Covid on Iona

[terrierjohn]

12 minutes ago, funinhounslow said:

Definitely not semantics. 
 

Quarantine - restricting movement of people who may have been infected to monitor symptoms 

 

Isolation - separation of infected people to prevent the spread of disease. 
 

How many isolation cabins do P&O have?

 

Dismissing the difference as “semantics” could lead to you being turfed off your cruise looking for a place to isolate 

 

I wonder why it is then that P&O call it quarantine when you re restricted to your cabin with norovirus, and the UK and the rest of the world refer to quarantine hotels for those who have to isolate after returning from red list countries.

It may be grammatically incorrect, but like lots of other words their meaning changes to incorporate a wider understanding.

[tring]

2 hours ago, jeanlyon said:

By the way is anyone else having the problem that when they try to post, they get all the other posts in their box where they type?  I have to log out and in again to clear it.

 

Not so much that, but yesterday afternoon I could not get the site to post my comments at all, yet was working fine on my phone.  Clicking on the notifications bell icon was not working properly either, sometimes taking ages for the notifications to show and and just not working at all some times over the last couple of days.

 

Seems to be working fine now for me and am posting this from our desktop.  The site has definitely not been working properly though.

 

Edited October 8, 2021 by tring

[chrisg1uk]

In the end the most important thing is the welfare of the passenger(s) who test positive. For me that means getting them to a hospital or at least off the ship to a quarantine hotel.  Even apparently mild cases can turn nasty quickly and being on a ship with serious covid is not the place to be to get a good outcome. The insurance situation is a nightmare and it seems likely a lot of folk (probably me included) will have not actually purchased what they thought they had.  P&O are naughty is they are in fact promoting a policy that doesn't meet what would be considered "normal" needs or at least be completely open.  I really am considering moving my cruise again and its over a year away!       

[Electra 7]

Hi does anyone know how ill this person was ?? because that makes a difference of being taken ashore or having to self isolate onboard does it not ??

[Britboys]

38 minutes ago, Electra 7 said:

Hi does anyone know how ill this person was ?? because that makes a difference of being taken ashore or having to self isolate onboard does it not ??

If you are talking about the original/first person that this thread refers to, it is irrelevant how mild or severe their symptoms are/were. The bottom line is that the regulations for Cadiz required that anyone who tests positive for Covid must be disembarked and go into a quarantine hotel.

[Son of Bare]

On 10/7/2021 at 11:34 AM, Dermotsgirl said:

Thank you for your posts - you are saying all the things I want to  say, but no longer have the will or energy to make the effort to post. 

 

You make a good point about the longer cruises. The 35 night cruises on Ventura in the new year are high risk - a long way from home, and a closed community for the virus to spread.  Also, there's the new 40 night cruise on Aurora - I said a few months ago when it was released that it was a very bold move on P&O's part. 

What is this new 40 night cruise on Aurora you speak of DG?

[tring]

19 minutes ago, Son of Bare said:

What is this new 40 night cruise on Aurora you speak of DG?

 

There is a 40 night Caribbean cruise on Aurora, commencing 20th February, followed by a Canaries cruise.  They were planned and went on sale after the original spring itinerary for Aurora and other cruises were cancelled in the summer.  Those cruises sold out quickly on the day they were released, so do not show on the cruises for sale on the P&O website. 

 

We were booked on the Aurora Caribbean until about 3-4 weeks ago when we cancelled it.

[Son of Bare]

2 hours ago, tring said:

 

There is a 40 night Caribbean cruise on Aurora, commencing 20th February, followed by a Canaries cruise.  They were planned and went on sale after the original spring itinerary for Aurora and other cruises were cancelled in the summer.  Those cruises sold out quickly on the day they were released, so do not show on the cruises for sale on the P&O website. 

 

We were booked on the Aurora Caribbean until about 3-4 weeks ago when we cancelled it.

I see.

Thanks, I wasn't aware of that.

We are booked on the Arcadia 40 night Caribbean in November.

[Interestedcruisefan]

20 hours ago, tring said:

 

We returned from a two week Spanish Cruise on Tuesday, with Fred who has been doing some cruises of more than a week long for a couple of months now, including his first international cruise mid August.

 

If a cruise lasts more than a week there is a mandatory covid test mid cruise on that cruise line, though I suspect that may not be necessary if there was a need for tests for specific port visits during that time, (not the case for our cruise).  As it was a cruise requirement, rather than a port requirement, we were not charged for that test, but everyone was tested on the same day.  The crew are also tested weekly and always have been.  As all cruise lines are following the same guidelines, that may well be how things will work when the Carnival cruise lines get into regular longer cruises, rather than their summer ones which, I think, were all no longer than one week.

