NCL’s legal obligation?

[OctoP]

This may be in the fine print somewhere but I can’t find it.

 

I know NCL can and should be able to cancel ports where there is danger, whether it be war, weather, zombies, or whatever. Safety is always the first priority.
 

When this occurs, are they legally obligated to replace a certain percentage of those ports with substitute ports? Or provide any kind of compensation if other ports aren’t available for whatever reason? Could they legally just shift everything to days at sea?

Edited October 19, 2023 by OctoP

[cruiseny4life]

They can do whatever they want and provide no compensation to you. 

[Guindalf]

If you read the T&Cs, you'll see that NO ports are guaranteed and can be removed or replaced for ANY REASON.

 

Your cruise ticket includes acceptance of this and, as such, there is zero legal obligation on behalf of the cruise line to provide alternative ports or replace them with days at sea.

[julig22]

2 minutes ago, OctoP said:

When this occurs, are they legally obligated to replace a certain percentage of those ports with substitute ports? Nope

Or provide any kind of compensation if other ports aren’t available for whatever reason? Nope, other than refund unused port taxes/fees. Unused, as in if they collected more taxes/fees than they had to spend overall for the cruise. And just as they don't have to refund fees for a specific missed port, they also don't charge you extra if there are additional fees because of a substitute.

Could they legally just shift everything to days at sea? Maybe.  Closed loop (US) requires a visit to a foreign port, US start/end but different ports require distant foreign port. So they have to deal with that requirement somehow.

 

[schmoopie17]

They could do a cruise to nowhere, man. (Cue the Beatles...)

 

While that would still be better than sitting on my sofa for a week, it's not what most people envision when booking a cruise.

[CruiseMH]

22 minutes ago, OctoP said:

When this occurs, are they legally obligated to replace a certain percentage of those ports with substitute ports? Or provide any kind of compensation if other ports aren’t available for whatever reason? Could they legally just shift everything to days at sea?

At least in germany they are legally obligated to compensate you when "the character of the trip changes". What exactly this means is not defined.Usually you don`t get compensation if they change e.g. the isles of a greek isles cruise. But if they go to Italy instead of greece then they might have to compensate. This is even applicable in case of events out of the cruise lines control.

 

Unfortunately as most of the NCL guests don`t live in germany, this information is completely useless for most.

[schmoopie17]

4 minutes ago, CruiseMH said:

 

Unfortunately as most of the NCL guests don`t live in germany, this information is completely useless for most.

Being a beer drinker, this is one month I wish I lived in Germany.

[hallux]

1 hour ago, schmoopie17 said:

They could do a cruise to nowhere, man.

They could, but if the cruise is closed-loop from a US port the US government might have something to say unless there are extreme extenuating circumstances...

[IAcruising]

1 minute ago, hallux said:

They could, but if the cruise is closed-loop from a US port the US government might have something to say unless there are extreme extenuating circumstances...

 

If I recall, there was a cruise to nowhere earlier this hurricane season on a one-Mexico-stop cruise. They did get an exemption from the US, due to weather and scheduling. Very rare, to be sure.

 

[RD64]

5 minutes ago, hallux said:

They could, but if the cruise is closed-loop from a US port the US government might have something to say unless there are extreme extenuating circumstances...

 Very true - they need that foreign port requirement.

[OctoP]

1 hour ago, CruiseMH said:

At least in germany they are legally obligated to compensate you when "the character of the trip changes". What exactly this means is not defined.Usually you don`t get compensation if they change e.g. the isles of a greek isles cruise. But if they go to Italy instead of greece then they might have to compensate. This is even applicable in case of events out of the cruise lines control.

 

Unfortunately as most of the NCL guests don`t live in germany, this information is completely useless for most.

This makes perfect sense, especially for something very expensive. If what I purchased changes in a material way, it’s no longer what I intended to buy.

 

So, I guess good for them that they can get away with it, but not good for people who don’t get what they thought they were buying. Buyer beware. 

[ChiefMateJRK]

Just now, OctoP said:

So, I guess good for them that they can get away with it, but not good for people who don’t get what they thought they were buying. Buyer beware. 

Have you ever booked an airline ticket that had delays, missed connections, cancelled connecting flights, mechanical problems, etc?  I've had all of those, and never "got what I thought I (or my company) were buying."  It's just the world that we live in.

 

What do I need to "beware" of?

 

 

[OctoP]

1 minute ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

Have you ever booked an airline ticket that had delays, missed connections, cancelled connecting flights, mechanical problems, etc?  I've had all of those, and never "got what I thought I (or my company) were buying."  It's just the world that we live in.

 

What do I need to "beware" of?

 

 

Beware of the fact that what you may get could be nothing like what you thought you were getting.  It’s effectively a game of chance, with all the risk on the customer. 

 

I have certainly run into travel issues like cancelled flights, but they either got us on another flight or compensated us in some way for the trouble. Apples and oranges. 

[mjkacmom]

10 minutes ago, OctoP said:

This makes perfect sense, especially for something very expensive. If what I purchased changes in a material way, it’s no longer what I intended to buy.

 

So, I guess good for them that they can get away with it, but not good for people who don’t get what they thought they were buying. Buyer beware. 

Europe has different travel laws. I believe they don’t have a refundable deposit, and I don’t think they pay gratuity on the FAS packages but I’m not sure about that. I’m guessing there are travel insurance policies that can cover missed ports for US cruisers.

