, cruisingguy007 said:

 

No one is arguing that they will ask. Simply showing proof isn't the issue. Some here believe that there is a method to guarantee a 95% vaccine rate during a cruise. A government data base of some sort. Asking for proof and requiring proof won't mean that though. There WILL be cheats and usurpers but I don't think it will be as big issue as many think. It's much the same as the questions they ask you when you visit a hospital/medical building etc. It'll end up being a mostly honor system, possibly backed with a flimsy document requirement for theater, and people will continue to pontificate on how you MUST be vaccinated or will simply have to be left behind...lol. As I said, It won't be a big problem; most of us are vaccinated and many are eagerly awaiting the opportunity to vaccinate our kids as well but money, ID's, credentials of all kinds, registrations etc are all forged and many so called "checks" are merely voluntary information based. That's simply the reality, whether people "feel" strongly one way or the other.       

So, how many of these 'cheats and usurpers' will be willing to risk losing cruise $$$$ by presenting phoney or no vaccination proof?

Edited April 29, 2021 by AnitaVacation

[TNcruising02]

If they do require proof of vaccination, maybe the cruise lines can also have each passenger age 18 and over sign a sworn statement under penalty of perjury that they are fully vaccinated, along with the dates and places of vaccination.  Then if that person develops a severe case of covid during the cruise and it is later determined the person forged the vaccination card, the person can be arrested.  There needs to be criminal consequences for submitting fake vaccination records.

[balcony bound]

32 minutes ago, TNcruising02 said:

If they do require proof of vaccination, maybe the cruise lines can also have each passenger age 18 and over sign a sworn statement under penalty of perjury that they are fully vaccinated, along with the dates and places of vaccination.  Then if that person develops a severe case of covid during the cruise and it is later determined the person forged the vaccination card, the person can be arrested.  There needs to be criminal consequences for submitting fake vaccination records.

Sounds reasonable, maybe a fine as well.

[cruisingguy007]

1 hour ago, AnitaVacation said:

So, how many of these 'cheats and usurpers' will be willing to risk losing cruise $$$$ by presenting phoney or no vaccination proof?

 

It's not that simple. Chances are excellent you will have a few of these "undesirables" on your cruise. It's just the facts. My point was there won't be a huge number of them. Most of us are vaccinated, kids will be soon and we can take our cruises protected and have a great time. Once you're on board I doubt this concern will even enter your mind. People are whipping themselves into a frenzy over something they can't control.  

[iwannacruznow]

Why don't they scan the micro chip they put in my arm?😁

[cscurlock]

11 hours ago, naxer said:

If it's illegal to ask a passenger's vaccine status, how will a cruise line know if 95% of its passengers are vaccinated?

In what state are we talking about here?

[Stallion]

Exactly ZERO states-Texas and Florida provide you can't ask for vaccination cards which only apply to intra-state commerce

[pc_load_letter]

1 hour ago, cscurlock said:

In what state are we talking about here?

 

Perhaps it's illegal to "ask" but what if they state that customers need to show proof of vaccination? They're technically not asking.