HAL continuing to downgrade its product

[Hlitner]

Yeah, we remember the Yum Yum man and it was a nice HAL tradition.  On the other hand, we were recently in MSC Seashore's Yacht Club where there was no Yum Yum man, but our Butler was everywhere.  If we came out of our suite our Butler was around and waiting to take us to reserved seats in the theater, off the ship (bypassing any queues), etc.  When we were in the Yacht Club's Lounge our Butler was around several times an hour checking that we had the drinks and snacks we wanted.  No Yum Yum man, but we sure had amazing service (without anyone ringing the dinner bell).  We could simply walk up to the restaurant anytime from 7-9 and be immediately seated without a reservation or wait.  There were no apparent crew shortages, and everything was as good or better than pre-covid.  And that is as it should be since folks were paying normal prices!   The only hint that COVID even happened was that the crew usually wore masks.  

 

Folks, when I see posts from folks saying that "things are getting better," Mrcruiser says they are going to bring things back, etc. etc.  Baloney.  Folks are cruising now and should expect everything to be in place.  I sure don't want to have a substandard cruise and hear, "if you come back in a few months things will be back to normal."  Things should be normal NOW.  And what about all these add-on items in the MDR, Pinnacle, etc!  That sounds like bush league budget cruising!

 

Some posters mention that HAL cruises are not full (or even near full).  Word of mouth is a powerful weapon and many folks react to what they hear.  My goodness, we are supposed to be on the Westy in 4 months (Japan/Asia) and HAL has yet to post any excursions for the first couple of weeks.  We have seen other posts about other cruises where there are no posted excursions.  HAL's message is "

There are no Shore Excursions available to be booked for this port at this time. Please check back later. For now, there is still plenty to experience on board.

and this is HAL's answer to folks who are flying halfway round the world?  I am sorry but this is just more bush league.  And that is the message posted for the first 6 ports in several countries!

 

Hank

[Destiny0315]

1 hour ago, RD64 said:

The Yum Yum Man is a classic (and truly a low cost) tradition that needs to be brought back

Sure, the cost of the crew member may not have gone up much, but the cost of butter mints surely has gone through the roof since 2005.😊

[Guest ldtr]

1 minute ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

And the food?  How does one read the offering of "rustic lasagna" as a dinner entree three times in a short cruise as being back to pre-Covid levels?

I have not experienced it on any of my HAL cruises including my last HAL cruise in September on the Eurodam the food and menu variety was excellent. For that matter did not experience it even on my cruises much earlier in the restart.

 

When was this cruise? What ship? What else was on the menu?  I would consider it not up to speed if they were repeating the same menu thee times in a week cruise.  Was the menu always the same on those nights or did that item just happen to show up on various combinations of different selection?

[Seasick Sailor]

We "Vintage" cruiser's have been spoiled by the old day's.  New cruisers have no idea what "used to be". We used to be treated like royalty even though we only had vista suite's. Honestly... I don't worry about the yum yum man or even cheap chocolate candies on our pillows and bed turn down. I just want to be at sea, meet lovely interesting passengers, sun on my face,  a thriller book to read, laundry taken care of, waiters so accommodating, intriguing meals, and interesting ports. We are thankful and blessed to sail with our Holland America family.

[cruisemom42]

4 minutes ago, ldtr said:

I have not experienced it on any of my HAL cruises including my last HAL cruise in September on the Eurodam the food and menu variety was excellent. For that matter did not experience it even on my cruises much earlier in the restart.

 

When was this cruise? What ship? What else was on the menu?  I would consider it not up to speed if they were repeating the same menu thee times in a week cruise.  Was the menu always the same on those nights or did that item just happen to show up on various combinations of different selection?

 

Quote from eroller's Oct 25 sailing on Nieuw Amsterdam:

 

• The food overall - small portions, bland, lacking variety or finesse.  Deserts were tasteless.
• Too many pasta choices - obviously a budget cut.  Rustic Lasagna featured on the dinner menu 3 times on a 5 night cruise.  Ridiculous. 
• No "always available" section on the dinner menu.  Most cruise lines offer this.  The menus were rather basic and sometimes the selection limited.
• Steak only offered once on this five night cruise.  Plenty of pasta though.  Again clearly budget cuts. 

