Shorts in the Dining Room??

[nini]

17 minutes ago, memoak said:

Remember the Patrick Dennis character in Auntie Mame at Christmas. “Oh boy Auntie Mame long pants can I put them on now ?”

ABSOLUTELY!!! That is one of my favorite movies (starring Rosalind Russell). 

[MrSchwump]

We were recently on the Enchanted, our first time since sailing resumed.  I was very surprised at how lax the dress code in the MDR was.  The only time I did not see men in shorts, t-shirts and ball caps was on formal night.  Then I saw guys with jeans and polo shirts.

 

It didn't bother me or diminish my enjoyment one bit.  It's just a remarkable change.  Once a few years ago, I wasn't allowed in the MDR because was wearing a short sleeved shirt. 

 

This seems to fit the new Princess paradigm, the most consistent thing about Princess is their inconsistency.

Edited March 27, 2023 by MrSchwump

[Thrak]

1 hour ago, MrSchwump said:

We were recently on the Enchanted, our first time since sailing resumed.  I was very surprised at how lax the dress code in the MDR was.  The only time I did not see men in shorts, t-shirts and ball caps was on formal night.  Then I saw guys with jeans and polo shirts.

 

I guess I'm just old. Wearing ball caps at dinner is simply wrong. When in a restaurant take your dang hat off. It's truly sad that this simple act of good manners seems to have vanished from US culture. (Hmmm... US Culture. Has that become an oxymoron?)

[SargassoPirate]

It has been suggested here before, but wouldn't it be nice if there could be two dining rooms?  One for those who adhere to the dress code, and one for everyone else in wife beaters sweat pants, shorts, and backwards ballcaps?

 

Actually, the other dining room for the Golden Corral crowd is the buffet.

 

Nevermind.....

[JimmyVWine]

10 hours ago, 555 said:

Approve of it or not it's the way of the future on Princess and there's no turning back.

While I can agree that the lessening of standards on Formal Night is the way of the future and there's no turning back, I wholeheartedly disagree with the idea that wearing shorts to dinner on a Princess cruise has arrived in full measure and that there is no turning back.  The sign shown in Post #30 supports that, as does the fact that out of 400 people in an MDR at any given time, you might see 1% of the men wearing shorts.  The fact that this (and many other threads) on the topic exist belies your conclusion.  

[Flyinby]

On 3/26/2023 at 8:21 AM, Shazambilo said:

I am going on my 1st Princess cruise next month, after going on 40+ cruises on other lines.  Are shorts allowed in the dining room at night (other than formal night)?

I assume you can read, so why go on Princess if you find it important to wear shorts in the dining room?  Why not stick with the "40+ cruises other cruise lines" instead?

 

Seems simple enough. I don't care much for dressy environments or having to change from shorts at dinnertime, but it's no big deal, and if I wasn't willing to do what they require in plain English, I'd go elsewhere.

 

Or, you can listen to the ones that say to ignore the requirements and wear what you want, because it "doesn't bother "me", and those who don't like it can find another way  to travel."   Because, after all, it's all about "me".

[JimmyVWine]

23 minutes ago, Flyinby said:

Seems simple enough.

I really don't know why this is so difficult.  As consumers, we ALL make purchasing decisions based on past experience and present expectations.  When I choose a restaurant, I do so because I expect it to be a certain way, with a certain menu and a certain atmosphere.  If I want casual, I choose casual.  If I want a $250 Chef's Tasting Menu, I choose accordingly.  But I don't want all restaurants to homogenize and move toward some casual standard just because the "majority" of restaurants are casual.  I know they are.  But sometimes, when I feel like it, I want to move off of the casual.  And sometimes I want to wear shorts and a t-shirt and eat off of picnic tables with my hands.  But I know going in which is which.

 

The same is true for cruise lines.  If you want an "adult only" cruise, those exist.  But imagine showing up for a Virgin cruise only to see 200 kids getting ready to board.  You ask an employee what going on, and they tell you that "family travel is the way of the future and there is no turning back."  Well that's fine.  But that's not what I bought.  When one chooses a Princess cruise, one purchases what Princess is selling, and one must understand that the other 3,499 people who bought that cruise did so with expectations as to what that cruise would be like.  It will mirror cruises on most other cruise lines in many respects, but will differ in a few, perhaps subtle respects.  But those subtle differences are what drive the purchasing decision.  If those differences will cause you to not enjoy yourself as much, then choose another cruise line.  Princess offers a certain level of elegance, for lack of a better word, that some other cruise lines offer, but others eschew.  If that level of elegance is incompatible with your achievement of a good time, there are other options.  The customer should try to match their expectations with the product instead of wanting the product to adjust to the customer.  If the latter happens, then you will have a complete homogenization of the cruise industry landing in "the middle", and who really wants that?  Why do we want every cruise line to be identical?