 

Regards testing required by ports, do we actually know that will only be needed for people who are wanting to leave the ship in certain ports, or will it be required for all people on the ship, before it enters their waters (as is often the case with yellow fever certificates and visas for instance).  I do not know the answer to that myself, but would be interested in where that information may have been published, if it has been.

 

I've carefully gone through the P and O Covid protocol information and there is zero mention of any tests needed halfway on longer cruises

 

Similarly for Royal Caribbean 

 

Both state that crew will be regularly tested on board but no mention of passengers

 

I also read that MSC tested all passengers halfway on board their superspreader cruise in September but ONLY as a result of already knowing they had a Covid outbreak on board

 

Interestingly when that MSC cruise reached Southampton environmental health officers went on board uninvited and immediately shut down the buffets on the ship !

 

 

Edited October 9, 2021 by Interestedcruisefan

[funinhounslow]

13 hours ago, Electra 7 said:

Hi does anyone know how ill this person was ?? because that makes a difference of being taken ashore or having to self isolate onboard does it not ??

No. 
 

P&O terms and conditions, para 23:

 

 In addition, any Guest who, in the opinion of P&O Cruises and/or the Master and/or a member of ship’s medical staff, demonstrates the symptoms of a viral illness (including but not limited to Coronavirus (COVID-19)) may be disembarked by P&O Cruises without any further liability

 

https://www.pocruises.com/legal-and-privacy/booking-terms-and-conditions

[Interestedcruisefan]

(Re testing for Covid halfway on longer cruises for Fred Olsen)

 

I've also read through the Covid Protocol for your cruise line (Fred Olsen) and there is no mention at all of routine Covid tests halfway through longer cruises for all passengers.

 

So I wonder if what you experienced was due to the ship having a known outbreak of Covid and not out of routine ?

Edited October 9, 2021 by Interestedcruisefan

[Interestedcruisefan]

3 minutes ago, funinhounslow said:

No. 
 

P&O terms and conditions, para 23:

 

 In addition, any Guest who, in the opinion of P&O Cruises and/or the Master and/or a member of ship’s medical staff, demonstrates the symptoms of a viral illness (including but not limited to Coronavirus (COVID-19)) may be disembarked by P&O Cruises without any further liability

 

https://www.pocruises.com/legal-and-privacy/booking-terms-and-conditions

And note that is just symptoms

 

Doesnt even require a positive test for medical staff to be legally able to disembark you 

 

No mention of close contacts in that clause

 

Perhaps they need to add a clause for them

[Bin man]

Replying to quote 23 terms and conditions surely the part before the bit about p and o liability is this .In the event that any Guest refuses to remain in their cabin during the period recommended by P&O Cruises, So to me that part is if the customer refuses then that's why they say about liability 

[funinhounslow]

53 minutes ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

No mention of close contacts in that clause

Yes there is. 
 

I didn’t quote the whole paragraph,  just the most relevant part.

 

Might be worth having a read before booking a cruise…

[funinhounslow]

4 minutes ago, Bin man said:

Replying to quote 23 terms and conditions surely the part before the bit about p and o liability is this .In the event that any Guest refuses to remain in their cabin during the period recommended by P&O Cruises, So to me that part is if the customer refuses then that's why they say about liability 

The part I quoted begins “in addition”, so the preceding bit isn’t relevant. 
 

Seems clear cut to me. If they think you’ve got the virus (no positive test required) they can disembark you. 

[davecttr]

That paragraph includes travelling companions so why with Norovirus do we have sufferers being confined to cabin but their travelling companions are free to roam the ship.

[Interestedcruisefan]

Here's the full paragraph:

 

In the event that a Guest is diagnosed with any viral and/or bacterial illness whilst  on board or if, in the opinion of P&O Cruises and/or the Master and/or a member of ship’s medical staff a Guest displays any symptoms of a viral or bacterial illness (including, but not limited to, Coronavirus (COVID-19)) that Guest, any accompanying Guest and any other Guest who, in the opinion of  any of P&O Cruises and/or the Master and/or a member of ship’s medical staff has been in close contact with that Guest may be required to remain in his or her cabin for reasons of health and safety. In the event that any Guest refuses to remain in their cabin during the period recommended by P&O Cruises, the Master or the ship’s medical staff, or if any Guest does not comply with any measures in place, or any instruction from a member of the ship’s crew designed or intended to prevent or limit the spread of any bacterial or viral infection (including any instruction given by a local operator during a shore experience) then that Guest may for reasons of health and safety be required to remain in the medical centre or be disembarked (or refused permission to embark or disembark) by P&O Cruises without any further liability. In addition, any Guest who, in the opinion of P&O Cruises and/or the Master and/or a member of ship’s medical staff, demonstrates the symptoms of a viral illness (including but not limited to Coronavirus (COVID-19)) may be disembarked by P&O Cruises without any further liability.