 

 

[Florida_gal_50]

I really wonder if that lasagna is an always available item.  On my navigator menus it’s in the section of the other always available items such as chicken and salmon.  

[Guest ldtr]

23 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

Quote from eroller's Oct 25 sailing on Nieuw Amsterdam:

 

• The food overall - small portions, bland, lacking variety or finesse.  Deserts were tasteless.
• Too many pasta choices - obviously a budget cut.  Rustic Lasagna featured on the dinner menu 3 times on a 5 night cruise.  Ridiculous. 
• No "always available" section on the dinner menu.  Most cruise lines offer this.  The menus were rather basic and sometimes the selection limited.
• Steak only offered once on this five night cruise.  Plenty of pasta though.  Again clearly budget cuts. 

 

 

Maybe they can answer the questions since it it not your first hand experience.

[cruisemom42]

1 minute ago, ldtr said:

Maybe they can answer the questions since it it not your first hand experience.

 

So you're suggesting someone else's first-hand report isn't valid?

[Guest ldtr]

20 minutes ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

I really wonder if that lasagna is an always available item.  On my navigator menus it’s in the section of the other always available items such as chicken and salmon.  

Maybe so I did go back to some menus from last January and they had Beechers Mac and Cheese available every on a 7 day cruise, though everything else on the menu changed each night so did not really notice and I like a good mac and cheese (for that matter I also like a good lasagna). 

 

Kind of like on Princess the Fettuccine Alfredo in on the menu every night along with another pasta dish that changes.  It is my fall back entry if nothing else on the menu appeals to me.

Edited November 12, 2022 by ldtr

[Guest ldtr]

7 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

So you're suggesting someone else's first-hand report isn't valid?

No I am suggesting that since you cannot answer the questions maybe they can, since it was not your first hand experience and you cannot answer the questions concerning that cruise.  Since it was their experience they should be able to provide context.

Edited November 12, 2022 by ldtr

[Florida_gal_50]

4 minutes ago, ldtr said:

Maybe so I did go back to some menus from last January and they had Beechers Mac and Cheese available every on a 7 day cruise, though everything else on the menu changed each night so did not really notice and I like a good mac and cheese (for that matter I also like a good lasagna).

Same, that Mac and cheese is not showing for me so I really suspect the lasagna is always available.  The Mac and cheese was on the menu in March.

Edited November 12, 2022 by Florida_gal_50

[eroller]

19 minutes ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

I really wonder if that lasagna is an always available item.  On my navigator menus it’s in the section of the other always available items such as chicken and salmon.  

Nope as there was no “always available” section on the menu.  Rustic Lasagna was listed with the other main entrees (which did change) 3 of 5 nights on this cruise.  It wasn’t separate, on top or on bottom of the menu, but incorporated with the other entree choices for that evening.  

[Guest ldtr]

31 minutes ago, eroller said:

Nope as there was no “always available” section on the menu.  Rustic Lasagna was listed with the other main entrees (which did change) 3 of 5 nights on this cruise.  It wasn’t separate, on top or on bottom of the menu, but incorporated with the other entree choices for that evening.  

Do you have the menus?  Did everything else change?  Was there another pasta dish each night that did change?

 

On the menus I have copies of HAL does not seem to have a separate always available section (unlike Princess) it appears that their always available items were in the same sections as the items that changed each day.  At least in the ones I have from last January.  Did not save pictures of my most recent Eurodam cruise.

Edited November 12, 2022 by ldtr

[LMaxwell]

5 minutes ago, ldtr said:

Do you have the menus?  Did everything else change?  Was there another pasta dish each night that did change?

I was on that same cruise - There was no chicken/beef/fish/vegetarian "always available" section of the menu. Found that a bit strange.  The mains were a selection of items and some would reappear on various nights.  I recall Salmon only being on the menu 2x, however the final night it was Caribbean seafood night in the Lido so went there, can't say what the MDR menu was that night. Yes, lots of pasta based dishes offered, with each night having a few 

 

I thought the quality/taste overall was acceptable and presentation was nice, but yes, portions all tiny. I'm really watching what I eat so it didn't bother me, but a starter and main really didn't seem like a "full meal" you might expect on a cruise.  Yes, they did try to insist on dessert ordered with dinner. We would skip that to walk around and get dessert at buffet only to find they shut down at 8pm. 