Edited March 27, 2023 by JimmyVWine

[Princessfan20]

We choose Princess for their itineraries and could really care less what others are wearing. What we have viewed on Princess is that it is not as elegant as some like to pretend or gaslight others.  

Basically, it is a lot of mature people who either have really strange taste or old ill fitting clothes which use to look fairly good 10/15 years ago.   People wearing shorts in the dining room is really a very minor foul compared to what is really worn.  We have never seen anyone turned away for what they are wearing to the MDR and we have seen some very questionable garb.

 

Fantasize all you want that Princess ships are full of royals going to a gala ball.  It just is not true. Princess is way more about many other wonderful things than what people wear on elegant nights.

Edited March 27, 2023 by Princessfan20

[JimmyVWine]

13 minutes ago, Princessfan20 said:

Princess is way more about many other wonderful things than what people wear on elegant nights.

Wrong thread.  This isn't about Formal or Elegant Nights.  It is about shorts in the MDR for dinner.

[david63]

This all comes back to the same old issue. It is irrelevant what the dress code is in any venue on any ship/cruise line, the problem is with the enforcement of the code.

 

I will read a brochure/web site and from the information in there make a decision as to whether that ship/cruise line provides what I want from a cruise and I then expect the cruise line to keep thier side of the deal.

[555]

2 hours ago, Thrak said:

 

I guess I'm just old. Wearing ball caps at dinner is simply wrong. When in a restaurant take your dang hat off. It's truly sad that this simple act of good manners seems to have vanished from US culture. (Hmmm... US Culture. Has that become an oxymoron?)

How did baseball caps creep into this thread?

 

 

1 hour ago, JimmyVWine said:

While I can agree that the lessening of standards on Formal Night is the way of the future and there's no turning back, I wholeheartedly disagree with the idea that wearing shorts to dinner on a Princess cruise has arrived in full measure and that there is no turning back.  The sign shown in Post #30 supports that, as does the fact that out of 400 people in an MDR at any given time, you might see 1% of the men wearing shorts.  The fact that this (and many other threads) on the topic exist belies your conclusion.  

I'll never argue any percentages as their impossible to prove but on the Enchanted last cruise -in the Caribbean, there were many guys on casual evenings wearing shorts. Compared to past years, it's a big change for Princess and my belief is that there just trying to compete with the other cruise lines & become a more relaxed vacation. I firmly believe that they'll never return to a more strict dress requirement and just leave it up to the individuals to choose for themselves what is proper. 

The picture in post #30 is from a long time ago. As a matter of fact they no longer post any dress code outside of the dining room doors.  

[555]

3 minutes ago, david63 said:

This all comes back to the same old issue. It is irrelevant what the dress code is in any venue on any ship/cruise line, the problem is with the enforcement of the code.

 

I will read a brochure/web site and from the information in there make a decision as to whether that ship/cruise line provides what I want from a cruise and I then expect the cruise line to keep thier side of the deal.

I can understand some disappointment and I'm almost positive that they've taken it into account. The end result might be a loss of a few customers but I doubt if we'll even see those statistics.

In the mean time during my cruising career, I'll enjoy the benefit of a more relaxed cruise ship dining room.  

[roadster08]

1 hour ago, Thrak said:

 

I guess I'm just old. Wearing ball caps at dinner is simply wrong. When in a restaurant take your dang hat off. It's truly sad that this simple act of good manners seems to have vanished from US culture. (Hmmm... US Culture. Has that become an oxymoron?)

In the US people are permitted to express their individuality, within reason. As long as someone is not creating a scene and being a nuisance, they will likely not be criticized.

 

That may not be the culture you are accustomed to, but it's culture. 

[tcdcruiser]

41 minutes ago, roadster08 said:

In the US people are permitted to express their individuality, within reason. As long as someone is not creating a scene and being a nuisance, they will likely not be criticized.

 

That may not be the culture you are accustomed to, but it's culture. 

 

So it is your opinion or assertion, that someone who make a reservation in a venue where shorts are expressly not allowed, and then wears shorts to that venue is simply expressing their individualism. 

 

IMHO is is not simply an expression of individualism, it is more like an expression of elitism.  

Edited March 27, 2023 by tcdcruiser

[PrincessLuver]

47 minutes ago, roadster08 said:

In the US people are permitted to express their individuality, within reason. As long as someone is not creating a scene and being a nuisance, they will likely not be criticized.

 

That may not be the culture you are accustomed to, but it's culture. 

 

Well said and all products must change with the times or become irrelevant and Princess is certainly moving in a more relaxed, modern and casual/elegant direction.  