[ChiefMateJRK]

3 minutes ago, OctoP said:

I have certainly run into travel issues like cancelled flights, but they either got us on another flight or compensated us in some way for the trouble. Apples and oranges. 

No, it's the same thing.  I can't ever remember being "compensated" by an airline for issues (allegedly) beyond their control.  I actually think the cruise lines are more noble than the airlines in this area.

 

How has an airline compensated you for your grief?

[BirdTravels]

36 minutes ago, OctoP said:

Beware of the fact that what you may get could be nothing like what you thought you were getting.  It’s effectively a game of chance, with all the risk on the customer. I have certainly run into travel issues like cancelled flights, but they either got us on another flight or compensated us in some way for the trouble.

But you, the customer, signed a contract that allows the cruise line to do it. I think that the characterization of going a a cruise as being a "game of chance" is a total, unsubstantiated exaggeration. It is total Fake News. 

 

The same is true of your assertion that airlines compensate you for your trouble when there are "travel issues". I am a multi-multi-million mile flyer and have never got compensated for my trouble,,, ever. 

 

On our cruise last week, the NCL had to cancel one day in Bermuda because of a tropical storm passing over the island. They owed us nothing. But, we did get $100 OBC to compensate us for our trouble. NCL far exceeded my expectations and did far more than any airline. 

 

Not fine print... in the contract you agree to... 

(c) Itinerary Deviation: The Guest agrees that the Carrier has the sole discretion and liberty to direct the movements of the vessel, including the rights to: proceed without pilots and tow, and assist other vessels in all situations; deviate from the purchased voyage or the normal course for any purpose, including, without limitation, the health and safety in the interest of Guests or of the vessel (including the outbreak of any communicable disease), or to save life or property; put in at any unscheduled or unadvertised port; cancel any scheduled call at any port for any reason and at any time before, during or after sailing of the vessel; omit, advance or delay landing at any scheduled or advertised port; return to port of embarkation or to any port previously visited if the Carrier deems it prudent to do so; substitute another vessel or port(s) of call without prior notice and without incurring any liability to the Guest on account thereof for any loss, damage or delay whatsoever, whether consequential or otherwise, except as may be required by law. 

Edited October 19, 2023 by BirdTravels

[MoCruiseFan]

2 hours ago, OctoP said:

This may be in the fine print somewhere but I can’t find it.

 

I know NCL can and should be able to cancel ports where there is danger, whether it be war, weather, zombies, or whatever. Safety is always the first priority.
 

When this occurs, are they legally obligated to replace a certain percentage of those ports with substitute ports? Or provide any kind of compensation if other ports aren’t available for whatever reason? Could they legally just shift everything to days at sea?

 

Per the cruise contract that we all agree to, no compensation is due at all.  Search the contract for Itinitrary Deviation.  They can legqlly can cel every port and sail at sea the whoel cruise and there is no compensation due.  This is true for all cruise lines.

[schmoopie17]

4 minutes ago, MoCruiseFan said:

 

Per the cruise contract that we all agree to, no compensation is due at all.  Search the contract for Itinitrary Deviation.  They can legqlly can cel every port and sail at sea the whoel cruise and there is no compensation due.  This is true for all cruise lines.

Or just look above where @BirdTravelsposted it ^^^

[cruiser2015]

22 minutes ago, ChiefMateJRK said:

No, it's the same thing.  I can't ever remember being "compensated" by an airline for issues (allegedly) beyond their control.  I actually think the cruise lines are more noble than the airlines in this area.

 

How has an airline compensated you for your grief?

It really isn't a great comparison.

Obviously, an airline flight is a much simpler product.

Their contract is to transport you from point A to point B.

Except in the rare situation when, say, a major weather event makes things impossible, they do what they must to get you there. Late? Possibly. Routed through other stops on the way? Could be.

Compensation? Sometimes.

But if the circumstances prevent them from getting you there, you do get a full refund along with the aggravation.

 

Personally, I don't believe the line should compensate for most deviations that are beyond their control. But there can be some limits that are beyond reason. Not sure if that ever happens.

[IAcruising]

6 minutes ago, BirdTravels said:

except as may be required by law. 

 

Great for CruiseMH, who's from Germany, but OctoP is out of luck.

 

[ChiefMateJRK]

1 hour ago, IAcruising said:

 

Great for CruiseMH, who's from Germany, but OctoP is out of luck.

 

I don't believe that anybody on a fantastic NCL cruise is "out of luck."  They're either having a tremendous amount of fun or complaining.  It is largely (entirely) up to the individual.

[BirdTravels]

5 hours ago, IAcruising said:

 

Great for CruiseMH, who's from Germany, but OctoP is out of luck.

 

OctoP wants compensation because their cruise is going to somewhere other than the planned port calls in Tel-Aviv/Haifa and Jerusalem/Ashdod. 

[SpainAlien]

I do think that if a port is replaced with a sea day you should get your port fees back but it would appear that NCL haven't been doing that of late

[julig22]

3 minutes ago, SpainAlien said:

I do think that if a port is replaced with a sea day you should get your port fees back but it would appear that NCL haven't been doing that of late

It has been said oh so many times....  Just because you miss a port doesn't mean that NCL has collected extra taxes/fees overall. They only have to return any taxes/fees that are in excess.

[hallux]

4 hours ago, SpainAlien said:

I do think that if a port is replaced with a sea day you should get your port fees back but it would appear that NCL haven't been doing that of late

They did it as recently as March.  The reason for not refunding those fees, if it happens, has been explained in this forum so many times in the last few months.