 

Conversely; the breakfast MDR menu is extensive compared to other cruise lines, and the kids menu contains some real hidden gems with large selection, and did rotate. Hadn't seen that before. 

[Guest ldtr]

19 minutes ago, LMaxwell said:

I was on that same cruise - There was no chicken/beef/fish/vegetarian "always available" section of the menu. Found that a bit strange.  The mains were a selection of items and some would reappear on various nights.  I recall Salmon only being on the menu 2x, however the final night it was Caribbean seafood night in the Lido so went there, can't say what the MDR menu was that night. Yes, lots of pasta based dishes offered, with each night having a few 

 

I thought the quality/taste overall was acceptable and presentation was nice, but yes, portions all tiny. I'm really watching what I eat so it didn't bother me, but a starter and main really didn't seem like a "full meal" you might expect on a cruise.  Yes, they did try to insist on dessert ordered with dinner. We would skip that to walk around and get dessert at buffet only to find they shut down at 8pm. 

 

Conversely; the breakfast MDR menu is extensive compared to other cruise lines, and the kids menu contains some real hidden gems with large selection, and did rotate. Hadn't seen that before. 

Thank you. We would usually order 2 items and the main like a soup and salad for example to go with the main.  Where they discouraging that or just not enough choice?

[Florida_gal_50]

1 hour ago, eroller said:

Nope as there was no “always available” section on the menu.  Rustic Lasagna was listed with the other main entrees (which did change) 3 of 5 nights on this cruise.  It wasn’t separate, on top or on bottom of the menu, but incorporated with the other entree choices for that evening.  

It’s is no longer spelled out on the menu as always available.  None of the items are.  Hal has had salmon and chicken as always available for years.  They say nothing about always available.   The fact that it didn’t change should be a pretty good clue that it is a regular item 😉.

Edited November 12, 2022 by Florida_gal_50

[cruisemom42]

1 hour ago, ldtr said:

No I am suggesting that since you cannot answer the questions maybe they can, since it was not your first hand experience and you cannot answer the questions concerning that cruise.  Since it was their experience they should be able to provide context.

 

My question was a simple one, addressed to you:  given the experience reported of having inexpensive (and un-elegant) dishes like "rustic lasagna" as a dinner entree several times on a short cruise, does it really seem to support your premise that things are "getting back to normal"?

[Guest ldtr]

13 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

My question was a simple one, addressed to you:  given the experience reported of having inexpensive (and un-elegant) dishes like "rustic lasagna" as a dinner entree several times on a short cruise, does it really seem to support your premise that things are "getting back to normal"?

Cannot answer that question without knowing what is on the rest of the menu.  As I indicated my cruise in January had Beechers Mac and Cheese on the menu each night.  So someone could certainly say that the food was not up to par because it had mac and cheese on the menu each night.  On the other hand at that time it appears that the mac and cheese was the always available pasta dish, and the overall menu was on par with what I remembered from pre covid days. 

 

To answer your question would need to know what the rest of the menus were like.  Thus my questions. Without more information I can only address what I have experienced.  If someone could post the menus we coule all make an informed conclusion based upon our own experiences and desired food choices.

 

What does seem to have changed is the menu layout itself, there is not an always available section, but instead the always available items are put into the same sections as the items that change. At least on the menus I have a copies of.

 

Let me reverse the question based upon the information presented are you drawing the conclusion that it has not?

 

Edited November 12, 2022 by ldtr

[cruisemom42]

4 minutes ago, ldtr said:

Cannot answer that question without knowing what is on the rest of the menu.  As I indicated my cruise in January had Beechers Mac and Cheese on the menu each night.  So someone could certainly say that the food was not up to par because it had mac and cheese on the menu each night.  On the other hand at that time it appears that the mac and cheese was the always available past dish, and the overall menu was on par with what I remembered from pre covid days. 