[Interestedcruisefan]

TBF I guess with the Covid viruses they will know you have it before they disembark you as they can test you easily enough

 

Whereas they keep the right to disembark just for symptoms for other viruses they can't test so easily

 

As well as the right to disembark close contacts

 

Also don't forget there is a period of incubation for covid before it gives a positive test result hence why we all have to do tests two days after we return rather than same day

 

So a close contact might initially test negative whilst they still have the illness coming their way

 

 

Edited October 9, 2021 by Interestedcruisefan

[Interestedcruisefan]

They might need another clause stating that if you do have Covid and do stay in your cabin and abide by instructions etc and are only mildly ill you can still be disembarked 

 

Maybe there is another generic medical  clause covering that already somewhere else?

Edited October 9, 2021 by Interestedcruisefan

[Marmaduke]

Thanks Megabear for your reply regarding Allianz insurance and the work you are doing researching other insurance policies, all very informative.

[tring]

2 hours ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

(Re testing for Covid halfway on longer cruises for Fred Olsen)

 

I've also read through the Covid Protocol for your cruise line (Fred Olsen) and there is no mention at all of routine Covid tests halfway through longer cruises for all passengers.

 

So I wonder if what you experienced was due to the ship having a known outbreak of Covid and not out of routine ?

 

No it is a standard procedure Fred are following for cruises over 7 nights, but like P&O and other cruises not all fine details are easily available on their website. We were aware of it as it was mentioned on social media.  Also it is something that could well be brought in any time, as you say with MSC.  I  had seen a comment someone made at that time, saying the testing was required by Liverpool - that was the next port.

 

Certain illnesses on a ship have to be notified to a port authority on docking and I am sure covid would be included in those.  Also the port health authorities have to clear a ship as well as border force when a ship docks, so it would not be unforseen for them to go on s ship to make checks.  In fact I have seen mention that when a ship first docks on the US, the health authorities go on board and are "crawling" over everything, including the kitchens as routine.

 

It is because of that, I had assumed any tests required by a country which is visited would want any testing requirement done on everyone on the ship, rather than just those who intend to leave the ship.  Notification of any illnesses after all can only be done completely accurately if everyone is tested.

 

We were on a ship in February 2020 going up the coast of India and our temperatures were routinely taken as we left the ship in the ports.  The ship had notified the authorities in Mumbai that a member of crew had flu symptoms and he was wizzed off the ship by the authorities, placed in hospital and tests made.  Soon after that they also stopped people leaving the ship to go into the city.  The Captain left the port earlier than planned after that, since there was concern Dehli may have stopped the ship leaving the port.  A day later the sick crew member was confirmed of having a specific flu strain, but it was still required that we all had our temperatures taken that day, before we were allowed to dock in Porbandar the next day, (which was essential to leave India, even if no one went ashore, or we would have been classed as still being there by immigration).  Even though the temperature checks were fine, only passengers were allowed ashore in Porbandar, not crew, though as the Captain said, we spend, they do not 🙂

 

 

Edited October 9, 2021 by tring

[Son of Bare]

1 hour ago, Interestedcruisefan said:

Here's the full paragraph:

 

In the event that a Guest is diagnosed with any viral and/or bacterial illness whilst  on board or if, in the opinion of P&O Cruises and/or the Master and/or a member of ship’s medical staff a Guest displays any symptoms of a viral or bacterial illness (including, but not limited to, Coronavirus (COVID-19)) that Guest, any accompanying Guest and any other Guest who, in the opinion of  any of P&O Cruises and/or the Master and/or a member of ship’s medical staff has been in close contact with that Guest may be required to remain in his or her cabin for reasons of health and safety. In the event that any Guest refuses to remain in their cabin during the period recommended by P&O Cruises, the Master or the ship’s medical staff, or if any Guest does not comply with any measures in place, or any instruction from a member of the ship’s crew designed or intended to prevent or limit the spread of any bacterial or viral infection (including any instruction given by a local operator during a shore experience) then that Guest may for reasons of health and safety be required to remain in the medical centre or be disembarked (or refused permission to embark or disembark) by P&O Cruises without any further liability. In addition, any Guest who, in the opinion of P&O Cruises and/or the Master and/or a member of ship’s medical staff, demonstrates the symptoms of a viral illness (including but not limited to Coronavirus (COVID-19)) may be disembarked by P&O Cruises without any further liability.