 

But this idea that somehow MDR's on Princess are sophisticated soirees with strict etiquette and a fine dining menu with items that you wouldn't eat every day, like caviar, steak tartare, or foie gras is just not reality.  They seem to be more at the level of a Cheesecake Factory, etc. as far as a fine dining experience goes.

 

As many have said, Princess has a suggested dress code for their MDR's which frequently are not adhered to and very frequently not monitored by Princess staff so does it really matter in the long run.  Bon Appetite!!

Edited March 28, 2023 by PrincessLuver

[JimmyVWine]

21 minutes ago, PrincessLuver said:

• But this idea that somehow MDR's on Princess are sophisticated soirees with strict etiquette and a fine dining menu with items that you wouldn't eat every day, like caviar, steak tartare, or foie gras is just not reality.  
• They seem to be more at the level of a Cheesecake Factory, etc. as far as a fine dining experience goes.

Neither is true.  Princess does not hold itself out as Restaurant DANIEL, nor does it present as a Cheesesteak Factory.  I've never had a waiter remove lobster tails tableside at a CF.  Rather than exaggerate, let's look at the source material that comes directly from the website and really is an accurate description of the MDR environment on non-Formal nights:

 

For evening dining, keep with what you would wear to a nice restaurant at home: skirts/dresses, slacks, and sweaters for ladies, pants and open-neck shirts for men. 

 

There is nothing "caviar and Krug" stodgy about this description. Nor is it "anything goes."

[martinitime1]

[odyssyus]

21 minutes ago, JimmyVWine said:

For evening dining, keep with what you would wear to a nice restaurant at home: skirts/dresses, slacks, and sweaters for ladies, pants and open-neck shirts for men. 

 

 

Reads like a suggestion, not a rule.

[Ombud]

JMHO

I wear the ones on the left with a IMO appropriate top & sandals to a nice restaurant here. So why not onboard??

 

Edited March 28, 2023 by Ombud

[roadster08]

54 minutes ago, tcdcruiser said:

 

So it is your opinion or assertion, that someone who make a reservation in a venue where shorts are expressly not allowed, and then wears shorts to that venue is simply expressing their individualism. 

 

IMHO is is not simply an expression of individualism, it is more like an expression of elitism.  

Elitism is not a concept top of mind for most average Americans. About only group I hear it applied to is to the very best athletes who are a world apart from everyone else.

 

It is important to respect cultural differences when visiting new places. It takes effort on both sides and sometimes that wall appears to be too steep to climb. 

[PrincessLuver]

1 hour ago, JimmyVWine said:

 

For evening dining, keep with what you would wear to a nice restaurant at home: skirts/dresses, slacks, and sweaters for ladies, pants and open-neck shirts for men. 

 

Hilarious. It does not say shorts cannot be worn since they are a form of pants.  All the self-righteous in the world will not change the fact that shorts are frequently worn in Princess MDR’s and they are always allowed first and last night of a cruise.

[Thrak]

47 minutes ago, Ombud said:

JMHO

I wear the ones on the left with a IMO appropriate top & sandals to a nice restaurant here. So why not onboard??

 

 

At home it gets up to 110° F and higher in the summer. Folks will wear nice shorts to the nicest venue in town. However, the venues here don't "request" that you not do so. Princess does so request so I feel it's only polite to concede to their wishes. (It is also never hot inside the ship.)

[Thrak]

7 minutes ago, PrincessLuver said:

Hilarious. It does not say shorts cannot be worn since they are a form of pants.  All the self-righteous in the world will not change the fact that shorts are frequently worn in Princess MDR’s and they are always allowed first and last night of a cruise.

 

Yes, they are definitely allowed the first night as sometimes luggage hasn't arrived. That is a specific case.

[Ombud]

24 minutes ago, PrincessLuver said:

Hilarious. It does not say shorts cannot be worn since they are a form of pants.  All the self-righteous in the world will not change the fact that shorts are frequently worn in Princess MDR’s and they are always allowed first and last night of a cruise.

Bermuda shorts when made of the right material are often viewed as an alternative to a skirt. If my calves bother someone they shouldn't look. Anyway they're more appropriate on my body than leggings which are pants 

 

 

Edited March 28, 2023 by Ombud

[Seaside99]

At the end of the day it is all about respect. Self respect, respect for your fellow cruisers, respect for the cruise line and their staff. It you think you are so important that respect doesn’t matter then show up at any venue in whatever you what. And others who have a modicum of self respect, will just look at you and secretly say what a slob for wearing a ball cap (front or back)in a MDR  or shorts and a T or whatever goes for super casual dress (like tattered jeans or PJ pants). A cruise is a special occasion for the few that can afford it. Treat it with respect. Just my 10 cents worth.