 

To answer your question would need to know what the rest of the menus were like.  Thus my questions. Without more information I can only address what I have experienced.  If someone could post the menus we coule all make an informed conclusion based upon our own experiences and desired food choices.

 

What does seem to have changed is the menu layout itself, there is not an always available section, but instead the always available items are put into the same sections as the items that change. At least on the menus I have a copies of.

 

Let me reverse the question based upon the information presented are you drawing the conclusion that it has not?

 

 

Why yes; yes I am.

 

The OP already stated that it was listed 3 nights out of 5.  I could perhaps buy the explanation that it was an "always available" item if it were either listed every night (or not listed at all, as that seems to be the opinion of others on how HAL now handles these items).  But why list it 3 nights out of 5 unless it was intended to be one of the evening's entree choices?

 

And even if we cannot agree on that, the OP also stated that pasta dishes were plentiful and more expensive proteins were absent.  I just can't see that as "returning to normal", but YMMV....

[LMaxwell]

21 minutes ago, Florida_gal_50 said:

It’s is no longer spelled out on the menu as always available.  None of the items are.  Hal has had salmon and chicken as always available for years.  They say nothing about always available.   The fact that it didn’t change should be a pretty good clue that it is a regular item 😉.

 

Except the chicken and fish was not on the menu every night. 

 

They would be there some nights, not there others. The mains were listed in a single column. 

[LMaxwell]

25 minutes ago, ldtr said:

Thank you. We would usually order 2 items and the main like a soup and salad for example to go with the main.  Where they discouraging that or just not enough choice?

 

Just not much choice.  I don't think they discouraged it; we ordered a 2nd main to share on one night.  It was pretty much the skimpiest cruise ship menu I had ever seen.  As I noted in my own review, it is possible that I didn't get the "full experience" on my first HAL cruise. 

Edited November 12, 2022 by LMaxwell

[oakridger]

4 minutes ago, ldtr said:

What does seem to have changed is the menu layout itself, there is not an always available section, but instead the always available items are put into the same sections as the items that change. At least on the menus I have a copies of.

 

 

 

It's not listed as always available but each day there is a salmon, chicken/steak and pasta dish as well as the Rustic Homemade Lasagna listed since I've been onboard on September 25th. (Nieuw Amsterdam and currently Rotterdam).  The Lido buffet here on Rotterdam seems to have Beechers Mac and Cheese some nights from what I recall.

[Guest ldtr]

3 minutes ago, cruisemom42 said:

 

Why yes; yes I am.

 

The OP already stated that it was listed 3 nights out of 5.  I could perhaps buy the explanation that it was an "always available" item if it were either listed every night (or not listed at all, as that seems to be the opinion of others on how HAL now handles these items).  But why list it 3 nights out of 5 unless it was intended to be one of the evening's entree choices?

 

And even if we cannot agree on that, the OP also stated that pasta dishes were plentiful and more expensive proteins were absent.  I just can't see that as "returning to normal", but YMMV....

Without actually knowing what was on the rest of the menu it comes down to each persons  view. 

 

From my experiences it has, other opinions may differ.  I certainly did not notice a lack of chicken, beef, pork  or fish choices on the cruises I have been on.   

 

What about the HAL cruises you have actually been on recently?  Any first hand experiences?

[Guest ldtr]

4 minutes ago, oakridger said:

 

It's not listed as always available but each day there is a salmon, chicken/steak and pasta dish as well as the Rustic Homemade Lasagna listed since I've been onboard on September 25th. (Nieuw Amsterdam and currently Rotterdam).  The Lido buffet here on Rotterdam seems to have Beechers Mac and Cheese some nights from what I recall.

What is your view of the overall menu, since you seem to be reporting the meat dishes are there as well as the pasta dishes?  Any copies of the menu's?

[LMaxwell]

7 minutes ago, oakridger said:

 

It's not listed as always available but each day there is a salmon, chicken/steak and pasta dish as well as the Rustic Homemade Lasagna listed since I've been onboard on September 25th. (Nieuw Amsterdam and currently Rotterdam).  The Lido buffet here on Rotterdam seems to have Beechers Mac and Cheese some nights from what I recall.

 

Were you on the 5 night NA cruise after it repositioned?