I would suggest the last sentence which begins with 'In addition,' is there to simplify any problems PO might have with passengers who refuse to be tested by the ships medical staff because they suspect them of being Covid positive.

No one is going to want to be thrown off Irrespective of how complete their insurance is, and some guests might exercise their right not to be tested if they suspect they may be positive but have few or no symptoms at that time.

 

[seasickphil]

1 hour ago, davecttr said:

That paragraph includes travelling companions so why with Norovirus do we have sufferers being confined to cabin but their travelling companions are free to roam the ship.

Dave we were on the Jewel of the Seas, my wife along with nearly 500 other passengers got the Norovirus, i did not get it but was still confined to our cabin with my wife, i was certainly not allowed to roam the ship. We had a red sticker put on our cabin door to alert our room stewards not to enter and our food was left outside our cabin door. This was a few years ago now so things might have changed.

[Eglesbrech]

1 hour ago, seasickphil said:

Dave we were on the Jewel of the Seas, my wife along with nearly 500 other passengers got the Norovirus, i did not get it but was still confined to our cabin with my wife, i was certainly not allowed to roam the ship. We had a red sticker put on our cabin door to alert our room stewards not to enter and our food was left outside our cabin door. This was a few years ago now so things might have changed.

We were the same on the one occasion I had noro (a few years ago now). Both confined to cabin until, released by the Doctor. Food trays dropped off at the door. Watched endless films!
 

I have heard that more recently the healthy party is allowed out but with some restrictions eg can’t use the buffet or public toilets but thats just hear say.

 

By the way I like your name, it made me smile. And are you regularly seasick?

[Interestedcruisefan]

2 hours ago, tring said:

 

No it is a standard procedure Fred are following for cruises over 7 nights, but like P&O and other cruises not all fine details are easily available on their website. We were aware of it as it was mentioned on social media.  Also it is something that could well be brought in any time, as you say with MSC.  I  had seen a comment someone made at that time, saying the testing was required by Liverpool - that was the next port.

 

Certain illnesses on a ship have to be notified to a port authority on docking and I am sure covid would be included in those.  Also the port health authorities have to clear a ship as well as border force when a ship docks, so it would not be unforseen for them to go on s ship to make checks.  In fact I have seen mention that when a ship first docks on the US, the health authorities go on board and are "crawling" over everything, including the kitchens as routine.

 

It is because of that, I had assumed any tests required by a country which is visited would want any testing requirement done on everyone on the ship, rather than just those who intend to leave the ship.  Notification of any illnesses after all can only be done completely accurately if everyone is tested.

 

We were on a ship in February 2020 going up the coast of India and our temperatures were routinely taken as we left the ship in the ports.  The ship had notified the authorities in Mumbai that a member of crew had flu symptoms and he was wizzed off the ship by the authorities, placed in hospital and tests made.  Soon after that they also stopped people leaving the ship to go into the city.  The Captain left the port earlier than planned after that, since there was concern Dehli may have stopped the ship leaving the port.  A day later the sick crew member was confirmed of having a specific flu strain, but it was still required that we all had our temperatures taken that day, before we were allowed to dock in Porbandar the next day, (which was essential to leave India, even if no one went ashore, or we would have been classed as still being there by immigration).  Even though the temperature checks were fine, only passengers were allowed ashore in Porbandar, not crew, though as the Captain said, we spend, they do not 🙂

 

 

Well bearing in mind Fred Olsen have a special page about Covid protocol on board and how they keep you safe etc I'm amazed that if it's standard procedure to test everybody halfway on the cruise that they are not publicising it?

 

Thats a major protocol there 

 

Let's be honest 

 

It's bad enough worrying if you will pass the pre departure test before they let you on the ship

 

Without worrying you've also got to pass a test halfway on the cruise to stay on board the ship effectively ?

 

I can't see how they could get away without that being stated in their protocol 

 

Bearing in mind they are so clear in stating the other Covid tests you are required to take in order to cruise with them! 

 

You shouldn't be finding out about something like that via social media

 

That's a very significant  protocol

 

Edited October 9, 2021 by Interestedcruisefan